This guy with quak **** are the biggest losers in the community. Lock thread
Sorry if i hurt your feelings.
Is 2018 the xbox one X is here is powerful and all but i notice something since the xbox one X was first announced as Project Scorpio.
DX12 hyping was basically stop by MS,so was cloud hyping as well.
Fast forward again to 2018,and you don't hear anything about DX12 any more,and the cloud is probably what is holding back CD3.
I think the XBO X proved without shadow of a doubt that DX12 was basically a hoax and that would never increase power like it was hyped,and the cloud was even more of a hoax,in the end of the day CPU usage on consoles has always been streamline and while on PC DX12 or Mantle and other may have bring some performance games on consoles it just didn't.
1. "You don't hear anything about DX12 any more" is not a proper argument.
2. Ryzen CPU killed AMD's DX12 narrative.
3. Lower latency 8T/8C Jaguar at 2.3 Ghz doesn't solve lacking FLOPS power when compared to Ryzen 8T/4C or 12T/6C or 16T/8C
15 watt mobile Ryzen 8T/4C with 3.03 Ghz clock speed with Cinebench R15.
Ashes of Singularity has many unit objects with plenty of draw calls. Games like Total War (PC) uses extensive batch draw calls DX11 workaround.
XBO's DX12 command processing unit with micro-coding support only reduces DX12 API processing which on the PC is handled by the CPU which translates DX12 API calls into DX ASM and then to GPU ISA.
GCN Intrinsic Functions bypass "DX12 API calls into DX ASM and then to GPU ISA" stage which is used in games like Doom (AMD PC GCN, XBO and PS4). NVIDIA GPUs has their own Intrinsic Functions with Gameworks/ NVAPI access. PS4 has GCN Intrinsic Functions access methods.
Games like Alien Isolation shows PS4 (1080p with ~30 fp results) being bottle-necked by PS4's lower latency DX11 like API and Jaguar CPU relative to PC's stronger CPU and similar Radeon HD 7850 GPU (1080p with ~60 fp results) with bloated DX11 API.
Doom PS4 with GCN Intrinsic Functions rivals PC's R7-265/7850 results.
Ashes of singularity wasn't on PS4 or xbox one,so Brad wardell claims about it were unfounded,DX12 would never double the power of the xbox one it was a lie.
Alien Isolation was a shitty cash grab on 5 platforms,it didn't have CPU problems barely had anything happening on screen and was 1080p on both platforms.
Fact is your arguments were wrong,and never was a case presented were a game double from 30FPS on xbox one to 60FPS for using DX12,which again basically was on xbox one all alone but with some things missing.
1. "You don't hear anything about DX12 any more" is not a proper argument.
2. Ryzen CPU killed AMD's DX12 narrative.
3. Lower latency 8T/8C Jaguar at 2.3 Ghz doesn't solve lacking FLOPS power when compared to Ryzen 8T/4C or 12T/6C or 16T/8C
15 watt mobile Ryzen 8T/4C with 3.03 Ghz clock speed with Cinebench R15.
1-Yes it is and you don't see MS saying how DX12 will push the xbox one X,they don't need that crap anymore the xbox one X is powerful on its own without flashy API's or secret sauce.
2-Rysen is not on any xbox one,and that's like saying intel killed DX12 narrative.
3-Which is not the argument here stop arguing bullshit no one is,the point here is simple DX12 was a hoax it worked on PC because PC was full of abstraction,unlike consoles were CPU worked much better.
DX12 Is nothing more than MS own xbox one low level tool bring to PC and is confirmed by the fact that Mantle was from day 1 on PS4,but somehow it took MS more time to deliver the same shit.
There were reports of what DX12 basically was,and i even quote MS stating that they would bring the xbox one API to PC before DX12 was even named.
So yeah nor the magical cloud or DX12 lived to the hype.
Ashes of Singularity has many unit objects with plenty of draw calls. Games like Total War (PC) uses extensive batch draw calls DX11 workaround.
XBO's DX12 command processing unit with micro-coding support only reduces DX12 API processing which on the PC is handled by the CPU which translates DX12 API calls into DX ASM and then to GPU ISA.
GCN Intrinsic Functions bypass "DX12 API calls into DX ASM and then to GPU ISA" stage which is used in games like Doom (AMD PC GCN, XBO and PS4). NVIDIA GPUs has their own Intrinsic Functions with Gameworks/ NVAPI access. PS4 has GCN Intrinsic Functions access methods.
Games like Alien Isolation shows PS4 (1080p with ~30 fp results) being bottle-necked by PS4's lower latency DX11 like API and Jaguar CPU relative to PC's stronger CPU and similar Radeon HD 7850 GPU (1080p with ~60 fp results) with bloated DX11 API.
Doom PS4 with GCN Intrinsic Functions rivals PC's R7-265/7850 results.
Ashes of singularity wasn't on PS4 or xbox one,so Brad wardell claims about it were unfounded,DX12 would never double the power of the xbox one it was a lie.
Alien Isolation was a shitty cash grab on 5 platforms,it didn't have CPU problems barely had anything happening on screen and was 1080p on both platforms.
Fact is your arguments were wrong,and never was a case presented were a game double from 30FPS on xbox one to 60FPS for using DX12,which again basically was on xbox one all alone but with some things missing.
1. "You don't hear anything about DX12 any more" is not a proper argument.
