Wonderful 101 Continues Its Filtering: Gamespot 4/10

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nintendoboy16

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#51 nintendoboy16
Member since 2007 • 37361 Posts

@Oemenia said:
@nintendoboy16 said:

@Oemenia: Seriously, is there a sector of InfoWars hiring for games?

Can't wait for BotW to go multiplat, then we'll be talking about how its the worst open-world game ever.

The only non-BS thing you've ever said right now... and even there. W101 is Platinum. Not Nintendo.

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#52 DocSanchez
Member since 2013 • 5451 Posts

People who usually rely on review scores like they are gospel now just dismissing this one because they don't like it. oh the joy.

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nintendoboy16

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#53 nintendoboy16
Member since 2007 • 37361 Posts

@DocSanchez said:

People who usually rely on review scores like they are gospel now just dismissing this one because they don't like it. oh the joy.

Yup... and worse yet. Evidence is mounting that this is a bad port (Nintendo fansites like Nintendo World Report further confirm it). Especially on the Switch.

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Pedro

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#54 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 39228 Posts

@DocSanchez said:

People who usually rely on review scores like they are gospel now just dismissing this one because they don't like it. oh the joy.

No surprise. These are the same folks who spend more time discussing scores than actually playing games.

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ConanTheStoner

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#55 ConanTheStoner
Member since 2011 • 18507 Posts

This a stealth bash on Solid? 😂

Review scores and confirmation bias do typically go hand in hand.

But most of the people in this thread who are dismissive of this review (not even mentioning the score) are the furthest thing from score dorks on this forum.

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hrt_rulz01

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#56 hrt_rulz01
Member since 2006 • 20036 Posts

Seems like you either love or hate this game...

I never played it on Wii U, but I'm a massive Platinum fan so I'm getting it next week on Switch. I'm cautiously optimistic that I'll like it.

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#57 ConanTheStoner
Member since 2011 • 18507 Posts

@hrt_rulz01 said:

Seems like you either love or hate this game...

I never played it on Wii U, but I'm a massive Platinum fan so I'm getting it next week on Switch. I'm cautiously optimistic that I'll like it.

It's definitely a unique game, hard to compare to anything else. But if you're into Platinums brand of action, you'll likely enjoy it.

Of course the game isn't officially out yet, maybe it'll get patched up. But seems the Switch version is a bust for now. PS4 version is good, and PC version is the best if you have one of those options.

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#58 hrt_rulz01
Member since 2006 • 20036 Posts

@ConanTheStoner said:
@hrt_rulz01 said:

Seems like you either love or hate this game...

I never played it on Wii U, but I'm a massive Platinum fan so I'm getting it next week on Switch. I'm cautiously optimistic that I'll like it.

It's definitely a unique game, hard to compare to anything else. But if you're into Platinums brand of action, you'll likely enjoy it.

Of course the game isn't officially out yet, maybe it'll get patched up. But seems the Switch version is a bust for now. PS4 version is good, and PC version is the best if you have one of those options.

Yeah I'd be surprised if I flat out don't like it... I'm looking forward to it.

I'm sure the Switch version will be good enough.

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jg4xchamp

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#59  Edited By jg4xchamp  Online
Member since 2006 • 62965 Posts

The Wonderful 101 is Platinum's 2nd best game, give or take one's opinion on Vanquish.

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SolidGame_basic

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#60 SolidGame_basic
Member since 2003 • 26037 Posts

@ConanTheStoner said:
@hrt_rulz01 said:

Seems like you either love or hate this game...

I never played it on Wii U, but I'm a massive Platinum fan so I'm getting it next week on Switch. I'm cautiously optimistic that I'll like it.

It's definitely a unique game, hard to compare to anything else. But if you're into Platinums brand of action, you'll likely enjoy it.

Of course the game isn't officially out yet, maybe it'll get patched up. But seems the Switch version is a bust for now. PS4 version is good, and PC version is the best if you have one of those options.

Damn, that sucks that the Switch version isn't as good.

