VR Founder: 30fps Isn't Good Artistic choice, It's Failure

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#1 Posted by Cloud_imperium (14291 posts) -

Gamespot writes :

While many console games still run at 30 frames per second, Oculus VR’s founder Palmer Luckey has said he doesn’t think of it as a choice, but a failure.

Speaking with LinusTechTips, Luckey explained that virtual reality requires much higher frame rates than what you need on a typical screen. He said that 60fps is enough, but that we’ll see huge improvements with up to 90Hz or 120Hz and even small improvements beyond that.

“VR is going to need much higher frame rates than consoles, although even for consoles or traditional PC games, I don’t think 30fps is smart,” Luckey said. “It’s not a good artistic decision, it’s a failure.”

Last month, developer Ready at Dawn said that its PlayStation 4 exclusive The Order: 1886 will run at 30fps by design, as it’s seeking to deliver a "filmic look." As director Dana Jan explained: “60fps is really responsive and really cool. I enjoy playing games in 60fps, but one thing that really changes is the aesthetic of the game in 60fps.” Jan said that at 60fps would cause the game to look like “something on the Discovery Channel, like an HDTV kind of segment or a sci-fi original movie maybe. Which doesn't quite have the kind of look and texture that we want from a movie.”

Luckey said that he starts to see diminishing returns between 90Hz and 120Hz, and that VR is probably going to end up somewhere in that range, at least for the foreseeable future.

As for VR experiences using mobile devices (which Oculus is reportedly working on) Luckey said he thinks we’ll see more simple gaming and communication experiences, like panoramic photo capture and virtual movie theaters.

Source

Avatar image for NFJSupreme
#2 Posted by NFJSupreme (6491 posts) -

cinematic games look better at 60fps Read at Dawn is talking BS.

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#3 Posted by R3FURBISHED (12360 posts) -

It's a much better artistic choice to strap a TV to your head.

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#4 Posted by happyduds77 (1688 posts) -

It's a stupid PR talk. Even Uncharted 4, a franchise that is well known for it's cinematic experience probably more than any game ever is targeting 1080p/60fps.

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#5 Posted by MonsieurX (36762 posts) -

And not having the game full 1080p is another "artistic" decision,lolz

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#6 Posted by Cloud_imperium (14291 posts) -

@MonsieurX said:

And not having the game full 1080p is another "artistic" decision,lolz

You are clueless . It makes the game more "cinematic" . Higher resolution makes the game way too sharp to a point where the game no longer feels like a movie . If only the game was black and white too... /s

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#7 Posted by AmazonAngry (968 posts) -

vr is failure. always has been, always will be.

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#8 Posted by MonsieurX (36762 posts) -

@amazonangry said:

vr is failure. always has been, always will be.

All hail Project Morpheus

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#9 Posted by NFJSupreme (6491 posts) -

someone should tell the Ready at Dawn guys that this looks more filmic than their game. TLOU60fps

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#10 Posted by The_Stand_In (869 posts) -

@amazonangry said:

vr is failure. always has been, always will be.

Unproven as of yet in this decade and irrelevant to the statement.

What he said is true. It's not artistic direction to graphically hinder your game. Especially if you are trying to look "lifelike" like The Order. It's a failure to meet the industry standard. Having everything blurry as hell and choppy to boot is not an artistic direction unless you are trying to go for the "drunken, nearsighted man with severe head trauma" look.

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#11 Posted by AmazonAngry (968 posts) -

@MonsieurX said:

@amazonangry said:

vr is failure. always has been, always will be.

All hail Project Morpheus

nope. will be failure

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#12 Posted by wolverine4262 (20831 posts) -

Sounds like the kinda dumb shit that Lulu_Lulu would say...

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#13 Edited by Mr-Powers (508 posts) -

He founded VR? Wow, he must have been an adviser on Lawnmower Man.

And, why are we still talking about Oculus? It's dead. Herms trying to revive a corpse LMFAO.

"As for VR experiences using mobile devices (which Oculus is reportedly working on) Luckey said he thinks we’ll see more simple gaming and communication experiences, like panoramic photo capture and virtual movie theaters."

AHAHAHAHHAHAH!

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#15 Edited by cfisher2833 (2150 posts) -

@NFJSupreme said:

cinematic games look better at 60fps Read at Dawn is talking BS.

I love how just about every cow was singing the 30fps is cinematic line, and then ND released the 60fps footage of Uncharted 4...yeah, that kind of shut them up.

Seems we got some salty cows in this very thread.

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#16 Posted by GhoX (6267 posts) -

Lower framerate by itself is objectively worse than higher framerate. Just like lower resolution by itself is objectively worse than higher resolution. These are purely technical matters, and artistic design has no ground whatsoever.

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#17 Edited by EducatingU_PCMR (1550 posts) -

Morpheus flop confirmed.

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#18 Posted by CrownKingArthur (5262 posts) -

i only ever tolerate 30 fps gaming when 'special' console exclusives force it upon me

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#19 Edited by Speak_Low (2248 posts) -

He probably should have just said that "30fps is a failure" for VR - and it would be right, because any frame rate hiccups and sluggishness has reportedly caused awful motion sickness from users since the enveloping images are an eyelash away from the eyes. What is a minor, dismissive hitch on an HDTV magnifies into something completely jarring and nauseating in the VR headset. John Carmack describes it as feeling like you "just got kicked in the temples". VR has to be at least 60fps and above for the experience to truly work.

