@Minishdriveby:
I am convinced you are messing with me. Maybe I am being to quick to jump to judgment, but I think it is the case.
Anomaly1989's forum posts
@Minishdriveby said:
@anomaly1989 said:
@Minishdriveby said:
@anomaly1989 said:
@Minishdriveby said:
@anomaly1989 said:
@Minishdriveby said:
I don't understand how catering to a wider market constitutes "snitching," companies follow profit. I don't think a more user friendly market has deterred growth of the medium. I think it's promoted it. There are still hard games if that's what you're into.
The market did not grow nor shrink due to easy psychologically manipulative games. Gamers were going to be gamers anyways. Now, with this in mind, understand how the prisoner's dilemma relates. Companies making psychologically manipulative, easy, gimmicky games are snitching.
As for calling games a "medium"
(mē'dē-əm)
n., pl., -di·a (-dē-ə), or -di·ums.
- Something, such as an intermediate course of action, that occupies a position or represents a condition midway between extremes.
- An intervening substance through which something else is transmitted or carried on.
- An agency by which something is accomplished, conveyed, or transferred
Games are not a medium. Games are meant to be GAMES not propaganda. U are one of the rats aren't you?
#NoSnitchZone
The market has grown exponentially, partly due to attracting new consumers. Gamers were going to be gamers, but that's like saying Japan will always have a steady supply of workers which is false unless there is a new generation and population growth. I don't think developers got together to scheme about making games easier or more accessible. I think the industry saw that there was untapped wells of money that could be tapped. It's therefore the consumer that changed the industry not the producers.
Have you never heard of an Artistic Medium?
Games are not a medium. They are many things such as tools for enhancing memory, reflexes, hand eye coordination, environment mapping (in the brain), creative problem solving, math skills etc etc. As for the general term of "artistic medium," It differs greatly from the term "medium." I could call a dirt road that I drove on an "artistic medium" if I wanted to. Generally a medium is something that conveys a message, and the message tends to be ideological.
A medium is generally something you use to convey a message. I think games should stay away from this (unless you like the idea of every game ending up with COD-like propaganda. Excuse me while I go throw up at the thought of all those kids being told what to think by a bunch of pretentious rich people. After all, games are not work nor are they cable TV).
The market grew because the population grew and internet access grew. Most gamers already wanted easy psychologically manipulative games. Shoot I remember, back when games were hard, everyone wanted cheat codes. That doesn't mean they should be implemented. Just like gamers want cheaper games. That's why in economic theory this is the equivalent of mass dry snitching in the prisoner's dilemma. If there was no or at least relatively little access to these easy psychologically manipulative games, there would still be the same number of gamers out there!
But, this does open up the market for harder games if a few designers would bother focusing on game-play. Hard doesn't mean good, but a game that is well balanced, fun, and extremely difficult is always the best type of game. Just look at Dark Souls. It wasn't even hard (not even remotely, imo) and this generation won't shut up about how cool it is because it is "so hard dude." As long as people are having fun getting decimated by the game, victory is always within reach and is even more stimulating to their brains. The problem is because of mass dry snitching in the industry This Is Simply Less Profitable in the majority of cases.
In great measure, I do blame reviewers for not enforcing a no-snitching policy. Snitches should have gotten bad reviews. But they didn't. Everyone sold out. And in turn our children suffer. What about the children?
I think they definitely are a medium. They are a way to convey ideas to an audience, and it's becoming more and more common these days to create games with a more philosophical questioning than it was in the '70s and '80s which even back in those days have interesting philosophical questions if you peel back the superficial layer of shooting aliens and focus more on the design process, something I think many are more interested now that tools to create games are in the hands of many many more people.
You created a non sequitur with your argument though. Allowing developers to ask questions and convey messages to the audience doesn't lead every game down the same path as Call of Duty. Call of Duty seems to follow the trend of what's popular anyway, it never asks big questions but only gives forth the popular ideas of media focused events. The fact that more games are being created by one man teams also shoots your argument that you don't want corporations telling you what to think. You seem smart enough though that even if corporations have a message behind their game that you would be able to choose whether or not to agree with that message.
As for the growing market couldn't all three be contributing to the growth in the market: user accessibility, internet, and population growth? Your argument now also points to the consumers being at fault for the lack of difficulties in games, like I said. Yes, consumers wanted easier games. Yes, consumers used cheat codes when available. Developers followed the trend of the market. The consumer gets what he wants. Just like the consumer now gets games cheaper then probably any other time in the history of video games. Of course, there is also still the market for difficult games.
