A question about the bible?

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Ikouze

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#1 Ikouze
Member since 2009 • 2027 Posts

Okay let me start out, I don't mean to offend anyone in anyway by asking this question. But I'm agnostic and I was just thing about the bible. I was wondering why you hear all of these things about talking animals, splitting seas, angels coming to visit earth and prophets like we do in the bible? We don't hear about any of the miracles happening now like we do in the bible. What's up with that? Can someone explain this for me?

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Ed_Cetera

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#2 Ed_Cetera
Member since 2009 • 373 Posts
Ever heard of allegory?
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Ikouze

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#3 Ikouze
Member since 2009 • 2027 Posts

Ever heard of allegory?Ed_Cetera

Nope. Explain please.

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D_Battery

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#4 D_Battery
Member since 2009 • 2478 Posts
Ever heard of allegory?Ed_Cetera
Blasphemy! It's all 100% true!
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deactivated-57e5de5e137a4

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#5 deactivated-57e5de5e137a4
Member since 2004 • 12929 Posts

You don't hear about most of those things in the New Testament either, except for Jesus' resurrection and the Apocalypse.

If you have questions about the Bible, the best way to get the answers is to read it for yourself. I'm agnostic as well.

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super_mario_128

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#6 super_mario_128
Member since 2006 • 23884 Posts
Ever heard of allegory?Ed_Cetera
Pretty much this. The Bible taken literally doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
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YoJim8obaJoe

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#7 YoJim8obaJoe
Member since 2008 • 2653 Posts

It is explained at some point in the bible but it long time since i read it,if i remember right after Moses freed the slaves and started the journey to the promised land,in the time Moses was away to collect the commandments his followers started following false gods and this pretty much pissed God off and he wasnt best pleased.Obviously more in-depth than that :) I'd still say miracles happen though

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Ed_Cetera

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#8 Ed_Cetera
Member since 2009 • 373 Posts

[QUOTE="Ed_Cetera"]Ever heard of allegory?Ikouze

Nope. Explain please.

Basically I don't believe most of those stories were meant to be taken literally.
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bsman00

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#9 bsman00
Member since 2008 • 6038 Posts

Okay let me start out, I don't mean to offend anyone in anyway by asking this question. But I'm agnostic and I was just thing about the bible. I was wondering why you hear all of these things about talking animals, splitting seas, angels coming to visit earth and prophets like we do in the bible? We don't hear about any of the miracles happening now like we do in the bible. What's up with that? Can someone explain this for me?

Ikouze
Cause it was all made up by men....its just a story
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ghoklebutter

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#10 ghoklebutter
Member since 2007 • 19327 Posts

It's just like history I guess. But then again I'm not Christian.

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Ikouze

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#11 Ikouze
Member since 2009 • 2027 Posts

It is explained at some point in the bible but it long time since i read it,if i remember right after Moses freed the slaves and started the journey to the promised land,in the time Moses was away to collect the commandments his followers started following false gods and this pretty much pissed God off and he wasnt best pleased.Obviously more in-depth than that :) I'd still say miracles happen though

YoJim8obaJoe

Then wouldn't that mean...Other people that practice other religions such as Buddism, and Hindusism are going to hell? Well isn't that a load of crap. I guess my GF is going to hell because she's Buddist.

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Noskillkill

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#12 Noskillkill
Member since 2009 • 1116 Posts

Jesus and God are already done taking care of business, getting Christianity out there, spreading the word, demonstrating what he can do and what he will do. He has returned to Heaven and we are now in the waiting process until he returns. thats why nothing big happens anymore. (but it would be so much easier to have strong faith if those things did happen today)

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Teenaged

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#13 Teenaged
Member since 2007 • 31764 Posts

[QUOTE="Ed_Cetera"]Ever heard of allegory?Ikouze

Nope. Explain please.

Allegory is a continuous metaphor.

When an author/poet etc uses allegory he says one thing but does not mean it literally. In stead he/she wishes to convey an underlying message through his/her words.

