Yes or No - is Kojima a good writer?

@Gue1:

I hear that man, I wish Kojima didn't create main line MGS games for handhelds. PW is still good though, I actually found it more enjoyable than MGS4.

Anyways if you want to watch the full gameplay segment, here is the Youtube link.

Good writer? Lulz, no. Just got the MGS legacy collection to play through the complete thing before Phantom Pain arrives and the writing is laughably bad. Codec conversations are especially painful. It's still highly entertaining to me. But I also consider movies with Dolph Lundgren highly entertaining, so...

Short answer: no

Long answer: nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

hahaha God no. He's good at the type of stuff he does but in general writing terms his stuff is pretty crappy.

why is it a yes or no question? :P

Yes Kojima is a good writer, but he is horrible at keeping twists and sequals intertwine in a none messy way.

Maybe he simply ain't taking it seriously, or he just loses focus and finished the MGS series in his head long ago. But the first MGS games and Zone of the enders points to "yes"

So perhaps he simply sucks at making long running series? ^^

signed in just to say YES!

He is but he is also from a very different culture than ours, despite the fact that he draws much of his inspiration from Western movies and such to appeal to a broader audience. It's like watching your own culture in a convoluted funhouse mirror. It's so fascinating.

That's probably the best description of it I have heard, yet. Kojima may not be a good writer in terms of what gets lost in the translation directly and some of the cheese comes across as unnecessary if we're speaking strictly academically. However, he is a GREAT storyteller and that is why millions of people come back for more Metal Gear. The universe he has created is plenty captivating.

He's solid, but not better than Cage.

No he isn't.

The mgs universe is one big retconned,convoluted,nanomachine filled bullshit.It's not even comical at this point.

*givethismanacookie.jpg*

Really, that's a perfect way to put it.

MGS2 was seriously convoluted but still I loved it:) I am slightly disappointed that he lied about MGS4 being the last MGS and then releasing MGS5.

by video game standards, hes a great writer.

by film/literature standards, hes average.

you know why you're wrong? Because writing for video games is much more difficult than doing it for a film. That's why we can't compare.

Degree of difficulty wouldn't change the fact that the other mediums have higher standards for writing, because they have flat out better written stuff top to bottom.

Ergo his point stands. Though he was being a bit nice. Even by videogame standards he isn't that good, and by film/lit standards he'd be atrocious.

hes just ok... Naughty Dog has the best writers imo

Came into thread solely to see your response. You did not disappoint.

I think he took it way too far. Some of his ideas were really clever but 1 hour long Cut scene in video games is just crazy!

Definitely.

In the lit world, a writer like JK Rowling is seen as "average" or "pedestrian" (in terms of technical writing skill that is) and she's a heck of a lot better than Kojima.

That being said, I'd take a Kojima story over novels by bad writers like Dean Koontz and James Patterson any day of the week.

Iol. What kind of logic is this?

Bunch of haters in here man, It wouldn't be MGS if it wasn't absolutely insanity mixed with some plausible truths.

Pmc's, Drones, The constant threat of Nuclear war are all things that are a part of todays battlefield, Metal gears are just around the corner. I'm sure many of you have no idea how advanced drone research is coming along. Prosthetic implants are also becoming more and more common among soldiers.

I doubt I'd like MGS as much if it took itself so seriously. Kojima still has some of the best characters in any video game, big boss is the greatest soldier that ever lived and will ever live.

Um the problem is when MGS tries to take itself seriously and when it's trying to be in on the joke.

It's not dissing, by any measure of writing technique Kojima would be poor. On script writing alone he is out right shit at it.

Perfect analogy.

His ideas seem great until you see the way he ham-handedly executes them.

His dialogue is absolutely fantastic however, there's so many quotable MGS lines.

I disagree and agree with you to a certain extent. What he really needs is a talented editor. Luckily MGS5 is looking to be the polar opposite of MGS4.

On a related note, I think people are a bit too hard on videogame stories that at least put in the effort.