Well at least you are no longer arguing that it is just an "artistic medium" that games are turning into. It is an ideological medium. My argument is that THAT is not what they are meant to be, and they should not be turned into one.
Philosophical questioning is great when it strives for objectivity. Still, it is dangerous territory for games. Very dangerous. Just look at TV. It is not even "art." It is simply manipulation. When I brought up COD I was talking about COD's ideological message. This is manipulative psychology being used to subvert logical thought. Whether or not someone is "smart" (that is a vague word - I would say clever instead) enough to see through it is irrelevant, because MOST people are not and Edward Bernays and his pupil Hitler proved this a long time ago. NOTHING follows the trend of what is popular. Some things shape the trend of what is popular, and some things follow the trend of other things that shaped what is popular.
The market does not dictate pricing (Game Theory does - specifically the Prisoner's Dilemma), so why don't game companies start snitching and give us some cheap games? The first one to start snitching would make a killing right? Wrong, the no snitching policy would be strictly enforced because that would mess up everyone else's profits. But snitching on difficulty doesn't hurt anyone's money so they will do it with no repercussions and the gamers get screwed in the end.
Easy games full of thought manipulation, like crack, might feel good at first but the high is short lived and leaves the user craving more. The only way to get another high is to spend more money or try to smoke the little pebbles that fell on the ground (replay the same garbage game they just played with less enjoyment than before). Game companies know this. Game companies need to stop selling drugs and they need to stop snitching.
Paintings/Films/Novels are ideological mediums as well. Who are you to say what games should and should not be? If you want to play space invaders and pacman, play space invaders and pacman. Enjoy them for what they are. You're shouting into a void that doesn't listen; you still have your toys, go play with them.
NOTHING follows the trend of what is popular, yet somethings follow the trend of things that shaped popularity? I'm guessing all the flappy bird clones weren't following the success of flappy bird? I'm guessing the Playstation Move wasn't following the popularity of the Wii?
I think various digital sales and the competitive used market blow the high pricing accusations out of the water. Game Publishers are not afraid to lower prices 2 months after release. The used market place isn't afraid to drop prices to half of what the game sells at new. Digital sales aren't afraid to slash games by 75%.
I don't play space invaders and pacman. I am forced to play games like the OpenXcom because no one cares about game play anymore. The void doesn't listen because it is indeed a void, an abyss, nothing - it will fail. I am just letting it know this ahead of time and inviting you to step out of the void.
"NOTHING follows the trend of what is popular. Some things shape the trend of what is popular, and some things follow the trend of other things that shaped what is popular." Now re read your second paragraph and see if that doesn't make sense. Stop playing word games. I could elaborate but I don't feel like it because you accused me of playing pacman and space invaders. That was an old man reference. I am 25.
"I think various digital sales and the competitive used market blow the high pricing accusations out of the water. Game Publishers are not afraid to lower prices 2 months after release. The used market place isn't afraid to drop prices to half of what the game sells at new. Digital sales aren't afraid to slash games by 75%."
There was no high pricing accusation, just a statement about Game Theory. In fact, I advocate not snitching, making more money off games, and making QUALITY in return. As for the rest, whatever - Game Theory is dictating the market. Game companies as a whole decided to start doing the things you are talking about. The Dons got together and issued a Decree on each of the things you mentioned.
@Minishdriveby said:
@anomaly1989 said:
@Minishdriveby said:
@anomaly1989 said:
@Minishdriveby said:
I don't understand how catering to a wider market constitutes "snitching," companies follow profit. I don't think a more user friendly market has deterred growth of the medium. I think it's promoted it. There are still hard games if that's what you're into.
The market did not grow nor shrink due to easy psychologically manipulative games. Gamers were going to be gamers anyways. Now, with this in mind, understand how the prisoner's dilemma relates. Companies making psychologically manipulative, easy, gimmicky games are snitching.
As for calling games a "medium"
(mē'dē-əm)
n., pl., -di·a (-dē-ə), or -di·ums.
- Something, such as an intermediate course of action, that occupies a position or represents a condition midway between extremes.
- An intervening substance through which something else is transmitted or carried on.
- An agency by which something is accomplished, conveyed, or transferred
Games are not a medium. Games are meant to be GAMES not propaganda. U are one of the rats aren't you?
#NoSnitchZone
The market has grown exponentially, partly due to attracting new consumers. Gamers were going to be gamers, but that's like saying Japan will always have a steady supply of workers which is false unless there is a new generation and population growth. I don't think developers got together to scheme about making games easier or more accessible. I think the industry saw that there was untapped wells of money that could be tapped. It's therefore the consumer that changed the industry not the producers.
