why has neather sony nor microsoft wanting to talk about storage space for next gen?

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firedrakes

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#1 firedrakes
Member since 2004 • 2008 Posts

i notice this. i all the news their staying away from saying it all.

seeing if they start doing 4k gaming installs are going to balloon in size.

wondering if anyone else has notice this.

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lundy86_4

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#2  Edited By lundy86_4  Online
Member since 2003 • 54193 Posts

It'll be 2TB or 4TB. If they go with SSDs, which seems to be the standard leak from dev's, then it will be the former.

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mrbojangles25

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#3  Edited By mrbojangles25
Member since 2005 • 44839 Posts

It's a small and relatively cheap thing. It'd be like advertising that your car has four tires. Of course it's going to have storage space that is reasonable.

@lundy86_4 said:

It'll be 2TB or 4TB. If they go with SSDs, which seems to be the standard leak from dev's, then it will be the former.

That would certainly be something worth mentioning. I don't know how it would work on consoles, but SSD's have given me about a 7-second boot time on my PC (that's fast, btw). Doesn't make too big of a difference on games loading but studies show it makes some difference.

SSDs would also be one less mechanical item to fail (no moving parts) so people wouldn't need to use their warranty as often, and they are reeeeeeaally small relative to HDDs so you could make your unit smaller.

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Archangel3371

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#4 Archangel3371
Member since 2004 • 28895 Posts

That’s something that they can kind of throw in at the last minute so to speak. Really no need to commit to a specific size right now.

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lundy86_4

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#5  Edited By lundy86_4  Online
Member since 2003 • 54193 Posts

@mrbojangles25 said:

It's a small and relatively cheap thing. It'd be like advertising that your car has four tires. Of course it's going to have storage space that is reasonable.

@lundy86_4 said:

It'll be 2TB or 4TB. If they go with SSDs, which seems to be the standard leak from dev's, then it will be the former.

That would certainly be something worth mentioning. I don't know how it would work on consoles, but SSD's have given me about a 7-second boot time on my PC (that's fast, btw). Doesn't make too big of a difference on games loading but studies show it makes some difference.

SSDs would also be one less mechanical item to fail (no moving parts) so people wouldn't need to use their warranty as often, and they are reeeeeeaally small relative to HDDs so you could make your unit smaller.

SSDs are announced, or at least leaked, IIRC. I use an SSD for boot, and HDDs for video/games. I'm meaning to switch to NVMe SSD for gaming, but i'm waiting to take the plunge.

SSDs are a great addition, like you stated. Read/writes are pretty much a non-issue nowadays.

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the_bi99man

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#6 the_bi99man
Member since 2004 • 11292 Posts

@firedrakes: you think 4k is going to balloon install sizes? That's not how resolution works.

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watercrack445

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#7 watercrack445
Member since 2017 • 2076 Posts

Because they are going to produce their own HDDs and SSDs.

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Fedor

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#8 Fedor
Member since 2015 • 5470 Posts

@the_bi99man: It is how 4k textures work.

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Grey_Eyed_Elf

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#9 Grey_Eyed_Elf
Member since 2011 • 6539 Posts

Games have gone from being 7-14GB in size to 30-60GB... 1TB NVME's are not cheap, these console are either going to be expensive in $600+ range or all these rumours and "leaks" are just a lie.

You could build a PC with X1/PS4 specs on launch for 100-150 (500-600 PC) more and the same went for the Pro and X1X(600-700 PC)... The leaked specifications of the PS5 are of a PC with in the $1000 range.

Also the guy above who posted 2-4TB?... I am a bit out of the loop with current rumours but you people are special if you think that is even remotely possible.

  • 8 core Zen 2 3GHz+
  • More powerful than a XT a $400 GPU
  • Has Ray Tracing
  • 16 - 24GB GDDR6
  • 2TB SSD
  • 4K Bluray

On a 200w PSU for $400-500?... Its just not happening.

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GoldenElementXL

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#10 GoldenElementXL
Member since 2016 • 3573 Posts

@Grey_Eyed_Elf: Don’t bother. There is no getting through to these people

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Grey_Eyed_Elf

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#11  Edited By Grey_Eyed_Elf
Member since 2011 • 6539 Posts

@goldenelementxl: Oh I know... I just come back here once and a while throw a few jabs while tipsy and don't respond to them. Like Glover says "I'm too old for this s***".

