The Order vs FF The Spirit Within graphics

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gpuking

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#1 gpuking
Member since 2004 • 3914 Posts

The once seemingly impossible for real time graphics Final Fantasy The Spirit Within CGI is pretty much now within spitting distance to be achieved in a video game, yes, with the advance of modern real time graphics technology and GPUs, we can finally be able to cross the boundary and step into a brave new world of offline prerendered CGI, at least the earlier ones. The Playstation 4 exclusive The Order 1886 is one such example. Of course in terms of raw numbers, FF TSW could still be well ahead but what could be perceived through your eyes tells a whole different story. When you carefully blend the right mixture of both tech and art..and a suitable amount of mustache, the end result is of the most revealing!

I think The Order has exceed TSW in some areas such as skin shader, SSS, eye shader and perhaps lighting. At this stage it might be unfair to compare a video game's graphics to The Order, we might have to start to use early CGI movies for comparison.

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MonsieurX

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#2 MonsieurX
Member since 2008 • 39858 Posts

Took you a while to create a thread about The Order's graphics since it flopped harde.

Still,inb4lock

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clyde46

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#3  Edited By clyde46
Member since 2005 • 49061 Posts

Considering FF:SW was made in 2001 for fucks sake, 14 years later improvements better of been made...

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dxmcat

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#5 dxmcat
Member since 2007 • 3385 Posts

Ironic you're comparing The Order to a movie.

Oh the Irony.

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AM-Gamer

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#6 AM-Gamer
Member since 2012 • 8116 Posts

@clyde46: Yea but it was done on multiple super computers. It's cool to see in game visuals catch up. Eventhough it took 14 years. I remember seeing that movie and asking how long it would take.

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AM-Gamer

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#7 AM-Gamer
Member since 2012 • 8116 Posts

I'm actually enjoying the game, much better then the reviews stated. It certainly has issues but I hope it sells well. I would like to see what could be done with a sequel.

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DEadliNE-Zero0

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#9  Edited By DEadliNE-Zero0
Member since 2014 • 6607 Posts

1- Using CG from 2001

2- The game uses extreme levels of blur, specially during combat scenarios. Don't remember CGI videos being so blurry.

3- Took you long enough to make a gfx thread about the game.

I'm honestly very surprsied you didn't try to compare to PC games.

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supergokublitz

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#10 supergokublitz
Member since 2005 • 639 Posts

lovely amazing looking game shame about the gameplay, What gameplay you ask? Exactly!

Bring on Bloodborne gonna be a thousand time better than this tosh.

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zeeshanhaider

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#11 zeeshanhaider
Member since 2004 • 5524 Posts

@scottpsfan14 said:

Bu but I thought Crysis 3 was graphics king?? Lmao.

However, there are indeed some more advanced shaders in use with The Order. FF SW is using 2001 tech. But it also has the advantage of higher density polygon meshes used through out as it has ample rendering time. So I'd say it's the modern shaders that make The Order look better than geometric detail.

Technically it still trounces the order 10 times over.

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AM-Gamer

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#12  Edited By AM-Gamer
Member since 2012 • 8116 Posts

@scottpsfan14: lmao

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gpuking

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#14 gpuking
Member since 2004 • 3914 Posts

@deadline-zero0 said:

1- Using CG from 2001

2- The game uses extreme levels of blur, specially during combat scenarios. Don't remember CGI videos being so blurry.

3- Took you long enough to make a gfx thread about the game.

I'm honestly very surprsied you didn't try to compare to PC games.

Because PC games aren't even in the same ballpark at this stage, they're gonna need Ryse 2 or Crysis 4 to compete.

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clyde46

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#16 clyde46
Member since 2005 • 49061 Posts

@scottpsfan14 said:
@AM-Gamer said:

@clyde46: Yea but it was done on multiple super computers. It's cool to see in game visuals catch up. Eventhough it took 14 years. I remember seeing that movie and asking how long it would take.

No it isn't. Clyde hates it and he hates life too. Everything looks shit! And it just so happens that the game is shit L.M.A.O.

If you are trying to be funny, its not working.

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AM-Gamer

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#18  Edited By AM-Gamer
Member since 2012 • 8116 Posts

@scottpsfan14: You played it at all? It's not GotY but it's certainly not shit. I think expectations have as a lot to do with it.

