Discussion

808 comments
Thunderbear24
Thunderbear24

I think you are being a bit unfair towards PC gaming and most of what id said isn't all that true. For a start, it is not true that the faster hardware comes out on consoles first, and that PC's have to catch up. While we speak, there are graphic cards out there worth £800, and CPU's that have a 12 core. This is mega fast hardware which I am sure that a PS4 won't have, or why else do you think gaming PC's are so much bigger than consoles, and that they need lots of installation. When BF2 was out, the PS2 was the fastest console together with the first Xbox. BF2 was only available for the PC's as other consoles couldn't run them. The PS2 in time had its own version of the game, but the graphics were very very poor. We also had many other good games that consoles couldn't run in the past like Neverwinter Nights for example, and Battlefield 2142. Yes I have notice that there are less games now that only PC's can run, but is this because consoles are better? Or could it be that the gaming companies would market more if they made the same games for all platforms?

These days, yes maybe all platforms can run BF3 but unlike on a PC, I am sure that you can't play 64 players within just one game at the same time. PC's are strong for fantasy adventure too, and Dragonage 2 proved to be a better title for PC gaming. Plus why are we forgetting about all the great PC games such as World of War Craft, Civilization 5, Sins of a Solar Empire, Warhamer online, Cities Platinum, Blood bowl Chaos Edition, and Many many more?

I also hear that with PC's you need to know about drivers, and ISO's etc. But, do you really? Finding a graphics card driver is the easiest things to do in the world, and it's the only driver you would need to find. Go into the graphics cards brand website, go to the card downloads, find your card in the list, that's it. If that is too hard for you, then go to the link where the website will detect your card, and self install it. Updating a driver is a easy as downloading a game on your play station. PC games use to be harder to update but it's simple now. All new games auto update.

Finally, let me conclude the argument about how much they cost. Yes a gaming PCs will cost more but are you really spending more at the end of the day. When you buy a gaming PC or a console, it only makes sense that you will be buying a fair amount of games to play, yes? How much did the PS3 cost when it was launched? Say about £400. A fair gaming PC costs about £700, yes? {Trust me, you don't have to buy £800 graphic cards to run the best games} So, that's £300 more. Yes, that's a lot more but remember that a PC isn't just for playing games. Now, how much is a new releases from a console game? Are they about £45 to even £50 each? Now, that is a lot for just one game. 2 games could even cost you £100, wow !! On the other hand, the same title on the PC would cost £25 to £35 at the most. When buying many games, an extra £15 to £20 will make up the extra  £300 soon , unless you don't buy many games but then what would be the point? Many new games on steam even cost just £15, or even less from when they do offers. So tell me, do you really think that the new PS4 games will cost less than £45 each? I don't think so.

From all that I have said here, I bet you must be thinking that I hate consoles and playstsations. Don't worry, because you are wrong. I have lots of experience in console games and I do love them. There are many things that I like better with consoles but I think that my message here is long enough. I had owned many Nintendo's, PS1, PS2, Xbox 360, etc. So yes, I like them. I only wrote this because as I have experience in all platforms, I don't like it when people say gaming PC's are worse when it's far from true. If someone started attacking the Play station, I would also try to defend it.

I think the PS4 looks great, and I will look forward to see how it develops. I may even buy one to. Thanks for reading, Thunderbear.



DiverseGamer
DiverseGamer

Playstation 4:

When everyone decided not to buy digital games.

adrianlev
adrianlev

I'm a PC gamer and stand by my rig, but I think there's quite a lot of overestimating on the PC's capability versus that of a console, and a lot of underestimating on how much faster you can make your game if you know the exact architecture you are writing for.

Consider Crysis 3. To play that on its midrange graphics settings you need either:

a PS3 (released Nov 2006) ; 

an XBOX 360 (released Oct 2005); or

a PC with AMD 6000-series/Nvidia GTX 500-series (released Oct/Nov 2010 respectively - 5 years later) (Crysis 3 recommended spec)

Now let's compare hardware specs of 7th gen consoles and the average gaming PCs at the time, and 8th gen (PS4) consoles and average gaming PCs today.