Example: Plato's allegory of the cave.

Plato was describing no real cave and no real men trapped inside it.

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unholymight

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#14 unholymight
Member since 2007 • 3378 Posts

[QUOTE="Ikouze"]

[QUOTE="Ed_Cetera"]Ever heard of allegory?Teenaged

Nope. Explain please.

Allegory is a continuous metaphor.

When an author/poet etc uses allegory he says one thing but does not mean it literally. In stead he/she wishes to convey an underlying message through his/her words.

How are we supposed to know whether to take it literally or not? I mean, wasn't it taken literally historically?
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#15 Teenaged
Member since 2007 • 31764 Posts

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="Ikouze"]

Nope. Explain please.

unholymight

Allegory is a continuous metaphor.

When an author/poet etc uses allegory he says one thing but does not mean it literally. In stead he/she wishes to convey an underlying message through his/her words.

How are we supposed to know whether to take it literally or not? I mean, wasn't it taken literally historically?

An allegorical text can be judged as such based on the styIe, the plausibility of what it describes, the traditions of religions which shows us a pattern of using allegory to convey messages etc.

To me most important is the styIe, which encompasses the expressive means an author uses, his/her "styIe" etc.

As for if the peopleof the time thought it was literal. I think to them literal and metaphorical had no distinction. Allegory was more frequent in the ancient times, because it is used when humans try to explain things they cannot otherwise and back then there were more things unknown to us than today.

In short I would say that to them, allegory was their literal truth. Judging by the social conditions back then, the skeptics were too few. Today the average person is many times more skeptical than the average person then. Most people lived simple lives and had no interest to discern allegory from literal narration. Especially in issues where "naturally" allegory was used. I dont think the use of allegory is always conscious and thats why I dont believe a distinction between literal and allegorical is existant to all people. And to my perception most people back then had no such distinction formed in their heads.

So the answer to this no matter what it is, wont be enlightening imo.

And even if it was I disagree that it has any role to play in the issue.

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deactivated-5df4e79c309ad

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#16 deactivated-5df4e79c309ad
Member since 2005 • 6045 Posts

Okay let me start out, I don't mean to offend anyone in anyway by asking this question. But I'm agnostic and I was just thing about the bible. I was wondering why you hear all of these things about talking animals, splitting seas, angels coming to visit earth and prophets like we do in the bible? We don't hear about any of the miracles happening now like we do in the bible. What's up with that? Can someone explain this for me?

Ikouze
Maybe it's because such miracles are not going to make many people believe in God.
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Teenaged

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#17 Teenaged
Member since 2007 • 31764 Posts

[QUOTE="Ikouze"]

Okay let me start out, I don't mean to offend anyone in anyway by asking this question. But I'm agnostic and I was just thing about the bible. I was wondering why you hear all of these things about talking animals, splitting seas, angels coming to visit earth and prophets like we do in the bible? We don't hear about any of the miracles happening now like we do in the bible. What's up with that? Can someone explain this for me?

Jemdude

Maybe it's because such miracles are not going to make many people believe in God.

Then why were they supposedly performed 2000 years ago?

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Darth-Caedus

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#18 Darth-Caedus
Member since 2008 • 20756 Posts
For the same reason elves don't exist now, yet they do in Lord Of The Rings...it's just a story...>___>
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Teenaged

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#19 Teenaged
Member since 2007 • 31764 Posts

For the same reason elves don't exist now, yet they do in Lord Of The Rings...it's just a story...>___>Darth-Caedus
:|:|:|:|:|:|:|:|:|:|

What did you say, just now?

What-..I don-.....How c-.... :|

:cry:

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unholymight

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#20 unholymight
Member since 2007 • 3378 Posts

[QUOTE="unholymight"][QUOTE="Teenaged"]Allegory is a continuous metaphor.

When an author/poet etc uses allegory he says one thing but does not mean it literally. In stead he/she wishes to convey an underlying message through his/her words.