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#61  Edited By osan0
Member since 2004 • 15754 Posts

I didn't enjoy this game (wiiu version) unfortunately an i'm usually a fan of platinums stuff (have astral chain in the post now). I love the scenario, i love the whole saturday morning cartoon hero vibe and i LOVE the soundtrack (seriously, if you listen to it and you dont want to do some sort of hero flex then seek help).

But i just didn't like the actual gameplay. tried twice to get suck in but didnt do it for me.

I would love to see maybe a bit of a different take set in the same universe. i also want wonderful 101 cartoons on Saturday morning!

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#62 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98514 Posts

I'm laughing at all the people taking a GS review seriously. I thought we stopped doing that back in the late 2000's.

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nintendoboy16

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#63  Edited By nintendoboy16
Member since 2007 • 37361 Posts

I feel dirty posting Digital Foundry, but... oh Platinum, how did you screw Switch owners this bad?

Loading Video...

"You dun f***ed it up!" - Angry Joe

If I were Nintendo, I'd drop business with them, and they can work more with Tencent as it what it seems to want anyway as they go the self publishing route.

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#64  Edited By jg4xchamp  Online
Member since 2006 • 62965 Posts

@ConanTheStoner said:

are the furthest thing from score dorks on this forum.

Right? Mother fuckers out here talking about how the dude can't play, because this game has been out for 7 years, and there are all sorts of ways to find the info needed to understand the game. I get that the game does a poor job explaining itself, but the stuff that are not its technical short comings, is big time "mad because you bad" lol

Dude could have given the game an 8 again, and my reaction would be similar.

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#65  Edited By SolidGame_basic
Member since 2003 • 26037 Posts

@nintendoboy16 said:

I feel dirty posting Digital Foundry, but... oh Platinum, how did you screw Switch owners this bad?

Loading Video...

"You dun f***ed it up!" - Angry Joe

If I were Nintendo, I'd drop business with them, and they can work more with Tencent as it what it seems to want anyway as they go the self publishing route.

I watched the video. Not sure what you mean by Switch owners getting screwed. The hardware itself isn't much better than the Wii U. But yea, I can confirm playing on PC is definitely the best way to go if you can. I got an early copy and it plays really well and looks really sharp. Played it on ultra wide 1440p too.

A side note: after beating the game yesterday, I whipped out the Wii U version. It still plays pretty well, at least from what I saw in the beginning stage. Gamespot's assertion that not having the Gamepad hurt the game was overblown. I still preferred using the second stick. Using a touchpad is slower and just as error prone in my opinion.

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#66 jg4xchamp  Online
Member since 2006 • 62965 Posts

@SolidGame_basic said:

I watched the video. Not sure what you mean by Switch owners getting screwed. The hardware itself isn't much better than the Wii U. But yea, I can confirm playing on PC is definitely the best way to go if you can. I got an early copy and it plays really well and looks really sharp. Played it on ultra wide 1440p too.

A side note: after beating the game yesterday, I whipped out the Wii U version. It still plays pretty well, at least from what I saw in the beginning stage. Gamespot's assertion that not having the Gamepad hurt the game was overblown. I still preferred using the second stick. Using a touchpad is slower and just as error prone in my opinion.

Loading Video...

No one who plays that at a competent level uses the touchpad, the right analog stick is mandatory to do anything cool in that game.


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#67 SolidGame_basic
Member since 2003 • 26037 Posts

@jg4xchamp said:
@SolidGame_basic said:

I watched the video. Not sure what you mean by Switch owners getting screwed. The hardware itself isn't much better than the Wii U. But yea, I can confirm playing on PC is definitely the best way to go if you can. I got an early copy and it plays really well and looks really sharp. Played it on ultra wide 1440p too.

A side note: after beating the game yesterday, I whipped out the Wii U version. It still plays pretty well, at least from what I saw in the beginning stage. Gamespot's assertion that not having the Gamepad hurt the game was overblown. I still preferred using the second stick. Using a touchpad is slower and just as error prone in my opinion.

