P2m / Nintendo, Microsot and Sony Casts UNLEASHED!

It's the idea that somehow Nintendo "won" while completely ignoring the notion if you put those systems side by side lineup for lineup, it's wouldn't even be debateable that it's anything other than last.

Nintendo is held to a lower standard, because we make apologies for why they don't get certain games, and thus judge it against the other systems like everything is created equal. Except we take games out of the other systems lineups(the multiplats) to put the Nintendo system on an even playing field. If the lineups were judged primarily on everything each system was getting the PC, PS4, and Xbox One spanked the system on 3rd party multiplats and indie games alone. Those games don't vanish, the WiiU doesn't get to live in this mystical world where multiplats are pointless.

Plus it plays with the notion that everything is about being a multisystem owner. The PC, PS4, and Xbox One could be someones one and only console, and they would be fine the entire gen on those multiplats alone. The WiiU would be drought after drought after drought in comparison. The other 3 battle for primary real estate, the WiiU is playing to be side bitch.

In the delusional world of the Nintendo apologist where we play this zero sum game of you can either A) play exclusives or B) play multiplats, the PC,PS4, and Xbox One offer you C) both of the above. With the Nintendo platform, it is A, that's all it has to offer. In comparison? we're taking things away from the other systems to even make this a debate.

If anything the System Wars logic is to judge it on exclusives alone, instead of everything that system has to offer.

And that's completely ignoring things like

-2014 vs 2015 stuff
-Gameplay footage vs games with no gameplay footage
-The same arguments levied against Microsoft/Sony(poor gameplay for one series, played out franchise) being levied against Nintendo's lineup

And I say this as someone who owns all 4 of the platforms, and thus I only use my consoles for exclusives, and console exclusive stuff(ala Metal Gear/Destiny).

@Minishdriveby: I agree of course that our own desires for owning a console don't have to be all encompassing to every game... hell, no gamer even need acknowledge a single AAA quality multiplat if it isn't their cup of tea...

But...

We're talking about how the consoles at e3, or at least how we perceive them as stand alone pieces of hardware. As a stand alone piece of hardware I can't say the wiius showing scratched many itches... as a side car, sure... there's some stuff I want to play and I'm sure, given nintendos pedigree, it will be quality stuff...

Still...

Blaring the trumpets to the sound of a Nintendo win, to me, can't be done when many of the most anticipated games in the industry are absent on the wiiu, as in, I can't ignore those absences despite knowing I may consume games differently as you suggested.

If I'm a first time buyer... looking for next gen games, the wiiu had a decent showing but to me was largely overshadowed by what the other two showed.

@jg4xchamp: I think the notion of a company press-conference winning comes down to whether an individual gets excited for owning the product that they're selling. Neither MS nor Sony's press conference did that; it got me excited, but excited to own another system that I can find almost all the games shown (PC).Nintendo on the other showed games that weren't available on any of the other systems, and I think that's where the "winning" sentiment comes from.

To be fair though, I don't really think anyone won. I'm walking away from E3 more disappointed out of the console manufacturers than anything else.

I'm fine with the Wii-U being the "side-bitch,". It's why most are looking to purchase it.

It was close, by I actually gave it to Nintendo after they announced more games after their Direct Feed. I thought there presentation was more entertaining with almost no boring parts, unlike Sony's. Nintendo's conference actually made me want to go out and get a Wii U. I wasn't expecting that at all.

Nintendo >>>> Microsoft >>>> Sony >>>> Ubisoft >>>> EA.

Well see there is the difference. If we're arguing press conferences? sure, Nintendo was highly entertaining.

But press conferences get way too much credit/blame, and ignores all the stuff that doesn't get stage time, but gets proper demonstrations at E3 the real deal. At the end of the day I'm not excited for a press conference, I want a lineup. If you want to make this an individual thing, yeah I can see why Nintendo would win if someone has a capable PC. Exclusives wise Nintendo had more things up my alley with actual gameplay footage (Bayonetta2>**** the rest). But if judged in a broader sense, on a bigger scale. On lineup vs lineup, the WiiU isn't just beaten, it's completely, thoroughly, top to bottom outclassed. And that goes double time for any of the handhelds.

