New Jersey hates the free market, bans sales of Tesla cars

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deactivated-5b1e62582e305

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#1 deactivated-5b1e62582e305
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Tesla was dealt a crushing blow in New Jersey today after the state's Motor Vehicle Commission passed a rule that will prevent the company from selling its electric cars directly to consumers starting in April. Unlike other automakers, Tesla sells its Model S through company-owned retail stores — a business model that cuts out the franchised auto dealerships that have ruled the market for decades. New Jersey is the third US state to ban car manufacturers from selling directly to customers, joining Texas and Arizona. But unlike those two states, New Jersey is home to a booming luxury vehicle market, making this a major loss for Tesla.

As you might guess, Tesla is outraged by the decision. In a blog post, the company blasted Governor Chris Christie's administration for deceitful tactics. Tesla claims that Christie previously agreed to delay the proposed amendment, which would have allowed "a fair process" in the state legislature. But yesterday — just 24 hours before the amendment was hurriedly passed — Tesla says it abruptly received word that Christie's administration "had gone back on its word." Tesla says the amendment "is an affront to the very concept of a free market." And the company insists this isn't just about cutting out the middleman; Tesla says full control over the buying experience is necessary to properly educate car buyers about the benefits that come with going electric.

http://www.theverge.com/2014/3/11/5497638/tesla-sales-banned-in-new-jersey

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I would ask why this is happening but let's not kid ourselves, car manufacturers are scared of Tesla so they resort to lobbying for this kind of crap.

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edinsftw

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#2  Edited By edinsftw
Member since 2009 • 4243 Posts

Yea thats bullshit, any other business can sell directly to customers.

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TheWalkingGhost

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#3 TheWalkingGhost
Member since 2012 • 6092 Posts

Ok? Then just franchise the dealerships. Problem solved.

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Master_Live

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#4 Master_Live
Member since 2004 • 20510 Posts

Let my Tesla go.

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deactivated-5b1e62582e305

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#5 deactivated-5b1e62582e305
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@TheWalkingGhost said:

Ok? Then just franchise the dealerships. Problem solved.

Why can I walk into an Apple store and buy an iPad in NJ but not walk into a Tesla store and buy a car? It just makes no sense.

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lostrib

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#6 lostrib
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That is dumb as hell

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Master_Live

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#7  Edited By Master_Live
Member since 2004 • 20510 Posts

Conflicting interests won't let it happen:

New Jersey To Tesla: You're Outta Here

Like many other dealer groups across the country, New Jersey dealers did not want Tesla to be able to sell cars directly to customers.

Christie spokesman Kevin Roberts said, “Since Tesla first began operating in New Jersey one year ago, it was made clear that the company would need to engage the Legislature on a bill to establish their new direct-sales operations under New Jersey law. This administration does not find it appropriate to unilaterally change the way cars are sold in New Jersey without legislation, and Tesla has been aware of this position since the beginning.”

And that is that.

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LostProphetFLCL

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#8 LostProphetFLCL
Member since 2006 • 18526 Posts

Crap decision from the state whose governor has the most redundant name in politics...

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SaintLeonidas

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#9 SaintLeonidas
Member since 2006 • 26735 Posts

Reason #9,865,001 never to go to New Jersey.

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limpbizkit818

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#10 limpbizkit818
Member since 2004 • 15044 Posts

Should have been posted in the OP:

Christie spokesman Kevin Roberts said, “Since Tesla first began operating in New Jersey one year ago, it was made clear that the company would need to engage the Legislature on a bill to establish their new direct-sales operations under New Jersey law. This administration does not find it appropriate to unilaterally change the way cars are sold in New Jersey without legislation, and Tesla has been aware of this position since the beginning.”

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dave123321

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#11 dave123321
Member since 2003 • 35553 Posts

@Aljosa23: you can buy an ipad outside of apple stores in nj though

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deactivated-5b1e62582e305

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#12  Edited By deactivated-5b1e62582e305
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@limpbizkit818 said:

Should have been posted in the OP:

Christie spokesman Kevin Roberts said, “Since Tesla first began operating in New Jersey one year ago, it was made clear that the company would need to engage the Legislature on a bill to establish their new direct-sales operations under New Jersey law. This administration does not find it appropriate to unilaterally change the way cars are sold in New Jersey without legislation, and Tesla has been aware of this position since the beginning.”

That does not change anything. It is still a stupid "law" and entirely goes against the "Pro-Business" stance of the GOP.

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deactivated-5b1e62582e305

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#13 deactivated-5b1e62582e305
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@dave123321 said:

@Aljosa23: you can buy an ipad outside of apple stores in nj though

And? That was Apple's decision not the government's. Besides, there are plenty of other brands that only sell at their specialty stores like Gucci yet there's somehow an issue when a car company does it.

