Feedbackula - Dishonored! Stealth! Comments!
This week, Johnny takes a look at what you've been saying about Dishonored and the state of stealth gameplay. Warning: may contain opinions.
by Sarah Lynch on
I like being able to choose if I'm stealthy or not. In Skyrim, I like to sneak, but I also like to just run in and take people out if I want to.
Is that comment about Human Revolution having just as complex mechanics as Thief serious? I love how he then says he'd love to see a pure stealth game - what does he think Thief is?
Okay gamespot, you have some explaining to do. Why is it, when I check my e-mail, and I have emails in my inbox that people have liked my comment, or replied to my comment, that when I select the option to view the comment, or reply to someone, it links me back to the article, but not the actual comment. I had to wade through several pages of crap to find my original post. very frustrating.
While I am a huge Feedbackula fan for holding up a mirror to the trolls out there, I do sometimes get the impression that the only way to get on an episode is to have a comment that is either A, hateful, or B, riddled with grammar and spelling errors. It seems a well-reasoned comment written in fluent English just isn't funny. But, since I really want to be on the show at least once, here it goes: "Staelth mechaniks are sh*t. I just want to make stuff go boom that's what she said, hehehehe."
I love going bang-bang too. Definitely picking up Dishonored later on along the line and the upcoming MGS; Ground Zeroes whenever that has a solid release date. I like that my favorite stealth games seem to be taking a open-ended approach these days.
Conviction had horrible control, plain and simple. Chaos Theory was a the last best Splinter Cell. Remember Double Agent? Of course not.
I think it's funny that this is even being discussed since this has been happening for some time. Games as well as TV have been dumbing down for the last 15 years because it will always appeal to the lowest common denominator. As we as consumers become more and more dependent and distracted by all of our gadgets our attention span and ability to utilize more interesting game mechanics without the game doing most of the work for you (Assassins Creed anyone?) has become the norm. I have watched several youtube walkthroughs for Dishonored and the guy doing it states very clearly that he could care less about the story and just wanted to see how fast he could finish so he could move onto the next crack hit I mean game....In a way, I think modern gaming is becoming homogenized and there are very few of us left, or at least we are the minority, who remember how unforgiving a lot of old games were which is why it was such a quest to either complete the game without cheating and claim bragging rights, or find the cheats. It's really kinda sad and it reminds me of Forest Gump....stupid is as stupid does.
Grammar. Punctuation. Syntax. Even now as I'm typing this, spell check is underlining my errors. C'mon people. What would be an intelligent thought is completely disregarded if you have to stumble through it.
Really? are we arguing on that a game should be stealth only? or action only? im not here to start an argument but i will say that diversity is not a bad thing, personally i dont care whether a game is a mix of stealth, action etc etc... as long as the game had good game play and a good story that's what matters.. for me diversity is good i don't want to be able to do just stealth when the situation asks for a different approach.. That said there are games that should only be stealth correct but that dose not mean that games that are a mix of different genres are bad, most games these day's coming up bad is one thing but don't blame that on the mix up of genres that has nothing to do with it. The amount of play styles dishonered gives you is amazing and i have to say something new, perfect? no but it sure as hell shows the potential of mixing up different genres.
hitman has always given you the option for violence, and that game was never the most popular, and what are titles like that doing these days? dumbing down their stealth system as much as they can so this generation of halfwits can play too.
And heck in half the games these days all you have to do is hit a button and your guy goes stealth anyways, its a joke.
Lots of differents OPIONIONS here... just join the navy, people... that will solve all our problems.
Why do we have to worry about everything being accessable? I mean, I'm not foaming at the mouth about watering down this or that, but why not make a game that is a great stealth game and doesn't try to be everything to everyone? I know the answer already: it's sales. Sales are important, but as a gamer and someone who has supported a few kickstarter projects, I have to believe there is something more important than sell-ability in the production of games. Something special happens when a developer, staffed by people who are passionate about games, get free reign to make games they want to play as gamers rather than something that will move X units, following a formula. Games are an art, and you can really tell when someone has put their soul into an artform. If someone can deliver an amazing gameplay experience revolving around stealth or cooking or sword fighting or any topic then they should do it and trust in their instincts, and not worry about making sure that anyone will be able to pick up and be good at the game or enjoy it.
I think 99% of the idiots here think they are entitled to options. It's sad that if a developer decides to go one way with the game, the minority get upset and start raging. Kids these days need games handed to them with easy gameplay. If it doesn't have that, they won't sell it.
the stealth element still there games are becoming or incorporating the sense of realism.
if Sam fisher is on a mission in real life and he gets discover, he still have to get out/or finish the mission with new objectives. thats what developers/publishers are trying to incorporate in games the freedom of choice to continue or reset.
if you are playing a stealth game and you get discover just reset the game or load your last save
The biggest issue plaguing stealth games is the constant quicksave/reload mechanic that is 100% necessary for a stealthy playthrough. If developers can come up with more modern alternatives to having to reload your game over and over (example Braid's time reversal), pure stealth games would become more popular and playable by those who get frustrated with the genre.
