The Great (Left) American Divide - Will that help Trump win another election?

No folks, the left is anything but united. In fact, among the farther left, it's now a negative thing to be called a liberal (at least in the States) - and that's where I lean, even though I support M4A, LGBTQ rights, etc. But I also know that in politics, there must be compromise in order to get somewhere. Sadly, some people on the left seem to hate that.

It reminds me of this moment from Star Wars: Rebels when Mon Mothma and Saw Gerrera bicker about how to handle the Empire.

Do you think that could help Trump get another win?

@nintendoboy16: I'm a libertarian that will be voting Trump, I dont mind liberals. But the far left imo is very toxic. The far left has started joining many libertarian groups ive followed for years, all,of a sudden I'm seeing alot of hammer and sickle, now I cant vote with AnComms and Jorgenson is trying to pull these potential voters because she knows they hate Biden.

In essence, not only do I dislike the far left, they are now even ruining the libertarian party for me.

The democrats are very fractured, worst fracturing ive seen in my lifetime in a party. Untill now id say the tea party movement and Ron Paul pushing back against the Mcain, Bush, Romneys was the biggest fracturing. But the prog left vs more classical liberals is pretty bad, alot of the prog left wont vote for Biden.

Democrats are screwed this election if you ask me. No enthusiasm. Good luck, I predict a Trump landslide. Rub my nose in it if im wrong, but I dont see Trump loosing.

Yeah far left is as bad as the far right; instead of denying facts and being ignorant like the right, they manipulate and bastardize the facts to suit their needs.

I'm a moderate, I feel bad for other moderates. No one wants to cater to our boring, logical sensibilities. Emotions prevail far too often.

And yeah, the democrats are fractured; when you have "mainstream" democrats campaigning against more liberal and progressive democrats instead of focusing on beating Republicans, you know your party is fractured.

Swear to god it's almost as bad as all those fights Christians used to have "I'm going to kill you, you're not the right kind of Christian!" then "No, our Jesus is the superior Jesus. Your Jesus is weak and lame" and so on.

@mrbojangles25: Used to have? Isn't the Methodist Church in the process of splitting currently?

the only correct jesus is rngesus

The left is anything but a monolith. It is a bunch of bickering ideals, that are only united in that strategically supporting one another could stop the other guy. But even then, lefties spend more time fighting EACHOTHER than fighting the right.

The right arent exactly a monolith either, but I do see more unity in the right wing than I see in the left wing.

The only thing that could help here is ranked choice voting, even then... will it be enough?

RNGesus hates me so so much in FF14 (Ishgard Restoration) right now.

@Maroxad: Big surprise that conservatives are usually more united.

What? The right has been fractured for a few years now and has gotten worse. They are even spending money on ads against trump.

The right are fractured too, that is why I said they arent a monolith. But the base seems far more united than the heads. Usually in their hatred for the left. Most of the division in the right comes from the establishment, so to speak.

The opposite is true for the left, where the base is extremely fractured, while the top members are all united under Biden.

Trump has record high approval ratings among republicans.

I am also a libertarian who will be voting for Trump. While we can criticize him for the dumb bump stock ban and of course tariffs (which have no please in a free market economy), he has shattered expectations, and to deny this is to deny reality.

• First Step Act (over 7k prison sentences reduced, 90% of those were black people)
• Tax cuts which resulted in big companies investing in the US economy
• Most dramatic deregulation in US history- fewer regulations mean more freedom!
• Hasn't started any other wars and is definitely less war hawkish than Obama or Bush
• Putting a plan together to pull our troops out of the middle east (about time!)
• Cutting funding to mismanaged progressive cities (yay)
• He has done a lot for us veterans (The Veterans Benefits and Transition Act and the Forever GI Bill Housing Payment Fulfillment Act, The Homeless Veterans’ Reintegration Program, the Mission Act, and the HAVEN ACT)
• He post-humorously pardoned Jack Johnson who was the first black heavyweight champ boxer- he was charged with a crime for racist reasons and the charges were bogus- not even Obama did this
• Increased federal funding to historically black colleges
• Peace talks with Isreal and the Arab Emirates
• First president in U.S. history to open up a dialogue with North Korea
• Pre-pandemic (lowest levels on unemployment in American history)
• Repeal of the mandatory mandate tax of Obama care (this just forced people to get expensive insurance and if they didn't comply they had to pay a mandate tax at the end of the year)
• He is also killing it on the judicial side
• He was nominated for the Nobel Peace prize last year and he just got nominated again

