White father and son arrested in killing of Ahmaud Arbery, black man gunned down while jogging in Georgia

Not sure what they were thinking and to be an ex cop is inexcusable.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2020/05/07/ahmaud-arbery-shooting-video-prosecutor-arrest-mcmichael/3089040001/

Apparently, gun violence killed at least 15,292 people in the US last year.

The video is disgusting. This is cold blooded murder and I am astounded they actually tried to claim self defence after they ran up on him.

It took two months for an arrest and two DAs had to recuse themselves. "one [DA] said he thought the McMichaels had used their citizens' arrest rights." I guess that means assuming the worst of someone, tracking them down, and then killing them?

Why were they not arrested months ago? Oh....I know why.

About time..............

Good. Bury these racist shits under the jail. Disgusting.

Presumption of someone casing a construction home is not reasonable cause a felony occurred, nor is it any crime unless, and this is a stretch, but trespassing. A misd. offense committed in their presence would establish grounds for a citizens arrest. The whole armed citizen chasing down someone for looking at a construction home will not have any jury appeal. Lastly, there will be a credible grounds for defense in regards to the actual struggle over the gun. I think the best scenario is to seek manslaughter charges.

Is that it? Thought it would be more than that.

Still terrible, pointless, and needless.

In your opinion do you think the struggle over the firearm is what caused the guy to get shot?

I'm just asking because I am having flashbacks of Trayvon Martin, where they said he'd still be alive if he just kept walking or ignored Zimmerman instead of confronting him.

Obviously it's a little different in Florida because they have the stand your ground rule, right?

I guess this must be the 'freedom' you red necks are always crowing about.

This is why I'm happy to live in Australia where stuff like this rarely happens.

@mrbojangles25: I believe that is the current defense. However, that is telling me the shotgun safety was off and finger on the trigger, which could aptly establish examples of gross negligence.

What about intent? They were stalking him as well.

Usually a father and son would do positive things together. Is it different in Georgia?

It took an outrage on social media to get this to happen???

@LJS9502_basic: It would be against call-taker advice to follow any suspect. Our 911 operators always tell the witnesses do not follow.

They will argue they were simply trying to effect a citizens arrest. Following by itself is a huge stretch to argue premeditated murder.

i'm a bit ignorant of the law here but if there is a scenario like this where armed individuals tried to apprehend a person, that person naturally fought back and was killed for fighting back, does a self-defense argument still hold for the shooter?

if you put yourself in the situation where YOU are the agressor / confronter but then have to kill someone else because they retaliate, is that really self-defense?

@comp_atkins: The window of "self defense" isn't exactly an easy open-shut notion. For example, a victim can quickly turn into a suspect once the threshold of "defense" is replaced with "offense." It's all about proportionate response and the fluidity of it. The facts leading up to this event (totality, bigger picture) will be important along with the mindset at the time of the discharge of the firearm.

To answer your question, creating an exigency gets law enforcement in hot water due to higher expectations. A citizen though who in their eyes are effecting a (weak) citizens arrest, there will undoubtedly be civil liability if the criminal side falls through. Again, if the actual foundation of wanting to effect an arrest falls apart (or being the "aggressor"), then I see the gross negligence being at the forefront.

These guys actively ran down a man and murdered him. Even if the dude was a burglar, (which I don't believe for a second) you cannot give chase and gun him down. Absolutely devastating news and if they had shot him in the leg and still breathing, all of this would've be such a big deal.

I live in Atlanta GA, under GA law, a person performing a citizen arrest is allowed to pursue someone that they have witness or have proof committed a crime. But however, I also have the rights to stand my ground until police arrives. The thing is though, they purely chased him down out of suspicion. No witness or proof is the problem here.

It needs to be pointed out that in a citizen arrest, private citizens do not get the same legal liability protections that law enforcement get. If you violate their civil rights in the process in any way, the State isn’t coming to rescue you and that extends to if you apprehend the wrong guy. You will get slapped with false imprisonment charges!

Meanwhile black on white crime greatly eclipses white on black. But what does the media report on?

Oh yeah, (((they))) hate white people

You have to be an absolute filth and trash of a human being to post that, which is unrelated to this incident - which regardless of political sides, is a heinous and disgusting act.

That and alongside your worthless threads and I'm not sure why you're even on these forums.

I predict these guys will get off due to the focusing on Abbey grabbing for the gun. That a defense of “stand your ground” can be furthered with a straight face in disregard of the circumstances leading up to it just goes to show how fucked our justice system truly is. These guys chased an innocent man down who was only going on a run and shoved a 12 gauge barrel in his face for something they “suspected” with the only basis for that belief being the pigment of his skin. You never can predict what someone will do when you pull a gun on them. I don’t blame Abbey at all, even if he did go for the gun. Given the situation, being run down and confronted, I probably would’ve as well.

