Why is a good story so hard to come by?

Because when you can't do good gameplay because of platform limitations, you settle for story.Neon_Noir

[QUOTE="Neon_Noir"]Because when you can't do good gameplay because of platform limitations, you settle for story.darkspineslayer

Because when you can't do good gameplay because of platform limitations, you settle for story.Neon_Noir

Gravity Rush says hai.

Are high budgets on consoles contributing to this?darkspineslayer

It's the main reason, seemingly.

Also, play more PC games.

[QUOTE="darkspineslayer"]Are high budgets on consoles contributing to this?Cherokee_Jack

I don't agree with your argument and feel great games can be on any platform. Look at Heavy Rain and Allan Wake. Both fantastic emotional stories on two different platforms that aren't handhelds. Uncharted is another good example and so is Ni No Kuni. Anyways, there are a lot of great story given games on every platform.nightshade869

Gameplay >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> StoryNeon_Noir

The problem with stories in games is that most of them aren't actually /about/ anything. Could you tell me about the themes in Uncharted?

But I have played games with really good stories. As I listed in my earlier post. Though I guess that depends on whether or not you think Dear Esther is a "game."

[QUOTE="Neon_Noir"]Gameplay >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Storycampzor

The problem with stories in games is that most of them aren't actually /about/ anything. Could you tell me about the themes in Uncharted?PannicAtack

[QUOTE="nightshade869"]I don't agree with your argument and feel great games can be on any platform. Look at Heavy Rain and Allan Wake. Both fantastic emotional stories on two different platforms that aren't handhelds. Uncharted is another good example and so is Ni No Kuni. Anyways, there are a lot of great story given games on every platform.darkspineslayer

[QUOTE="PannicAtack"]The problem with stories in games is that most of them aren't actually /about/ anything. Could you tell me about the themes in Uncharted?darkspineslayer

[QUOTE="darkspineslayer"][QUOTE="nightshade869"]I don't agree with your argument and feel great games can be on any platform. Look at Heavy Rain and Allan Wake. Both fantastic emotional stories on two different platforms that aren't handhelds. Uncharted is another good example and so is Ni No Kuni. Anyways, there are a lot of great story given games on every platform.nightshade869

Because writing and thinking are hard.

[QUOTE="darkspineslayer"][QUOTE="PannicAtack"]The problem with stories in games is that most of them aren't actually /about/ anything. Could you tell me about the themes in Uncharted?nightshade869

Games are a very hard medium to do good stories in, they have a level of interactivity and player control that makes it very hard to have a great narrative. The ones with really good stories or narratives are usually something like visual novels or have limited gameplay

Yakuza and Metal Gear are good if you have the necessary IQ to enjoy them.  ;)

Yakuza 3 and 4 are cheap right now and you can buy the Metal Gear Solid Collection to play Metal Gear Solid 3. I don't tell you to buy MGS4 because that game's mostly fan-service.

Because you're looking in the wrong medium.

[QUOTE="nightshade869"][QUOTE="darkspineslayer"] No, I couldn't. That's kind of my point actually. Why are games with a good story and a point to make so rare? Uncharted's whole point is being an action flick in game form. Now if I asked someone in this topic to explain the themes in something like Half Life 2, you might get an answer. It's a good example of gameplay and story, apparently.darkspineslayer

you can't even come up with fair criticism to bash on Uncharted 3. Those aren't even plotholes if you had a brain to figure it out but anyway.   :lol:

just imagine. If writing a book and writing a script for a film is hard (the reason why we have so many bad movies) how much more harder would it be when you have to make it interactive? Like you make a game about Looper (2012), the story of the movie is fantastic but what types of gameplay other than a corridor cover shooting would you be able to include within its context? I mean, to make a game fun you need lots of creativity and sometimes that creativity doesn't go well with the story so then what do you do? That's when you need to make some sacrifices... Like fawk  the story and make the character do some super-human stuff even though he has no powers or maybe turn a normal guy into a professional killer. These are the kind of choices you have to make when you want to be unique with your story-telling and gameplay unless you want to keep going with the mold of military background and more shooting for the sake of some consistency even if generic. And even then you would need the knowledge about guns and other military backgrounds to even make a story like the one in the Call of Duty games.

I bet you think that even writing a "decent" story is not that hard but it is. Create likeable characters, interesting plots, intriguing settings, a good script, the scenarios, the editing... These things don't come easy and they are not something just anybody could do. You could write about personal stories like love but how much fun would it be in a game? How much fun would it be to anybody else if is not well written?

The only reason you're talking all this garbage is because you have never tried to write something. Just do it and ask for the opinion of other people about what you wrote and I can assure you that some dreams will be crushed. This sh*t is complex as hell.

Why do you think this is so rare?darkspineslayer

Few developers want to spend time on crafting an intricate narrative when they could be working on visuals, sound, gameplay, level creation, AI etc.

[QUOTE="Neon_Noir"]Gameplay >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Storycampzor

Would Tetris be any better with a story? Lolno.