Have you never heard of an Artistic Medium?
Games are not a medium. They are many things such as tools for enhancing memory, reflexes, hand eye coordination, environment mapping (in the brain), creative problem solving, math skills etc etc. As for the general term of "artistic medium," It differs greatly from the term "medium." I could call a dirt road that I drove on an "artistic medium" if I wanted to. Generally a medium is something that conveys a message, and the message tends to be ideological.
A medium is generally something you use to convey a message. I think games should stay away from this (unless you like the idea of every game ending up with COD-like propaganda. Excuse me while I go throw up at the thought of all those kids being told what to think by a bunch of pretentious rich people. After all, games are not work nor are they cable TV).
The market grew because the population grew and internet access grew. Most gamers already wanted easy psychologically manipulative games. Shoot I remember, back when games were hard, everyone wanted cheat codes. That doesn't mean they should be implemented. Just like gamers want cheaper games. That's why in economic theory this is the equivalent of mass dry snitching in the prisoner's dilemma. If there was no or at least relatively little access to these easy psychologically manipulative games, there would still be the same number of gamers out there!
But, this does open up the market for harder games if a few designers would bother focusing on game-play. Hard doesn't mean good, but a game that is well balanced, fun, and extremely difficult is always the best type of game. Just look at Dark Souls. It wasn't even hard (not even remotely, imo) and this generation won't shut up about how cool it is because it is "so hard dude." As long as people are having fun getting decimated by the game, victory is always within reach and is even more stimulating to their brains. The problem is because of mass dry snitching in the industry This Is Simply Less Profitable in the majority of cases.
In great measure, I do blame reviewers for not enforcing a no-snitching policy. Snitches should have gotten bad reviews. But they didn't. Everyone sold out. And in turn our children suffer. What about the children?
I think they definitely are a medium. They are a way to convey ideas to an audience, and it's becoming more and more common these days to create games with a more philosophical questioning than it was in the '70s and '80s which even back in those days have interesting philosophical questions if you peel back the superficial layer of shooting aliens and focus more on the design process, something I think many are more interested now that tools to create games are in the hands of many many more people.
You created a non sequitur with your argument though. Allowing developers to ask questions and convey messages to the audience doesn't lead every game down the same path as Call of Duty. Call of Duty seems to follow the trend of what's popular anyway, it never asks big questions but only gives forth the popular ideas of media focused events. The fact that more games are being created by one man teams also shoots your argument that you don't want corporations telling you what to think. You seem smart enough though that even if corporations have a message behind their game that you would be able to choose whether or not to agree with that message.
As for the growing market couldn't all three be contributing to the growth in the market: user accessibility, internet, and population growth? Your argument now also points to the consumers being at fault for the lack of difficulties in games, like I said. Yes, consumers wanted easier games. Yes, consumers used cheat codes when available. Developers followed the trend of the market. The consumer gets what he wants. Just like the consumer now gets games cheaper then probably any other time in the history of video games. Of course, there is also still the market for difficult games.
Well at least you are no longer arguing that it is just an "artistic medium" that games are turning into. It is an ideological medium. My argument is that THAT is not what they are meant to be, and they should not be turned into one.
Philosophical questioning is great when it strives for objectivity. Still, it is dangerous territory for games. Very dangerous. Just look at TV. It is not even "art." It is simply manipulation. When I brought up COD I was talking about COD's ideological message. This is manipulative psychology being used to subvert logical thought. Whether or not someone is "smart" (that is a vague word - I would say clever instead) enough to see through it is irrelevant, because MOST people are not and Edward Bernays and his pupil Hitler proved this a long time ago. NOTHING follows the trend of what is popular. Some things shape the trend of what is popular, and some things follow the trend of other things that shaped what is popular.
The market does not dictate pricing (Game Theory does - specifically the Prisoner's Dilemma), so why don't game companies start snitching and give us some cheap games? The first one to start snitching would make a killing right? Wrong, the no snitching policy would be strictly enforced because that would mess up everyone else's profits. But snitching on difficulty doesn't hurt anyone's money so they will do it with no repercussions and the gamers get screwed in the end.
Easy games full of thought manipulation, like crack, might feel good at first but the high is short lived and leaves the user craving more. The only way to get another high is to spend more money or try to smoke the little pebbles that fell on the ground (replay the same garbage game they just played with less enjoyment than before). Game companies know this. Game companies need to stop selling drugs and they need to stop snitching.
@Minishdriveby said:
@anomaly1989 said:
@Minishdriveby said:
I don't understand how catering to a wider market constitutes "snitching," companies follow profit. I don't think a more user friendly market has deterred growth of the medium. I think it's promoted it. There are still hard games if that's what you're into.