The coming generation is shaping up to be a repeat of a X1 and PS4 launch in terms of hardware... I have a feeling the CPU frequencies and GPU CU count will be substantially lower than what the rumours are suggesting, it will be another HD 7790 situation.

Also the rumours of a Pro with a 60 CU 1700Mhz GPU... DO these people not understand that the PRO and X1X are mid life releases who run off the same power targets and the reason why they had better hardware is because of the hardware available at the time was better and ran at the same TDP, so releasing a 60 CU 1700MHz console means that AMD has managed to get a 60CU to run at 150w'ish, which makes no sense since 40 CU XT can't even do that and it doesn't even have ray tracing support like the console is meant to have.

The same people believe these rumours are the same people who are making them up and "leaking" them since clearly they both share the same level of knowledge on hardware.

Keep in mind that the HD 7850/7790 and RX 480 require less power to run the either of the two Navi cards, but these guys think they are getting something with almost 2x the CU count AND have high frequencies?... FML.

I can't wait till they release the inevitable sub 3GHz and 40CU console with overpriced GDDR6/1TB NVME for $500+... I mean jeez 3GHz+ 8 core Zen and 60 CU's at 1700MHz and now a 2-4TB SSD and Ray Tracing?... Willy Nelson wants his weed back.

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Zero_epyon

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#12 Zero_epyon
Member since 2004 • 13485 Posts
@lundy86_4 said:
@mrbojangles25 said:

It's a small and relatively cheap thing. It'd be like advertising that your car has four tires. Of course it's going to have storage space that is reasonable.

@lundy86_4 said:

It'll be 2TB or 4TB. If they go with SSDs, which seems to be the standard leak from dev's, then it will be the former.

That would certainly be something worth mentioning. I don't know how it would work on consoles, but SSD's have given me about a 7-second boot time on my PC (that's fast, btw). Doesn't make too big of a difference on games loading but studies show it makes some difference.

SSDs would also be one less mechanical item to fail (no moving parts) so people wouldn't need to use their warranty as often, and they are reeeeeeaally small relative to HDDs so you could make your unit smaller.

SSDs are announced, or at least leaked, IIRC. I use an SSD for boot, and HDDs for video/games. I'm meaning to switch to NVMe SSD for gaming, but i'm waiting to take the plunge.

SSDs are a great addition, like you stated. Read/writes are pretty much a non-issue nowadays.

The SSDs in the new consoles won't be like the average SSD on some PCs. They're super fast custom SSDs that most likely use PCIe 4.0. I have a PCIe 4.0 M.2 drive on my desktop right now. It destroys every other drive I've ever owned. Even my previous M.2 drive which was previously the fastest SSD I've ever owned. And the best part, it was the cheapest I've ever bought with the most space I've ever had at 1TB.

I definitely see 2TB being the total space for the first batch of SKUs and it won't break the bank. I see the move to 4 B later in the gen, especially if there's a midgen refresh.

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firedrakes

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#13  Edited By firedrakes
Member since 2004 • 2008 Posts

@Zero_epyon: that your option but this is game console manf. volume to price is key.

seeing current gen tail end have been 1 tb. and you see how much is left and then with game installs. even 2 tb would not be good at at all.

idk you getting faster speeds with gen 4.0 of it. seeing its how many lanes you have will get you the speed.

atm am running 128 pce gen 3 lanes and i still not max it out with my set up.

but that being said a ton of mobo manf cheap out on lane count for it.

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sakaiXx

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#14 sakaiXx
Member since 2013 • 6432 Posts

Its actually a great PR weapon if used at right moment. If microsoft announced its going to have 1tb storage, Sony can 1up them by selling to media ps5 have 1.5 to 2 tb storage.

With them using relatively same architecture next gen, its these kinds of things that will be used to attract consumers.

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HalcyonScarlet

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#15  Edited By HalcyonScarlet
Member since 2011 • 8491 Posts

I expect it'll be a large HDD and a small SSD, like Intel Fast Response Technology. It's the cost effective fast way of doing things. There's no reason to have a large expensive SSD on its own.

That's what I've decided to use on my computer for PC gaming. A 2.5 2TB 5400RPM WD Blue and a 64GB Transcend SSD. Didn't want an expensive 2TB SSD or a big noisy high performance 2TB HDD.