Granted, they pale in comparison to film/literature/television, but I still think many video game stories are still beautiful, thought provoking, thematically interesting, and suspenseful on their own merits, and they can create atmosphere in a way that's incredibly unique. Plus, there are tons of memorable characters in gaming. The problem is that the execution is just not there most of the time. Good ideas are compromised by rough storytelling. I was just watching my brother play through Final Fantasy VIII and it had tons of beautiful and suspenseful moments and some brilliant thematic stuff, but the translation was just plain shoddy and the story had so many bizarre holes. It was a beautiful mess.

However, I will say that most video games don't even try.

Brief moments of brilliance don't overrule a complete lack of consistency. He makes dialogue that regurgitates itself. If you need an editor because you can't see that, you're not good at dialogue. You would be poor.

Videogames don't get to be in a vacuum where the other mediums with better writers don't exist. If we need to put him in a bubble to justify his status, he's not good.

@GreySeal9: I won't dive into the entire ins and outs of video game stories, but one thing a lot of games fumble up big time in is pacing.

Movies and books are all stories. Movies especially have the advantage of being watched in one session. Games are often trying to tell a story in an experience that lasts many hours while trying to cram in as much gameplay as possible.

That means that you can go hours just shooting dudes in the face while nothing of value in the story occurs, so the game tries to hamfistedly give an elongated cutscene to make up for it. Or sometimes they cram too many cutscenes between minimum amounts of gameplay for exposition's sake, which pisses me off in games like MGS.

I think you're right, video games have a lot of merits to stand on their own with other mediums. Games like Metroid Prime, Gears of War 1, Dark Souls, and so on take advantage of this. But so many other games throw unique qualities like atmosphere away when they can't pace themselves for shit.

I want to add something to this, but I can't really say it any better. Pacing is by far the worst enemy of video game stories. Some games do narrative pacing better than others, but I've actually never seen a game actually do it well. At least nothing comes to mind immediately.

And what exactly of value did you add to this thread besides a sorry little rant?

While I agree that MGS is not as deep as its fanboys think it is (more convoluted than deep), I think comments like this lack perspective. Why exactly do you think an MGS plot in comparable to something like Jersey Shore?

Your intelligence is really on full display with that comment. Forget we talked please.

@GreySeal9: Uncharted 2 is actually a pretty decent example. It's pretty much an Indy rip off but as a story done quite well until the last few chapters take a turn for the dumb and drag.

I'll admit, I haven't played many old RPGs, but their more pure view of Japanese storytelling intrigues me.

Yeah, it's quite interesting to see how the Japanese storytelling differs from Western storytelling: it's much less linear and much less concerned with logical rules, etc.

While I think UC2's story is trite, I will admit that it is very well paced by game standards.

I wouldn't hold out for a coherent answer if I were you.

@rnd_9 said:

Wow that looks awful. I see the dumbed down the AI even worst than MGS4 probably because most MGS players don't have the skill to play anything that actually provides a challenge.

Coupled with more of Kojima's awful story telling and this game will be lucky to get an AA, since it no longer has the hype that MGS4 had.

Good riddance, after this game flops maybe Kojima can go direct some low budget porn or something.

For MGS fans or people simply interested in analysis of the series, search up the channel Matthewmatosis on YouTube. Very good critique and analysis of the series' games, motifs, character, and overall story.

Yeah, this guy is very stupid and obnoxious. I'm pretty sure he's an Underdog123x alt account.

I didn't know you were Irish

@SolidGame_basic: That's not me lol.

No.

No.

He had a good story in MGS, but the writing and presentation brought it down.

His writing is very Evangelion. Convoluted garbage

Kojima is terrible writer .

For videogame standards he´s ok,kinda good sometimes but not even close to the best. Overall though,he´s mediocre as hell.

I wholeheartedly agree. Games will never transcend certain boundaries since they are always (with maybe the exception of the likes of Dear Esther) bound to be objective-based (whereas IMO the best films are anything but this). They'll always strive for providing as much continuity and transparency to the player as they can, and that's what kills any artistic potential, especially if you're familiar with auteur cinema.

He was a great writer but his writing has been at a decline.

Excellent: MGS2, MGS3
Decent: MGS1
BioWare: MGS4

I voted yes, but it's really yes AND no ;)

He's quite brilliant in his use of tropes, clichés and trolling.

MGS2 was a Meta masterpiece.