How about an Atheist amateur history buff. In essence the first Crusade was because there were knights running around Europe, with nothing to do after Europe somewhat stabilized, hired out by rich nobles to do their dirty work. Several kings appealed to the Pope Alexander II that they should capture back the Holy Land. The Pope agrees, 1st Crusade starts, they continue on from roughly 1095-1293 or so, problems with European, and now American, presence in the Middle East ensue to this day.
From what I know about it, it is a war set into action by the catholic church over muslims getting too close inwards to their land. Christianity is no way responsible, and Jesus would have an agro at that pope who commissioned it.
It was the Catholics' fault. End of story. Nothing to do with Christianity, and completely contrary to Jesus' teachings. :)Lansdowne5
I thought Catholics were Christians? Especially as, at the time, the Church of England didn't exist, and Roman Catholicism was the primary form of Christianity by a long way.
[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"]It was the Catholics' fault. End of story. Nothing to do with Christianity, and completely contrary to Jesus' teachings. :)Bourbons3
I thought Catholics were Christians? Especially as, at the time, the Church of England didn't exist, and Roman Catholicism was the primary form of Christianity by a long way.They don't agree precisely with fundamentalist protestantism, therefore they're not Christians. >_>
[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"]It was the Catholics' fault. End of story. Nothing to do with Christianity, and completely contrary to Jesus' teachings. :)Bourbons3
I thought Catholics were Christians? Especially as, at the time, the Church of England didn't exist, and Roman Catholicism was the primary form of Christianity by a long way.
Â
I believe you are correct. Catholic's at the time were the only Christan's save a few very small sects.
How about an Atheist amateur history buff. In essence the first Crusade was because there were knights running around Europe, with nothing to do after Europe somewhat stabilized, hired out by rich nobles to do their dirty work. Several kings appealed to the Pope Alexander II that they should capture back the Holy Land. The Pope agrees, 1st Crusade starts, they continue on from roughly 1095-1293 or so, problems with European, and now American, presence in the Middle East ensue to this day.btaylor2404
I thought the First Crusade with the Byzantine emperor appealing for mercenaries to fight the Seljuk Turks who were encroaching on his bordors and Pope Urban II declared the crusade.
I could be wrong, and this is all from memory, but I believe the 1st was as I described. The main reason being knights running around with nothing to do, kinda like letting our full military in the streets with no jobs but still fully armed.
I could be wrong, and this is all from memory, but I believe the 1st was as I described. The main reason being knights running around with nothing to do, kinda like letting our full military in the streets with no jobs but still fully armed.btaylor2404
Yeaaa!....Imagine the torment of a samurai with a brand new shiny sharpened katana in an eternally empty desert! Brings tears to my eyes!
[QUOTE="Bourbons3"][QUOTE="Lansdowne5"]It was the Catholics' fault. End of story. Nothing to do with Christianity, and completely contrary to Jesus' teachings. :)Funky_Llama
I thought Catholics were Christians? Especially as, at the time, the Church of England didn't exist, and Roman Catholicism was the primary form of Christianity by a long way.They don't agree precisely with fundamentalist protestantism, therefore they're not Christians. >_>
[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"]It was the Catholics' fault. End of story. Nothing to do with Christianity, and completely contrary to Jesus' teachings. :)Bourbons3
I thought Catholics were Christians? Especially as, at the time, the Church of England didn't exist, and Roman Catholicism was the primary form of Christianity by a long way. Oh they are, but it doesn't change that what did was against scripture. Therefore they seperated themselves from the religion and acted of their own accord.