And again to put this another way The Playstation 4 and Xbox One aren't battling for side bitch status. They are playing major league baseball, while nintendo is pitching a no hitter in triple A.Not to say a no hitter is to be scoffed, but there is a different in standard here. We have to take games away from the PS4/Xbox One, just to make the WiiU competitive in this argument. That is a system, by every definition of the words, being held to a lower standard than its perceived "competition"

And the question isn't who won the press conference battle, it was who won E3. That means all of it. That means lineup to me.

Ahh, sorry I didn't realize what the original question was. Well then my statement stands, nobody won. No company won the show. I'm going to message Jeff Gerstmann and hopefully get a reply, but listening to the GiantBomb E3 shows gave me the impression that this year was sort of a ghost town, compared to years prior.

To a degree, I agree with Champ. The Wii U is not and never will be on the same level as the PS4, and your take on Nintendo's E3 is going to depend on how OK you are with that side-bitch status. That said, I was still more impressed with their lineup they showed at the event personally.

I'll be the first to call Nintendo on their bullshit when it's due. the Wii U still has a shit UI, no folders, barely any online support by 2006 standards and by the numbers, the library is complete wank. it's a joke. there are no excuses to be made for Nintendo's continued shit relationships with third party publishers and they only exasperated that by making such a poorly designed console in the first place. They did in fact make their bed, expecting them not to have to lay in it though it just naive.

Was I looking for Batman to suddenly show up on Wii U? No. Was I looking forward to the amazing quality of their first party and maybe a few surprises? Yeah, and I got that. You can't ignore multiplatform games, but I'll have something to play those on, and when I do get the kind of game that grabs me away from those big players like Mario Kart 8, it's there.

TL;DR: Sure, Wii U is and will always be the side bitch, and I'm ok with that. while the other two lineups left me lukewarm outside of a few titles, I know that a lot of those Nintendo games will end up pushing those other titles to the side while I play them.

Giving them a free pass for being stuck in their position is just as naive.

Neither me nor Eroica came into E3 and were like "Yep nintendo has to get third party" ,because we are fully aware that's a lost cause. What we are saying though is that birds fly, fish swim, and that system from now until the end of this gen will be a "competitor" with easily the weakest lineup guaranteed because of the lack of multiplats and indie titles. The notion that they had a good showing is one thing. The notion that they won? while having platforms that

A) still will be getting major droughts that the other systems don't (exclusive droughts is first world problems tier, when the multiplats fill up a roster quick)
B) a vast majority of some of the best titles shown at E3 happen to be multiplats, that oh by the way aren't on the WiiU, but are on the systems we deem to be competitors, but somehow don't count, because the Xbox One and PS4 share them, which completely ignores how flawed that logic is, because it flat out glosses over the simple fact that the PS4/Xbox One get them, while the WiiU doesn't.

Spin this any way all of you want. By the very nature that we take games away from the PC, from the PS4, from the Xbox One to make it competitive, the WiiU is held to a lower standard than the other 3 are. "I'll have something to play those on" is exactly why the WiiU isn't playing in the same league as the other 3. The other 3 don't need a "yeah I'm gonna pair this with this". They can flat out hang as just your only system, and it would all be good in the hood.

And if we want to argue the subjectivity of which lineup of games was more enticing, that works against Nintendo just as much as anyone else.

-We dismissed LBP3 on podcast for having shit platforming mechanics, completely ignoring that Dynasty Warriors is scrub status in its genre to the point where even pathetic ass God of War is better, so why does Hyrule Warriors matter?
-We dismissed CGI and zero gameplay demos being shown: yet we're all ZELDA, YAY ZELDA....that game had zero gameplay shown. It showed about as much Gameplay as Uncharted 4. The most you got was Aunoma saying nice things.
-We dismiss all these other games for being from old, stale, franchises and not new ip or ideas. But another Zelda, another Smash Bros, another yarn game, another Bayonetta, another Kirby canvas.
-We dismiss The Last of US remastered and Halo collection for being remakes/port jobs, But one of the big games for the 3DS shown during this thing was: a freakin remake of Pokemon
-We dismiss part of the other 2 lineups for being 2015. Zelda, Xenoblade, Yoshi, and even Nintendo doing new ips Splatoon and Project S.T.E.A.M were 2015 titles.
-We diss Sony for basically throwing the cold shoulder to the Vita, and getting that system console ports. But the big 3DS game this year in 2014: is a glorified console port that just happens to come first.
-Starfox in its current form isn't even a game. It's a tech demo. To go along with 2 other tech demos to showcase the gamepad.