The market did not grow nor shrink due to easy psychologically manipulative games. Gamers were going to be gamers anyways. Now, with this in mind, understand how the prisoner's dilemma relates. Companies making psychologically manipulative, easy, gimmicky games are snitching.
As for calling games a "medium"
(mē'dē-əm)
n., pl., -di·a (-dē-ə), or -di·ums.
- Something, such as an intermediate course of action, that occupies a position or represents a condition midway between extremes.
- An intervening substance through which something else is transmitted or carried on.
- An agency by which something is accomplished, conveyed, or transferred
Games are not a medium. Games are meant to be GAMES not propaganda. U are one of the rats aren't you?
#NoSnitchZone
The market has grown exponentially, partly due to attracting new consumers. Gamers were going to be gamers, but that's like saying Japan will always have a steady supply of workers which is false unless there is a new generation and population growth. I don't think developers got together to scheme about making games easier or more accessible. I think the industry saw that there was untapped wells of money that could be tapped. It's therefore the consumer that changed the industry not the producers.
Have you never heard of an Artistic Medium?
Games are not a medium. They are many things such as tools for enhancing memory, reflexes, hand eye coordination, environment mapping (in the brain), creative problem solving, math skills etc etc. As for the general term of "artistic medium," It differs greatly from the term "medium." I could call a dirt road that I drove on an "artistic medium" if I wanted to. Generally a medium is something that conveys a message, and the message tends to be ideological.
A medium is generally something you use to convey a message. I think games should stay away from this (unless you like the idea of every game ending up with COD-like propaganda. Excuse me while I go throw up at the thought of all those kids being told what to think by a bunch of pretentious rich people. After all, games are not work nor are they cable TV).
The market grew because the population grew and internet access grew. Most gamers already wanted easy psychologically manipulative games. Shoot I remember, back when games were hard, everyone wanted cheat codes. That doesn't mean they should be implemented. Just like gamers want cheaper games. That's why in economic theory this is the equivalent of mass dry snitching in the prisoner's dilemma. If there was no or at least relatively little access to these easy psychologically manipulative games, there would still be the same number of gamers out there!
But, this does open up the market for harder games if a few designers would bother focusing on game-play. Hard doesn't mean good, but a game that is well balanced, fun, and extremely difficult is always the best type of game. Just look at Dark Souls. It wasn't even hard (not even remotely, imo) and this generation won't shut up about how cool it is because it is "so hard dude." As long as people are having fun getting decimated by the game, victory is always within reach and is even more stimulating to their brains. The problem is because of mass dry snitching in the industry This Is Simply Less Profitable in the majority of cases.
In great measure, I do blame reviewers for not enforcing a no-snitching policy. Snitches should have gotten bad reviews. But they didn't. Everyone sold out. And in turn our children suffer. What about the children?
@Minishdriveby said:
I don't understand how catering to a wider market constitutes "snitching," companies follow profit. I don't think a more user friendly market has deterred growth of the medium. I think it's promoted it. There are still hard games if that's what you're into.
The market did not grow nor shrink due to easy psychologically manipulative games. Gamers were going to be gamers anyways. Now, with this in mind, understand how the prisoner's dilemma relates. Companies making psychologically manipulative, easy, gimmicky games are snitching.
As for calling games a "medium"
(mē'dē-əm)
n., pl., -di·a (-dē-ə), or -di·ums.
- Something, such as an intermediate course of action, that occupies a position or represents a condition midway between extremes.
- An intervening substance through which something else is transmitted or carried on.
- An agency by which something is accomplished, conveyed, or transferred
Games are not a medium. Games are meant to be GAMES not propaganda. U are one of the rats aren't you?
#NoSnitchZone
@platinumking320:
I liked the first Kane and Lynch but I was completely wasted the whole time I was playing it. Interesting story about Kane and Lynch - I was playing at my friends 3rd story apartment over the lake and a real police helicopter came right up to the balcony and shined a light in for a good amount of time before completely leaving the lake.
Anyways, I don't remember enough of it to comment, but in general you are right, There are nothing but cheap gimmicks and lame game play these days. The level design is boring. The loadouts are overpowered. Death means literally nothing but a 5 second reload. Death should mean something (XCOM Ironman Mode got this right). There must be a huge death penalty or a lot of backtracking to do upon death....or both preferably.
It's like they are saying "Hey America: This is what we think of you idiots. Enjoy. 60 bucks."