PC 2006:   CPU:  3.2GHz,     GFX: 450MHz-128Mb,  RAM: 1Gb

XBOX360:  CPU:  3.2GHz,    GFX: 500MHz:256Mb,   RAM: 256Mb

Playstatn3: CPU: 3.2GHz,     GFX: 500MHz:256Mb,   RAM: 256Mb

PlayStn4:   CPU: 2GHz x 8,   GFX:"next generation",  RAM: 8Gb

PC 2012:   CPU: 3.2GHz x 4, GFX: 775GHz-1Gb,      RAM: 8Gb

Those averages came from a lot of Googling and some intelligent guesswork.  They aren't enthusiast specs, but they do seem fairly representative of your average PC gamer's spec.  That said, real polls would be useful in case anyone knows of any.  At any rate, what does all this suggest to me?

At the time of release, console hardware was slightly more advanced than the average PC, but broadly in the same generation. Despite this, it took the PC another 4-5 years to be able to play games that console hardware was capable of playing back in 2005/6 - we just had to wait for game developers to work out how to unlock the console potential. And that's the difference optimisation on a known platform can give you - and its something the PC just can't take advantage of because all of our PCs are different.  The PC's grunt is a necessary compensation for the console's refinement.  I believe that the PC grunt we have available right now isn't enough to keep up with the PS4's potential over the coming years.

Further, it seems to me that the PS4's hardware has a more significant lead over the average PC today than 7th gen consoles did when they were released.  Game engines today and likely in the future are further targeting consoles, and hardware speeds are not expected to increase over the next 5 years as significantly as they did over the previous 5 years (wiki Moore's Law).

With all this in mind, I would expect it to be a good five years again before PCs are powerful enough to play what the PS4 has the potential to play in the same time frame, and it shouldn't take as long for developers to realise its potential as it did with 7th gen.

There are lots of other things to consider of course, like resolution, frame rates, texture qualities, game design trends, production budgets, standardising game engines and so on - but I think at the least it should give us pause for thought before being so quick to judge the PS4 as a weak step forward.  To me it seems likely that the PS4 will usher in a next generation of graphics that the current console limitations hold us back from reaching.  If history is anything to go by, us PC gamers will have to wait a couple generations of hardware to take advantage of that.

DarthLefein
DarthLefein

I have $500 to buy Ps4 and Destiny right now.

106473
106473

Watch it all be a lie and the Dualshock 4 is going to be for the PS3 lol and they say, "The damn console has more years in it."

Joel_Cool
Joel_Cool

The end music made me want to play Roller coaster Tycoon 2 again! As far as PS4, going to be sticking with PC. I am disappointed in what Sony is bringing to next gen. I think some of these new entries in the gaming console market will some revolution to the current competitors.

steve69canada
steve69canada

This program brought to you by the Toast Association of America. EAT MORE TOAST!!

MelvinMcDougal
MelvinMcDougal

I could answer you Chris, however, that would go against everything I stand for, er...against.  Now if you'll excuse me, I need a diaper change.

art_vertex007
art_vertex007

Actually it's not about hardware that make a system success. It's GAMES. Any hardware that has more of 90+score games will always win.

amar1234
amar1234

i get the feeling all gamespot people are broke muda fudders. LOL they cant afford 600 dollars after 10 years... /facepalm.

amar1234
amar1234

when is the industry finally going to grow up and realize the PC is where its at, and consoles should just be down sized and be nothing but mobile gaming. They should make PC hardware more affordable by mass producing ready made PC/game boxes. They should work with Microsoft to produce a better front end for gaming. So people can pop in their game disc and start playing straight away. Its certainly all possible, if the powers that be just shared their workload, and would result ina better gaming experience for all

GurtKurt
GurtKurt

I just wanted to remind you, that a lot of sources mentioned that the leap in hardware power was not that big this generation. And having a PS4 running a PS3 game with emulation software running in the background, emulating a totally different processor core structure. That needs a lot of Power. And as far as i recall, they are still working on making it happen "somehow". Also i would be interested how they actually do it. Because everybody who uses emulators know how exponentially more power they need compared to their original hardware setup.