The former argument stands and no amount of mental gymnastics would make anything I said untrue. The latter argument about the games themselves? Even with something so dependent on subjectivity you still can't make complaints about the other 2, that can not be levied against the stuff Nintendo showed.

You like their games? more power to you. You thought they won? congrats. But I'd ask based on what other than "you like their games", because pure lineups top to bottom, they are outclassed on sheer quantity.

@jg4xchamp: It's not like you to gloss over the "I think Champ is right" part of that.

You do have a point, and I agreed with it. Mileage will vary depending on how ok you are with where Nintendo sits. I don't strictly give them a pass for it, but I realize what it is. At this point, I'm not sure it's apologist as much as defeatist. I never even bought the Wii U thinking it would get much more than a shit controller and a handful of great games.

Yes, the Wii U is the side bitch. Should that be alright? Of course not. When it comes to what they showed at each conference though (that is the goalpost set of course), I'll still take Nintendo. It excited me more. That is obviously a very subjective take, and I won't argue that it isn't at play here.

I thought everyone was fairly lukewarm on Hyrule Warriors overall. The best to be said about it is that I might check it out. We also completely glossed over Pokemon while giving the other two lip service for the exact reason cited.

And again speaking for myself, since that seems important to point out, my excitement for the new Zelda is almost completely conceptual. I don't buy a second of the actual footage, but the open-ness does excite me.

(I don't care how many times Aounuma said it's gameplay @Charizard1605, it's at best a fucking cutscene)

everyone complains about corridor shooters but its not necessarily a bad thing if its done well. no one had a problem with gears and its bullet sponge type gameplay. open world shooters tend to get really boring especially if traversing the area isnt planned and done well. crysis games were crap imo and even the far cry franchise had far cry 2 which i also thought was horrible.

oh and the ps3 e3 closer 2013 (besides the $399 no drm/used games section where sony obliterated ms conference) was destiny, not the last of us.

edit: didnt platinum games also make madworld? was that a good game? i remembered it flopping score wise on gs (not like score matters but im just saying)

and was that eroica that kept mixing up the ubisoft conference and sony? lol rainbow six was ubisoft final reveal...no for sony

microsoft confrerence- it was a lot like the 2013 e3 conference except the content wasnt as good as 2013 (titanfall was their closer). everyone was saying safe, and i guess you can say that, but i thought that it was stupid to put their B franchises as the closers (phantom dust was a $20 game when it first came out though it scored 8 . something on gs. crackdown became a B franchise after the 2nd game) and not halo. say what you want about it being a remaster compilation title, but that was the 2nd most exciting reveal they had other than sunset overdrive demo. FINAL GRADE = B

nintendo conference - it was a good conference. too short but i loved their presentations. it felt personal for some reason. the games they revealed were pretty good. i never really got into zelda games (even though i own a couple of games) but this game trailer really looked awesome. not much into 2d platformers but i liked the yoshi games trailer. oozing charm. splatoon looks promising.the only thing that bothered me about it is that they talked about the ability to camp in the ink and just pop up to ambush ppl...SOUNDS HORRIBLE. they better find a way to do something about that so it isnt abused. reveals for smash were ehhh... just release it already. FINAL GRADE= B+

sony conference- lets just get it out the way- they need to stop with the corporate talk. let it be about the games and games only please....dont dedicate 30 minutes on that crap. cool content...but not what i was looking for in a conference. if you are going to stream it to gamers, i hope they know that we are over it. other than that, apart from ubisoft, they had the best reveals. stage demo's were the best. gushing over far cry 4 and arkham knight (even if that was a pc build, they can downgrade the graphics and i wouldnt care much). those demo's made me happy as a gamer. order 1886 was okay. if they didnt have 2 previous trailers, this would have been awesome...but i want to know that they are actually going to have more than 5 minutes of shooting in between 10 minutes of qte/ cutscenes. uncharted 4 trailer in engine is mind blowing. im kind of expect that there is going to be a downgrade with in game cut scenes and game play like the other games, but that is still mind blowing. good indies as well. no vita or the last guardian at the conference but ps tv was there. good conference...could have been a great one. FINAL GRADE = B+

