Have EA/Bioware thrown in the towel on ToR?

It appears there have been some pretty big layoffs at The Old Republic camp. Is there anyone around who still wants to claim the game is healthy and doing fine?

Poor Bioware. I only hope other developers actually take notice and begin to realize that nobody wants another cookie-cutter-me-too MMORPG. Are you paying attention Bethesda?

Remember folks: Flower boy only likes to play games from 1995! biggest_loser

Wow, you're so clever. :roll:

Not that I would expect anything even marginally intelligent from you, of course.

He makes a good point, in 2012 the MMORPG is the new FPS, everybody is trying to pump one out, some look great but others look so same ol and just a waste of resources, my strong gut feeling is that TESO will fall on its face, I don't even think there are enough interested players around to populate all of the different MMOs coming out haha.

....Hopefully not, I hate seeing PC developers go bad, I want PC games to thrive and be successful.FelipeInside

The problem is most people don't want to play a WoW knockoff when they can just play the real thing. I really don't see the point in companies trying to beat Blizzard at their own game. Developers need to differentiate themselves from WoW, not copy it.

[QUOTE="FelipeInside"]....Hopefully not, I hate seeing PC developers go bad, I want PC games to thrive and be successful.-wildflower-

The problem is most people don't want to play a WoW knockoff when they can just play the real thing. I really don't see the point in companies trying to beat Blizzard at their own game. Developers need to differentiate themselves from WoW, not copy it.

[QUOTE="FelipeInside"]....Hopefully not, I hate seeing PC developers go bad, I want PC games to thrive and be successful.-wildflower-

The problem is most people don't want to play a WoW knockoff when they can just play the real thing. I really don't see the point in companies trying to beat Blizzard at their own game. Developers need to differentiate themselves from WoW, not copy it.

And a very bad copy is no copy at all - may the force be with you NOT.

[QUOTE="-wildflower-"]

[QUOTE="FelipeInside"]....Hopefully not, I hate seeing PC developers go bad, I want PC games to thrive and be successful.Darocy

The problem is most people don't want to play a WoW knockoff when they can just play the real thing. I really don't see the point in companies trying to beat Blizzard at their own game. Developers need to differentiate themselves from WoW, not copy it.

And a very bad copy is no copy at all - may the force be with you NOT.

The MMO market has grown oversaturated ever since F2P gained traction as a business model. People are overwhelmed by the choices arrayed in front of them.

The MMO market has grown oversaturated ever since F2P gained traction as a business model. People are overwhelmed by the choices arrayed in front of them.

The_Capitalist

[QUOTE="biggest_loser"]Remember folks: Flower boy only likes to play games from 1995! -wildflower-

Wow, you're so clever. :roll:

Not that I would expect anything even marginally intelligent from you, of course.

[QUOTE="FelipeInside"]....Hopefully not, I hate seeing PC developers go bad, I want PC games to thrive and be successful.-wildflower-

The problem is most people don't want to play a WoW knockoff when they can just play the real thing. I really don't see the point in companies trying to beat Blizzard at their own game. Developers need to differentiate themselves from WoW, not copy it.

[QUOTE="-wildflower-"]

[QUOTE="biggest_loser"]Remember folks: Flower boy only likes to play games from 1995! biggest_loser

Wow, you're so clever. :roll:

Not that I would expect anything even marginally intelligent from you, of course.

[QUOTE="-wildflower-"]

[QUOTE="FelipeInside"]....Hopefully not, I hate seeing PC developers go bad, I want PC games to thrive and be successful.Toxic-Seahorse

The problem is most people don't want to play a WoW knockoff when they can just play the real thing. I really don't see the point in companies trying to beat Blizzard at their own game. Developers need to differentiate themselves from WoW, not copy it.

[QUOTE="biggest_loser"][QUOTE="-wildflower-"]

Wow, you're so clever. :roll:

Not that I would expect anything even marginally intelligent from you, of course.

FelipeInside

[QUOTE="Toxic-Seahorse"][QUOTE="-wildflower-"]

The problem is most people don't want to play a WoW knockoff when they can just play the real thing. I really don't see the point in companies trying to beat Blizzard at their own game. Developers need to differentiate themselves from WoW, not copy it.

FelipeInside

Is this really surprising? The game has launched and made it through the needed early game fixes. Sounds like the right time to size the team going forward towards content updates and expansion. A full dev staff simply isn't needed. :|

Thrown in the towel... please.

It appears there have been some pretty big layoffs at The Old Republic camp. Is there anyone around who still wants to claim the game is healthy and doing fine?

Poor Bioware. I only hope other developers actually take notice and begin to realize that nobody wants another cookie-cutter-me-too MMORPG. Are you paying attention Bethesda?

-wildflower-

So tired of simpletons calling every MMO a WoW clone, get a new schtick please.

This is coming from someone who thinks TOR is a failure of a game, but it has nothing to do with being a WoW clone. It did plenty different enough to separate itself from WoW, it just is not a great game.

The best part about this is how the Doctors try to spin the layoffs into a feel-good story.

.... It did plenty different enough to separate itself from WoW, it just is not a great game.

vfibsux

Such as?