I agree. There are some games that will let you kill one or two villains stealthly and then end up in a massacre... I hope the new Hitman game offers the option to progress in style...
goota love this show, making fun of trolls is so much fun!and on the subject, I think making a blend between stealth and action like dishonored makes it more realistic. You start out sneaking, but when you get caught you fight for your life!
I think there would be enough of an audience for a game of pure stealth. its just that companies don't want to risk. I wish more companies would take a chance.
The main problem in stealth games is the lack of reward for going a stealthy approach. Sure it's fun to sneak around and avoid detection, but at the end of the day, all you accomplished was walking across a room.
Dishonored did a good job breaking this trend for me as it presented legitimate non-lethal approaches to your missions that actually dished out a lot of poetic justice. Stealth/stealth-hybrid games just need to offer more rewards and more gameplay elements that revolve around not being detected in order to make stealth more enjoyable.
It seems like most of these opinions are based on how people "feel" about stealth in games and whether it is cool or dumb, which doesn't seem like the best criteria for evaluating the gaming industry's recent use of stealth in games. I don't think that I would be going out on a limb to suggest that games are rewarding when they are challenging, but not impossible. One of the ways of increasing the challenge of a game is to limit the amount of beneficial items in the game. This is one of the reasons why the Thief games were so challenging / rewarding. Resources like arrows and potions were always available, but they were never available in surplus. By sneaking effectively, you curbed your resource consumption, so that you would have those precious resources for when it really counted. Unfortunately, in games like Dishonored, Deus Ex, etc., resources are so plentiful that it is rare to ever run out. Playing through Dishonored even on max difficulty, I found that I was almost always full on potions, ammo, traps, grenades... everything, even when I used them frivolously. Dishonored was a home run in terms of style, but in terms of challenge and reward, it was about the same experience as sitting through a good movie.
Hell, in the original Deus Ex (PC, 1999) stealth was not only an option but at times the BEST option. Stealth would help you avoid civilian casualties from fire fights.
I love it when they directly quote people, complete with terrible grammar, misspellings, extraneous apostrophes, and missing words. Proofread, people. Or repeat 4th grade. Other wise, your would sound a like a idiot's. XD
Enjoyed the episode.
That person who mentioned the "Good ol' days" syndrome might have a point, we can remember things better than they were. But I think at the same time with examples like Splinter Cell, Dead Space and Resident Evil, you can't help but feel that there is also a growing "It makes more money" syndrome, where companies seem to be steering the game to be more explosive, flashy, hand-holdy and immediately gratifying in order to appeal to a larger audience - Ergo, making more money.
This type of apparent shift in direction combined with the absolute saturation of certain types of games and abundance of sequels (Fifa, CoD) can really take you back and make you wonder where the magic in many games has gone.
Dishonored is a great game, just beat it yesterday. I snuck through the whole game and I loved it. Having the choice also means more replay value. Look at games like Skyrim or even Borderlands, there are different classes that lead to the games being played in very different ways. There are no classes in Dishonored, but there are multiple ways the game could be played which is what makes it so much better.
MGS4, proper incorporation of action if you want to play run and gun. Also proper incorporation of total stealth mechanics if you want to play that way. MGS4 is the greatest stealth and action game of all time. Also you can take multiple routes through various levels and also play the game differently in each play through. MGS4... nuff said.
why not giving me a choice to fly over obstacles farting rainbows and singing " Nyan,nyan,nyan,nyan..." (At least Skyrim gave me that option XD (mods))
@SolanOcard Actually, ya! I've wondered the same thing... but I'm not sure this is the right place to post that.
"sometimes get the impression...", please option B for the win cause it's funny as fark (cough.. sorry meant fork.. cough sorry something caught in my throat) to hear grammatical errors read back without the merest hint of sarcasm. Nothing funnier than an illiterate rant, well perhaps an illiterate off topic rant. But hey Feedbackular has most bases covered thankfully ;-)
Really enjoying the show guys.
@Crush_Project Well I don't really see the point in that. I hate stealth games so games dumbing down their stealth machanic still wouldn't draw me into the franchise. I'm sure, I like most other gamers know what genre of games they like and avoid the ones they don't watering down the genre still doesn't distract that its a stealth game at its core.
@Hellknite190 These games can be beaten mostly in stealth, going terminator is easy way out for people who moan that Stealth sucks. Even like Prototype 2 can be stealth played through most of the time. Anyways there is loads of blurring of genres, action just sells better but that doesn't mean the stealth sucks in it, that person who thinks that just sucks at it.
@fotis52 I couldn't agree more.
@Bavoke Sounds like MGS.
@Braz_the_Mad I agree completely until you touch down on Dishonored. Granted, items such as ammo and the like were not too hard to come by, but on harder difficulties the excess use of these things could lead to a very quick demise depending on the players personal skill level. I'll admit, the game isn't perfect, but is it not a step in the right direction?
@Sarijon yep, thats my point, you try and please everyone and you end up pleasing no one.