@jsmoke03: great post... I agree with some of your points, not all... I wish I had the time to respond directly proper, but I will later. I don't think confused Ubisoft's with Sony though. I actually didn't watch Ubisoft's conference. I did think the uncharted showing was weak sauce though and here's why....

We already knew the game was in development and it had been confirmed by ND.... thus, a teaser with zero content fell on deaf ears for me. It's as if they announced the game twice or something. Had they said, "here is 3 minutes of uncharted 4" and shown the game in action they would furthered my hype for the game... their e3 showing was a billboard to confirm something we already knew... I was disappointed in that.

All three did play it somewhat safe though, I agree... I think content wise sony, MS and ninty could arguably be called a "subjective draw" in the end... truly up to the taste of the gamer... Microsoft beat sony in the presentation itself though and that to me was glaring (albeit not ultimately important given its just a presentation) but I loved that they came out, looked the camera in the eye and said "thank you... this device is a gaming device first and foremost and we will do anything to make you happy" and them showed great games for over an hour... no way I'm giving sony a pass based on them focusing on external media when we all know it had ms done it we'd be calling it a doomsday move. What's good for the goose is good for the gander... Sonys presentation and focus on ganes lacked behind ms and ninty.

As I said... great post brother.

I have to say it was pretty close this year, but Sony won it slightly

@jg4xchamp: So much win #BeaconofTruth

This thread shows the consensus that SONY did indeed win E3. IT's been a blast and pure joy since the release of the PS4. Looking forward to the rest of this year with all the games I'm going to buy for it and I'll be buying a couple games for Xbone and 1 for Wiiu.

You're gonna get shitty ass smash bros over Bayonetta 2.

After I joined #TeamSonyWorldClassExclusivesAreArt, such brotrayel.

@jg4xchamp: ssb? Cmon now champ don't give heil THAT much credit... he's waiting on the 1 game on wiiu to be the next Mario party game.

I think Nintendo>Microsoft>Sony this year. Guess it just depends on the kinds of games you like.

I'm happy to say at last count Microsoft has a commanding lead in views of their e3 show... nintendo in second sony in last....

Congrats MICROSOFT on your system wars sanctioned WIN!!!

Yeah i guess. I felt that MS showed more trailers and teasers than gameplay. They only showedo off gameplay from Forza horizon 2, Sunset Overdrive, Ori and Inside. Not sure if those are exclusives or just timed exclusives

If by won you mean showed more CGI trailers than anyone else then yea, congrats

@TheEroica: there are more views on the video you released first? It must be a sign from lord Kaz.

@slaves: cmon slaves... Sony didn't show gameplay either... and that piss poor unveiling of uncharted 4 was a disgrace to the fans. Oh yay, drake with bug on his face! Wait a minute they already announces this game... so what's this for?

If we're pulling the cgi card, nintendo won e3 hands down. Like you, I'd rather see something real. Face bugs and non interactive explosions are meh.

@darkspineslayer: shhhhh.... they released at the same time! ;)

I don't know why but stirring post e3 trouble is fun. I still think that the results this year are purely subjective as to who "won". I'd like to use the cliché, gamers won.

totally agree. If someone has to win out of the big 3 its between Nintendo but overall Ubi had the best conf. That damn Far Cry 4! As far as the Uncharted crap that should have opened the conf if it had to be there. Don't build up the wait for nothing. Hell at this point The Order has me more interested than Uncharted.

