Will Sony have the convenience of success next gen like they did this gen?

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Posted by jaydan (2208 posts) 1 month, 6 days ago

Poll: Will Sony have the convenience of success next gen like they did this gen? (58 votes)

Yes 41%
No 59%

Part of the reason why the PS4 became the top-selling console this gen was over the convenience Microsoft shot themselves in the foot so early on over the whole DRM fiasco with the Xbox One. It was so bad for Microsoft that much of their own fanbase felt betrayed and jumped ship and came knocking over at PS4's window.

Will Sony have this same convenience next gen or will they fall back into a cocky mindset like they did during the PS3 years?

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#1 Edited by lundy86_4 (52739 posts) -

No, but they've built a tremendous library and first-party outing with this gen. Whilst I do feel they need to vary their first-party format, there's no doubting that it wasn't solely due to MS' goof that threw Sony ahead.

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#2 Posted by jaydan (2208 posts) -
@lundy86_4 said:

No, but they've built a tremendous library and first-party outing with this gen. Whilst I do feel they need to vary their first-party format, there's no doubting that it wasn't solely due to MS' goof that threw Sony ahead.

I think you're right to some lengths. While it was convenient this gen, they wasted no time building their next-gen foundations with a large library of games. While next gen I don't think there will be many conveniences like their main competitor shooting themselves in the foot, next-gen must be treated as an uphill climb so they don't fall into that safe place that brings out the cockiness of Sony we've seen before.

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#3 Edited by lundy86_4 (52739 posts) -

@jaydan said:

I think you're right to some lengths. While it was convenient this gen, they wasted no time building their next-gen foundations with a large library of games. While next gen I don't think there will be many conveniences like their main competitor shooting themselves in the foot, next-gen must be treated as an uphill climb so they don't fall into that safe place that brings out the cockiness of Sony we've seen before.

I think MS have made tremendous leaps-and-bounds with regards to what they're actually marketing. They're transitioning to a universal software environment, and the Xbox is simply one of their outlets. As it is, i'm not sure if simple hardware sales will confirm a win anymore.

I think both Sony and MS need to keep on their game, as Nintendo has really done well this late-gen with the Switch.

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#4 Edited by jaydan (2208 posts) -
@lundy86_4 said:
@jaydan said:

I think you're right to some lengths. While it was convenient this gen, they wasted no time building their next-gen foundations with a large library of games. While next gen I don't think there will be many conveniences like their main competitor shooting themselves in the foot, next-gen must be treated as an uphill climb so they don't fall into that safe place that brings out the cockiness of Sony we've seen before.

I think MS have made tremendous leaps-and-bounds with regards to what they're actually marketing. They're transitioning to a universal software environment, and the Xbox is simply one of their outlets. As it is, i'm not sure if simple hardware sales will confirm a win anymore.

I think both Sony and MS need to keep on their game, as Nintendo has really done well this late-gen with the Switch.

I think you're right about Microsoft. In some ways they're beginning to deviate into new directions than just racing in the console wars, just as Nintendo has deviated away from it years ago. Microsoft has learned many lessons this gen and some of them were taken with "hard to swallow pills" from their own fanbase, but with that I'm beginning to see them evolve into something different than just a brand for gaming consoles. We're looking at services here and I think that will largely become a great future with Microsoft. I guess it depends if Microsoft is anywhere near introducing a next-gen console or if that's within their plans at all. Sony for all we know can be left with no competition unless other companies step up to the plate (like Google). Nintendo for what I can see, there's no reason to even think about a next console. All Nintendo needs to do is go with their handheld traditions and have new variations of the Switch every couple years or so. Nintendo has already kinda broken away from the console race norm when they went from Wii U to Switch, so in my opinion next gen could be a gen we'll truly start to see a diminishing image of what defines a "gen" if more companies end up just doing their own thing.

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#5 Posted by AJStyles (739 posts) -

PS5 is going to destroy the Xbox 2. Xbox has lost 3 gens in a row. PlayStation has always beaten Xbox.

These are facts and I don’t see it changing just because Microsoft paid a handful of no name websites to praise gamepass LOL

The Xbox brand is damaged beyond all repair. No one cares about halo or gears anymore.

Any of the supposed flaws of PlayStation from rabid fanboys have been fixed or are being fixed.

You haters complained about name changes, so Sony fixed that. You complained about backwards compatibility, PS5 will have it. You complained about about crossplay, some games have it now and more will in the future. PS5 will most likely be a lot more open.

Sony listens to gamers despite what you vocal minority sheep/lemmings claim. You are just scared and jealous of the power of PlayStation.

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#6 Posted by jaydan (2208 posts) -
@ajstyles said:

PS5 is going to destroy the Xbox 2. Xbox has lost 3 gens in a row. PlayStation has always beaten Xbox.

These are facts and I don’t see it changing just because Microsoft paid a handful of no name websites to praise gamepass LOL

The Xbox brand is damaged beyond all repair. No one cares about halo or gears anymore.

