The term "Flop" in the gaming industry.

This topic is locked from further discussion.

#1 Edited by MrYamini (10 posts) -

Please watch my video on this very topic- /watch?v=3n7fs6peZVI

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So yesterday, a Youtube critic said Sonic Worlds flopped in response to a thread made here on how the game received bad ratings by Gamespot. He made this argument citing this website and its users on what determined if the game flopped or not.

I am here to dispel the notion of a game, or any product flopping based on quality, hype and a few reviews by bias critics.

First off, Sonic Lost Worlds is not a flop. It has not been on the market long enough to determine if it is a flop.

A Flop is determined by 2 factors. The amount of consumers buying the product, and the the revenue gained off of product. This is how ALL businesses determine what is a successful product and what isn't. This is why there are many great movies and VIDEO GAMES that will not have sequels. Those movies and VIDEO GAMES flopped, and the production company is not interested in investing in a product that has already cost them money.

So to reiterate the point, the people who BUY the product are ultimately the ones who determine if a product flops or not. Not a review website, Not a critic, Not the quality of the game, not the hype. Regardless of how bad the reception of a particular product is, if it made enough money, it will have a successor. That successor may promise to correct whatever flaws were in the original product, but if it sold, it was NOT a flop.

Now with that said, I am interested in hearing what you all have to say regarding this topic.

#2 Edited by lundy86_4 (42805 posts) -

Games flop here, if they fail to meet hype.

Scores are rated:

AE: 7-7.5

AAE: 8-8.5

AAAE: 9-9.5

AAAAE: 10

------

E = Exclusive (one system).

That's it, that's all.

#3 Posted by MonsieurX (29157 posts) -

Not going to watch your video

#4 Posted by TheEroica (13221 posts) -
#5 Edited by airshocker (28710 posts) -

Normal standards of what a flop is don't apply to SW. In fact, logic doesn't even really apply to SW so all of this is moot to begin with.

#6 Posted by psymon100 (6138 posts) -

bu bu but

a game which is successful in business, might not be a game i enjoy.

a game i really enjoy, might not achieve good sales.

a game which achieves widespread critical acclaim from users, still might not get a sequel.

i see what you're saying tc. in a board room this conversation would be greeted with plenty of nodding and the offer to pick up your coffee. here in sw unfortunately i'm afraid I'm going to have to ask you to make my coffee. please. please someone get me a coffee. please.

#7 Edited by MrYamini (10 posts) -

Games flop here, if they fail to meet hype.

Scores are rated:

AE: 7-7.5

AAE: 8-8.5

AAAE: 9-9.5

AAAAE: 10

------

E = Exclusive (one system).

That's it, that's all.

Why is that though. What set of people created this standard of backwards thinking.

Watch Machinima's "Top 10 FLOPS of the Video Game Industry"..They (some) are FLOPS because they did not sell, not because they were bad games.

#8 Edited by airshocker (28710 posts) -

@mryamini said:

Why is that though. What set of people created this standard of backwards thinking.

Rofl. WELCOME TO SW! This place has even created names for people who like certain consoles more than the other. It's absurdly hilarious.

#9 Posted by psymon100 (6138 posts) -

@mryamini said:

@lundy86_4 said:

Games flop here, if they fail to meet hype.

Scores are rated:

AE: 7-7.5

AAE: 8-8.5

AAAE: 9-9.5

AAAAE: 10

------

E = Exclusive (one system).

That's it, that's all.

Why is that though. What set of people created this standard of backwards thinking.

Watch Machinima's "Top 10 FLOPS of the Video Game Industry"..They (some) are FLOPS because they did not sell, not because they were bad games.

I don't know who is in charge.

#10 Posted by lundy86_4 (42805 posts) -

@mryamini said:

Why is that though. What set of people created this standard of backwards thinking.

Watch Machinima's "Top 10 FLOPS of the Video Game Industry"..They (some) are FLOPS because they did not sell, not because they were bad games.

The SW community. It's inherent to this board.

----

You came here, and it's part of this board. People spreading it elsewhere are dipsh*ts.

#11 Edited by lostrib (32942 posts) -

don't spam your shit here

#12 Posted by Ribnarak (2282 posts) -

TC all intelligent thinking must be left outside before entering the world of system wars.

#13 Posted by MrYamini (10 posts) -

@mryamini said:

Why is that though. What set of people created this standard of backwards thinking.

Watch Machinima's "Top 10 FLOPS of the Video Game Industry"..They (some) are FLOPS because they did not sell, not because they were bad games.

The SW community. It's inherent to this board.

----

You came here, and it's part of this board. People spreading it elsewhere are dipsh*ts.

That is exactly what is happening though. People are spreading this nonsense and then using these very boards as their proof. I don't know if you are familiar with BlackB0nd, but is the guy I am having a disagreement with. Although he is pretty insignificant within the gaming community, it is the point.