@mighty-lu-bu:

1. Source

2. False. Caused a deficit of 3 trillion

3. BS

4. He almost started wars with Iran and North Korea

5. So did Obama. But the right was against it

6. So screwing over cities over political differences and then blaming it on them is good?

7. Some were Obama

8. Who cares? Token gesture

9. Source. And those colleges need to go

10. Everyone does that

11. False

12. Thanks Obama. Trump inherited it not created it

13. That creates a record uninsured

14. No he isn’t. He is stacking courts to protect him from crimes and force his will on an unwilling populace. Half the country is not on the same side

15. By a far right racist. Obama won it

Nice try, but you fail....Again. Biden 2020

@jeezers: Kind of agree about Trump probably winning. COVID and the turmoil surrounding it are the only reason Biden has a chance, but that's still not guaranteed. To take on someone with an enthusiastic base, you need a clear alternative with equal enthusiasm. Biden just doesn't have that. He might get a few fed up Republicans to vote for him, but that won't mean much if the base stays home.

1. https://reason.com/2020/09/07/the-first-step-act-has-reduced-prison-terms-for-more-than-7000-people/

https://www.theroot.com/91-percent-of-inmates-freed-by-first-step-act-were-blac-1835387925

2. The 3 trillion dollar COVID-19 relief bill had nothing to do with tax cuts.

3. https://www.heritage.org/government-regulation/commentary/heres-how-much-red-tape-trump-has-cut

https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/2020-06/regulation-v43n2-5.pdf (conclusion: In his first two years in office, President Trump emphasized deregulation to a greater extent than his predecessors.)

4. Almost only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades- Trump did not start any new wars. The Iranian people cheered the death of Soleimani as did I as he was directly responsible for killing hundreds of my U.S. service members. Also, he is the first sitting president to ever to go to North Korea have peace talks with them.

5. Obama started conflicts in Libya, Syria, and Yemen- he also double-downed on Bush's terrible Iraq and Afghanistan wars (Trump has not).

6. Democrats have ruined their cities and states for a long time. Let's look at my home state of CA as an example: we pay some of the highest taxes even though we are in debt for billions, and we have the most homeless in the country. Cities and states with failed liberal policies shouldn't be awarded with federal bailouts / federal funding period.

7. Obama did not do much for veterans. He cut our pay for starters (https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/01/worst-president-ever-obamas-disdain-for-the-us-military/ ) Can you name a single thing off the top of your head that he did? I can't.

8. Who cares? Jack Johnson was the first black heavyweight boxing champion in boxing history. In the 1930s he received a bogus (and racist) charge for transporting a white woman across state lines. It's funny because even though Obama was black, he did nothing for blacks.

9. https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2019-12-19/trump-signs-bill-restoring-funding-for-black-colleges - also they need to go? What a racist thing to say.

10. Sure there have been peace talks with Isreal and the Arab Emirates but they have NEVER come to an actual peace agreement. Thanks again, Trump! https://www.forbes.com/sites/lisettevoytko/2020/08/13/trump-israel-and-united-arab-emirates-sign-historic-peace-agreement/

11. https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2019/jun/30/donald-trump-becomes-first-sitting-us-president-en/

12. Obama had nothing to do with the low unemployment rates, what directly affected this was Trump's tax cuts and his deregulations. (https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/trumps-average-unemployment-rate-is-the-lowest-in-recorded-history)

13. It actually doesn't. Remember when the ACA became law, over 4 million American's lost their private insurance plans (even though Obama lied with the now infamous statement "you can keep your doctor". All Trump did was remove the tax penalty ACA mandate for not having coverage (https://www.newsweek.com/trump-kill-obamacare-repealing-individual-mandate-763095)

14. Yes, he is stacking courts with conservative judges who will uphold the U.S. Constitution- cry me a river.

15. Christian Tybring-Gjedde is not a racist- he is tough on immigration and rightfully so. Just look at how unchecked immigration has destroyed the UK. Obama also did nothing to receive the award (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-34277960)

No offense, but you are very ignorant of the facts and the facts speak for themselves. Thanks for playing though.