Any of the supposed flaws of PlayStation from rabid fanboys have been fixed or are being fixed.

You haters complained about name changes, so Sony fixed that. You complained about backwards compatibility, PS5 will have it. You complained about about crossplay, some games have it now and more will in the future. PS5 will most likely be a lot more open.

Sony listens to gamers despite what you vocal minority sheep/lemmings claim. You are just scared and jealous of the power of PlayStation.

I know you're a blatant troll on these boards and it comes with no surprise to everyone, but LOL.

I love all the "YOU" assertions to things that have lacked presence in this thread until this post just now.

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#7 Edited by strategyfn (481 posts) -

No, I don’t think PS5 will be as successful as PS4. The market is over saturated and there are people who are just content with owning their PS4 since it is so good.

I think PS5 will just come up short of PS4s success.

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#8 Posted by lundy86_4 (52739 posts) -

@ajstyles said:

No one cares about halo

You may have missed the reactions to the MCC on PC. Your idiocy seems to know no bounds.

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#9 Posted by jaydan (2208 posts) -
@lundy86_4 said:
@ajstyles said:

No one cares about halo

You may have missed the reactions to the MCC on PC. Your idiocy seems to know no bounds.

@ajstyles is really nothing more than a shock-value troll poster. The base of his trolling antics is he'll jump into a thread and take a shit on it for people to react and call him out on things. He'll never actually respond back to people or come to any defenses beyond the initial post that riles people up. The real joke is on the people that get riled up on him as he sits back and has a snarl. It's the basic pattern of this poster as he'll jump in any thread and leave a post and leave to another thread and do the same thing. Rinse and repeat.

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#10 Posted by Subspecies (327 posts) -

No, probably not. But they're still going to tear MS a new one.

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#11 Posted by lundy86_4 (52739 posts) -

@jaydan said:

@ajstyles is really nothing more than a shock-value troll poster. The base of his trolling antics is he'll jump into a thread and take a shit on it for people to react and call him out on things. He'll never actually respond back to people or come to any defenses beyond the initial post that riles people up. The real joke is on the people that get riled up on him as he sits back and has a snarl. It's the basic pattern of this poster as he'll jump in any thread and leave a post and leave to another thread and do the same thing. Rinse and repeat.

Oh yeah, i've seen his posting style. Though, it's always fun to poke a troll who is so blatantly ignorant lol.

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#12 Edited by XVision84 (15799 posts) -

As a company that directly paid the consequences of the PS3's terrible launch, I'd be shocked if they made the same mistake. That would be straight up incompetence which Sony is not known for.

The same goes for Microsoft who are primed to have a fantastic next generation. They've got game pass and all the studio acquisitions going for them. There are a lot of reasons to be excited next gen because both companies seem to be moving forward in top form. It's anyone's game.

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#13 Posted by jaydan (2208 posts) -
@XVision84 said:

As a company that directly paid the consequences of the PS3's terrible launch, I'd be shocked if they made the same mistake. That would be straight up incompetence which Sony is not known for.

The same goes for Microsoft who are primed to have a fantastic next generation. They've got game pass and all the studio acquisitions going for them. There are a lot of reasons to be excited next gen because both companies seem to be moving forward in top form. It's anyone's game.

So do you think the competition will be tough next gen? This might have just been a "gimme" gen for Sony. I know all the fanboys want to boast sales, and no shit PS4 won this gen, there is no denying that; but at the same rate, it was an easy gen to win when its competition dug its own grave. Do you think next gen we'll truly see the definition of competition in all its glory? I think that can be exciting and scary at the same time as anything could happen.

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#14 Edited by Kali-B1rd (2060 posts) -

There's a few factors involved that will affect Sony potentially negatively next gen:

  1. Rise of game streaming services (from big backers google, microsoft, amazon etc)
  2. Sony's franchises are going to hit the same wall Microsoft's did. Uncharted 5? Gran Turismo 12323? Last of us 3? Horizon 2-3?
  3. no remasters to fall back on this time.... (backwards compatibility) lots of Sony's smaller IPs have been one time wonders, or not even made an appearance.... their exclusive range has shrunk since the PS1/2 days, especially the diversity in genres (YAY FOR 3rd person action games x12131092831023)

Obviously, if game steaming fails they will be in the best position again. As Microsoft has the same problems as above but even worse and a weaker global brand....

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#15 Posted by XVision84 (15799 posts) -
@jaydan said:
@XVision84 said:

As a company that directly paid the consequences of the PS3's terrible launch, I'd be shocked if they made the same mistake. That would be straight up incompetence which Sony is not known for.

The same goes for Microsoft who are primed to have a fantastic next generation. They've got game pass and all the studio acquisitions going for them. There are a lot of reasons to be excited next gen because both companies seem to be moving forward in top form. It's anyone's game.