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thehig1

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#16 thehig1
Member since 2014 • 7372 Posts

@firedrakes: probabily because its a boring thing to talk about

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HalcyonScarlet

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#17 HalcyonScarlet
Member since 2011 • 8491 Posts

@Zero_epyon said:
@lundy86_4 said:
@mrbojangles25 said:

It's a small and relatively cheap thing. It'd be like advertising that your car has four tires. Of course it's going to have storage space that is reasonable.

@lundy86_4 said:

It'll be 2TB or 4TB. If they go with SSDs, which seems to be the standard leak from dev's, then it will be the former.

That would certainly be something worth mentioning. I don't know how it would work on consoles, but SSD's have given me about a 7-second boot time on my PC (that's fast, btw). Doesn't make too big of a difference on games loading but studies show it makes some difference.

SSDs would also be one less mechanical item to fail (no moving parts) so people wouldn't need to use their warranty as often, and they are reeeeeeaally small relative to HDDs so you could make your unit smaller.

SSDs are announced, or at least leaked, IIRC. I use an SSD for boot, and HDDs for video/games. I'm meaning to switch to NVMe SSD for gaming, but i'm waiting to take the plunge.

SSDs are a great addition, like you stated. Read/writes are pretty much a non-issue nowadays.

The SSDs in the new consoles won't be like the average SSD on some PCs. They're super fast custom SSDs that most likely use PCIe 4.0. I have a PCIe 4.0 M.2 drive on my desktop right now. It destroys every other drive I've ever owned. Even my previous M.2 drive which was previously the fastest SSD I've ever owned. And the best part, it was the cheapest I've ever bought with the most space I've ever had at 1TB.

I definitely see 2TB being the total space for the first batch of SKUs and it won't break the bank. I see the move to 4 B later in the gen, especially if there's a midgen refresh.

People should also consider the software side of things. They're using highly optimised programming techniques at every level with eliminating loading in mind. So 'custom' could also relate to firmware and how the games are designed around already loading what you're going to need, and how everything specifically uses the hardware. Nothing was designed like that in the current gen.

The latest SSD technology isn't cheap. People shouldn't default conclude that crazy expensive next gen tech is the only solution.

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Litchie

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#18 Litchie  Online
Member since 2003 • 24698 Posts

Please work on your grammar. That was painful.

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firedrakes

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#19 firedrakes
Member since 2004 • 2008 Posts

@thehig1: that is true

litchie lazy trolling comment yet

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DaVillain-

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#20 DaVillain-  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 39137 Posts

Meh, I'll just customize my storage just like I did with my PS4 if it turns out to be shit on PS5 in the distance future.

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TheEroica

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#21 TheEroica  Moderator
Member since 2009 • 18547 Posts

Because they haven't announced their consoles yet?

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the_bi99man

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#22 the_bi99man
Member since 2004 • 11292 Posts
@fedor said:

@the_bi99man: It is how 4k textures work.

True, but I'm about 99% sure that's not what OP is talking about. The console rumors are hyping 4k resolution, because 4k TVs are getting close to being standard now, and 4k was one of the main draws of the Ps4 Pro and X1X, over the baseline models. The new consoles probably will output at native 4K, making graphical concessions elsewhere as necessary in order to keep that standard. And game installs definitely will get larger, because of larger textures, among other things. But the fact that the console renders the image on screen at 4K rather than 1080p does not have any effect on that.

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Zero_epyon

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#23 Zero_epyon
Member since 2004 • 13485 Posts
@firedrakes said:

@Zero_epyon: that your option but this is game console manf. volume to price is key.

seeing current gen tail end have been 1 tb. and you see how much is left and then with game installs. even 2 tb would not be good at at all.

idk you getting faster speeds with gen 4.0 of it. seeing its how many lanes you have will get you the speed.

atm am running 128 pce gen 3 lanes and i still not max it out with my set up.

but that being said a ton of mobo manf cheap out on lane count for it.

Console manufacturers are no strangers to selling at a loss. They will often do so if they believe the tech will get cheaper as the gen lives on and they can make up for the loss in software sales. My point is, don't worry about storage space. I'm sure if you ever run out, they'll have options for you to expand it. Something MS and Sony have been doing since 360 and PS4.

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LJS9502_basic

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#24  Edited By LJS9502_basic
Member since 2003 • 167869 Posts

I'm sure they will have variations. Not sure why they would need to talk about it now though.