Teenaged

How are we supposed to know whether to take it literally or not? I mean, wasn't it taken literally historically?

An allegorical text can be judged as such based on the styIe, the plausibility of what it describes, the traditions of religions which shows us a pattern of using allegory to convey messages etc.

To me most important is the styIe, which encompasses the expressive means an author uses, his/her "styIe" etc.

As for if the peopleof the time thought it was literal. I think to them literal and metaphorical had no distinction. Allegory was more frequent in the ancient times, because it is used when humans try to explain things they cannot otherwise and back then there were more things unknown to us than today.

In short I would say that to them, allegory was their literal truth. Judging by the social conditions back then, the skeptics were too few. Today the average person is many times more skeptical than the average person then. Most people lived simple lives and had no interest to discern allegory from literal narration. Especially in issues where "naturally" allegory was used. I dont think the use of allegory is always conscious and thats why I dont believe a distinction between literal and allegorical is existant to all people. And to my perception most people back then had no such distinction formed in their heads.

So the answer to this no matter what it is, wont be enlightening imo.

And even if it was I disagree that it has any role to play in the issue.

I see. I was wondering whether the fact that people interpreted the Bible differently over time caused the Word of God to be different for different time periods. This would suggest an evolution of the religion, where it is changed such that only the parts that make sense in a contemporary or in this case modern context are left behind, and any parts that do not make this kind of sense have found new uses as metaphors that do make sense in the contemporary context. This would conflict somewhat with the view that Christianity and the Word of God is constant and unchanging.
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dark-warmachine

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#21 dark-warmachine
Member since 2007 • 3476 Posts

With so much questionable things in the bible, that's the best TC can come up with.:(

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AngelofDeath213

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#22 AngelofDeath213
Member since 2009 • 2219 Posts
For the same reason elves don't exist now, yet they do in Lord Of The Rings...it's just a story...>___>Darth-Caedus
Comparing one of the largest religions in the world to a fantasy novel doesn't seem right to me.
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Darth-Caedus

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#23 Darth-Caedus
Member since 2008 • 20756 Posts

[QUOTE="Darth-Caedus"]For the same reason elves don't exist now, yet they do in Lord Of The Rings...it's just a story...>___>Teenaged

:|:|:|:|:|:|:|:|:|:|

What did you say, just now?

What-..I don-.....How c-.... :|

:cry:

I never said they ever existed....just like none of the stuff TC said ever existed >_>

Or are you complaining that I said elves don't exist?:P

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#24 Teenaged
Member since 2007 • 31764 Posts

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="Darth-Caedus"]For the same reason elves don't exist now, yet they do in Lord Of The Rings...it's just a story...>___>Darth-Caedus

:|:|:|:|:|:|:|:|:|:|

What did you say, just now?

What-..I don-.....How c-.... :|

:cry:

I never said they ever existed....just like none of the stuff TC said ever existed >_>

But the joke was that I supposedly did believe they existed and that you ruined my dreams etc. :P

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Darth-Caedus

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#25 Darth-Caedus
Member since 2008 • 20756 Posts
[QUOTE="AngelofDeath213"] Comparing one of the largest religions in the world to a fantasy novel doesn't seem right to me.

Well...to be fair, I compared it to one of the worlds biggest fantasy novels at least...:P
But the joke was that I supposedly did believe they existed and that you ruined my dreams etc. :P

Teenaged
Oh, ok...the "just now" part through me a bit:P
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#26 Teenaged
Member since 2007 • 31764 Posts

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="unholymight"] How are we supposed to know whether to take it literally or not? I mean, wasn't it taken literally historically?unholymight

An allegorical text can be judged as such based on the styIe, the plausibility of what it describes, the traditions of religions which shows us a pattern of using allegory to convey messages etc.

To me most important is the styIe, which encompasses the expressive means an author uses, his/her "styIe" etc.