@TheEroica: That was actuallly in engine, not a trailer. There weren't many games that were teaser or just CGI magic during Sony's conference

as far as the uncharted part goes, i can forgive them a bit because of the exodus that happened at nd. i think vga's is where we get gameplay...if not then its going to be next years e3 closer (i hope not though) but yea i can see where there is a disappointment in it

yea they were all safe, and there were titles that would have pushed all 3 conference to great.

if ninty announced a new playable metroid or a console pokemon, that would have been awesome.

if ms showed gears and a halo 5 gameplay, that would have been awesome.

if sony showed gameplay of the last guardian, legend of dragoon, time splitters,dark cloud or even resurrect the agent then that would have been mind blowing. sony could have announced soo many sequels

oh and a suggestion. i usually watch youtube vids on my mobile and you and heils mic's are weak compared to animal mother darklink and champs mics. its fine on the desktop but could use an improvement on mobiles

enjoy the podcast immensely

@jsmoke03: Question, did it sound like I was speaking English?

@slaves: yes yes yes to uncharted. If I asked people ahead of time what the most boring uncharted reveal could be, I guarantee "drake standing up and walking off screen would've been high on the list. Especially since we already knew the game was in development.

I still hold some hype for the order. It looks beautiful and it will most likely offer some pretty intense fun for what it appears to go for.

I was elated to find out Evolve isn't Xbone exclusive. Looking forward to that game.

@jsmoke03: animal heil and I actually all use the exact same mic... I'll work on levels a bit. We've definitely had our shows where recording is a chore, but I'll keep working with the guys on it. Thanks for your support brother. Means a lot to us. Come on sometime.

lol sorry to say but your mic is the worst. you sound like an original blues recording in the 1920's...but its in english

maybe cuz animal speaks louder than both of you combined lol rawr

would be an honor to join sometime. let me just get my equipment sorted out.

@TheEroica: That was actuallly in engine, not a trailer. There weren't many games that were teaser or just CGI magic during Sony's conference

Since SONY won E3 and is on a roll this gen, I propose a podcast name chance to Full throttle, pedal to the metal with SONY! What ya think @TheEroica?

@Heil68: I don't know buddy... Dat world class ms e3 presentation of games both present and future totally changed the twisted and cold hearts of cows across the globe... it's showing in our view statistics that system wars has chosen their king... and their can only be ONE.

VIVA LA XBOX!

@TheEroica:

Well I'm doing intro on next cast. :D

@Heil68: hell no.... haha. Thanks for giving me a heads up. :P

So what's the topic for next week?

How great Sony is and how they dominate the gaming industry, as the topic should be every week. Subtopics include how much a lem @TheEroica is becoming again and how @Heil68 is planning to run for president by running on the Live, Learn and Love platform.

Sounds awesome!

@slaves: gaming is reaching it's apex of awesome with the world class god box one leading the way.... sign me up to board the xlove express, which will be reaching all counties in all lands across the globe this summer to cure that nasty bout of the no Gamez ps4 blues :(

@TheEroica: Oh God someone shoot me now LOL. BTW hows that XOne treating you?

@slaves: special ordered from the delicate trustworthy hands at microsoft. I ordered it day 1, but bill Gates is still making it for me... diamond encrusted with solid gold controllers. See, the ps4 is like eating at mcdonalds... just throw dat shit in a bag so I can have a quick lunch and move on with my day... an XOne should be savored like a finely cooked steak. Don't rush greatness slaves... you know better. ;)

@TheEroica: That makes me laugh and cringe at the same time. Good post man

@slaves: lol... I really don't even care about the "which is better" haha I just love the banter. I can't wait to own everything.! Then I will have achieved the true live live learn enlightenment @Heil68: #legendary

@TheEroica: Understood. I was about 2 clicks away a few days ago into buying a XOne or a WiiU. I couldn't make up my mind and I still have a massive backlog between PS4, PS3, 360, Vita and Steam. @Heil68 is truly on another plane of existence compared to everyone else and only he can show us the way to true gamers gaming.

@slaves: yeah I'm thinking Santa may bring an Xlove this year... wiiu needs a price drop before I jump.

@TheEroica: that maybe the case for me too. We just bought a swimming pool so I'll be spending some time outside soon. I just added you on Steam btw.

Ahhh we did a pool last year, deck this year. thing I ever did was convince the wife I should have a slush fund account for my hobbies... and hookers

@TheEroica: LOL I think I'm going to try to convince mine tonight. I'll let you know how that goes.