So do you think the competition will be tough next gen? This might have just been a "gimme" gen for Sony. I know all the fanboys want to boast sales, and no shit PS4 won this gen, there is no denying that; but at the same rate, it was an easy gen to win when its competition dug its own grave. Do you think next gen we'll truly see the definition of competition in all its glory? I think that can be exciting and scary at the same time as anything could happen.

I do, things will especially get interesting with Stadia launching. Next gen is looking to be a transitory period between physical gaming and digital/game streaming. Curious how that will go.

I really have no idea how the generation after the next one (PS6) will end up after all these changes the industry is going through.

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#16 Edited by Ten_Pints (3760 posts) -

I think backwards compatibility will play a bigger role especially if there are considerable performance gains to be had to make 60fps a reality for all games which is possible.

If it ends up being same performance then not so much advantage.

Hopefully the mid gen upgrades have made devs allow for future hardware improvements to be taken advantage of giving Sony a bigger number of potential loyal customers.

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#17 Posted by UnrealGunner (1036 posts) -

PS4 is being currently outsold by the Switch so no I don't see why people will go out and pay $500 for a new Sony console that has no games

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#18 Edited by ellos (1999 posts) -

No they really don't have the games for the kind of success they had this gen. This has been a combination of them winning 3rd party and blending there bread and butter exclusives movies, I mean games. They have been warding of the kinda diversity they use to have in there lineup. They have also been slowly pushing away the advantage they had coming from japan. All this new stand they have will effect that. I mean is it just Atlus persona left now? Sony is practically screaming just put your games on switch. We don't really need your shit. In the era where 3rd party will have plenty of places to put there games and MS will not fumble this time Sony is bound to lose some share. The xbox could once again be the home of COD and all other multiplats.

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#19 Edited by hrt_rulz01 (18706 posts) -

MS screwing up the launch of XB1 definitely gave them a big boost early on, and they've done a good job of keeping up that momentum throughout the gen...

But I don't think they'll have it as easy going forward. Both MS & Nintendo have stepped up their games big time, and there are some signs of the old Sony arrogance of the past returning. But I have no doubt that the PS5 will be successful, but I don't think it'll be as dominant as PS4. (Although, the fact that PS5 will be BC with PS4 may help them sustain the advantage since most gamers will probably want to stay in the ecosystem). But we'll see. It'll be interesting.

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#20 Posted by emgesp (7830 posts) -

Sony is gonna continue to kill with their first party franchises and will have all the third party support. Unless they pull another $599.99 US Dollars situation they will win next-gen.

Microsoft might do better next-gen, but they will still trail behind Sony. There is literally nothing they can do to stop that and perhaps Microsoft knows this and doesn't care.

When you have all your big 1st party franchises also get released on the PC there is less incentive to buy Microsoft's box if you already own a decent gaming PC.

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#21 Edited by emgesp (7830 posts) -
@unrealgunner said:

PS4 is being currently outsold by the Switch so no I don't see why people will go out and pay $500 for a new Sony console that has no games

Please use common sense. PS4 is 5+ yrs old where as Switch has only been on the market for 2 yrs and is just starting to hit its prime.

Regardless, PS4 is still selling well and will eventually hit 100 million sold by the end of 2019. PS5 having BC with PS4 games will make it an automatic day 1 purchase for a lot of people, especially if it runs games better. Also, we don't know if it will be $500. I actually think it will be less.

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#22 Edited by Son-Goku7523 (625 posts) -
@emgesp said:
@unrealgunner said:

PS4 is being currently outsold by the Switch so no I don't see why people will go out and pay $500 for a new Sony console that has no games

Please use common sense. PS4 is 5+ yrs old where as Switch has only been on the market for 2 yrs and is just starting to hit its prime.

Regardless, PS4 is still selling well and will eventually hit 100 million sold by the end of 2019. PS5 having BC with PS4 games will make it an automatic day 1 purchase for a lot of people, especially if it runs games better. Also, we don't know if it will be $500. I actually think it will be less.

He's actually wrong. In US the Switch has been outselling PS4 but worldwide the PS4 has won every year this gen including last year and 2017 when the Switch launched. This is the only year that it looks like Sony may lose and it's because people are getting ready for next year's PS5 launch and may be hesitant to buy a PS4 since PS5 is so close.

They've been winning every year worldwide since 2013 and it's why they are about to hit 100 million sold before E3. These fanboys are delusional and don't bother checking numbers before they come on here to spew their nonsense. In his head he saw Nintendo win NPDs and then he imagined they were winning everywhere lol.

On topic: I think PS5 will be even more successful than the PS4 was. Sony won't be starting from scratch like they did with PS4. The day one PS4 BC will entice a lot of PS4 owners to carry their digital libraries to PS5. Some people may say "but we had BC in the past and it didn't help Sony" and I'll say they are wrong applying things from the past to today's gaming market. BC is going to mean more next gen than ever before because this gen is the first gen where most people have more digital games than physical, and those people won't be willing to throw away all their digital games to move to a different ecosystem. Unlike previous gens you can't carry all your games to Gamestop and trade them in to a new system and ecosystem. Gamers are going to get locked into ecosystems with their libraries like how phone buyers are locked into ecosystems due to apps and services on their phones.