Loading Video...

No one who plays that at a competent level uses the touchpad, the right analog stick is mandatory to do anything cool in that game.

Yea, I can't imagine trying to use the touch pad to do combos like that lol. Cool music btw, sound so familiar..

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#68 nintendoboy16
Member since 2007 • 37361 Posts

@SolidGame_basic said:
@nintendoboy16 said:

I feel dirty posting Digital Foundry, but... oh Platinum, how did you screw Switch owners this bad?

Loading Video...

"You dun f***ed it up!" - Angry Joe

If I were Nintendo, I'd drop business with them, and they can work more with Tencent as it what it seems to want anyway as they go the self publishing route.

I watched the video. Not sure what you mean by Switch owners getting screwed. The hardware itself isn't much better than the Wii U. But yea, I can confirm playing on PC is definitely the best way to go if you can. I got an early copy and it plays really well and looks really sharp. Played it on ultra wide 1440p too.

Having a worse framerate than the Wii U version... wow! Like you said, the Switch isn't more powerful than the Wii U, so you'd imagine it would be on par, if not slightly better. Nope... it's worse.

I'm not one of those extreme framerate snobs where it stops for a milisecond and "it's broken", but yikes, this isn't even that.

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#69 jg4xchamp  Online
Member since 2006 • 62965 Posts

@SolidGame_basic said:

Yea, I can't imagine trying to use the touch pad to do combos like that lol. Cool music btw, sound so familiar..

MvC2

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#70  Edited By Chozofication
Member since 2020 • 41 Posts

Reviewers can’t play games.

Although, the switch version is worse than Wii U. Arguably Wii U is still the best version, but ps4 has higher frame rate, switch is lower than Wii U with no dual screen.

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#71 Chozofication
Member since 2020 • 41 Posts

@jg4xchamp: eh, w101 at its best is incredible but both bayonetta games are better.

Vanquish is on the low end..

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#72 jg4xchamp  Online
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@chozofication said:

@jg4xchamp: eh, w101 at its best is incredible but both bayonetta games are better.

Vanquish is on the low end..

The 2nd Bayonetta is not better. It's a major downgrade as far as depth of its systems are concerned. For 10 hour club cats, I get that the kamiyaisms in Wonderful 101 long over stay their welcome, but the battle system and getting good at it are a significant upgrade over Wonderful 101. Bayonetta 2 also is a massive step back enemy designs wise.

The rest of their games are all lacking player kit wise. Hell most of them enemy design wise as well.

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#73 FemtoG
Member since 2020 • 64 Posts

A 4? Really?

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#74 Chozofication
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@jg4xchamp said:
@chozofication said:

@jg4xchamp: eh, w101 at its best is incredible but both bayonetta games are better.

Vanquish is on the low end..

The 2nd Bayonetta is not better. It's a major downgrade as far as depth of its systems are concerned. For 10 hour club cats, I get that the kamiyaisms in Wonderful 101 long over stay their welcome, but the battle system and getting good at it are a significant upgrade over Wonderful 101. Bayonetta 2 also is a massive step back enemy designs wise.

The rest of their games are all lacking player kit wise. Hell most of them enemy design wise as well.

Bayonetta 2 is definitely more lenient with players than the first. It's also got less irritating design but definitely in depth it's a step down. The weapons however are a lot better and overall it's more polished than the first. If 3 can bring back the challenge and depth of 1 but leave out the irritants that'd be the best.

Wonderful 101 is honestly more satisfying than both bayonetta games when you get really good, and has the best over the top moments. It's also unfortunately a lot less polished and some scenes irritatingly go on forever as you suggested.

But finding things out for yourself is not a negative for the W101.

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#75 SolidGame_basic
Member since 2003 • 26037 Posts

@nintendoboy16 said:
@SolidGame_basic said:
@nintendoboy16 said:

I feel dirty posting Digital Foundry, but... oh Platinum, how did you screw Switch owners this bad?