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osan0

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#25 osan0
Member since 2004 • 15491 Posts

I am interested to see what they do here. it's definitely something that needs to be tackled on next gen systems. a combination of blu-ray drive, 5400rpm laptop HDDs and slow CPUs are not going to cut it next gen.the loading times would be horrific.

Sonys comments suggest that they are going with a drive faster than a sata3 SSD anyway (which, looking at the current pricing of SSDs, actually makes sense. if it doesnt cost more to go faster then why not?).

but i wonder what the overall setup will be? will it just be 1 big SSD to store everything on? will the SSD be small and used more like a cache to store frequently used or the last used game while the rest is on a HDD?

will the entire storage solution be user replaceable with off the shelf parts or are MS and sony going to treat the SSD like a memory card and customise it specifically for their consoles?

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shellcase86

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#26 shellcase86
Member since 2012 • 4568 Posts

1TB would be fine with me. I know most users on these forums have that hoarder mentality, that they have to have 100 games installed at any given time and need a 20TB HDD, but I remove and re-download stuff constantly.

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firedrakes

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#27  Edited By firedrakes
Member since 2004 • 2008 Posts

@shellcase86: true but again if games are in 4k that will be around 6 games total .

lets say 1 call of duty, well over 120gb just for 1 game.

i think their going to do a ssd/normal hdd(not a laptop one)

we hope they give us a option.

this are all valid issues.

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Litchie

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#28  Edited By Litchie  Online
Member since 2003 • 24698 Posts

We know next to nothing about the next consoles. Why the hell would they talk about storage (which also happens to be the most boring thing to talk about)? I don't think even they know themselves yet.

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lamprey263

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#29 lamprey263
Member since 2006 • 36268 Posts

I haven't really thought of it. This gen I bought external HDDs, and on my Xbox One it's said to help load times. On a system built to use an SSD, I wonder if an external expansion might hinder performance significantly.

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Ten_Pints

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#30 Ten_Pints
Member since 2014 • 3939 Posts

I'd be assuming a 120gb ssd plus 1 or 2tb HDD.

People saying 1tb ssd, how much do you expect the new consoles to cost? The drive alone will be £100.

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Random_Matt

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#31 Random_Matt  Online
Member since 2013 • 4445 Posts

Get a 2TB nvme and call it a day.

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FinalFighters

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#32  Edited By FinalFighters
Member since 2013 • 3244 Posts

Who cares? you can use external HDD's on your consoles now.

buy a 2TB - 8TB external HDD, plug it into the USB port and call it a day..

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xantufrog

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#33 xantufrog  Moderator
Member since 2013 • 11856 Posts

@ten_pints: agreed. My money's on a small SSD for the OS and swap and a large cheap HDD

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#34 BoxRekt
Member since 2019 • 2071 Posts

@HalcyonScarlet said:

I expect it'll be a large HDD and a small SSD, like Intel Fast Response Technology. It's the cost effective fast way of doing things. There's no reason to have a large expensive SSD on its own.

That's what I've decided to use on my computer for PC gaming. A 2.5 2TB 5400RPM WD Blue and a 64GB Transcend SSD. Didn't want an expensive 2TB SSD or a big noisy high performance 2TB HDD.

You are spot on correct!

And the SSD from Sony will be non-removable, but you'll have the ability to swap out and upgrade the standard HDD.

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HalcyonScarlet

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#35 HalcyonScarlet
Member since 2011 • 8491 Posts

@boxrekt said:
@HalcyonScarlet said:

I expect it'll be a large HDD and a small SSD, like Intel Fast Response Technology. It's the cost effective fast way of doing things. There's no reason to have a large expensive SSD on its own.

That's what I've decided to use on my computer for PC gaming. A 2.5 2TB 5400RPM WD Blue and a 64GB Transcend SSD. Didn't want an expensive 2TB SSD or a big noisy high performance 2TB HDD.

You are spot on correct!

And the SSD from Sony will be non-removable, but you'll have the ability to swap out and upgrade the standard HDD.

I think it'll have a bit more of an emphasis on write speed, because smaller SSDs don't, but I don't think it'll need to be anything too elaborate like people think. And it'll just make very good use of SATA 3 speeds.

Otherwise it'll just use a different method to Intel FRT, where it'll be constantly loading data before you use it.

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2Chalupas

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#36 2Chalupas
Member since 2009 • 7117 Posts

@FinalFighters said:

Who cares? you can use external HDD's on your consoles now.

buy a 2TB - 8TB external HDD, plug it into the USB port and call it a day..