Other than the digital games, Sony has also won a lot of faith in gamers with their excellent 1st party output this gen. A lot of gamers are going to want to come back to PS5 ecosystem to play sequels to their megahits like Spiderman, GOW, HZD, TLOU, Bloodborne, etc. Sony has proven themselves to be competent game creators unlike MS, and a lot more gamers will be willing to a risk money on PS5 after Sony's track record this gen than the Xbox after mega-flops like Crackdown and Sea of Thieves destroyed MS' reputation.

MS are also killing their chances of competing next gen with Sony by releasing all their games on PC. A lot of gamers that bought the XB1 at the beginning of this gen for exclusives won't be returning next time if they can play all those games on PC.

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#23 Edited by Sushiglutton (7156 posts) -

I think PS outsold Xbox about 2:1 this gen? I think it's going to be much closer next gen. As you said a big part of the success for PS was not that Sony did something brilliant, but that MS behaved like total morons. I think MS has a much better grasp on what they need to do this time around. Last gen PS had the power advantage out of the gate. This time around I expect the more powerful of the xbox:s (assuming they are releasing more than one as rumored) to be the overall best performing machine. MS has invested a lot in game studios and some vey competent ones. So I also think the exclusive situation will be different next gen, with MS matching Sony better at the very least (it's hard to do any worse lol).

Anyway in summary I think next gen will be much more even. Closer to 1:1 than 2:1.

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#24 Posted by robert_sparkes (2941 posts) -

MS have never had a chance this gen they had the worst reveal I can remember in recent memory. PS did everything right what ms had done wrong.

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#25 Edited by emgesp (7830 posts) -
@Sushiglutton said:

I think PS outsold Xbox about 2:1 this gen? I think it's going to be much closer next gen. As you said a big part of the success for PS was not that Sony did something brilliant, but that MS behaved like total morons. I think MS has a much better grasp on what they need to do this time around. Last gen PS had the power advantage out of the gate. This time around I expect the more powerful of the xbox:s (assuming they are releasing more than one as rumored) to be the overall best performing machine. MS has invested a lot in game studios and some vey competent ones. So I also think the exclusive situation will be different next gen, with MS matching Sony better at the very least (it's hard to do any worse lol).

Anyway in summary I think next gen will be much more even. Closer to 1:1 than 2:1.

It might be a bit closer in US, but Sony will absolutely destory Xbox in every other region. I still think Xbox will trail behind Sony even in NA come next-gen, because honestly why should people jump ship in masses to the Xbox brand when PS4 delivered in spades this gen?

What can Microsoft due next-gen to entire loyal PS4 owners? Microsoft's 1st party output this gen has been pretty abysmal for the most part and they keep making stupid decisions like that $250 all digital XB1s that is more expensive than the standard disc based version and comes with no advantages.

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#26 Edited by MosquitoBaby (77 posts) -

They will. PS5 will be Sony's PS2. My number 1 reason is because of the new IP's they built this gen + backwards compatibility. Honestly, they set themselves up perfectly for next gen. Now, I believe PS6 gen will be full cloud, so I think that's the gen were Sony could potentially lose to another competitor like Google or some other surprise. But for me, they are safe with the PS5.

Also, for people saying GAMEPASS. Sony has PSNOW, a service that has 4x more subscribers than the Gamepass and is the biggest gaming subscription service in the world. So, please. Sony has beaten Microsoft 3 gens in arrow, they'll do it again next gen.

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#27 Edited by Sushiglutton (7156 posts) -

@emgesp said:
@Sushiglutton said:

I think PS outsold Xbox about 2:1 this gen? I think it's going to be much closer next gen. As you said a big part of the success for PS was not that Sony did something brilliant, but that MS behaved like total morons. I think MS has a much better grasp on what they need to do this time around. Last gen PS had the power advantage out of the gate. This time around I expect the more powerful of the xbox:s (assuming they are releasing more than one as rumored) to be the overall best performing machine. MS has invested a lot in game studios and some vey competent ones. So I also think the exclusive situation will be different next gen, with MS matching Sony better at the very least (it's hard to do any worse lol).

Anyway in summary I think next gen will be much more even. Closer to 1:1 than 2:1.

It might be a bit closer in US, but Sony will absolutely destory Xbox in every other region. I still think Xbox will trail behind Sony even in NA come next-gen, because honestly why should people jump ship in masses to the Xbox brand when PS4 delivered in spades this gen?

What can Microsoft due next-gen to entire loyal PS4 owners? Microsoft's 1st party output this gen has been pretty abysmal for the most part and they keep making stupid decisions like that $250 all digital XB1s that is more expensive than the standard disc based version and comes with no advantages.

I agree that it's an advantage for Sony that they dominated so much this gen. People will assume next gen will be the same as far as exclusives goes. And they will want sequels to their favourites. I mean if you played GoW, you for sure wanna get the platform that let's you play the sequel.