Loading Video...

"You dun f***ed it up!" - Angry Joe

If I were Nintendo, I'd drop business with them, and they can work more with Tencent as it what it seems to want anyway as they go the self publishing route.

I watched the video. Not sure what you mean by Switch owners getting screwed. The hardware itself isn't much better than the Wii U. But yea, I can confirm playing on PC is definitely the best way to go if you can. I got an early copy and it plays really well and looks really sharp. Played it on ultra wide 1440p too.

Having a worse framerate than the Wii U version... wow! Like you said, the Switch isn't more powerful than the Wii U, so you'd imagine it would be on par, if not slightly better. Nope... it's worse.

I'm not one of those extreme framerate snobs where it stops for a milisecond and "it's broken", but yikes, this isn't even that.

Oh I see.. hopefully they'll patch it up. They really should.

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#76 jg4xchamp  Online
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@chozofication said:
@jg4xchamp said:

The 2nd Bayonetta is not better. It's a major downgrade as far as depth of its systems are concerned. For 10 hour club cats, I get that the kamiyaisms in Wonderful 101 long over stay their welcome, but the battle system and getting good at it are a significant upgrade over Wonderful 101. Bayonetta 2 also is a massive step back enemy designs wise.

The rest of their games are all lacking player kit wise. Hell most of them enemy design wise as well.

Bayonetta 2 is definitely more lenient with players than the first. It's also got less irritating design but definitely in depth it's a step down. The weapons however are a lot better and overall it's more polished than the first. If 3 can bring back the challenge and depth of 1 but leave out the irritants that'd be the best.

Wonderful 101 is honestly more satisfying than both bayonetta games when you get really good, and has the best over the top moments. It's also unfortunately a lot less polished and some scenes irritatingly go on forever as you suggested.

But finding things out for yourself is not a negative for the W101.

The weapons are even more homogenized, which is already an issue for Bayonetta, outside the bow, which just straight up sucks anyway. Those are a step back as well tbh.

Polish while important isn't nearly as valuable to a game like this (or any game for that matter) as depth. A lot of the fun of these type of games is improving n being able to express yourselves with the systems. And on that front The Wonderful 101 offers that type of gameplay with something genuinely unique, while still having sound enemy designs.

Lenient is whatever, Devil May Cry under Itsuno is plenty lenient, but the tools it has allows the player to at least do fun shit and offers hours of things to get good at. Bayonetta 2 is just baffling between Umbran Climax being overly powerful and the best decision at all times, no punishment for getting hit, and dropping higher level play options for basically no reason (although DMC5 similarly drops important tech).

Similar reasons why Vanquish is a class or two better than anything else they made. Tbh Platinum low key sucks when Kamiya isn't directing, with the Mikami game being the exception. Saito might be a good game director given he made Revengeance n Transformers on a budget and under a year, but neither of those games are worth more than a few spins, much less stack up favorably to Kamiya's battle systems.

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#77 Chozofication
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@jg4xchamp: I definitely disagree on the weapons. Chain chomp, skating on chainsaws that shit is dope. The whips.

The bow does suck.

Polish ties in with fun and the overall experience which are of the utmost importance.

What I meant by lenient is it's definitely easier to dodge/trigger witch time in bay bay 2, pull off combos etc. I think it just gives you more time. I would probably agree that the first bayonetta is better overall, in addition to the things said it kind of leans off the first game too much in terms of the presentation and plot. Even the final moments feels like a copy of the first.

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#78 jg4xchamp  Online
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@chozofication said:

@jg4xchamp: I definitely disagree on the weapons. Chain chomp, skating on chainsaws that shit is dope. The whips.

The bow does suck.

Polish ties in with fun and the overall experience which are of the utmost importance.

What I meant by lenient is it's definitely easier to dodge/trigger witch time in bay bay 2, pull off combos etc. I think it just gives you more time. I would probably agree that the first bayonetta is better overall, in addition to the things said it kind of leans off the first game too much in terms of the presentation and plot. Even the final moments feels like a copy of the first.