Nah. The console should definitely still have enough space to store games internally, that's a basic function. Let's not go the Nintendo route of not providing the basics of a functioning console. Depending on how much next gen games take, 1TB or 2TB should suffice (replacing 500GB or 1TB options from this gen).

The only question is how fast that storage is, can they manage a full 1TB SSD or chip based storage. Or maybe to cut costs, we see just the operating system stored on a fast SSD and then game data on a separate HDD, as someone suggested 128GB SSD and 1TB HDD. I could see that possibly happening.

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Daredevils2k

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#37 Daredevils2k
Member since 2015 • 2138 Posts

Combo between cloud and ssd

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getyeryayasout

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#38 getyeryayasout  Online
Member since 2005 • 12684 Posts

They're byte-ing their lips.

*snicker*

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#39  Edited By Ezekiel43
Member since 2017 • 1980 Posts

@2Chalupas said:
@FinalFighters said:

Who cares? you can use external HDD's on your consoles now.

buy a 2TB - 8TB external HDD, plug it into the USB port and call it a day..

Nah. The console should definitely still have enough space to store games internally, that's a basic function. Let's not go the Nintendo route of not providing the basics of a functioning console. Depending on how much next gen games take, 1TB or 2TB should suffice (replacing 500GB or 1TB options from this gen).

The only question is how fast that storage is, can they manage a full 1TB SSD or chip based storage. Or maybe to cut costs, we see just the operating system stored on a fast SSD and then game data on a separate HDD, as someone suggested 128GB SSD and 1TB HDD. I could see that possibly happening.

The basics of a functioning console? Back in the day, you just put the game in the console and played. That's one of the things that separated them from PCs. Switch is more of a classic console by not making you wait thirty minutes while the disc is installed.

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ronvalencia

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#40  Edited By ronvalencia
Member since 2008 • 28256 Posts

@Grey_Eyed_Elf said:

Games have gone from being 7-14GB in size to 30-60GB... 1TB NVME's are not cheap, these console are either going to be expensive in $600+ range or all these rumours and "leaks" are just a lie.

You could build a PC with X1/PS4 specs on launch for 100-150 (500-600 PC) more and the same went for the Pro and X1X(600-700 PC)... The leaked specifications of the PS5 are of a PC with in the $1000 range.

Also the guy above who posted 2-4TB?... I am a bit out of the loop with current rumours but you people are special if you think that is even remotely possible.

  • 8 core Zen 2 3GHz+
  • More powerful than a XT a $400 GPU
  • Has Ray Tracing
  • 16 - 24GB GDDR6
  • 2TB SSD
  • 4K Bluray

On a 200w PSU for $400-500?... Its just not happening.

FYI, Xbox One X's PSU is rated at 245 watts.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/11992/the-xbox-one-x-review/6

In addition, the Xbox One X is outfitted with a power supply that Microsoft equates to an 80 Plus Gold unit, which means it should be 90% efficient at 50% load with a 115 V source, and there shouldn’t be too much extra power wasted from the PSU converting AC voltage.

90 pecrent of 245 watts yields 220 watts

Xbox One X's physical parts are the standard for Xbox Scarlett i.e. higher than 256 bit memory bus and larger APU chip area.

245 watts gold rated PSU... it happened for Xbox One X!

PC hardware has multiple profit overheads when compared to Xbox One hardware.

PC hardware purchases can be subsidized by income tax offset.

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AJStyles

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#41 AJStyles
Member since 2018 • 1199 Posts

Some of you guys are crazy.

If you look at the logical cost issue and slow rate of HDD increases from PS3/360 to PS4/Xbone, the PS5/Xbox2 will launch with 1TB drives.

This is just common sense thinking.

1TB for the standard PS5/Xbox2. If there is a pro version of either, it would be higher.

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Techhog89

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#42 Techhog89
Member since 2015 • 3813 Posts

@ronvalencia: Uh... You might want to consider looking up how PSUs work. Also working on your reading comprehension...

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X_CAPCOM_X

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#43 X_CAPCOM_X  Online
Member since 2004 • 8779 Posts

Because they want you to buy their streaming services.

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ronvalencia

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#44  Edited By ronvalencia
Member since 2008 • 28256 Posts

@techhog89 said:

@ronvalencia: Uh... You might want to consider looking up how PSUs work. Also working on your reading comprehension...

Claim: On a 200w PSU for $400-500?... Its just not happening.