That being said I do think MS can and will improve in the ways I mentioned in my previous post. I also think their messaging will be smarter. Focus more on the core gamers at the start to get the ball rolling. Instead of focusing a reveal, that only the core watches, on everything the core audience despises...

If MS does better in the three areas I have mentioned (power, content, messaging) I don't see why the relative numbers would not improve for them.

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#28 Edited by jaydan (2208 posts) -

I think the consensus is Sony will NOT have the convenience next gen like they did with this one; however, that does not necessarily mean it's a bad thing.

Although it was a "gimme" gen for Sony, they wasted no time building the fanbase with the PS4 and further establishing the maturity of older franchises as well as introducing new ones. Next gen might not be as easy and they are going to have a lot of uphill climbing to do to stay relevant, but thanks to all the foundations put into place this current gen, they'll have a great set of cards to start out with the PS5.

Competition might just get back to a glorious state because Microsoft and Nintendo learned a lot from their own mistakes over the last gen and you can get stronger with that trial-and-error. We might see the introduction of entirely new competitors such as Google, and anything can go next gen. VR might finally start to throw some serious punches and we can throw that in for good measure. We might be ready to brace ourselves for some exciting competition next gen. Sony might not have the same level of convenience next gen, but that might also incline greater excitement for all of us.

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#29 Edited by EG101 (1965 posts) -

The Play Station Brand is too big and Popular to fail much like the Apple I Phone brand.

I do believe that MS will provide much better competition next Gen than this Gen because Nadella has finally made Xbox an important division inside of MS by promoting Phil Spencer into a VP role.

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#30 Posted by phbz (4331 posts) -

I think MS will probably not win the next gen but they don't need to. All they need is to keep the work they're doing and build upon it. It's not like Samsung is going out of market because Apple is the most popular mobile brand. There's enough money to be made.

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#31 Posted by pdogg93 (1529 posts) -

MS will not make another console after next gen’s beatdown

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#32 Edited by WhatAFailure (311 posts) -

I got confused what "convenience of success" means. I voted "Yes" but after reading the comments, maybe I meant to vote "No"?

All I know is PS5, so far, is looking like a successful repeat of PS4's domination. Notice how lemmings aren't even questioning it. Microsoft has so many things they need to address next gen, and their exclusive game library just isn't as strong.

Also, I'd say PS4's success isn't just simply MS shooting themselves in the foot. Credit has to be given to Sony for things they took action on and did right. You have to admit rebooting God of War was risky, but it worked. You have to admit killing off Killzone (for now) and letting a developer with zero experience with open world games actually make an open world game was immensely risky - but it worked. Sony could've turned in a quick, half-assed Spider-Man port but actually found a talented & passionate developer and gave them creative freedom to make a terrific comic book video game.

PSVR was a risk at a time when a majority were dismissing and laughing at VR. PSVR ends up selling the most, and Sony will continue to support it all through the PS5 years, just like they promised years ago.

So the answer to the poll question is more complicated. It's not simply that MS ran into the wall, knocked themselves out, and Sony had to put in minimal effort and still won. Nope. Sony still took risks they normally wouldn't have to, and you don't get to over 100 million consoles sold without making assertive decisions and looking way down the path ahead to predict where things might be heading (such as VR, or the need to reboot God of War due to franchise fatigue).

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#33 Posted by jaydan (2208 posts) -

@whatafailure: interestingly so, the key lemmings of SW have not made a presence in this thread, yet they're actively shit-posting the "movie game" stigma in other threads. This thread is promoting a serious and transparent conversation about what odds we'll have next gen, and surprising most people here are bringing good conversation to the table; but, no lemmings to be seen. It makes me wonder what their real values are when it comes to having a video game discussion.

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#34 Posted by osan0 (15380 posts) -

they do have a lot of momentum behind them. assuming they don't do anything really stupid with the PS5 (and based on the limited info we have so far its looking good....but there isn't much info) its going to be very hard to dislodge them by trying to copy what Sony does.

however there are problems for them going forward. The cost of development continues to rise and will shoot up next gen again. 3rd parties publish on everything to mitigate the risk. MS are releasing their games on any windows device (and are even somewhat expanding: cuphead on the switch for example) to mitigate the risk. Nintendo bowed out of the hardware and tech race to save on the cost of development.

Sony only release their games on their platforms and the games they like to make are not cheap to develop (some cracks are already showing this gen). with modern development costs, how sustainable is it to continue to release on one platform only? what happens if the sales split is more 50/50 next gen? will they be overshadowed by 3rd parties that like to release similar games and can throw a lot more money at their titles?

how success is defined next gen could also change. traditionally its been the console with the most sales (and factoring in software sales too). will that still hold? will number of online subscribers be a bigger factor? number of devices a service is on? Sony could have the console with the most sales but if xbox live has double/triple the subscribers, is on everything but PlayStation and tracks a crap load more titles downloaded (because they are part of the subscription) and are generally generating more revenue and profit than PlayStation then who has really won?

on another note though: i think MS have learned their lesson this gen: they cannot compete on service alone and expect to win. this gen they didnt want to make games. they wanted to be like google: MS provide the services (and make money), other companies make the content. it has sunk in that they can't do that so their recent dev shopping should hopefully pay off with some great games next gen.