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dave123321

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#14 dave123321
Member since 2003 • 35553 Posts

@Aljosa23: just saying that an argument needs to be sound

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#15 dave123321
Member since 2003 • 35553 Posts

I agree with you, aljosa

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#16  Edited By limpbizkit818
Member since 2004 • 15044 Posts

@Aljosa23 said:

@limpbizkit818 said:

Should have been posted in the OP:

Christie spokesman Kevin Roberts said, “Since Tesla first began operating in New Jersey one year ago, it was made clear that the company would need to engage the Legislature on a bill to establish their new direct-sales operations under New Jersey law. This administration does not find it appropriate to unilaterally change the way cars are sold in New Jersey without legislation, and Tesla has been aware of this position since the beginning.”

That does not change anything. It is still a stupid "law" and entirely goes against the "Pro-Business" stance of the GOP.

It's not a law, but a ruling passed by the New Jersey Motor Vehicle Commission. NJ says that it was made clear to Tesla that if the direct-sales method was to be used, then Tesla would need to change the state's law. Tesla is mad that they are not getting special treatment and that the ruling was not pushed back (aka blocked).

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deactivated-5b1e62582e305

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#17  Edited By deactivated-5b1e62582e305
Member since 2004 • 30778 Posts

@limpbizkit818 said:

@Aljosa23 said:

@limpbizkit818 said:

Should have been posted in the OP:

Christie spokesman Kevin Roberts said, “Since Tesla first began operating in New Jersey one year ago, it was made clear that the company would need to engage the Legislature on a bill to establish their new direct-sales operations under New Jersey law. This administration does not find it appropriate to unilaterally change the way cars are sold in New Jersey without legislation, and Tesla has been aware of this position since the beginning.”

That does not change anything. It is still a stupid "law" and entirely goes against the "Pro-Business" stance of the GOP.

It's not a law, but a ruling passed by the New Jersey Motor Vehicle Commission. NJ says that it was made clear to Tesla that if they wanted to sell cars their way, then Tesla would need to change the state's law. Tesla is mad that they are not getting special treatment and that the ruling was not pushed back (aka blocked).

What exactly is the point you are trying to make? I am saying this law/ruling/it does not matter what it is called right now is stupid and simply a ploy by other manufacturers to **** Tesla. Wanting to sell your product directly to consumers like every single company in existence is not "special treatment".

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dave123321

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#18 dave123321
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I wonder how many companies have direct sales

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deactivated-5acfa3a8bc51d

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#19 deactivated-5acfa3a8bc51d
Member since 2005 • 7914 Posts

Wow Tesla cars are awesome

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#20  Edited By the_bi99man
Member since 2004 • 11465 Posts

Good to have further confirmation that New Jersey is run by retards. As if we didn't already know.

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#21 limpbizkit818
Member since 2004 • 15044 Posts

@Aljosa23 said:

@limpbizkit818 said:

@Aljosa23 said:

@limpbizkit818 said:

Should have been posted in the OP:

Christie spokesman Kevin Roberts said, “Since Tesla first began operating in New Jersey one year ago, it was made clear that the company would need to engage the Legislature on a bill to establish their new direct-sales operations under New Jersey law. This administration does not find it appropriate to unilaterally change the way cars are sold in New Jersey without legislation, and Tesla has been aware of this position since the beginning.”

That does not change anything. It is still a stupid "law" and entirely goes against the "Pro-Business" stance of the GOP.

It's not a law, but a ruling passed by the New Jersey Motor Vehicle Commission. NJ says that it was made clear to Tesla that if they wanted to sell cars their way, then Tesla would need to change the state's law. Tesla is mad that they are not getting special treatment and that the ruling was not pushed back (aka blocked).

What exactly is the point you are trying to make? I am saying this law/ruling/it does not matter what it is called right now is stupid and simply a ploy by other manufacturers to **** Tesla. Wanting to sell your product directly to consumers like every single company in existence is not "special treatment".

My point is that you should have included NJ's response in your OP in order to give a better picture of the issue. Tesla does want special treatment. They wanted the ruling blocked and the current laws (even if they suck) subverted.

Let me get this straight: You want NJ to delay a ruling by one of its own state agencies in order to protect the right of a billion dollar corporation (Tesla) to have access to free market competition? Funny, if the details of this story where a little different I could see you crying about how the very same Pro-Business GOP were selling out to business interest. But since you like Tesla, I guess this is different. Damn if you do, damn if you don't.