#14 Edited by lundy86_4 (42805 posts) -

@mryamini said:

That is exactly what is happening though. People are spreading this nonsense and then using these very boards as their proof. I don't know if you are familiar with BlackB0nd, but is the guy I am having a disagreement with. Although he is pretty insignificant within the gaming community, it is the point.

How many people? Quote who, and post the links. You stated it was an individual. Hardly an issue.

Yep, Blackb0nd was a big poster here, forever ago. Just let it slide.

#15 Posted by Blackbond (24485 posts) -

Not going to watch your video

Exactly what I said. Dude made this thread and that video because of my video. What can I say King Bond severing conscious minds as usual

#16 Posted by Basinboy (10973 posts) -

Flop: a game that fails to live up to expectations

#17 Posted by Blackbond (24485 posts) -

@mryamini said:

That is exactly what is happening though. People are spreading this nonsense and then using these very boards as their proof. I don't know if you are familiar with BlackB0nd, but is the guy I am having a disagreement with. Although he is pretty insignificant within the gaming community, it is the point.

How many people? Quote who, and post the links. You stated it was an individual. Hardly an issue.

Yep, Blackb0nd was a big poster here, forever ago. Just let it slide.

9,000 subs, one of the most famous posters on this board ever and even voted its King. Haven't posted forever and people still know me and yet I'm insignificant in the gaming community by this guy. I love the damage control LOL

#18 Posted by Samus3D (1675 posts) -

Given how most reviewers marked down Lost World for "being too difficult" and "Sonic's too slow" I wouldn't consider that a flop.

#19 Posted by lundy86_4 (42805 posts) -

@lundy86_4 said:

@mryamini said:

That is exactly what is happening though. People are spreading this nonsense and then using these very boards as their proof. I don't know if you are familiar with BlackB0nd, but is the guy I am having a disagreement with. Although he is pretty insignificant within the gaming community, it is the point.

How many people? Quote who, and post the links. You stated it was an individual. Hardly an issue.

Yep, Blackb0nd was a big poster here, forever ago. Just let it slide.

9,000 subs, one of the most famous posters on this board ever and even voted its King. Haven't posted forever and people still know me and yet I'm insignificant in the gaming community by this guy. I love the damage control LOL

Insignificant by me?

#20 Edited by asylumni (2103 posts) -

@mryamini said:
@lundy86_4 said:

@mryamini said:

Why is that though. What set of people created this standard of backwards thinking.

Watch Machinima's "Top 10 FLOPS of the Video Game Industry"..They (some) are FLOPS because they did not sell, not because they were bad games.

The SW community. It's inherent to this board.

----

You came here, and it's part of this board. People spreading it elsewhere are dipsh*ts.

That is exactly what is happening though. People are spreading this nonsense and then using these very boards as their proof. I don't know if you are familiar with BlackB0nd, but is the guy I am having a disagreement with. Although he is pretty insignificant within the gaming community, it is the point.

You do realize that words can have more than one meaning, right? Even with the same base language different communities can adopt special meanings to words or phrases. System Wars is, itself, just such a community. We ascribe a meaning to the term "flop" that is not particularly recognized outside of this community, but that doesn't make it any less valid. You coming here making sweeping statements about our "backwards thinking" is incredibly rude and won't make a very good impression. It is akin to traveling to a foreign country and criticizing their language and customs because they don't match your own.

#21 Edited by MrYamini (10 posts) -

@lundy86_4 said:

@mryamini said:

That is exactly what is happening though. People are spreading this nonsense and then using these very boards as their proof. I don't know if you are familiar with BlackB0nd, but is the guy I am having a disagreement with. Although he is pretty insignificant within the gaming community, it is the point.

How many people? Quote who, and post the links. You stated it was an individual. Hardly an issue.

Yep, Blackb0nd was a big poster here, forever ago. Just let it slide.

9,000 subs, one of the most famous posters on this board ever and even voted its King. Haven't posted forever and people still know me and yet I'm insignificant in the gaming community by this guy. I love the damage control LOL

LOL. You found lil old me after Blocking me on your Youtube account for exposing you on the word FLOP. You, and many others are either ignorant or very stupid. Your contributions to the gaming community is very insignificant. I can list 10 other personalities that have contributed to the community in a positive and informative way. You sir, are a troll that has been exposed for the fraud that you are.

#22 Posted by MrYamini (10 posts) -

@asylumni said:

@mryamini said:
@lundy86_4 said:

@mryamini said:

Why is that though. What set of people created this standard of backwards thinking.

Watch Machinima's "Top 10 FLOPS of the Video Game Industry"..They (some) are FLOPS because they did not sell, not because they were bad games.

The SW community. It's inherent to this board.

----

You came here, and it's part of this board. People spreading it elsewhere are dipsh*ts.