But im sure all the people complaining are perfectly aware of this. Cheers ;)

lo_crow98
lo_crow98

for all the trolls wanting to play the ps3 games on the new console... good idea incoming quit trolling and go ahead and sell your ps3 but dont buy a ps4... buy a computer instead you can play games since before you were born and beyond o and u probably wont have to pay for any of them ;) now stfu, quit buying consoles and start having freedom of playing whatever game you want at anytime you want. oh and once again this freedom is acquired buy buying a pc not a pre built pc called a ps4 thank you for stopping the ignorance

Sekhemket
Sekhemket

Wow how have I missed these videos until now? The voice overs for comments are hilarious. 

houshidar
houshidar

where do they get these awesome background tracks from? 

kmykL_optiOn
kmykL_optiOn

I was disappointed when there was no program for exchanging PSP games for downloading on the Vita.. Sure I still have my PSP, but I don't go through the trouble of digging it out to recharge it just to play an old game. I can see this sentiment brewing ahead for the PS3 and PS4, especially since these are large consoles and would probably be stored in boxes somewhere too annoying to dig out when there's just that one game I want to play.

StewedRat
StewedRat

Sweet Cthulhu's slimy tentacles! The comments are so chock full of stupidity, poor grammar and bile that I want to punch my screen.

Marshydude1
Marshydude1

Joliverw but nothing about not being able to play or pay again for your titles has bin confirmed yet I understand all the points people are making I just don't agree with them

mike9876543210
mike9876543210

since when did the dualshock 3 controller have buttons for r2 and l2, they're proper triggers, just not shaped as well as the xbox controllers 

Marshydude1
Marshydude1

Mooncalf your full of it you don't have to pay for the games you already own because you already have a ps3 I don't understand what the big deal is with all this some people need to get a grip

TransvormerSCol
TransvormerSCol

Well guys, the PS4 is going to be AWESOME! ... for gaming console standards of course ;D

Marshydude1
Marshydude1

Chrisx28 get a nextbox then and pay for online play Sony have listened to the people with the ps4 by making it about the GAMES and they have gave us extras that we don't have to use if we don't want

Marshydude1
Marshydude1

U don't have to use the share button if you don't want here's an idea why don't u act like its not there

AlexF_AT
AlexF_AT

@chrisx28 

Yeah that pisses off . If they make it only downloadable and unresellable theres only one solution : Hack it .

bjenning04
bjenning04

Wtf, why do we need a "share" button on the controller? If I want to share something, I'll get on facebook, not my video game console.

chrisx28
chrisx28

  And another thought that is peeing me off is that Sony wants to force this network down our throats trying to get everything downloadable.  The vita storage was a joke and they want me to give them almost $100 for a card to hold the games I buy from their network.  They also want to take the right to trade games and resell them, but yet if we keep them instead we have to hang on to our old clunky systems to play them, how fair is that. Sony is getting to greedy.  Sony needs to let us tell them what we want within reason and than build the system around us.   I spend hundreds a month on gaming, I game on average 8-10 hours a day and in no way will I support the PS4 unless they fix these issues.  With the 360 and Wii U I really just don't need Sony as bad as they need me.  If more people would start understanding this Sony would get off their high throne and cool it.

bottaboomstick
bottaboomstick

Backwards compatibility being absent is no big deal. But PSN games on my ps3 should be available on my ps4.

AlexF_AT
AlexF_AT

@warhawk-geeby 

LOL thats just what i wanted to post ... WTF backwards compatibility ... just keep your PS3 with all the games whats the problem or are some people so poor that they must sell the PS3 to get the PS4 ???

warhawk-geeby
warhawk-geeby

I don't understand why everyone is getting so worked up over the backwards compatibility thing..? My original PS3 had backwards compatibility and I NEVER used it.  Probably twice maximum.  I'd much rather have a cheaper model of the PS4 then pay for something I'd barely use.

If you love your old games that much just keep the old console?

I've still got my megadrive for all the classics of my childhood, I don't see why this generation everything should change?  There will be new games for a new generation of console.  Just man up a little and bite the bullet.

meatz666
meatz666

@adrianlev I was a PC gamer for years, but gave up since it's cheaper to have a nice laptop and a console. Some info you might have left out on purpose
 

1) Just the graphic card of a "average" gaming console is the price of the whole console. How much a windows license is costing? Because if you go to Ready To Play rigs, they are extremely expensive. If you go custom, you have to know a little bit of hardware, and BUY a Windows license. And don't tell me you run your AAA on Linux. Unless you use a pirated Windows, which makes you a criminal.