This isn’t his fault. He was mindful of his own business, this was a run he’d taken numerous times before, and if these racist twats had minded their own business towards a man who’d made this run MANY times prior instead of letting their racist beliefs take over, he’d still be alive. Looking at the pictures of the father and son, these guys are the poster boys of redneck KKK if I’ve ever seen it.

So forcing a situation to legally kill someone?

Seems to me he was trying to defend himself from the racist rednecks...…….

@horgen: yes, essentially. At least that’s what the defense is looking to be at this point.

Nobody cares about that in this topic. Hate Crimes happen all the time, unfortunately. The reason this has been getting so much attention is how long it took for anything to be done.

And stop with the anti-semitic dogwhislting. Seriously.

Yeah, that was pretty awful. I don't want to bandwagon too much so I will just leave it at that.

I read today that Georgia doesn't actually have any hate crime laws. So the possibility of these guys getting slapped with a racially motivated anything is zero....which is unfortunate because it most definitely was racially motivated.

Not trying to make any grand statement on society, but the dude would be alive if he was white.

@Xabiss: that was a solid take 100% on point. After I looked into this story I was on the same vibe as these guys here. Its sad this happened, but mistakes made by both parties and unfortunately a man lost his life.

Going off what ive read, and because the struggle over the gun is on tape... It will probably be manslaughter charges. They should have never gone for a citizen arrest over something that trivial and carried a gun towards him. Should have waited on police and just followed at most.

Aubrey made a bad judgement call trying to take the guys gun by fighting over it.

What a mess

And the last part was on point as well, where they talk about how the media responds to stories of homicide when its white vs black compared to when its one of the more common cases of white vs white or black vs black incidents or Latino vs Latino. The media really doesnt gaf about those cases. Not like they do the "race war" cases of homicide. Someone already mentioned earlier in this thread that there was over 15,000 last year true. The media will focus extra on 3-5 of those cases throughout the year. They will all share a similiar theme.

Is there evidence this was racially motivated?

@Xabiss: Their point about this being in the news just because the murderers are white was pure nonsense, because in reality, this is in the new because they got away with it for two months just because the father is an ex cop and knows the prosecutors. Sure, if the killers were anything other than white, this would not be in the news, but not because of race, but because they would have been arrested on the spot.

Fair point, I should have made clear the above is my opinion, and not make it sound like fact.

Evidence aside, do you think this is not racially motivated? I'm sorry but I just have a really difficult time believing that a white guy jogging....jogging, not running, you know, like running frantically away from a crime...would have been shot.

Either way, there's a lot of spin you can put on this:

• it was racially motivated killing and these two white folk are klan members or something
• the dude really did look like the criminal and this was just a tragic misunderstanding.
• Young black males are taught to resist authority and if he just stopped and talked instead of wrestling for the gun everything would be fine.
• Etc, etc....

I guess we will have to wait for evidence and a trial (if that even happens) to get the actual answer. Until then I am just speculating.

I mean if you're jogging down the street when a truck pulls up and a occupant jumps out with a shotgun aimed at you, I'm fairly certain many would either go on the attack as means of defending themselves or run, which could've prompted them to either give chase with the truck or shoot him in the back because " The suspect began to flee"

So he would've been maybe alive in one scenario and dead in the other two. So as far as judgement calls make, it's highly understandable why he reacted the way he did.

What isn't sound judgement is arming yourself and chasing after someone cause you think he might look like someone who committed burglary. If that is then best to make yourself look as distinguishable as possible so you won't be mistaken for anyone else.

It was a bigger deal than it should have been because the guys were not arrested right away. It took months and for the video to be leaked.

Wow, cant believe people on here are defending those guys, America is sick.

Agreed.

The retards in my family who are defending these fuckers are also trump-loving Republicans. Coincidence?

I'm not one to pander to identity divisiveness solely on immutable characteristics, especially when there are no facts to establish any racism. The outrage "reeee" bandwagon will do their thing, especially in a Twittersphere where they get off on driving a wedge.

"Ex-cop"

Well, that says pretty much everything right there.

Perhaps he was trying to defend himself against thugs that were chasing him and now had a gun pointed at him.

Dude, are you honestly surprised. Do you honestly think people follow Trump because of his economic policies? He literally has no policies. They defend him because of other reasons.

Yeah. I never quite understood why one killing gets news coverage, as if it's special. Killing is killing. I guess it's all polotics and if they can use somebody they do.

One killing? False. Gun deaths are reported.

Yeah, but certain killings get publicized more than others. That's what I meant to say.

Because the circumstances. And why is that a problem? An ex cop getting off due to ties is a story.

I guess so, but there's alot of polotics involved due to the polotical nature of reporting these days.

The media knows it can't enrage certain communities by reporting black on black shootings as it does with white on black.

As a leftist, here's my take:

Maybe, he committed a minor crime - we don't know that yet. We simply don't know. However, they called the cops. Why did they feel to follow him? Much less shoot him. It was absolutely inane.

He didn't commit a crime. Have you listened to the 911 call?