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lostrib

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#19  Edited By lostrib
Member since 2009 • 49999 Posts

Not the graphics thread I was expecting

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gpuking

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#21 gpuking
Member since 2004 • 3914 Posts

The game in general just looks bonkers, like unfairly, unfathomably impressive. I really hope ND could dial things up more by year end with UC4 coz boy does it have competition.

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uninspiredcup

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#22  Edited By uninspiredcup  Online
Member since 2013 • 47734 Posts

After that five, I was under the impression the Sony people would have stopped boasting, apparently not.

Humility appears as absent as ever.

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lostrib

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#23 lostrib
Member since 2009 • 49999 Posts

@gpuking: I'd rather they worry about other aspects of UC4 before worrying about a graphics dick measuring contest

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#24  Edited By AM-Gamer
Member since 2012 • 8116 Posts

@scottpsfan14: Its not as automated as much as you think but more then it needs to be. For example a triangle prompt pops over someone when you want to melle them but no timing is involved. They should have just left the button prompt off. The shooting and cover mechanics are as good as any and the visuals and animation are outstanding. It does need more pure gameplay though. I really hope they do a sequel and listen to some of the critics because it could be a outstanding game.

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GarGx1

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#25 GarGx1
Member since 2011 • 10934 Posts

The Order does good faces and nothing else. It's over use of blur and fog to hide detail is ridiculous and still people go on about how awesome it looks.

Just stop, the game flopped hard and even it's 'awsome' blurred mess visuals couldn't save it.

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DEadliNE-Zero0

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#26  Edited By DEadliNE-Zero0
Member since 2014 • 6607 Posts

@scottpsfan14 said:

Because The Order has real time visuals that is probably more detailed than any other game per asset. Ryse cutscenes do compare but they are pre rendered on a bank of machines.

Not sure why you're bringing up Ryse, but Ryse on PC, like Crysis 3, isn't blurred to ****.

While i won't deny that all the cloth, hair and some other tech elements are amazing, it's obvious the game makes use of 2 major tricks to mask it's details.

1-Blur. This gives the game a very soft look, almost like a CGI vid or a "traditional movie". But it also hides and dissolves the detail, even in close proximity. This becomes most apaprent during firefights when anything just a few meters away looks "fogggy". If you remember some of my first comments on SW after i came back, was about just that, in an order thread. Open up a tab with a 1080p scan of any game (like Ryse i guess) and then one for TO1886. If you tell me TO looks far more blurry, you're lying

The very pics in the Op show bokeh effetcs. Anything not in clear focus becomes blurred out.

If you want to see what i mean, look at pics of Ryse looks closer to photorealistic than The Order 1886. This is due to texture modeling, lighting conditions, and so forth. Making it "look like CGI" isn't a proof of pure graphical power, since the CG in Avatar is still better than any game, but mainly different, from the style used in Pixar movies or Blizzard trailers.

2- Scope. You know how we tend to say that those UE4 or Cryengine tech videos don't count because nothing is happening on screen? Yeah, that's almost The Order 1886. It's level design is easily the most enclosed i've seen in awhile, for a third person action game.

Levels are extremely boxed in, environmental interaction is kept to a minimum, vistas are rare, and npc count is very low. So low infact, that the larger gathering i've seen so far is about 12-15 people in a public square. The detail is superb, i'll never deny it, but even DF touched on the small scope of the game being an advanatge in reaching the fidelity.

@gpuking said:

Because PC games aren't even in the same ballpark at this stage, they're gonna need Ryse 2 or Crysis 4 to compete.

I know. Star Citizen is already beyond the likes of the order and ryse.

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#27 SUD123456
Member since 2007 • 6271 Posts

Movie game sucks.

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#29 DEadliNE-Zero0
Member since 2014 • 6607 Posts

@lostrib said:

Not the graphics thread I was expecting

I know, Tormentos isn't here yet

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#30 uninspiredcup  Online
Member since 2013 • 47734 Posts

@SUD123456 said:

Movie game sucks.

Would rather play Quake 2 or Dark Forces II over these any day.

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#31  Edited By Snugenz
Member since 2006 • 13388 Posts

Fair enough, but FF: Spirits Within is probably the better movie.

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#32 clyde46
Member since 2005 • 49061 Posts

@Snugenz said:

Fair enough, but FF: Spirits Within is probably the better movie.

Burn.

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gpuking

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#33 gpuking
Member since 2004 • 3914 Posts

Some more CGI like graphics which in my opinion approaches even some of the newer game CGIs.