[QUOTE="vfibsux"]

.... It did plenty different enough to separate itself from WoW, it just is not a great game.

-wildflower-

Such as?

Also, it's the Austin Texas Studio that created ToR, and all their employees are hired mostly as contract jobs. I was looking at the artist positions and unlike the canada studio, they don't offer any actual permanent positions. So maybe thats why, contracts are up at the studio.

Remember folks: Flower boy only likes to play games from 1995! biggest_loser

patch update 1.3 is due out soon, with alot of changes that will make thhe game better and attract more players, like group finder, and server change

Doesn't surprise me - if you heap a bunch of fluff on the same used, recycled $&%# that's been done over and over again - the end results are not going to be pretty. This game killed itself due to its severe lack ambition - it's probably the most gigantic oxymoron in existence within the gaming industry. Its lucky its as successful as it is.

Sucks, especially in this economy.

I may find SWTOR to be a uninspired and poorly designed game. But this really sucks for the people who lost their jobs. I hope that those affected can find new jobs. I also hope, SWTOR's development isn't too set back by this.

I also hope this is a message, that tacking on a story, especially one as poorly written as SWTOR's is not a good idea for an mmo. And make the game less derivative.

There's only so long an extremely linear game that's very similar gameplay wise to every other mmorpg with the only difference being that...it's more linear and has more of a personal story (lol) than others can go on pretending to be healthy and doing fine. The reports are saying that most servers are on light, which means less than 100 players in a server. By comparisson, I see over 2k players on a niche pirvate server of a niche sandbox mmorpg I play....

There's only so long an extremely linear game that's very similar gameplay wise to every other mmorpg with the only difference being that...it's more linear and has more of a personal story (lol) than others can go on pretending to be healthy and doing fine. The reports are saying that most servers are on light, which means less than 100 players in a server. By comparisson, I see over 2k players on a niche pirvate server of a niche sandbox mmorpg I play....

QQabitmoar

[QUOTE="QQabitmoar"]

There's only so long an extremely linear game that's very similar gameplay wise to every other mmorpg with the only difference being that...it's more linear and has more of a personal story (lol) than others can go on pretending to be healthy and doing fine. The reports are saying that most servers are on light, which means less than 100 players in a server. By comparisson, I see over 2k players on a niche pirvate server of a niche sandbox mmorpg I play....

FelipeInside

And what's wrong with personal story in an MMO? FelipeInside

The problem with a "personal" story is that it doenst really fit in well with the whole massively multiplayer part.

You know, you saving the whole world, killing the big bad (which could have been fine and all had it not been cliche, cheesy and overdone as ****). You are the choosen one... along with the other few thousand chosen ones in this very station, all who have the exact same destiny as you.

Story and mmo just dont mix well.

[QUOTE="QQabitmoar"]

There's only so long an extremely linear game that's very similar gameplay wise to every other mmorpg with the only difference being that...it's more linear and has more of a personal story (lol) than others can go on pretending to be healthy and doing fine. The reports are saying that most servers are on light, which means less than 100 players in a server. By comparisson, I see over 2k players on a niche pirvate server of a niche sandbox mmorpg I play....

FelipeInside

From reports. My friend who unsubbed said there were less than 50 people in his server most of the time and the indication was 'Light'.

On the story thing, I think it's just stupid in an MMO. You are playing the same personal story, watching the same cutscenes, killing the same bad guy every other play does. But isn't the same true for single player games? Yes, but in single player games you don't actually see the other dudes running around playing the same perosnal story you are, the big evil dude you just killed respawning a few minutes later.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for a rich *baground* story and lore in an MMORPG. But when it comes to perosnal story, it seems kinda stupid to me how you are the chosen one etc etc and there are hundreds more 'chosen ones' running around you at the same time. I think MMORPGs should have a rich baground story and lore, as for a personal story, they should provide the tools to create your story yourself through interacting with other players. For example, I've mostly played on private servers in Lineage 2, and I've got countless stories of politics, wars, betrayals, drama etc.

[QUOTE="-wildflower-"]Your name certainly suits you. Baldur's Gate? You really have no idea what you're grunting on about but, again, I'm not surprised.

Son? I probably have moles on my sack older than you.Lonelynight

You know what's funny, certain people are allowed to troll these boards with impunity yet others are banned and moderated for the tiniest infractions. Just look at this thread. How many DB's have simply attacked me without adding anything, not a single word or thought, to the topic (biggest_loser, SkyTard20, ect.). If Gamespot had any standards I'd be inclined to think there were double standards at play.

Back on topic: I wonder how long before EA throws in the towel on Bioware completely and the good Doctors go the way of Westwood, Bullfrog, and Origin? I guess they could always make Facebook games. Oh, wait...

It seems like people don't even want to play Bioware's crappy games when they're free.

Back on topic: I wonder how long before EA throws in the towel on Bioware completely and the good Doctors go the way of Westwood, Bullfrog, and Origin? I guess they could always make Facebook games. Oh, wait...

It seems like people don't even want to play Bioware's crappy games when they're free.