Trump is going to get Republicans, libertarians, and independents to vote for him.

trump has his base. Not all Republicans and you can't say he'll get libertarians or independents either. His approval rating has never been high and he trails in the polls.

You're going to be voting for Trump because you're far right.

1. Bi-partisan bill.

2. Tax Cuts flopped. https://www.npr.org/2019/12/20/789540931/2-years-later-trump-tax-cuts-have-failed-to-deliver-on-gops-promises

3. Mass deregulations not good for the environment, and the economy went to shit anyway due to Trump. Good job.

4. "In June 13, President Donald Trump told the graduating class at West Point, “We are ending the era of endless wars.” That is what Trump has promised since 2016, but the “endless” wars have not ended. Trump has dropped more bombs and missiles than George W. Bush or Barack Obama did in their first terms, and there are still roughly as many US bases and troops overseas as when he was elected."

5. The plan that never comes. He had 4 years.

6. Cutting funding to cities that give a lion's shares to our federal government? Did you know Blue states/cities fund poor Red ones? Did you know Red ones are the leeches? "YAY! DERP I'M NEW TO POLITICS"

7. For their votes, he hates their guts in person. Obama did a lot too, he takes credit for some of his stuff.

8. Increased spending everywhere, that insane deficit though. https://www.politico.com/news/2020/01/28/federal-deficit-one-trillion-trump-107901

9. Appears to be all for show so far.

10. The NK talks WERE all show. It was pointless.

11. Pre-pandemic employment was worse than Obama's. He just continued his trend line, albiet with a slight dip. But we dont' have time machines. Look at current employment, the trump economy is shit. Very shit.

12. No statement.

13. He's killing it on the judicial side? That's subjective, you have to be heavily right leaning to enjoy this. Most people are against right wing policy vs left wing policy.

14. He was nominated by the same far right guy last time and didn't win.

But yeah. His current economy and 190,000 kills are worse than anything. He's super unpopular.

Deregulations on all scales are good, it's only leftists that want more regulations because they want more central power to the government. No wonder the entirety of the Democratic party is moving towards socialism (which is widely unpopular by the way). I remember a bunch of leftists were up in arms because Trump undid a bunch of Obama era environmental regulations which would have just put us back in the Clinton / Bush era- what the environment worse then? Nope.

He is just unpopular with Democrats- but Republicans love him and libertarians like myself are starting to come around. Most of us didn't vote for him in 2016 because we voted for Gary Johnson, but since Jo Jorgensen is such a weak libertarian candidate, a lot of us are going to be voting for Trump. If a libertarian Republican like Rand Paul endorses him, how bad can Trump be? The left makes Trump out to be Hitler, but nothing could be farther from the truth. Again, only uneducated leftists think Trump is racist, a bigot, and a sexist

Not going to reply with numbered points a second time, but I posted all of my sources for each point above, I suggest you educate yourself because you are coming off pretty ignorant.

No we want regulations to keep the water and air clean which is good for people, animals, and plants.

He's losing Republican votes so you can say his base loves him. But then they get their info from Fox News.

Again he undid Obama era environmental regulations... so your argument is that the environment was worse in the Clinton and Bush eras? If that is your argument then it is just downright silly.

Yeah? What regulations would those be?

Don't bother- they just parrot whatever CNN tells them.

https://hehill.com/policy/energy-environment/501225-new-trump-air-rule-will-limit-future-pollution-regulations-critics

@LJS9502_basic:

I think we're being trolled. He can't be serious with some of the comments tonight. We should have known after this comment:

Considering that side of the argument, alarmists, the REAL science deniers have yet to have a single doom and gloom prediction of theirs actually come true, the fact they're making more future predictions is funny. You'd have to be pretty gullible to believe them after about 50 years of being wrong.

Science beats trump. It's true.

the amount of money i could make with the gullible of humans.... so much

Yeah, too bad y'all ignore science and cherry pick a select few that agree with you and ignore the thousands who have called bullshit on it. But what should I expect for someone who doesn't even understand the basics of land management and conservation and would instead like to blame it on some superstition like some cultist.

Religion has been doing it for thousands of years.

Seems you as well don't understand science. Rolling back environmental protections does indeed pollute air and water. But bury that head in the sand.