But he shouldn't have gone after all PC and console games. Of course we'd all love 1080p 60fps on nearly every game, and so would devs, but there are real-world hardware limitations that they have to live with.

It's also why earlier versions of the Oculus Rift itself had unsatisfactory (but known) hardware limitations and loads of compromises. You release whatever hardware is possible at that time, knowing the next one will be better. Oculus Rift has the advantage of having many prototypes and experimental stages - even letting devs and eager adopters try them out and give valuable feedback. The VR scene is marching closer and closer to that lofty, dreamy theoretical goal, but they can also take their time with it and wait for better parts, or wait for video cards to catch up and drop in prices. Console makers like Sony and MS don't exactly have the same set of luxuries when designing their consoles ahead of time. There will be some built-in disappointments they know they have to live with.

Consoles are spec'd, budgeted and fixed at a precise range (to also make sure the company actually sees a profit) and that's all devs get to play with for the next five years. Unfortunately they are not getting 60fps on every game no matter how much they want it (or they achieve 60fps, but then we'd have the UGLY-UGLY version of Gears of War 3, Uncharted 3, TLOU and GTA V - and those games already have a few graphical shortcomings as it is at 30fps!)

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#20 Posted by ShepardCommandr (4825 posts) -

@amazonangry said:

vr is failure. always has been, always will be.

Avatar image for wis3boi
#21 Edited by wis3boi (32507 posts) -

@cfisher2833 said:

@NFJSupreme said:

cinematic games look better at 60fps Read at Dawn is talking BS.

I love how just about every cow was singing the 30fps is cinematic line, and then ND released the 60fps footage of Uncharted 4...yeah, that kind of shut them up.

Seems we got some salty cows in this very thread.

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#22 Posted by JangoWuzHere (19032 posts) -

I disagree, but whatever. If we're playing console games, then 60fps isn't required unless we're talking about fighting games.

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#23 Posted by Vecna (3425 posts) -

Ahh shit this hardware is holding our game back! Hurry make a press release saying it was an artistic decision to run the game at 900p with 30fps!

LMAO at the supposed next gen consoles.

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#24 Edited by 001011000101101 (4395 posts) -

lol what a fucking idiot. I can't wait to watch this shitty VR thing crash and burn.

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#25 Posted by mikhail (2697 posts) -

@001011000101101 said:

lol what a fucking idiot. I can't wait to watch this shitty VR thing crash and burn.

That idiot is worth about $40 million dollars and is more intelligent and articulate than you could be in your wildest dreams. Facebook thought the technology was worth acquiring...but I guess you know better.

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#26 Posted by DEadliNE-Zero0 (6607 posts) -

@wis3boi said:

@cfisher2833 said:

@NFJSupreme said:

cinematic games look better at 60fps Read at Dawn is talking BS.

I love how just about every cow was singing the 30fps is cinematic line, and then ND released the 60fps footage of Uncharted 4...yeah, that kind of shut them up.

Seems we got some salty cows in this very thread.

Glorious GIF

Avatar image for WilliamRLBaker
#27 Posted by WilliamRLBaker (28915 posts) -

lol coming from a person penning his hopes on a gimmick...lolololololol.

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#28 Posted by clyde46 (49048 posts) -

@WilliamRLBaker said:

lol coming from a person penning his hopes on a gimmick...lolololololol.

Gimmick? Lawl.

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#29 Posted by deactivated-57ad0e5285d73 (21398 posts) -

This is an odd topic as there's already some lag with most display devices. Cinematics I can understand, but gameplay needs consistency. Metal Gear Solid had different framerates for the game and the cinematics(except for maybe number 4? dont remember).

Avatar image for Shewgenja
#30 Posted by Shewgenja (18997 posts) -

This is epicly dumb. VR is shit at 30fps. Everyone should know that by now. Running a turn-based RPG at 60 fps is also fucking daft. People reading this shit with no context need to get a life.

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#31 Posted by cfisher2833 (2150 posts) -

@WilliamRLBaker said:

lol coming from a person penning his hopes on a gimmick...lolololololol.

His hopes? I think Luckey is pretty set for life...ya know, considering Facebook bought his kickstarted company for 2 billion dollars.

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#32 Posted by 001011000101101 (4395 posts) -

@mikhail said:

@001011000101101 said:

lol what a fucking idiot. I can't wait to watch this shitty VR thing crash and burn.

That idiot is worth about $40 million dollars and is more intelligent and articulate than you could be in your wildest dreams. Facebook thought the technology was worth acquiring...but I guess you know better.

Not saying I know better. I could never build tech like this. With that said, it will fail and I can't wait to witness it. It sounds good on paper but no one will want to wear this crap just for playing a game here and there. Maybe the rare basement dweller will, but that's about it.

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#33 Posted by DaBrainz (7907 posts) -

VR...lawl

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#34 Edited by Jankarcop (11056 posts) -

60 fps is important...lol consoles