As for if the peopleof the time thought it was literal. I think to them literal and metaphorical had no distinction. Allegory was more frequent in the ancient times, because it is used when humans try to explain things they cannot otherwise and back then there were more things unknown to us than today.

In short I would say that to them, allegory was their literal truth. Judging by the social conditions back then, the skeptics were too few. Today the average person is many times more skeptical than the average person then. Most people lived simple lives and had no interest to discern allegory from literal narration. Especially in issues where "naturally" allegory was used. I dont think the use of allegory is always conscious and thats why I dont believe a distinction between literal and allegorical is existant to all people. And to my perception most people back then had no such distinction formed in their heads.

So the answer to this no matter what it is, wont be enlightening imo.

And even if it was I disagree that it has any role to play in the issue.

I see. I was wondering whether the fact that people interpreted the Bible differently over time caused the Word of God to be different for different time periods. This would suggest an evolution of the religion, where it is changed such that only the parts that make sense in a contemporary or in this case modern context are left behind, and any parts that do not make this kind of sense have found new uses as metaphors that do make sense in the contemporary context. This would conflict somewhat with the view that Christianity and the Word of God is constant and unchanging.

I think what has changed over time is not so much an arising tendency to discard texts as allegorical but a tendency to scrutinise more and more.

But scrutinising doesnt lead to one way.

A person that will start scrutinising the Bible will then find themselves in the dichotomy allegory/literal narration, because in the process of scrutinising the purpose is justification and rationalisation, and defining the text in this linguistic dualistic principle you achieve a certain set of rules by witch you treat your text, and thats important; to have a solid "philosophy" as the basis of your study. And then they choose. I cant say or even guess what makes people choose though.

Of course others deny that there is such a dichotomy (or better put they dont see why the whole book is either allegorical or literal) so they are in the middle one could say.

BTW I am not saying the last group of people are in the wrong. They are most probably right imo.

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#27 Wikipedian
Member since 2007 • 1100 Posts

[QUOTE="Ed_Cetera"]Ever heard of allegory?Ikouze

Nope. Explain please.

The Bible was never meant to be taken literally. It was written as a compilation of mythology holding fundamental truths for life back in it's period.

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deactivated-5df4e79c309ad

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#28 deactivated-5df4e79c309ad
Member since 2005 • 6045 Posts

Then why were they supposedly performed 2000 years ago?

Teenaged

To help the people believe back then. They didn't have written historical accounts like we do today.

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#29 Teenaged
Member since 2007 • 31764 Posts

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]Then why were they supposedly performed 2000 years ago?

Jemdude

To help the people believe back then. They didn't have written historical accounts like we do today.

So miracles were used to attract people to the religion?

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#30 Dark_Knight6
Member since 2006 • 16619 Posts

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]Then why were they supposedly performed 2000 years ago?

Jemdude

To help the people believe back then. They didn't have written historical accounts like we do today.

So because we've got an old, unreliable book, God doesn't see it fit to prove his existence? :?

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#31 MetallicaKings
Member since 2004 • 4781 Posts

It is explained at some point in the bible but it long time since i read it,if i remember right after Moses freed the slaves and started the journey to the promised land,in the time Moses was away to collect the commandments his followers started following false gods and this pretty much pissed God off and he wasnt best pleased.Obviously more in-depth than that :) I'd still say miracles happen though

YoJim8obaJoe
why in gods name (pun intended) would the follows start believing in false gods? If I saw moses part the red sea, I piss my pants then bow down to him for the rest of my life
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#32 ghoklebutter
Member since 2007 • 19327 Posts
[QUOTE="YoJim8obaJoe"]

It is explained at some point in the bible but it long time since i read it,if i remember right after Moses freed the slaves and started the journey to the promised land,in the time Moses was away to collect the commandments his followers started following false gods and this pretty much pissed God off and he wasnt best pleased.Obviously more in-depth than that :) I'd still say miracles happen though

MetallicaKings
why in gods name (pun intended) would the follows start believing in false gods? If I saw moses part the red sea, I piss my pants then bow down to him for the rest of my life

Because of the golden calf.
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unholymight

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#33 unholymight
Member since 2007 • 3378 Posts

[QUOTE="unholymight"][QUOTE="Teenaged"]An allegorical text can be judged as such based on the styIe, the plausibility of what it describes, the traditions of religions which shows us a pattern of using allegory to convey messages etc.