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#22 deactivated-5b1e62582e305
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@limpbizkit818 said:

@Aljosa23 said:

@limpbizkit818 said:

@Aljosa23 said:

@limpbizkit818 said:

Should have been posted in the OP:

Christie spokesman Kevin Roberts said, “Since Tesla first began operating in New Jersey one year ago, it was made clear that the company would need to engage the Legislature on a bill to establish their new direct-sales operations under New Jersey law. This administration does not find it appropriate to unilaterally change the way cars are sold in New Jersey without legislation, and Tesla has been aware of this position since the beginning.”

That does not change anything. It is still a stupid "law" and entirely goes against the "Pro-Business" stance of the GOP.

It's not a law, but a ruling passed by the New Jersey Motor Vehicle Commission. NJ says that it was made clear to Tesla that if they wanted to sell cars their way, then Tesla would need to change the state's law. Tesla is mad that they are not getting special treatment and that the ruling was not pushed back (aka blocked).

What exactly is the point you are trying to make? I am saying this law/ruling/it does not matter what it is called right now is stupid and simply a ploy by other manufacturers to **** Tesla. Wanting to sell your product directly to consumers like every single company in existence is not "special treatment".

My point is that you should have included NJ's response in your OP in order to give a better picture of the issue. Tesla does want special treatment. They wanted the ruling blocked and the current laws (even if they suck) subverted.

Let me get this straight: You want NJ to delay a ruling by one of its own state agencies in order to protect the right of a billion dollar corporation (Tesla) to have access to free market competition? Funny, if the details of this story where a little different I could see you crying about how the very same Pro-Business GOP were selling out to business interest. But since you like Tesla, I guess this is different. Damn if you do, damn if you don't.

I don't really give a shit what NJ's rationalization of their stupid law is or why they even have such a dumb law to begin with nor do I see why it even matters.

The thing is they ARE selling out to business interests. But yes since I do like Telsa this is why I posted it, which should be obvious to anyone. Doesn't change the fact it is dumb.

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#23 deactivated-598fc45371265
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I never knew you to be a champion of teh free market Aljosa.

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#24  Edited By theone86
Member since 2003 • 22669 Posts

@limpbizkit818 said:

@Aljosa23 said:

@limpbizkit818 said:

Should have been posted in the OP:

Christie spokesman Kevin Roberts said, “Since Tesla first began operating in New Jersey one year ago, it was made clear that the company would need to engage the Legislature on a bill to establish their new direct-sales operations under New Jersey law. This administration does not find it appropriate to unilaterally change the way cars are sold in New Jersey without legislation, and Tesla has been aware of this position since the beginning.”

That does not change anything. It is still a stupid "law" and entirely goes against the "Pro-Business" stance of the GOP.

It's not a law, but a ruling passed by the New Jersey Motor Vehicle Commission. NJ says that it was made clear to Tesla that if the direct-sales method was to be used, then Tesla would need to change the state's law. Tesla is mad that they are not getting special treatment and that the ruling was not pushed back (aka blocked).

Is this some sort of poor attempt at a justification? I'm honestly not sure. Saying that something is a certain way is not the same thing as saying it should be that way. All you seem to be doing is appealing to authority.

They're also not asking for special treatment, they're asking that the law be amended for everybody.

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#25 limpbizkit818
Member since 2004 • 15044 Posts

@theone86 said:

@limpbizkit818 said:

@Aljosa23 said:

@limpbizkit818 said:

Should have been posted in the OP:

Christie spokesman Kevin Roberts said, “Since Tesla first began operating in New Jersey one year ago, it was made clear that the company would need to engage the Legislature on a bill to establish their new direct-sales operations under New Jersey law. This administration does not find it appropriate to unilaterally change the way cars are sold in New Jersey without legislation, and Tesla has been aware of this position since the beginning.”

That does not change anything. It is still a stupid "law" and entirely goes against the "Pro-Business" stance of the GOP.

It's not a law, but a ruling passed by the New Jersey Motor Vehicle Commission. NJ says that it was made clear to Tesla that if the direct-sales method was to be used, then Tesla would need to change the state's law. Tesla is mad that they are not getting special treatment and that the ruling was not pushed back (aka blocked).

Is this some sort of poor attempt at a justification? I'm honestly not sure. Saying that something is a certain way is not the same thing as saying it should be that way. All you seem to be doing is appealing to authority.

They're also not asking for special treatment, they're asking that the law be amended for everybody.

Justification? Appealing to authority? I'm not sure what your first paragraph is even addressing.......

You're right that they want to law changed. That's exactly what Mr. Roberts said: "it was made clear that the company would need to engage the Legislature on a bill to establish their new direct-sales operations under New Jersey law"

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#26 lamprey263
Member since 2006 • 44564 Posts

Great, that's what the world really needs, sleazy salespeople to trick people out of their money.