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/06/xbox-one-x-scorpio-games-explainer-video/

XBox One X has 245 watts PSU.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/11992/the-xbox-one-x-review/6

In addition, the Xbox One X is outfitted with a power supply that Microsoft equates to an 80 Plus Gold unit, which means it should be 90% efficient at 50% load with a 115 V source, and there shouldn’t be too much extra power wasted from the PSU converting AC voltage.

245 watts gold rated PSU... it happened for Xbox One X!

Also working on your reading comprehension...

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KungfuKitten

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#45  Edited By KungfuKitten
Member since 2006 • 26916 Posts

TB's of SSD storage is not that cheap. Anything that costs over $100 to put in the box is going to be advertised. Maybe it's not finalised. It is an easy something to change late in development.

Hybrids make more sense for the cost. And for loading times Sony already has a different solution.

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ronvalencia

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#46  Edited By ronvalencia
Member since 2008 • 28256 Posts

@Grey_Eyed_Elf said:

@goldenelementxl: Oh I know... I just come back here once and a while throw a few jabs while tipsy and don't respond to them. Like Glover says "I'm too old for this s***".

The coming generation is shaping up to be a repeat of a X1 and PS4 launch in terms of hardware... I have a feeling the CPU frequencies and GPU CU count will be substantially lower than what the rumours are suggesting, it will be another HD 7790 situation.

Also the rumours of a Pro with a 60 CU 1700Mhz GPU... DO these people not understand that the PRO and X1X are mid life releases who run off the same power targets and the reason why they had better hardware is because of the hardware available at the time was better and ran at the same TDP, so releasing a 60 CU 1700MHz console means that AMD has managed to get a 60CU to run at 150w'ish, which makes no sense since 40 CU XT can't even do that and it doesn't even have ray tracing support like the console is meant to have.

The same people believe these rumours are the same people who are making them up and "leaking" them since clearly they both share the same level of knowledge on hardware.

Keep in mind that the HD 7850/7790 and RX 480 require less power to run the either of the two Navi cards, but these guys think they are getting something with almost 2x the CU count AND have high frequencies?... FML.

I can't wait till they release the inevitable sub 3GHz and 40CU console with overpriced GDDR6/1TB NVME for $500+... I mean jeez 3GHz+ 8 core Zen and 60 CU's at 1700MHz and now a 2-4TB SSD and Ray Tracing?... Willy Nelson wants his weed back.

Your argument is valid when both RX-470/RX-480 and PS4 Pro was release during 2016, hence similar silicon maturity yields, but year 2017 Xbox One X GPU with 12 GDDR5-6800 chips has beaten PC's year 2016 RX-480 with 8 GDDR5-8000 chips.

Xbox One X GPU dev kit's 6.0 TFLOPS at ~150 watts which is roughtly half of Vega 64's 12.58 TFLOPS with 295 watts. The entire Xbox One X machine is known to consume ~180 watts.

Xbox One X dev kit has 6.6 TFLOPS (44 CU XT) with similar power consumption as Xbox One X retail boxes (40 CU Pro).

Factory overclocked RX-480 SKU known as RX-580 has 6.1 TFLOPS and 185 watts (known to exceed this 185 watts towards ~200 watts). Vega 64 scale can't be built on Polaris 10/20 silicon maturity.

XBox One X's peak 245 watts PSU x 90 percent efficiency has 220 watts available.

Leaked Xbox Scarlett Anubis has +270 watts range PSU which is higher than Xbox One X's 245 watts PSU.

https://www.psdevwiki.com/ps3/Power_Supply

Fat PS3 has 399 watts PSU with 66.5 to 82 percent efficiency. At 66 percent efficiency, 263 watts are available. Sony shipped lesser quality PSU.

Fat PS3 has 285 watts PSU with 74 to 79 percent efficiency. At 74 percent efficiency, ~220 watts are available.

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Techhog89

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#47 Techhog89
Member since 2015 • 3813 Posts
@ronvalencia said:
@techhog89 said:

@ronvalencia: Uh... You might want to consider looking up how PSUs work. Also working on your reading comprehension...

Claim: On a 200w PSU for $400-500?... Its just not happening.

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/06/xbox-one-x-scorpio-games-explainer-video/

XBox One X has 245 watts PSU.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/11992/the-xbox-one-x-review/6

In addition, the Xbox One X is outfitted with a power supply that Microsoft equates to an 80 Plus Gold unit, which means it should be 90% efficient at 50% load with a 115 V source, and there shouldn’t be too much extra power wasted from the PSU converting AC voltage.