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#35 Posted by pmanden (589 posts) -

@osan0: Nice post with a lot of interesting thoughts. No doubt that the measure of success will change in the future. If the number of consoles sold was the only measure for success, Microsoft would never had released any xbox exclusives on PC.

If we look at the number of consoles sold I think Sony will also win the next generation but not by much. If this gen ends at 110 million PS4s and 50 million Xbox sold, then next gen could be around 100 million versus 80 million.

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#36 Posted by BoxRekt (980 posts) -

@jaydan said:

@whatafailure: interestingly so, the key lemmings of SW have not made a presence in this thread, yet they're actively shit-posting the "movie game" stigma in other threads. This thread is promoting a serious and transparent conversation about what odds we'll have next gen, and surprising most people here are bringing good conversation to the table; but, no lemmings to be seen. It makes me wonder what their real values are when it comes to having a video game discussion.

Sorry his post was 100% spot on.

Your OP was kind of stupid and I was thinking the same the this guy was when reading your thread so I didn't answer your poll.

There was nothing "convenient" about the way Sony went to bat pushing out risky multimillion AAA games and new IP when MS was sitting on their ass pushing straight trash.

I like how you glossed over all the games he mentioned that Sony invested in that was pushing PS4 to the success we see today. Sony didn't have to do any of that if what you're saying is true, they could have just relied of multiplats being the industry leader and sat on their ass like MS did at the end of the 360 generation, but that's NOT what Sony has done.

Again, your OP is kinda stupid because it doesn't accurately paint the amazing effort Sony put into this gen.

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#37 Edited by jaydan (2208 posts) -

@boxrekt: If you actually bothered to read the content of this thread then you would have already read how we are talking about how Sony wasted no time this gen establishing a solid library of games, even from my own posts I elaborated on this. Sony had the convenience of having its competitor shoot itself in the foot right out of the flood gate to give a big head-start yet Sony never slept on that advantage either so they maintained and built that momentum for the rest of the gen. You're more than welcome to go back and read this thread.

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#38 Posted by NoodleFighter (10173 posts) -
@kali-b1rd said:

There's a few factors involved that will affect Sony potentially negatively next gen:

  1. Rise of game streaming services (from big backers google, microsoft, amazon etc)
  2. Sony's franchises are going to hit the same wall Microsoft's did. Uncharted 5? Gran Turismo 12323? Last of us 3? Horizon 2-3?
  3. no remasters to fall back on this time.... (backwards compatibility) lots of Sony's smaller IPs have been one time wonders, or not even made an appearance.... their exclusive range has shrunk since the PS1/2 days, especially the diversity in genres (YAY FOR 3rd person action games x12131092831023)

Obviously, if game steaming fails they will be in the best position again. As Microsoft has the same problems as above but even worse and a weaker global brand....

Don't forget that Sony is ran by SJWs now and are censoring games now. This is greatly going to affect how they perform in Japan since many Japanese developers and gamers are upset over this. Their censorship policies can change on a whim for a game which can greatly inconvenience devs., Sony has lately been drifting away from their Japanese heritage which is most shown with how they moved their headquarters to California and most of their exclusives don't really appeal to the Japanese audience. They're pushing Japanese developers and gamers away to PC and Nintendo Switch. If more big games like Devil May Cry V get censored by them eventually western gamers will get fed up with their crap as well.

@whatafailure said:

I got confused what "convenience of success" means. I voted "Yes" but after reading the comments, maybe I meant to vote "No"?

All I know is PS5, so far, is looking like a successful repeat of PS4's domination. Notice how lemmings aren't even questioning it. Microsoft has so many things they need to address next gen, and their exclusive game library just isn't as strong.

Also, I'd say PS4's success isn't just simply MS shooting themselves in the foot. Credit has to be given to Sony for things they took action on and did right. You have to admit rebooting God of War was risky, but it worked. You have to admit killing off Killzone (for now) and letting a developer with zero experience with open world games actually make an open world game was immensely risky - but it worked. Sony could've turned in a quick, half-assed Spider-Man port but actually found a talented & passionate developer and gave them creative freedom to make a terrific comic book video game.

PSVR was a risk at a time when a majority were dismissing and laughing at VR. PSVR ends up selling the most, and Sony will continue to support it all through the PS5 years, just like they promised years ago.

So the answer to the poll question is more complicated. It's not simply that MS ran into the wall, knocked themselves out, and Sony had to put in minimal effort and still won. Nope. Sony still took risks they normally wouldn't have to, and you don't get to over 100 million consoles sold without making assertive decisions and looking way down the path ahead to predict where things might be heading (such as VR, or the need to reboot God of War due to franchise fatigue).