-wildflower-

I don't know, man - Bioware's upcoming Command and Conquer game might keep them afloat until Mass Effect 4.

[QUOTE="FelipeInside"][QUOTE="QQabitmoar"]

There's only so long an extremely linear game that's very similar gameplay wise to every other mmorpg with the only difference being that...it's more linear and has more of a personal story (lol) than others can go on pretending to be healthy and doing fine. The reports are saying that most servers are on light, which means less than 100 players in a server. By comparisson, I see over 2k players on a niche pirvate server of a niche sandbox mmorpg I play....

QQabitmoar

From reports. My friend who unsubbed said there were less than 50 people in his server most of the time and the indication was 'Light'.

On the story thing, I think it's just stupid in an MMO. You are playing the same personal story, watching the same cutscenes, killing the same bad guy every other play does. But isn't the same true for single player games? Yes, but in single player games you don't actually see the other dudes running around playing the same perosnal story you are, the big evil dude you just killed respawning a few minutes later.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for a rich *baground* story and lore in an MMORPG. But when it comes to perosnal story, it seems kinda stupid to me how you are the chosen one etc etc and there are hundreds more 'chosen ones' running around you at the same time. I think MMORPGs should have a rich baground story and lore, as for a personal story, they should provide the tools to create your story yourself through interacting with other players. For example, I've mostly played on private servers in Lineage 2, and I've got countless stories of politics, wars, betrayals, drama etc.

[QUOTE="-wildflower-"]

Back on topic: I wonder how long before EA throws in the towel on Bioware completely and the good Doctors go the way of Westwood, Bullfrog, and Origin? I guess they could always make Facebook games. Oh, wait...

It seems like people don't even want to play Bioware's crappy games when they're free.

Planeforger

I don't know, man - Bioware's upcoming Command and Conquer game might keep them afloat until Mass Effect 4.

YOU LIEK MASS EFFECT? LOL!

YOU LIEK KOTOR? ROFL!

YOU LIEK BIOWAER GAEMS?

you must be michael bbay fanboi.

speciael aeffect? jeawhu i no wat dey r michael bbay use em.

game has cutscene so is michael bay inspired.

...

wildflower is a joke.

If you think they are going to throw in the towel you are delusional. There are currently 1.7 million subscribers which is profit with those numbers. A lot of other MMOs wished they had over 500,000. Now in the future it might go F2P, it might not....doesn't meant it has failed, I just personally think the subscription model is becoming obsolete and is being replaced with F2P, microtransactions and things like the Real Money Auction House in Diablo 3.FelipeInside

There are not 1.7 million subscribers (if there ever were). Even EA admits this, I'm not sure why you can't. Who is the delusional one again? The game is failing and it's rate of attrition is horrendous.

You may think the current 1.3 million subscribes EA claims to have is something to brag about, and for any other medium to small budget MMORPG it might be, but, when you factor in that the game cost upward of $200 million to produce, still has to payout for infrastructure, employees, marketing, etc., and the game has lost 25% of its subscribers in the past few months, while it was expanding into new territories, the picture isn't quite so pretty. In fact, it looks pretty bleak.

The subscriber model can still work but probably not on something as lackluster and lacking in ambition as ToR.

YOU LIEK MASS EFFECT? LOL!

YOU LIEK KOTOR? ROFL!

YOU LIEK BIOWAER GAEMS?

you must be michael bbay fanboi.

speciael aeffect? jeawhu i no wat dey r michael bbay use em.

game has cutscene so is michael bay inspired.

...

wildflower is a joke.

SkyWard20

Oh, little peanut, you're going to have to try harder than that. Maybe you should go watch some anime or buy a new cosplay outfit and calm down.

Poor, Mr. Woo...

YOU LIEK MASS EFFECT? LOL!

YOU LIEK KOTOR? ROFL!

YOU LIEK BIOWAER GAEMS?

you must be michael bbay fanboi.

speciael aeffect? jeawhu i no wat dey r michael bbay use em.

game has cutscene so is michael bay inspired.

...

wildflower is a joke.

SkyWard20

[QUOTE="FelipeInside"]If you think they are going to throw in the towel you are delusional. There are currently 1.7 million subscribers which is profit with those numbers. A lot of other MMOs wished they had over 500,000. Now in the future it might go F2P, it might not....doesn't meant it has failed, I just personally think the subscription model is becoming obsolete and is being replaced with F2P, microtransactions and things like the Real Money Auction House in Diablo 3.-wildflower-

There are not 1.7 million subscribers (if there ever were). Even EA admits this, I'm not sure why you can't. Who is the delusional one again? The game is failing and it's rate of attrition is horrendous.

You may think the current 1.3 million subscribes EA claims to have is something to brag about, and for any other medium to small budget MMORPG it might be, but, when you factor in that the game cost upward of $200 million to produce, still has to payout for infrastructure, employees, marketing, etc., and the game has lost 25% of its subscribers in the past few months, while it was expanding into new territories, the picture isn't quite so pretty. In fact, it looks pretty bleak.

The subscriber model can still work but probably not on something as lackluster and lacking in ambition as ToR.