245 watts gold rated PSU... it happened for Xbox One X!

Also working on your reading comprehension...

Not what I meant. First of all, it's 90% at 50% load, as it says right there. That's why I said that your reading comprehension is bad. Second, you calculated efficiency incorrectly. If a PSU is 90% efficient, that doesn't mean that it tops out at using 90% of its rated capacity; it means that 90% of the energy it uses is what it needs to feed to the system, and the other 10% is lost. A 245W PSU will still top out at 245W output no matter what its efficiency is; however, at 100% load with a Gold rating efficiency is around 87%, which means that at max load it would output 245W, but would need to use ~282W when doing so. That's what I meant. You don't understand what efficiency ratings are, and you completely ignored the "at 50% load" part even though you posted it yourself.

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Random_Matt

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#48 Random_Matt  Online
Member since 2013 • 4445 Posts

Cannot wait until the reveal, can we name and shame the ones who have been claiming these monster boxes are super duper powerful?

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ronvalencia

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#49  Edited By ronvalencia
Member since 2008 • 28256 Posts

@techhog89 said:
@ronvalencia said:
@techhog89 said:

@ronvalencia: Uh... You might want to consider looking up how PSUs work. Also working on your reading comprehension...

Claim: On a 200w PSU for $400-500?... Its just not happening.

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/06/xbox-one-x-scorpio-games-explainer-video/

XBox One X has 245 watts PSU.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/11992/the-xbox-one-x-review/6

In addition, the Xbox One X is outfitted with a power supply that Microsoft equates to an 80 Plus Gold unit, which means it should be 90% efficient at 50% load with a 115 V source, and there shouldn’t be too much extra power wasted from the PSU converting AC voltage.

245 watts gold rated PSU... it happened for Xbox One X!

Also working on your reading comprehension...

Not what I meant. First of all, it's 90% at 50% load, as it says right there. That's why I said that your reading comprehension is bad. Second, you calculated efficiency incorrectly. If a PSU is 90% efficient, that doesn't mean that it tops out at using 90% of its rated capacity; it means that 90% of the energy it uses is what it needs to feed to the system, and the other 10% is lost. A 245W PSU will still top out at 245W output no matter what its efficiency is; however, at 100% load with a Gold rating efficiency is around 87%, which means that at max load it would output 245W, but would need to use ~282W when doing so. That's what I meant. You don't understand what efficiency ratings are, and you completely ignored the "at 50% load" part even though you posted it yourself.

2. 213.15 watts still exceeds 200 watts argument.

3. My argument's position on against "On a 200w PSU for $400-500?... Its just not happening" did not change.

No material changes to my argument position.

https://www.maketecheasier.com/80-plus-power-supply-ratings/

The power factor is another measure of efficiency that captures the ratio of the power going into the power supply versus the power coming out of the power supply.

Using Power Factor efficiency alternative would equate 90 percent at 100% load.

Again, no material changes to my argument position.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/80_Plus

Using 230 V EU internal non-redundant gold rated PSU at 100 percent load yields 218 watts.

Again, no material changes to my argument position.

Your 87 percent efficiency argument is based on gold rated 115V PSU.

Actual Xbox One X's PSU specs

Input ranges:

100 V x 2.75A = 275 watts

110 V x 2.75A = 302.5 watts

200 V x 1.3A = 260 watts

230 V x 1.3A = 299 watts

---------------------------

Output (feeding into the motherboard):

12V x 20.42A = 245 watts

Efficiency example: 245 watts / 275 watts = 0.8909 or 89.09 percent. MS can claim gold rated.

Again, no material changes to my argument position.

FACTS: Using actual Xbox One X PSU SPECS output: 245 watts.

My "90 percent" efficiency usage was done for quick argument resolve while the actual output wattage number is 245 watts. LOL.

You forced me dig out actual Xbox One X's PSU and wasted my time.

Try again.

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lhughey

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#50 lhughey
Member since 2006 • 4655 Posts

Storage space is one of the things they can change at the last minute depending on cost concerns. They need to keep that variable flexible especially when they have no idea how Trumps trade scuffle will China will play out.

Additionally, storage space is not a deciding factor in a console because it's easy and relatively cheap to add a usb external HD.