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#34 AM-Gamer
Member since 2012 • 8116 Posts

@deadline-zero0: Star citizen details are not even close. It's far larger and more impressive but it doesn't look as detailed.

As for the blur it's not near as bad as you make it out to be.. It has a nice DoF effect as you draw your weapon and uses blur as you break into a full Sprint but outside of that it looks pretty clean. It's not like it just uses blur all the time.

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clyde46

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#36 clyde46
Member since 2005 • 49061 Posts

They could of made a good animated movie with this instead of a shitty game.

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#38 DEadliNE-Zero0
Member since 2014 • 6607 Posts

@Snugenz said:

Fair enough, but FF: Spirits Within is probably the better movie.

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#39 gpuking
Member since 2004 • 3914 Posts

@scottpsfan14 said:
@gpuking said:

The game in general just looks bonkers, like unfairly, unfathomably impressive. I really hope ND could dial things up more by year end with UC4 coz boy does it have competition.

I actually like how Uncharted 4 looks better than The Order. There is a layer of artistry to it that The Order lacks.

Not to mention that this is being done on a larger scale and not in closed corridors with scripted areas every few yards.

UC4 looked real good currently but it just lacks that post processing The Order seems to utilize so well, the character models do indeed look more impressive in UC4 but it's early days so hopefully we get to see more improvements at E3.

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#40  Edited By foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts

5/10

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#41 EducatingU_PCMR
Member since 2013 • 1581 Posts

TSW has better gameplay, and is not as linear.

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#43  Edited By DEadliNE-Zero0
Member since 2014 • 6607 Posts

@AM-Gamer said:

@deadline-zero0: Star citizen details are not even close. It's far larger and more impressive but it doesn't look as detailed.

As for the blur it's not near as bad as you make it out to be.. It has a nice DoF effect as you draw your weapon and uses blur as you break into a full Sprint but outside of that it looks pretty clean. It's not like it just uses blur all the time.

Not even close to detail?

Also, this comparison to CGI is stupid. CGI stands for computer generated image. It's not exactly that different from graphical techniques used in games. However, just like games, CG can be implemented in various ways.

this shot from Frozen is less detailed tha TO in some small effects. However, what about Avatar?

Still think The Order looks like CG? Right.

Now moving on to Ryse, since it seems to get brought up for some reason, it goes for a more realistic design approach. In terms of tech, i still find TO more impressive, but not by that much. Regarding the blur, you serious? Open up those 3 pics in a new tab.

Now compared to these 3 Ryse 1080p pics, and tell me TO looks even has sharp and clean.

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#44 Gue1
Member since 2004 • 12171 Posts

Spirit Within looks cleaner but shittier overall. The movie that almost killed Square if it wasn't for Sony helping them out. lol

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sts106mat

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#45 sts106mat
Member since 2005 • 25731 Posts

The order 1886 is graphics king and attention to detail king, eyeball king, cloth sack king, apple king, insides of an airship king, etc etc.

Everything else this year will likely pale in comparison...its that good looking.

Youtube videos cant even give you half the experience

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AM-Gamer

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#46  Edited By AM-Gamer
Member since 2012 • 8116 Posts

@deadline-zero0: Avatar us the peak of CGI. That doesn't mean the order doesn't rival CGI matter of fact it holds its own with most. And although techniques are the same as games Cgi can be generated by multiple machines at 1fps as it does not have to run in real time.

PS. Yes during stale shots the order looks as sharp and as clean. Ryse uses the exact same techniques. Motion blur during movement and linear environments. He'll even Cgi uses lots of motion blur and DoF.

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silversix_

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#47 silversix_
Member since 2010 • 26347 Posts

The thread we all been waiting impatiently.

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sts106mat

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#48 sts106mat
Member since 2005 • 25731 Posts

And people can stop going in about blur, its made to look like a film, the lens focussing is the same as in films/real life.

When a game portrays everything as crystal clear, it doesn't look right, cause that's not how we see the world. uts impossible for our eyes to be focussed on the foreground and at distance at the same time.

All movies & tv shows prove this too

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remiks00

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#49  Edited By remiks00
Member since 2006 • 4249 Posts

Lol, why is it always the usual trio of "armchair devs" white-knighting Playstation exclusives in gpuking/m3dude1/giovela2010/m3boarder32's awful troll threads?

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remiks00

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#50 remiks00
Member since 2006 • 4249 Posts

@foxhound_fox said:

5/10

Hilarious. Never change bro.