The whip has less unique properties than the Bayonetta 1 counterpart, it just has more dials like a sword so people can DPS with it, but the other one allowed for more unique combo routes, which Bayonetta already has an issue with in terms not having as free form combo routes. Ditto the chainsaws in comparison to the skates.

Visually the Bayo 2 stuff looks more unique, but in application they offer considerably less to the overall sandbox than Bayonetta's roster.

in Bayo 1 specific moves triggered witch time, it wasn't just dodge anything n get it. In Bayo 2 everything does, and added bonus it's the only way she can do real damage without using Umbran Climax.

At this point I just want to know who is directing Bayonetta 3, and if they are at the least bringing the core combat mechanics back to Bayonetta 1's rules, up to n including how enemies work. I'd prefer they add more command moves, but I'm not holding my breath on that one.

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#79 Chozofication
Member since 2020 • 41 Posts

@jg4xchamp said:
@chozofication said:

@jg4xchamp: I definitely disagree on the weapons. Chain chomp, skating on chainsaws that shit is dope. The whips.

The bow does suck.

Polish ties in with fun and the overall experience which are of the utmost importance.

What I meant by lenient is it's definitely easier to dodge/trigger witch time in bay bay 2, pull off combos etc. I think it just gives you more time. I would probably agree that the first bayonetta is better overall, in addition to the things said it kind of leans off the first game too much in terms of the presentation and plot. Even the final moments feels like a copy of the first.

The whip has less unique properties than the Bayonetta 1 counterpart, it just has more dials like a sword so people can DPS with it, but the other one allowed for more unique combo routes, which Bayonetta already has an issue with in terms not having as free form combo routes. Ditto the chainsaws in comparison to the skates.

Visually the Bayo 2 stuff looks more unique, but in application they offer considerably less to the overall sandbox than Bayonetta's roster.

in Bayo 1 specific moves triggered witch time, it wasn't just dodge anything n get it. In Bayo 2 everything does, and added bonus it's the only way she can do real damage without using Umbran Climax.

At this point I just want to know who is directing Bayonetta 3, and if they are at the least bringing the core combat mechanics back to Bayonetta 1's rules, up to n including how enemies work. I'd prefer they add more command moves, but I'm not holding my breath on that one.

I have to admit I would like Kamiya to return, but that probably won't happen.

Hell i'd settle to just see the game at all, it seems in limbo atm.

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#80 jg4xchamp  Online
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@chozofication said:

I have to admit I would like Kamiya to return, but that probably won't happen.

Hell i'd settle to just see the game at all, it seems in limbo atm.

Mans don't do his own sequels sadly.

My assumption has been that when they announced that game it was literally not even in production. That and if Astral Chain could only run 30 frames on the switch, they might be struggling like mad to get Bayonetta 3 at 60 on the switch. Because Bayonetta people aren't gonna be cool with 30 lol

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#81 ConanTheStoner
Member since 2011 • 18507 Posts

Playing this with proper performance and improved image quality.

For those playing it for the first time, this is an excellent video series. Explains a lot of the finer points that the game doesn't teach you. Hell even for returning players, I still found what I watched of it to be a great refresher.

Loading Video...

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#82 SolidGame_basic
Member since 2003 • 26037 Posts

@ConanTheStoner: enjoy, dude!

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#83 Archangel3371
Member since 2004 • 30261 Posts

Went out looking for the game yesterday and found out the physical version is coming out later. Guess I’ll have to wait until then to get it unfortunately.

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#84 Oemenia
Member since 2003 • 10404 Posts

@nintendoboy16 said:
@Oemenia said:
@nintendoboy16 said:

@Oemenia: Seriously, is there a sector of InfoWars hiring for games?

Can't wait for BotW to go multiplat, then we'll be talking about how its the worst open-world game ever.

The only non-BS thing you've ever said right now... and even there. W101 is Platinum. Not Nintendo.