The first couple of years of PS4s success was undeniably greatly due to how bad the original Xbox One was gonna be. All they had to do was say they wouldn't get rid of used games and people praised them as the saviors of the gaming industry. They got away with charging people to pay for online with no backlash because of that. It became cool to hate on anything Xbox during those first couple of years. People even made the graphical and performance differences between the PS4 and XONE seem bigger than it really was. The exclusive lineup for the PS4 was pretty weak up until Bloodborne came out but even then Bloodborne was pretty much the only high rated must have exclusive for PS4 that year. Most games were flops or simply did not gain a large audience and fell off into irrelevancy. Then there was the promise of games such as Final Fantasy 7 Remake, Deep Down and Shenmue 3 that still have yet to come out and I'm pretty sure Deep Down is vaporware at this point. So up until 2016 aside from remasters the PS4 was heavily relying on F2P and indie games most of which were already on PC. Playstation fans pretended to like indies for a while and trash AAA games up until the PS4 started getting them more consistently then it was back to trashing indies.

Microsoft have been using this gen to prepare themselves for next gen as you can see with their acquisition of many studios. They're gonna come with a much stronger exclusive games lineup. If The Outer Worlds 2 is Xbox exclusive or Obsidian makes a title similar to it, than the next Xbox already has a guaranteed killer app likely even more popular that can easily rival the likes of God Of War, TLOU2 and Death Stranding. Ninja Theory have proven themselves capable of making quality cinematic narrative driven titles. From the rumours of their upcoming game Razer it seems like it will be a coop hack n slash game with boss fights in the style of God Of War 4. This could also be a potential killer app for the Xbox. Playground Games is working on a open world RPG so it's nice to see something other than Forza come out of them it could end up being a similar success compared to Horizon Zero Dawn how a studio that made nothing but linear shooters made a great open world RPG game. I'm curious to see what Inxile will make now that they got much more money. As for the other developer acquisitions its more of a wait and see as their previous game history is questionable if they can bring quality titles now that they have more resources.

TBH dropping Killzone for the time being really wasn't that much of a risk considering how bad Shadowfall flopped and the Killzone series never did become a Halo killer let alone a rival. Plus Sony moving nearly all their first party and second party games into the third person action adventure genre Horizon Zero Dawn likely would have had a lower chance of being greenlit if it was first person instead of third. Spiderman wasn't a risk either since as you said they could have just given out a half-assed game if they wanted to. Did you not see the constant hype the game was getting the second it was revealed just because it was Spiderman? With how popular the MCU is people were going overboard with the hype talking about how it could be the start of a Marvel Video Game universe exclusive to Playstation. Spiderman was the complete opposite of a risk and more like a big opportunity. I don't think rebooting God Of War was that risky either as after God Of War 3, God Of War Ascension was a flop that was much less critically praised (80 on meta while 3 had 92) and it sold less copies. This was likely signs of the series going stale and the formula they had going likely couldn't top what they did with GOW3. Though I would agree on the risk of changing up the combat as it could have been something worse than the original series that everyone would hate.

I agree with PSVR being a risk it could have easily been as forgettable as the PSmove and eye toy. It appears to be getting better VR support than the PC headsets too.

I think Sony success is a combination of Microsoft and Nintendo screwing up with their consoles and pumping out more AAA games. Only downside that may be for Sony is that it took too long for them to start churning out AAA games for PS4 and a lot of the heavy hitters came out near the end of this generation which means devs may not have enough time to release games built from the ground up for the PS5 since they just released PS4 titles. PS5 will backwards compatibility so they can't rely on remasters either.

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#39 Posted by SaltSlasher (1006 posts) -

Nintendo is flopped over on their backs and Xbox aren't dogs, so no, they won't get that instant success, they will actually have to work for it, luckily they are great on their feet and can recover from anything.

But that isn't all, they got fight with services, Stadia, Atari VCS, Apple Arcade, etc. and fight with VR, Valve Index, Occulus, Labo, and Vive.

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#40 Posted by rzxv04 (578 posts) -

Unless MS really effs it up, I'd say no.

I do wonder how much potential pull they have with the new hits like GoW4, HZD where GoW bombed with Ascension and Killzone didn't score as close.

I think Sony needs more than that even if GoT and TLoU2 becomes good hits.

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#41 Posted by Ovirew (8871 posts) -

Like someone else mentioned above, it's incredibly hard to say what the years ahead will look like for gaming. We know Switch will likely be around for a while, we know the PS4 and XBO will be around a few more years, and PS5 is on the way. But Nintendo is interested in looking at gaming from different angles, and still has one eye on mobile. Microsoft may see more value in converting XBox into a service or merging it with Windows. Sony will likely continue to invest in VR.

Let's not forget that gamers are aging, and while they may still play some games their time and money to play will be lessened, or the kinds of games they like or have time for may change.