To me most important is the styIe, which encompasses the expressive means an author uses, his/her "styIe" etc.

As for if the peopleof the time thought it was literal. I think to them literal and metaphorical had no distinction. Allegory was more frequent in the ancient times, because it is used when humans try to explain things they cannot otherwise and back then there were more things unknown to us than today.

In short I would say that to them, allegory was their literal truth. Judging by the social conditions back then, the skeptics were too few. Today the average person is many times more skeptical than the average person then. Most people lived simple lives and had no interest to discern allegory from literal narration. Especially in issues where "naturally" allegory was used. I dont think the use of allegory is always conscious and thats why I dont believe a distinction between literal and allegorical is existant to all people. And to my perception most people back then had no such distinction formed in their heads.

So the answer to this no matter what it is, wont be enlightening imo.

And even if it was I disagree that it has any role to play in the issue.

Teenaged

I see. I was wondering whether the fact that people interpreted the Bible differently over time caused the Word of God to be different for different time periods. This would suggest an evolution of the religion, where it is changed such that only the parts that make sense in a contemporary or in this case modern context are left behind, and any parts that do not make this kind of sense have found new uses as metaphors that do make sense in the contemporary context. This would conflict somewhat with the view that Christianity and the Word of God is constant and unchanging.

I think what has changed over time is not so much an arising tendency to discard texts as allegorical but a tendency to scrutinise more and more.

But scrutinising doesnt lead to one way.

A person that will start scrutinising the Bible will then find themselves in the dichotomy allegory/literal narration, because in the process of scrutinising the purpose is justification and rationalisation, and defining the text in this linguistic dualistic principle you achieve a certain set of rules by witch you treat your text, and thats important; to have a solid "philosophy" as the basis of your study. And then they choose. I cant say or even guess what makes people choose though.

Of course others deny that there is such a dichotomy (or better put they dont see why the whole book is either allegorical or literal) so they are in the middle one could say.

BTW I am not saying the last group of people are in the wrong. They are most probably right imo.

Yes, this does make sense, considering that it was not very long ago that people could freely scrutinize religion (such as Darwin, who likely feared the prosecution). But I think that the trend of increasing amounts of text becoming viewed as allegorical did occur and arose as scientific advancements were able to explain more about the unknown. For example, before absolute dating techniques came along there could have easily been people who had taken literally that the age of the Earth was only a few thousand years. After the scientific advancements came along, that one section would have converted from being literal to allegorical.

I see that there are many ways to read the Bible but perhaps the advancement of science changed the guidelines by which people use to judge a section as either allegorical or literal.

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#34 D_Battery
Member since 2009 • 2478 Posts
[QUOTE="Jemdude"]

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]Then why were they supposedly performed 2000 years ago?

To help the people believe back then. They didn't have written historical accounts like we do today.

Lol, nice sig. I've never actually found anyone who supported the CHP, but I've heard of them here and there... Not exactly a prominent (or viable) party, but I guess it's commendable to stand up for what you believe, even if the guys representing you have no chance of getting in. Maybe I'll vote Marxist-Leninist next time just for fun; they have about the same odds as the CHP.
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mohfrontline

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#35 mohfrontline
Member since 2007 • 5678 Posts
I believe God became pissed off at some point in the Old Testament and said after His Son returns, that will be the last time He'd show his "marvels" on the Earth. I'll try and find the verse if I can, but I'm pretty sure that's the explanation.
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#36 GabuEx
Member since 2006 • 36552 Posts

For as long as there has been the Christian religion, there have been arguments over whether events described therein are intended to be literal historical accounts or whether they are intended to be simply parts of a story with fundamental messages to relate to its audience, but which is not intended to actually talk about things that actually happened. The ancient school of Alexandria taught an allegorical interpretation, whereas the ancient school of Antioch taught a literal interpretation.