Just wait till Bayonetta 2 goes back to PS and XBOX. All of a sudden it will be Platinum's worst game.

So the point still stands.

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#85 nintendoboy16
Member since 2007 • 37361 Posts

@Oemenia: I figured it out with you right now. Hint: Problem?

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#86  Edited By locopatho
Member since 2003 • 23814 Posts

"The seeds of Platinum’s best games are there [...] but it’s hard to appreciate them in a game that demands mastery over its complex mechanics without taking the time to properly explain how they work."

Bingo, that's my exact feelings towards the WiiU version years ago. This isn't 1985 and we're not kids with a single game and endless hours to figure it out. Tell us how to play your game, or give us a fun and intriguing way to learn ourselves (yes, we all liked Dark Souls), or piss off. It's not some sort of victory to drive players off with hostile, obscure mechanics. Not surprised it sold like shit, despite the ultra-marketable superhero concept.

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#87 locopatho
Member since 2003 • 23814 Posts

@jg4xchamp said:

this game has been out for 7 years,

Seems like they could have fixed it up and fixed it's flaws in the 7 years since it released, no?

@jg4xchamp said:

there are all sorts of ways to find the info needed to understand the game

That's some 1980's "Read Nintendo Power!" bullshit. It's the game's job to explain itself, or at least give a fun way for the player to learn, and when people start mentioning Wikis and YouTube tutorials, that's the sign of a shit game.

A gamer who buys this won't want to spend hours researching "How to play" and I'm pleasantly surprised this random ass GameSpot reviewer had to balls to call the game out for it and give it a crap score.

This isn't like a new dev's first game either, it's Platinum, they made Bayonetta which explained itself very well and gave you load screens to practice! So I don't know why're we're pretending it's cool for them to pull this crap in 2020 and expect a kind review.

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jg4xchamp

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#88 jg4xchamp  Online
Member since 2006 • 62965 Posts

@locopatho said:

Seems like they could have fixed it up and fixed it's flaws in the 7 years since it released, no?

That's some 1980's "Read Nintendo Power!" bullshit. It's the game's job to explain itself, or at least give a fun way for the player to learn, and when people start mentioning Wikis and YouTube tutorials, that's the sign of a shit game.

A gamer who buys this won't want to spend hours researching "How to play" and I'm pleasantly surprised this random ass GameSpot reviewer had to balls to call the game out for it and give it a crap score.

This isn't like a new dev's first game either, it's Platinum, they made Bayonetta which explained itself very well and gave you load screens to practice! So I don't know why're we're pretending it's cool for them to pull this crap in 2020 and expect a kind review.

No the **** it isn't.

1. the game's a port, not exactly a remake or some shit.

2. It's an old ass game with tons of info out there. I am not saying you don't criticize the game for it not teaching the player how to play, but if you do not know how to play, and there is information out there on how to play, that is a failure of you the reviewer. Because either way you slice it, if you describe something as working in a manner that isn't measurably true, then it's an incorrect statement.

lol Bayonetta doesn't explain basic dodge offset to people, you chuckle heads in this thread barely know how to dodge offset without googling it right now.

"hur durr it not teaching me means its shit" is also a lazy way of looking at it, the trade off for making a game with more complexity that doesn't tutorialize everything is that a lot of the learning is left up to the player. Should the game have not made you purchase your dodge or your block? No, those should have just been your default mechanics, but they aren't exactly deal breakers to how the game plays, much less how it players for anyone who deep dives action games.

This is difference between actually trying to play action games with some competence versus being 10 hour club.

Multiple things can be true the game can be shit at teaching newer players and difficult to grasp and it can also play well and have a ton of depth. More understandable why initial reviews have short comings, but after the game has been out and you have the resources to figure out what does what? You have the benefit of hindsight, that's not what you get with most new releases so its more understandable there.

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#89 nintendoboy16
Member since 2007 • 37361 Posts

So, consensus is reading:

PS4/PC: Great game!

Switch: This port sucks!