2) In a PCs, to be fully capable of running new games, you have to know a little bit of drivers, OS and how to keep your hd and RAM tight and tidy. In a console, you just put the dvd and play, as simple as that. Sometimes I get really happy of not having to open a troubleshooting guide, trying beta drivers for a radean, etc.


3) Crysis will always be a tool to make dumb kids dish thousand of dollars on their rigs, so they can say "Hey, my computer runs Crysis on Ultra High"! This is not gaming, this is benchmarking. This franchise was always cool to check great physics and lighting in action, but for gameplay... It sucks. You can't put this game in the same level as Half-Life

4) PC games were easier to get indie developers. They would die of starvation, while people would play their games with a crack... Guess where most of the PC developers migrated? Well, just think about an apple.

And enough with the Bit Wars already. People who really is hardcore should buy all the consoles and have a nice PC rig, so one can play any game release. And people who can't afford have to stop complaining... Maybe is a lot of free time on the internet while you're waiting the newest nvidia driver to download

punksterdaddy
punksterdaddy

@adrianlev WOW! That must've taken you some time? I had heard of "Moore's Law," but never really knew what it was or what it applied to? I only ever heard it referenced from time to time (until now). This small article(too large to say it's a comment) that you have typed & entered above, is very informative and you make a more than valid point.

Unlike "Richie Rich," below, who for some odd reason, feels the need to tell everyone, that he/she has money? Although, now that I think about it, in their own funny little way, has also been very informative...

For helping me to avoid, any possible future conversations we may have had together?

 And for that... I'm eternally grateful! 

Anyway, I thank you for posting this, it is quite educational.

mobywv
mobywv

@amar1234  basement dwellers or college kids.  People with good jobs don't have time to play video games! 

Eldeorn
Eldeorn

@amar1234 PC piracy is your reason for this not happening, plus the fact that one console is always the same as the next, instead of a mish-mash of computer hardware thrown together with either good, bad or old parts combined with either good or crappy drivers the most people have no clue about.

wewerethere
wewerethere

@amar1234 Then they couldn't have exclusive games. It's not gonna happen, 'cause it's not a good business model. It would be like choosing between being Sega before or after they made consoles. I agree that PC only gaming could be made into something cool, though.

JOLIVERW
JOLIVERW

@Marshydude1 I think what he was getting at was that most people will probably not have both their ps3 and ps4 under their TV. Which means that they will not be able to play their PSN games. Personally I am really annoyed about this.

ROGUE_OP
ROGUE_OP

@Marshydude1 I'm pretty sure your gonna have to pay for online with sony too now. and that controller needs to go. 

Eldeorn
Eldeorn

@bjenning04 How do you expect to share a live gameplay video by logging in to facebook on your PC/whatever?

The button isn't meant to be just about sharing a status update you know.

mike9876543210
mike9876543210

@bjenning04 stop being so negative, use the damn thing before judging it, you never know, it might be useful, no one knows yet do they!

Eldeorn
Eldeorn

@chrisx28 They are not forcing anything on you. You will still be able to buy BluRay games and even play them with internet unplugged.

Also, sony has already said that the console will not block second hand games. The publishers have the option to do so if they want, and it will most likely be certain games (online only titles for example), and not the entire library.

Plus, whats unfair about us playing the games on the system we bought them for? The only unfair I see here is your demands to get something you havent paid for in the first place. It's the publishers that sells you a system specific title, not Sony. And you don't get a free PC version of a multiplatform game because you bought the PS3 version of it, now do you? B/C between different systems is a luxury, not an eternal right.

Having sony listening to every consumer when they have these kind of demands would make a perfect disaster of a console. You are entitled to nothing more than what you already own and have paid for, then if you are unsatisfied with not getting a free PS1-PS3 included in the new console, you are welcome to not buy it.