I tend to fall down closer to the allegorical side than the literal side. I feel that the stories in the Bible may have been loosely based on events that took place in history, but their ultimate purpose is not to provide a factual historical account. Whenever Jesus spoke to his followers, he was instructing his listeners, not teaching them history. The ultimate thing that one is to learn from the Bible is the way in which one ought to conduct oneself in life, not historical facts.

To help the people believe back then. They didn't have written historical accounts like we do today.

Jemdude

Wait, but you just said that the miracles wouldn't help people to believe...

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unholymight

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#37 unholymight
Member since 2007 • 3378 Posts

For as long as there has been the Christian religion, there have been arguments over whether events described therein are intended to be literal historical accounts or whether they are intended to be simply parts of a story with fundamental messages to relate to its audience, but which is not intended to actually talk about things that actually happened. The ancient school of Alexandria taught an allegorical interpretation, whereas the ancient school of Antioch taught a literal interpretation.

I tend to fall down closer to the allegorical side than the literal side. I feel that the stories in the Bible may have been loosely based on events that took place in history, but their ultimate purpose is not to provide a factual historical account. Whenever Jesus spoke to his followers, he was instructing his listeners, not teaching them history. The ultimate thing that one is to learn from the Bible is the way in which one ought to conduct oneself in life, not historical facts.

[QUOTE="Jemdude"]

To help the people believe back then. They didn't have written historical accounts like we do today.

GabuEx

Wait, but you just said that the miracles wouldn't help people to believe...

If I were to adopt a religion such that it would help guide my behaviour and personal beliefs in life it would not fit to constrain myself to the model established by any popular religion, simply because each person is different and there are aspects of each religion that may not necessarily suit. If I were to choose the spiritual path I would create my own religion (or perhaps it would not be a religion since it's just 1 person), feeling free to alter it as I wish. A spiritual path is equal to any other spiritual path; no need for constraints in that case.
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RearNakedChoke

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#38 RearNakedChoke
Member since 2009 • 1699 Posts

[QUOTE="Ikouze"]

[QUOTE="Ed_Cetera"]Ever heard of allegory?Ed_Cetera

Nope. Explain please.

Basically I don't believe most of those stories were meant to be taken literally.

It's pretty convenient that all the stories in the bible that don't make sense are now "metaphorical"

It's entirely possible that people took the bible literally when it was originally written.

Christians pick and choose which stories to believe, and what principles to follow.

You don't see many people stoning adulters, homosexuals, or people who divorce and then remarry (which is also considered adultery in the bible).

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akuma_od3

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#39 akuma_od3
Member since 2009 • 583 Posts

Okay let me start out, I don't mean to offend anyone in anyway by asking this question. But I'm agnostic and I was just thing about the bible. I was wondering why you hear all of these things about talking animals, splitting seas, angels coming to visit earth and prophets like we do in the bible? We don't hear about any of the miracles happening now like we do in the bible. What's up with that? Can someone explain this for me?

Ikouze

Um, yes. The Bible is fiction, thats why.

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LJS9502_basic

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#40 LJS9502_basic  Online
Member since 2003 • 178860 Posts

For as long as there has been the Christian religion,

GabuEx

Are you forgetting the Jewish faith?

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THUMPTABLE

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#41 THUMPTABLE
Member since 2003 • 2358 Posts

[QUOTE="Ikouze"]

Okay let me start out, I don't mean to offend anyone in anyway by asking this question. But I'm agnostic and I was just thing about the bible. I was wondering why you hear all of these things about talking animals, splitting seas, angels coming to visit earth and prophets like we do in the bible? We don't hear about any of the miracles happening now like we do in the bible. What's up with that? Can someone explain this for me?