That is exactly what is happening though. People are spreading this nonsense and then using these very boards as their proof. I don't know if you are familiar with BlackB0nd, but is the guy I am having a disagreement with. Although he is pretty insignificant within the gaming community, it is the point.

You do realize that words can have more than one meaning, right? Even with the same base language different communities can adopt special meanings to words or phrases. System Wars is, itself, just such a community. We ascribe a meaning to the term "flop" that is not particularly recognized outside of this community, but that doesn't make it any less valid. You coming here making sweeping statements about our "backwards thinking" is incredibly rude and won't make a very good impression. It is akin to traveling to a foreign country and criticizing their language and customs because they don't match your own.

I understand that. Use it on here all you want, but dont use it outside of this community and believe it is valid, because it is not. The original and most widely accepted usage of the word still trumps the Gamespot communities usage of the word. I assume the word only became used like that in this community because of the ignorance of that it truly meant to flop and just stuck similar to calling an Indigenous American an Indian.

#23 Posted by asylumni (2103 posts) -

@mryamini said:

@asylumni said:

@mryamini said:
@lundy86_4 said:

@mryamini said:

Why is that though. What set of people created this standard of backwards thinking.

Watch Machinima's "Top 10 FLOPS of the Video Game Industry"..They (some) are FLOPS because they did not sell, not because they were bad games.

The SW community. It's inherent to this board.

----

You came here, and it's part of this board. People spreading it elsewhere are dipsh*ts.

That is exactly what is happening though. People are spreading this nonsense and then using these very boards as their proof. I don't know if you are familiar with BlackB0nd, but is the guy I am having a disagreement with. Although he is pretty insignificant within the gaming community, it is the point.

You do realize that words can have more than one meaning, right? Even with the same base language different communities can adopt special meanings to words or phrases. System Wars is, itself, just such a community. We ascribe a meaning to the term "flop" that is not particularly recognized outside of this community, but that doesn't make it any less valid. You coming here making sweeping statements about our "backwards thinking" is incredibly rude and won't make a very good impression. It is akin to traveling to a foreign country and criticizing their language and customs because they don't match your own.

I understand that. Use it on here all you want, but dont use it outside of this community and believe it is valid, because it is not. The original and most widely accepted usage of the word still trumps the Gamespot communities usage of the word. I assume the word only became used like that in this community because of the ignorance of that it truly meant to flop and just stuck similar to calling an Indigenous American an Indian.

Umm, you are aware that you're in System Wars right now, right? And no, unlike your assumptions, the adoption of a special meaning to the term "flop" was not done in ignorance.

Strange that you would be calling out BlackBond for trolling when that's all you seem to be interested in doing here.

#25 Edited by tubbyc (3658 posts) -

I think the "flop" system here started a long time ago when Caseywegner (who was a mod then) created a thread called "What to do about hype?". Then the official hype threads started with a poll predicting a score, and the "rule" that a game which doesn't score here at least what it was hyped gets called a flop.

It's just something some people like to play along with, if they're really into this kind of stuff. I don't worry about labeling games as flops.

#26 Edited by cain006 (8625 posts) -

Sonic Lost World isn't a flop but not for your reasons. It didn't have a hype thread, so therefore it was impossible for it to flop.

#27 Posted by Minishdriveby (10117 posts) -

@mryamini: If you're arguing with a person who thinks Gamespot's Community's opinion is relevant or standard then it's probably a lost cause. Also please turn off the tv when doing Videos; it's distracting.

#28 Posted by lamprey263 (22629 posts) -

it's a subjective term, but usually reserved for falling short of commercial or critical expectations

#29 Edited by trugs26 (5209 posts) -

There are two kinds of flops.

Flops by hype.

Flops by sales.

A game can flop in sales, and not flop in hype and vice versa.

Each flop can be measured by a scale, or a hard line. This depends on the user.

For example, you could say hype: 8, actual: 7.5, is a flop, where as a game hype: 8, actual: 2, is a hard flop, etc.

Others might just deem them both as flops, which I don't think is fair or correct usage of the term.

I think it should be on scale: mega flop<-----flop-----as expected-----above expectations----->Out of no where. Or something along those lines.

A sales flop is also a little variable, and it depends on the publisher as well. There is a flop by expectation, and a flop by budget. For example, flop by expectation is when a publisher makes a game for $5, and expects profit of $10, but actually gets a profit of $8. This can be regarded as a flop to the publisher but not necessarily to us, the consumers. If the game sells less than the budget of $5, then it is a flop to the publisher, and in the eyes of the consumer too.

That's how I interpret "flop".

#30 Posted by blangenakker (2158 posts) -

I always thought a flop was just a bad selling game

#31 Edited by Rage010101 (5470 posts) -

Take your crap somewhere else

#32 Edited by Armoured_Mage (766 posts) -

I miss the level 10 requirement.