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#27  Edited By foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts

@Aljosa23 said:

@TheWalkingGhost said:

Ok? Then just franchise the dealerships. Problem solved.

Why can I walk into an Apple store and buy an iPad in NJ but not walk into a Tesla store and buy a car? It just makes no sense.

I don't remember the last time there was a direct-to-customer auto dealer in North America. Pretty much all of them that I know of buy cars from the manufacturer at a reduced cost and garner profits from marking up the factory cost to or something around the MSRP.

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deactivated-5b1e62582e305

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#28  Edited By deactivated-5b1e62582e305
Member since 2004 • 30778 Posts

@foxhound_fox said:

@Aljosa23 said:

@TheWalkingGhost said:

Ok? Then just franchise the dealerships. Problem solved.

Why can I walk into an Apple store and buy an iPad in NJ but not walk into a Tesla store and buy a car? It just makes no sense.

I don't remember the last time there was a direct-to-customer auto dealer in North America. Pretty much all of them that I know of buy cars from the manufacturer at a reduced cost and garner profits from marking up the factory cost to or something around the MSRP.

Do you mean auto dealer in North America like a company from NA OR just one that sells its cars here? Because I am pretty sure luxury automobile companies have their own special stores since I can not walk to my local car dealership and pick up an Aston Martin or Rolls Royce lol. Teslas would qualify as luxury cars. In fact, luxury products in general sell directly to the consumer.

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#29 plageus900
Member since 2013 • 3065 Posts

Holy shit, I agree with Aljosa23.

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#30 GIJames248
Member since 2006 • 2176 Posts

This might be unexpected if we didn't have national social security and welfare already in place, but really, looking at the state of property rights from the last fifty years, this is totally predictable.

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#31 LJS9502_basic
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I'd have to look at the business law in those states to come to a conclusion. If there are specific criteria that must be met.....then Tesla would have to meet that. Otherwise, they have an unfair advantage over other companies. Not enough info to form a conclusion.

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#32 comp_atkins
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wouldn't a proponent of a free market be in favor of direct to consumer selling? someone found a more innovative way to do something that makes it cheaper than their competitors. isn't that the whole freaking point?!?

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#33 Serraph105
Member since 2007 • 36040 Posts

The governor also banned certain types of bullets. He clearly wants to keep the boot of the government on the neck of the citizens.

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#34 GazaAli
Member since 2007 • 25216 Posts

Yea, it appears some lobbyists were not too fond of Tesla's decision to cut the middleman. So much for free market and creative destruction.

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#35 Master_Live
Member since 2004 • 20510 Posts

@comp_atkins said:

wouldn't a proponent of a free market be in favor of direct to consumer selling?

I would favor the car maker selling however they decide it is better for them.

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#36 comp_atkins
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@Master_Live said:

@comp_atkins said:

wouldn't a proponent of a free market be in favor of direct to consumer selling?

I would favor the car maker selling however they decide it is better for them.

who is "they" though? consumers? auto makers? dealership owners?

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#37 Master_Live
Member since 2004 • 20510 Posts

Auto makers.

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#38 Crunchy_Nuts
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@LJS9502_basic said:

I'd have to look at the business law in those states to come to a conclusion. If there are specific criteria that must be met.....then Tesla would have to meet that. Otherwise, they have an unfair advantage over other companies. Not enough info to form a conclusion.

Yes. The criteria is that they must sell through a dealer which they do not own. Basically the state is propping up an entire industry which would pretty much collapse if it had to actually compete fairly.

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#39  Edited By comp_atkins
Member since 2005 • 38678 Posts

@Crunchy_Nuts said:

@LJS9502_basic said:

I'd have to look at the business law in those states to come to a conclusion. If there are specific criteria that must be met.....then Tesla would have to meet that. Otherwise, they have an unfair advantage over other companies. Not enough info to form a conclusion.

Yes. The criteria is that they must sell through a dealer which they do not own. Basically the state is propping up an entire industry which would pretty much collapse if it had to actually compete fairly.

pretty much. it's 2014, consumers ought to have the option to purchase a new car directly from a manufacturer rather than a franchised dealership. if they want all the extras/service that comes from a dealship, that could be an option as well, but it shouldn't be mandated by law. that will require a change in the state's laws, however, which doesn't appear to be happening anytime soon.

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#41 Jd1680a
Member since 2005 • 5960 Posts

Nearly all states in the US it is illegal for a car manufacture to sell directly to a customer. There have to be a middle man in the business of selling cars. Main reason this have happened is the auto dealerships have a huge chunk of money in state legislators to make it a law.

Im wonder if Tesla could fight the state laws on selling cars to consumers on constitutional grounds.