Jemdude

Maybe it's because such miracles are not going to make many people believe in God.



It does not happen now because it never happened then.

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deactivated-5df4e79c309ad

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#42 deactivated-5df4e79c309ad
Member since 2005 • 6045 Posts

Wait, but you just said that the miracles wouldn't help people to believe...

GabuEx

It helped the people back then to believe, but not the people of today.

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THUMPTABLE

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#43 THUMPTABLE
Member since 2003 • 2358 Posts

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]Wait, but you just said that the miracles wouldn't help people to believe...

Jemdude

It helped the people back then to believe, but not the people of today.


Your painting a picture to make your story fit.

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ViewtifulScott

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#44 ViewtifulScott
Member since 2005 • 878 Posts
Because it's a fantasy fiction tale written by bronze age sheepherders who got a wee bit too much sun, and started talking to a rock.
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ghoklebutter

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#45 ghoklebutter
Member since 2007 • 19327 Posts

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]Wait, but you just said that the miracles wouldn't help people to believe...

Jemdude

It helped the people back then to believe, but not the people of today.

Because it's a fantasy fiction tale written by bronze age sheepherders who got a wee bit too much sun, and started talking to a rock.ViewtifulScott
ROFL that made my night :lol:
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Teenaged

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#46 Teenaged
Member since 2007 • 31764 Posts

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]Wait, but you just said that the miracles wouldn't help people to believe...

Jemdude

It helped the people back then to believe, but not the people of today.

There's no rationality in what you are saying. Why use miracles only back then and not now?

And you didnt answer my previous question.

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lightleggy

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#47 lightleggy
Member since 2008 • 16090 Posts

Okay let me start out, I don't mean to offend anyone in anyway by asking this question. But I'm agnostic and I was just thing about the bible. I was wondering why you hear all of these things about talking animals, splitting seas, angels coming to visit earth and prophets like we do in the bible? We don't hear about any of the miracles happening now like we do in the bible. What's up with that? Can someone explain this for me?

Ikouze
because thats called faith, ever heard of it?
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lightleggy

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#48 lightleggy
Member since 2008 • 16090 Posts

[QUOTE="Jemdude"]

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]Wait, but you just said that the miracles wouldn't help people to believe...

Teenaged

It helped the people back then to believe, but not the people of today.

There's no rationality in what you are saying. Why use miracles only back then and not now?

And you didnt answer my previous question.

well even Jesus said "they ask for a proof, but they will not get it" when the people started saying "if you are the son of God, proove it" listen, im pretty sure that if something like the devil comming out of the ground in the middle of manhattan would make every single atheist to become christian and pray for salvation, and that is just not the way it was meant to be...
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Teenaged

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#49 Teenaged
Member since 2007 • 31764 Posts

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="Jemdude"]

It helped the people back then to believe, but not the people of today.

lightleggy

There's no rationality in what you are saying. Why use miracles only back then and not now?

And you didnt answer my previous question.

well even Jesus said "they ask for a proof, but they will not get it" when the people started saying "if you are the son of God, proove it" listen, im pretty sure that if something like the devil comming out of the ground in the middle of manhattan would make every single atheist to become christian and pray for salvation, and that is just not the way it was meant to be...

I didnt ask for Bible verses that reiterate the point.

I asked why miracles where performed back then and not now.

"not the way it was meant to be"? That clearly explains nothing at all. It doesnt explain why. There is no why? I would accept that, not as an answer that satisfies me but an answer that pretty much would end the discussion.

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FamiBox

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#50 FamiBox
Member since 2007 • 5481 Posts

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

[QUOTE="Ikouze"]

Nope. Explain please.

unholymight

Allegory is a continuous metaphor.

When an author/poet etc uses allegory he says one thing but does not mean it literally. In stead he/she wishes to convey an underlying message through his/her words.

How are we supposed to know whether to take it literally or not? I mean, wasn't it taken literally historically?

It's called cherry picking.