And while people aren't really talking about it, let's not rule out Apple's or Google's gaming services. What might at first seem odd could soon become a power-player in the industry.

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#42 Edited by jaydan (2208 posts) -

@NoodleFighter: You pretty much hit the nail on the head with most of your points. Some gamer's/fanboys must really have the attention-span of a dime if they really did not find the PS4 gen convenient for its success. The PS4 launched in 2013 and Bloodborne launched in 2015. There was two full years of a major drought in PS4's lineup. That's not to say games were not released; we had games like - Infamous: Second, Killzone: Shadow Fall and Knack, but none of these titles were even remotely killer-apps for the console. When Bloodborne launched, it was one of the biggest reliefs because about damned time the PS4 got its killer-app. From then on out things became a smoother sail.

But for two years there was a lot less going on for the PS4, but gamer's were distracted they couldn't be bothered by a console that was only relishing on "Greatness Awaits" over the fact Microsoft screwed up so badly.

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#43 Posted by MosquitoBaby (77 posts) -

@jaydan said:

@NoodleFighter: You pretty much hit the nail on the head with most of your points. Some gamer's/fanboys must really have the attention-span of a dime if they really did not find the PS4 gen convenient for its success. The PS4 launched in 2013 and Bloodborne launched in 2015. There was two full years of a major drought in PS4's lineup. That's not to say games were not released; we had games like - Infamous: Second, Killzone: Shadow Fall and Knack, but none of these titles were even remotely killer-apps for the console. When Bloodborne launched, it was one of the biggest reliefs because about damned time the PS4 got its killer-app. From then on out things became a smoother sail.

But for two years there was a lot less going on for the PS4, but gamer's were distracted they couldn't be bothered by a console that was only relishing on "Greatness Awaits" over the fact Microsoft screwed up so badly.

Dude, Sony has won 3 out of the last 4 gens. Their only blunder was the PS3 and it still outsold the 360 by the end. To think they're going to screw up, the numbers really aren't in your favor. Sony isn't going to commit the same mistake they did with the PS3 twice. They have a large library of new IP's they formed this gen, PSNOW is the biggest game streaming/subscription service, honestly they are set next gen.

The gen they will probably lose or I don't know what's going to happen is the PS6. By then I suspect streaming will be the norm and competition will be insane. Even so, with PSNOW they already have the technology. So they actually have a good head start there - but anything can happen.

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#45 Posted by Sagemode87 (1390 posts) -

The real reason is because MS has no presence outside of US. People overstate the 2013 reveal. I have friends who said they're getting PS4 after E3 then once MS reversed things they went right back. Not as many people held the reveal against them as the media would like us to believe. After all Xbox One is within 80 percent of PS4s sales in the states. They don't appeal to Europe, Asia, or other countries. Not to mention PS4 just has a bigger variety of games. Don't see MS ever beating Sony if they couldn't beat them 7th gen.

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#46 Posted by Sancho_Panzer (814 posts) -

@Sagemode87: This is kind of a big generalisation, but Europe's pretty price conscious. There is space for MS, or any other competitor here if they price right and market right.

Due to the high population density and relatively small landmass, we've also got good internet infrastructure, on the whole. That's why I think discless systems might be an interesting proposition over here. Time will tell I guess.

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#47 Edited by Sagemode87 (1390 posts) -

@sancho_panzer: I get where you're coming from. I just don't agree with the notion that Sony was handed this generation. They've pumped out great games and despite the fact that they could easily end the gen with a whimper considering their lead, they're ending it with a bang just as they always do.

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#48 Posted by Pedro (34010 posts) -

Anything that is not "I don't know" is speculation. Shit happens and sometimes it doesn't happen.

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#49 Posted by jaydan (2208 posts) -

@mosquitobaby: please point to the section within any of my posts where I directly say Sony is going to "screw up" next gen. I can save you the hassle and say I never made such a claim. This thread is a questionnaire whether Sony will have a similar convenience for success next gen like they did this gen. Even if they don't face any conveniences next gen that does NOT mean they won't be successful, it just means they'll have to work harder for that success next gen.

If you take those fanboy goggles off maybe you'll have an easier time with not making blindsided assertions. You might also realize I've openly criticized the other companies, too.

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#50 Edited by Sancho_Panzer (814 posts) -

@Sagemode87 said:

@sancho_panzer: I get where you're coming from. I just don't agree with the notion that Sony was handed this generation. They've pumped out great games and despite the fact that they could easily end the gen with a whimper considering their lead, they're ending it with a bang just as they always do.

Absolutely no doubt they've had a good gen throughout. They've earned their market position. Taking such a dramatic lead out of the gate must have made it very easy to invest with confidence, and that's exactly what they've done.

Still, it would be interesting to see what would have happened if the tables had been turned, and they'd made some careless blunder at release. Would the game support have been nearly so strong if they'd been way behind? It's hard to tell, but looking to their handhelds, I do think Sony can be very wary of throwing good money after bad.