Did you know that in the DMC 3 American release - all the difficulty was reduced for us whiney pathetic Americans. Japan's normal was America's easy, Hard (Japan) was normal (America). They even threw us an extra easy mode. This is seriously pathetic.
@Fenmapus said:
From a gamer’s point of view there is no reason whatsoever to be excited about console exclusivity. The fanboyism it has created translates to “The multinational mega-corporation I’m giving all my money to is better than your multinational mega-corporation!” and sound exactly as ridiculous. I don’t know if its brilliant PR, or that humans inherently want to belong to one group and hate another, but I don’t believe that console exclusivity should be anything to be happy about as a gamer.
Do you vote for Democrats or Republicans? Their policy is nearly identical. Their sponsors are the same people. It is basically voting for the same person. Obama talks about redistributing the wealth, but if you haven't noticed not much of that is happening and his main sponsors in the McCain election were from the financial sector ;). Divide and conquer is the oldest strategy in the book.
The regulated and the regulator
The anti-hacker and the hacker
Life is one big scam these days
They are all the same people!
But yes, they play on people's natural inclination to segregate themselves and feel superior to another logically non-existent type of person. "Oh...he's one of those." One of what? I am me - not one of "those." The primal circuitry in the human brain seems to be incapable of escaping this though. IDK if it was part of our sentencing in Babylon or what, but it sure is annoying. Especially when you are one of those who sees through the non-existent lines people draw in the non-existent sands. You can try to tell them the lines and the sands don't even exist, but they sure as heck will not believe you. Never free a mind once it has reached a certain age, I guess.
Please appreciate the humor in this brief lesson for what it is - humor:
Game Theory is all about human cooperation. The Prisoner's Dilemma (part of Game Theory) can be summed up to this in pricing (don't worry, I will get to the part about difficulty in a second):
2 giant evil corporations (muahahaha) decide they want to maximize profits so they cooperate on pricing. In The Prisoner's Dilemma, there is an analogy based on two criminals in an interrogation room. Either one can get a temporary, lesser, and short-term benefit from snitching on the other one. If neither of them snitch, it works out best for both of them.
Well, it is slightly more complicated than that but only slightly and I want to keep this simple. There are also different versions.
In this analogy, dropping the price of a product to gain a competitive edge on your competition is considered snitching.
As you can imagine, the international crime syndicates we call Multinational Corporations have figured out that snitching is bad for money. So they do not betray each other with regards to pricing. This is why all your new games cost $60 no matter who makes them (please don't jump in saying I'm wrong because this or that game happened to be 50. It is a general thing, but sometimes they betray each other - often out of desperation but sometimes as a calculated risk)
On to the difficulty part:
Back in the day, gaming companies recognized the value of a difficult game. They knew they could make the game easier, psychologically manipulate players instead of focusing on game play, crank out more games, and make more money. BUT, back then this would have been considered snitching. Once someone starts snitching - almost everyone starts snitching (shout out to all my real gaming companies that didn't rat, few and far between as you may be). It is the only way to stay in business at that point.
Now, back then snitching in this way (let's call this dry snitching) would have came with a penalty. Bad reviews, bad reputation etc...
Just some thoughts on why games are garbage these days.
Now:
Back to your regularly scheduled checkpoints, abundant health packs, trivial if not non-existent death penalties, cut-scenes every 5 minutes, mind-numbingly depth lacking, permadeathless, strategically mundane, profanity ridden, hollywood games.
If you need me, I will be playing something much cooler than what you are playing albeit in 2d and 10-20 years old.
@anomaly1989"Why is it so popular to use this word in video game culture? " word in question rape or ***
Both are forms of hate speech and should be disallowed. As a Christian, there are few things more annoying than another Christian running around calling homosexuals "fags" and calling promiscuous women "whores" while pretending to evangelize. God was quite specific about not judging outside the church, and was also very specific about foul language that does not serve the betterment of others souls. However, wide-spread use of the word "rape" in this context originated in the real gaming culture of America and not the erred religious culture of America. Hence the gamespot post.
Yes all hate speech should be disallowed, however the use of the word "rape" is especially damaging to the gaming community and is specifically relevant to the gaming community. That is why this post is about that specific word. Why has every other poster tried to work the angle of "what about this or that?" Well, I am not discussing "this or that" right now and the reason for this specific discussion is obvious to anyone who has ever played a video game. The profits being lost already are also relevant to gaming companies, as are the potential profits to be gained.
You did not actually answer the question, btw.
@notorious1234na:
I agree that lulz are in order for any COD recommending therapist. Therapeutic games require thought, concentration, strategy, fun, and skill. Especially in FPS games.
Other than that: my dog is more thought-provoking than your post.
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