[QUOTE="Funky_Llama"][QUOTE="Bourbons3"][QUOTE="Lansdowne5"]It was the Catholics' fault. End of story. Nothing to do with Christianity, and completely contrary to Jesus' teachings. :)Lansdowne5
I thought Catholics were Christians? Especially as, at the time, the Church of England didn't exist, and Roman Catholicism was the primary form of Christianity by a long way.They don't agree precisely with fundamentalist protestantism, therefore they're not Christians. >_>
I never claimed they weren't Christians . . . .Â
:roll: Your comment implied it. But anyway, humouring you for no reason... are Catholics Christians? >___>
[QUOTE="btaylor2404"]How about an Atheist amateur history buff. In essence the first Crusade was because there were knights running around Europe, with nothing to do after Europe somewhat stabilized, hired out by rich nobles to do their dirty work. Several kings appealed to the Pope Alexander II that they should capture back the Holy Land. The Pope agrees, 1st Crusade starts, they continue on from roughly 1095-1293 or so, problems with European, and now American, presence in the Middle East ensue to this day.AnObscureName
I thought the First Crusade with the Byzantine emperor appealing for mercenaries to fight the Seljuk Turks who were encroaching on his bordors and Pope Urban II declared the crusade.
The Crusades were attempts by the Catholic church to regain lost territory in Palestine. The church tried to use religion to boost morale, but it ultimately failed for 2 reasons 1: With the exception of the first crusade, the outcomes were decidedly secular 2: the people who went on crusades did it to gain land and money. religious fervor had remarkably little to do with the crusades. Vox Day in The Irrational Atheist has 2 great chapters on this subject, one entitled The War Delusion, and the other entield Hitler, the Inquisition, and the Crusades.
[QUOTE="Funky_Llama"][QUOTE="Bourbons3"][QUOTE="Lansdowne5"]It was the Catholics' fault. End of story. Nothing to do with Christianity, and completely contrary to Jesus' teachings. :)Funky_Llama
I thought Catholics were Christians? Especially as, at the time, the Church of England didn't exist, and Roman Catholicism was the primary form of Christianity by a long way.They don't agree precisely with fundamentalist protestantism, therefore they're not Christians. >_>
I never claimed they weren't Christians . . . .Â
:roll: Your comment implied it. But anyway, humouring you for no reason... are Catholics Christians? >___>
I can't make a generalization like that. Some Catholics truly are born again Christians who have given their lives to Christ. Others, on the other hand, are not. :)Â
I can't make a generalization like that. Some Catholics truly are born again Christians who have given their lives to Christ. Others, on the other hand, are not. :)Â
Lansdowne5
Then how can you say that Catholicism has nothing to do with Christianity? O_o
I can't make a generalization like that. Some Catholics truly are born again Christians who have given their lives to Christ. Others, on the other hand, are not. :)Â
Funky_Llama
Then how can you say that Catholicism has nothing to do with Christianity? O_o
I didn't. I said the Crusades were the "Catholics'" fault. i.e - the Catholics at the time.Â
When such major things happen then it isn't the masse's fault entirely (i.e. Catholics) but who led them or better urged them to support such acts (i.e. the Pope). Again I'll say that in times when the level of education was low and the power of religion strong (BAAAAAAD combination) it's easy for a whole nation or empire to make decisions (theoretically speaking as in that time the religious higherarchy was in power) swayed by the will of megalomaniacal men (i.e. the Popes).
So saying "it's the Catholics' fault" is unfair, at least. Say "it's the Popes' fault" and then you're a bit closer to being accurate...
I can't make a generalization like that. Some Catholics truly are born again Christians who have given their lives to Christ. Others, on the other hand, are not. :)Â
Lansdowne5
Then how can you say that Catholicism has nothing to do with Christianity? O_o
I didn't. I said the Crusades were the "Catholics'" fault. i.e - the Catholics at the time.Â
I can't make a generalization like that. Some Catholics truly are born again Christians who have given their lives to Christ. Others, on the other hand, are not. :)Â
Funky_Llama
Then how can you say that Catholicism has nothing to do with Christianity? O_o
I didn't. I said the Crusades were the "Catholics'" fault. i.e - the Catholics at the time.Â
So were the Catholics at the time Christians?
By their actions, I would say the majority were not. :)Â
Log in to comment