Question for all about Israel

Meh...

There exist many Christians which seem to have not read certain parts of the Bible like the book of Hebrews.  The result is an unbiblical view on who Israel is.

Let me explain.  Many interpret texts like Genesis 18:18 out of context with the rest of scripture.  The text states, "Abraham will surely become a great and powerful nation, and all nations on earth will be blessed through him."  The result of treating this out of context is the idea that if you bless the physical nation of Israel you yourself will be blessed.

People like this Zionistic Pastor seem to have never read passages like Romans 9.  Romans 9:6b-8 states, "For not all who are descended from Israel are Israel. Nor because they are his descendants are they all Abraham's children. On the contrary, "It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned." In other words, it is not the natural children who are God's children, but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham's offspring."  The rest of the chapter goes more in detail not to mention many other passages of scripture.

Basically, many Christians think they should bless and support the physical nation of Israel no matter the circumstances without realizing it is they that should be a blessing to the world.............. I honestly can't stand that view point.  Many who do take the position that people in the Old Testament were saved by the Law and sacrifices, not by grace.  That stance is completely unbiblical....

Keep in mind I used to believe this same stuff as my small country church believes this very same thing... Also, do not think I'm in any way against helping the Jewish people, I just do not like such strong misinterpretations of scripture.

And as for Christians trying to "speed up" Jesus' second coming, they need to quit and actually do something that will actually effect the world positively...

A quick question for mindstorm before I get on the topic. Do you study christianity? Where and what course? (Asking because I want to study it next year at uni along with philosophy).

And as regards to the topic, these people want to fulfill prophecy themselves inorder to bring God's coming even sooner (at least how they view it, I think). I personally don't think this is either good or bad, we should give charity to all nations.

A quick question for mindstorm before I get on the topic. Do you study christianity? Where and what course? (Asking because I want to study it next year at uni along with philosophy).

123625

Most colleges will offer a class like a historical overview of the New Testament but the professor rarely looks at more than one view of that history.  For example, a friend of mine goes to a public institution and gave purely their own thoughts on what the Bible teaches instead of laying out what many believe.  They might do so through only acknowledging Paul to have written about 7 letters while the vast majority of Evangelicals believe him to have written 14 letters.  Whatever you might take as a class should really be taken with a grain of salt as a result.

I'm a senior Christian Studies major at a private Southern Baptist University (North Greenville University) so to say I've taken a course on Christianity is an understatement.  I'm completely surrounded by Christian thought all the time, and questions like these come up many times a day.  Me and my friends simply discuss this stuff all the time... even until 3am at Denny's like last night.  Not to mention my own studies I do for fun.  I'm going to take at least 4 years more worth of classes at a Seminary, specifically Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary.  I say all of this to simply say one class vary rarely is able to touch the surface of Christianity.

I wish there were a class that one could take and then simply know everything there is to know about Christianity but that simply is not the case.  If it were I wouldn't feel like I've only graced the surface of the Christian faith. 

As for how I've learned about what I just spoke on in regards to Israel, it's a mixture of personal study, being around the other belief growing up, and a class that I took called Redemption in the Old Testament.  The professor has a doctorate in Hebrew and another in Greek so it was quite an amazing class.

Can someone clarifly the second coming of Jesus? Why would supporting Israel bring the second coming of Jesus?helium_flash

Romans 11:26a states, "And so all Israel will be saved."  Basicaly, many people believe Jesus will come back once Israel is united and at peace.  Once again the definition of Israel decides what this means.  Either God is waiting for peace in Israel or he is having patience in waiting for some people to come to Christ.  I take the latter approach...

Keep in mind I could be a little wrong on this issue... eschatology is not my forte.

I wouldn't trust any televangalist.helium_flash

Smart idea. :P

Eschatology!! I just learned a new word! :o

So I guess before Israel was created again in the mid 20th century, to Zionists there was no chance of a second coming? What if Israel is destroyed again?

Cameron, I've always understood, and heard sermons on it as well that the Temple had a major role in Jesus 2nd coming as well.  Have you run into that in your studies?btaylor2404

I'm not completely sure to be honest.  I know many who are fanatical about the "end times" talk about things like this but I can't say I know why or even what.  What I can tell about Jesus' Second Coming is he will come unlike before.  Instead of coming in the name of grace he will come as a judge.  Instead of being a suffering servent (Isaiah 53), he will come as king of the righteous and judge of the unrighteous (Psalm 2).

Many people try to figure out what is going to happen in detail but I personally do not think it will be done.  Just as Jesus caught people by surprise the first time I think many will be surprised the second.  People figured he'd come in and releaved the Israelites from the oppression of Roman rule.  Did he? Nope.  He came with a goal in mind much greater than had been thought... and did so according to Old Testament prophecy.

Eschatology!! I just learned a new word! :o

So I guess before Israel was created again in the mid 20th century, to Zionists there was no chance of a second coming? What if Israel is destroyed again?

 

helium_flash

First off, they'd freak out and make excuses.  I do not pretend to know whether Israel becoming a nation is indeed a fortelling of scripture.  It may, it may not.  I don't know...