Even though Trump rolled back regulations, didn't the U.S. lead the world in reducing carbon emissions for the last two years in a row? Yeah, those deregulations are really hurting the environment.

Do you not understand what deregulations are?

Nonetheless,

The US reduced CO2 emissions by 2.9%, however, other countries did better. For example Germany was at 8%.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/united-states-led-entire-world-in-reducing-co2-emissions-in-2019

@horgen: ‘Big surprise that conservatives are usually more united.’

Oh, we’re divided all right. There’s the nasty alt right that we all get lumped in as just because we support the President. A few posters in this thread have called me it.

Yup. I have been called a racist several times here and of course, the mods never do anything about it. We have leftists that post garbage posts but if you post anything that has a conservative or libertarian-leaning it will automatically get taken down.

TDS is real and these people are so out of touch with America it isn't funny. When Trump wins I really am afraid that cities will burn and they are literally mad at the democratic process of the people electing a president.

I still cant believe people think Trump is great. Like wtf.

@sonicare: ‘I still cant believe people think Trump is great. Like wtf.’

Why, because we don’t believe CNN’s and the rest of the biased mainstream media’s narrative that he’s bad?

I can’t believe Biden has any support given he’s never really done anything of note and he’s cognitively unfit for the position.

@mighty-lu-bu: ‘but if you post anything that has a conservative or libertarian-leaning it will automatically get taken down.’

Was that your thread that got locked a few days ago for posting a Tim Poole video and the mod claimed it was fake news? If that’s the case, why isn’t every CNN linked video not shuttered? They literally are fake news!

A couple of years before Bush left the office I started leaning heavily towards libertarian ideals. In 2016 I voted for Gary Johnson because I thought Trump was a terrible candidate, even though in the past I was very conservative. I heard all the narratives of Trump being a racist, a bigot, and a sexist which I thought was a bit ironic because these are common Democrat swears of Republicans (they have used these smears against every Republican presidential candidate since the 1980s). Then I saw an interview with Thomas Sowell, the prominent black economist and he told a panel of interviewers that he had seen no hard evidence that Trump was a racist. I thought to myself, what a peculiar thing for a black man to say so I started doing my own research, and what I found was very odd.

First and foremost, if you search Google, Bing, or even DuckDuckGo, you will find no articles or videos of Trump being called any of these things prior to the year 2016 which I found a bit strange. Starting in 2016, the first news agency to accuse Trump of these things was CNN and then other liberal media outlets such as the New York Times, Washington Post, MSNBC, etc. all decided to jump on the bandwagon but it got even more strange. I literally went through every article I could find and in every article, Trump was always taken out of context in some form or a video was cropped a certain way to make him look bad. So I painstakingly watched every press conference Trump ever did and I watched every single one of his speeches. I also read every single tweet he has posted for the since 2016.

Like Thomas Sowell, I have found no hard evidence that Trump is any of the things that people accuse him of. The bottom line is that people almost never do the research and I just wish people would put the time in like I did (spent hundreds of hours on this).

ah, a good ol' Mod-spiracy

If you can't find evidence that he's a sexist proto-fascist bigot, you are probably not very bright.

You are both technically right here. As your linked article says, the US had the "largest absolute decline", Germany had a larger per-capita decline.

But nearly all of this is due to the decline of coal use. So deregulation of coal has not helped turn the industry around.

https://insideclimatenews.org/news/07012020/infographic-united-states-emissions-2019-climate-change-greenhouse-gas-coal-transportation

@drlostrib: What ‘spiricy’? The thread is literally in Political Gamers under woman assaults 7 year old Trump supporter (paraphrased), the last post claimed the link was some random youtuber (even though Tim Poole has a large following) and locked the thread. I’d link it here but I’m not sure what the policy is here for linking locked threads.

@Nude_Dude: Can you?

I don't usually recommend getting information from some guy on YouTube, but this guy is very thorough with his research. You should check it out.

Yes. You can too! Google is your friend.

@Nude_Dude: I have - nothing credible comes up.

You seem a bit confused, but I'm sure they really are out to get you...

That's probably the only time you admit your own president's words aren't credible.

@Nude_Dude: Umm, no I didn’t. I’m a Trump supporter. Why would I write that?