The last console game that had this effect on the general population was the Mass Effect series. darkspineslayer

Yeah, in a bad way.

[QUOTE="campzor"][QUOTE="Neon_Noir"]Gameplay >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> StoryBlbecekBobecek

Would Tetris be any better with a story? Lolno.

Because writing and thinking are hard.

Vaasman

actually because reading is hard, cod generation thinks if they stop 5 mins to read something or watch a cutscene they are wasting time while they could be killing the same npcs for the 100th time so devs hardly even bother, you know, dat low attention span.

You need to read more books.

[QUOTE="Vaasman"]

Because writing and thinking are hard.

Krelian-co

actually because reading is hard, cod generation thinks if they stop 5 mins to read something or watch a cutscene they are wasting time while they could be killing the same npcs for the 100th time so devs hardly even bother, you know, dat low attention span.

[QUOTE="Vaasman"]

Because writing and thinking are hard.

Krelian-co

actually because reading is hard, cod generation thinks if they stop 5 mins to read something or watch a cutscene they are wasting time while they could be killing the same npcs for the 100th time so devs hardly even bother, you know, dat low attention span.

Sadly, this is literally true, I've experienced this exact thing with a few morons I know.

because most humans play Angry Birdshippiesanta

The sad reality of things.

Because developers make games not books. And (most?) gamers want play games not watching cutscenes/movie

[QUOTE="Krelian-co"]

[QUOTE="Vaasman"]

Because writing and thinking are hard.

Neon_Noir

actually because reading is hard, cod generation thinks if they stop 5 mins to read something or watch a cutscene they are wasting time while they could be killing the same npcs for the 100th time so devs hardly even bother, you know, dat low attention span.

Some people just play for gameplay, sure, but it is a very diverse medium and some games are meant to be taken in as a complete package. You think Journey or TWD would have gotten any GOTY awards if they were judged solely on the merits of their gameplay? I doubt anyone played Amnesia just for it's rudementary puzzle design. What about something like God of War? Would it even be half as recognised if it had small scale fights and T rated violence?

A good story or good art can go a long way towards improving the experience. Gameplay improvement doesn't have to be the only goal developers can strive for while evolving the medium.

Ask Gearbox and what they did with Aliens: Colonial Marines.

Specifically ask this guy:

If you are expecting a Citizen Kane story, or an Oscar worthy story you are probably looking in the wrong place. However lots of video games have good stories. Mass Effect, Dead Space, Bioshock, Halo, Gears, Uncharted, Assassin's Creed, etc. Most of these series have inspired books, and / or movies so there must be a good story there somewhere. Maybe your just too picky TC?

[QUOTE="Neon_Noir"][QUOTE="Krelian-co"]

actually because reading is hard, cod generation thinks if they stop 5 mins to read something or watch a cutscene they are wasting time while they could be killing the same npcs for the 100th time so devs hardly even bother, you know, dat low attention span.

Vaasman

Some people just play for gameplay, sure, but it is a very diverse medium and some games are meant to be taken in as a complete package. You think Journey or TWD would have gotten any GOTY awards if they were judged solely on the merits of their gameplay? I doubt anyone played Amnesia just for it's rudementary puzzle design. What about something like God of War? Would it even be half as recognised if it had small scale fights and T rated violence?

A good story or good art can go a long way towards improving the experience. Gameplay improvement doesn't have to be the only goal developers can strive for while evolving the medium.

If you are expecting a Citizen Kane story, or an Oscar worthy story you are probably looking in the wrong place. However lots of video games have good stories. Mass Effect, Dead Space, Bioshock, Halo, Gears, Uncharted, Assassin's Creed, etc. Most of these series have inspired books, and / or movies so there must be a good story there somewhere. Maybe your just too picky TC?

coasterguy65

Storytelling and interactivity can easily get in the way of one another.

To be honest, I wish most games would drop the story entirely. Sure, a few good stories are nice, but why try when failure is inevitable, especially when said failure ends up getting in the way of the reason people play your game.

Adventure games are the best genre for storytelling. And those games are far more structured than the rest. 

[QUOTE="Cherokee_Jack"][QUOTE="darkspineslayer"]Are high budgets on consoles contributing to this?darkspineslayer

Well here, I can help... Sit right down lemme tell ya a story bout a man named Jed, a poor mountaineer who can barely keep his family fed, and then one day he was shootin at some food, and up from the ground came a bublin crude, oil that is, black gold, Texas T, well, the next thing ya know ole Jed's a million-er and his kin folk said, hey Jed, move away from here, Californy is the place ya ought to be so the loaded up the truck and they moved to Beverly, Hills that is, swimin pools, movie stars. :twisted:

Made me think hmm, anyone ever try and make The Beverly Hillbillies into a game. :o :P

The Mass Effect games is an excellent example of a perfect blend of action and story. Video game perfection.001011000101101

The Mass Effect games is an excellent example of a perfect blend of action and story. Video game perfection.001011000101101