Eldeorn
Eldeorn

@bottaboomstick Nice contradiction there, considering that PSN games for PS3 are directly affected by the lack of B/C just like physical copies. Why? Because they are PS3 specific games, and not some magic multiplatform titles.

chrisx28
chrisx28

AlexF_AT I have plenty of cash and have several of every system out and I think both backwards compatible and being able to download the games I paid for is a must.  My living rooms main TV has a PS3, 360, Wii U, Cable Box, wireless headphone setup, 7.1 Surround and charging stations for all 3 consoles.  Why do I want to have to have a PS4 occupy space I don't have and extra plugins to clutter.  THE PSN games should always be at my disposal till death do us part.  And as far as backward compatibility goes new systems should always allow our games to go to the next system.  Even if I was a poor and needed to boost some cash from my old PS3 so I can upgrade what's the problem.

chrisx28
chrisx28

@bottaboomstick When a big title is coming soon like a new SSX, Dark Souls or Mass Effect I will run through the entire series a few weeks before the launch just for fun and a refreshment on events.  Telling me to hang onto my PS2, PS3 and PS4 is bull#$@%Edit (3 minutes)

Ixidor56
Ixidor56

@warhawk-geeby Most people don't ever use it, but they feel kind of cheated for not having it, they don't play the old games, but they like to know that they can, if someday they want. 
They also don't realize there are cost involved in making the system backwards compatible, so they feel like they should not pay again for the game they already bought.
I agree 100% with you, I hpe people would stop for a while to think about this, maybe some would realize that the lack of backwards compatibility is not a big deal.

Eldeorn
Eldeorn

@ROGUE_OP @Marshydude1 Im pretty sure we are just guessing how it's going to be.

Afterall, we can only base our predictions on how they have done things so far, and with that in mind, the odds are in favor of it being free with a Plus subscription model. Ofcourse, if they do ignore what people actually like the most about it (free) currently, and just think about more cash in their pockets, then, yeah we might see a change for the worse.

devastion913
devastion913

@mike9876543210 

That kind of unintelligent optimism wants to make me punch myself in the face. "It dosen't hurt to try!", uh, yeah, sometimes it does.

KAI3R
KAI3R

@MooncalfReviews @AlexF_AT 

Yes because that 150$ you get for selling your Playstation 3 is certainly going to offset the 150$ dollar cost to integrate backwards compatibility with the PS4... theres no difference, either way youll be spending the same amount.

Eldeorn
Eldeorn

@chrisx28 @bottaboomstick I wouldnt mind a remastered PS4 version of Dark Souls... Just port the PC version with enhanced textures and I'll be a happy clam.

MooncalfReviews
MooncalfReviews

@Ixidor56 There's a flaw in your "cost involved in making the system backwards compatible" statement. The PS4 will be able to run downloaded PS3, 2 and 1 games, which means they are already paying out for that feature.

My main objection with the whole thing is greed. The only reason they are doing it is so that people have to pay to play games they already bought once or twice over. Games we own, we have to buy again, just because they say so.

Eldeorn
Eldeorn

@devastion913 @mike9876543210 Trying is how we learn things (big news here). People with the mentality to not try things are those that still dont fully understand what the "Start" menu does on Windows... and I know a few like that.

Trying to use a button on a game controller...  I can't possibly see how that could hurt you even a little bit.

KAI3R
KAI3R

@Eldeorn 

You don 't have to pay for a thing if you keep your PS3 right there next to your PS4, no ones forcing you to buy anything just turn the thing on and play your old games....

Eldeorn
Eldeorn

@MooncalfReviews @Ixidor56 People wont have to pay for anything twice, since the PSN titles cannot be run on the console as they are now.

The huge majority of PS3 titles will never be available for purchase for the PS4, since most companies wont bother converting them. They are busy making new stuff.

The PS4 hardware will NOT be able to run anything from PS1-PS3. A video stream service from Gaikai is not compability on the actual console, and there will not be any type of downloading of any actual game data to run on the console. It's rather an interactive NetFlix if you will.

Longshot81
Longshot81

@MooncalfReviews @Ixidor56 

Wrong Moon, it was mentioned that they would be able to play ps1,2&3 games via two ways, emulation and streaming via the gaikai cloud service. So essesntially you will be playing the games on a virtual machine on the cloud that has the specs to play those games. The console(ps4) wont have the physical hardware capable to play them do to lower costs of the overall price.