2. Ryzen CPU killed AMD's DX12 narrative.
3. Lower latency 8T/8C Jaguar at 2.3 Ghz doesn't solve lacking FLOPS power when compared to Ryzen 8T/4C or 12T/6C or 16T/8C
15 watt mobile Ryzen 8T/4C with 3.03 Ghz clock speed with Cinebench R15.
1-Yes it is and you don't see MS saying how DX12 will push the xbox one X,they don't need that crap anymore the xbox one X is powerful on its own without flashy API's or secret sauce.
2-Rysen is not on any xbox one,and that's like saying intel killed DX12 narrative.
3-Which is not the argument here stop arguing bullshit no one is,the point here is simple DX12 was a hoax it worked on PC because PC was full of abstraction,unlike consoles were CPU worked much better.
DX12 Is nothing more than MS own xbox one low level tool bring to PC and is confirmed by the fact that Mantle was from day 1 on PS4,but somehow it took MS more time to deliver the same shit.
There were reports of what DX12 basically was,and i even quote MS stating that they would bring the xbox one API to PC before DX12 was even named.
So yeah nor the magical cloud or DX12 lived to the hype.
Alien Isolation was great. It was hardly a cash grab, that just a lazy argument people use on the internet.
@kingtito:
Ashes of Singularity has many unit objects with plenty of draw calls. Games like Total War (PC) uses extensive batch draw calls DX11 workaround.
XBO's DX12 command processing unit with micro-coding support only reduces DX12 API processing which on the PC is handled by the CPU which translates DX12 API calls into DX ASM and then to GPU ISA.
GCN Intrinsic Functions bypass "DX12 API calls into DX ASM and then to GPU ISA" stage which is used in games like Doom (AMD PC GCN, XBO and PS4). NVIDIA GPUs has their own Intrinsic Functions with Gameworks/ NVAPI access. PS4 has GCN Intrinsic Functions access methods.
Games like Alien Isolation shows PS4 (1080p with ~30 fp results) being bottle-necked by PS4's lower latency DX11 like API and Jaguar CPU relative to PC's stronger CPU and similar Radeon HD 7850 GPU (1080p with ~60 fp results) with bloated DX11 API.
Doom PS4 with GCN Intrinsic Functions rivals PC's R7-265/7850 results.
Ashes of singularity wasn't on PS4 or xbox one,so Brad wardell claims about it were unfounded,DX12 would never double the power of the xbox one it was a lie.
Alien Isolation was a shitty cash grab on 5 platforms,it didn't have CPU problems barely had anything happening on screen and was 1080p on both platforms.
Fact is your arguments were wrong,and never was a case presented were a game double from 30FPS on xbox one to 60FPS for using DX12,which again basically was on xbox one all alone but with some things missing.
1. "You don't hear anything about DX12 any more" is not a proper argument.
2. Ryzen CPU killed AMD's DX12 narrative.
3. Lower latency 8T/8C Jaguar at 2.3 Ghz doesn't solve lacking FLOPS power when compared to Ryzen 8T/4C or 12T/6C or 16T/8C
15 watt mobile Ryzen 8T/4C with 3.03 Ghz clock speed with Cinebench R15.
1-Yes it is and you don't see MS saying how DX12 will push the xbox one X,they don't need that crap anymore the xbox one X is powerful on its own without flashy API's or secret sauce.
2-Rysen is not on any xbox one,and that's like saying intel killed DX12 narrative.
3-Which is not the argument here stop arguing bullshit no one is,the point here is simple DX12 was a hoax it worked on PC because PC was full of abstraction,unlike consoles were CPU worked much better.
DX12 Is nothing more than MS own xbox one low level tool bring to PC and is confirmed by the fact that Mantle was from day 1 on PS4,but somehow it took MS more time to deliver the same shit.
There were reports of what DX12 basically was,and i even quote MS stating that they would bring the xbox one API to PC before DX12 was even named.
So yeah nor the magical cloud or DX12 lived to the hype.
1. MS bundled DX12 narrative with Digital Foundry's Xbox One X narrative e.g. DirectX12 API processing via micro-coding command processor.
2. DX12/Vulkan was heavily pushed by AMD's marketing for their weak CPUs.
3. You have forgotten there's a gap between DirectX11 API calls to GCN's ASM regardless of PC's legacy API overheads, hence why GCN Intrinsic Function access exist in Vulkan API, DirectX11 and DirectX12.
Even with Vulkan API usage, IDsoftware's Doom 2016 used GCN Intrinsic Functions to further reduce latency between the CPU to GPU. GCN Intrinsic Functions are also used in XBO and PS4 for their respective Doom builds.
Xbox One's DirectX11.X API calls are NOT GCN instruction set! DX11 API/Shader Model 5 has existed before GCN. DirectX12 API is needed for XBO's DX12 command processor with microcoding usage.
Microcoding is a specific technical term for instruction translation or instruction decoding.
Microcoding term is use for X86's CISC translation to RISCy instructions hardware as an example.
PS4's lower latency DX11 like API is pretty slow. Read https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-how-the-crew-was-ported-to-playstation-4
Initially, The Crew game was ported to PS4's DX11 like API (aka GNMX API) and it was slow i.e. 10 fps results from PC's 30 fps results.
"Most people start with the GNMX API which wraps around GNM and manages the more esoteric GPU details in a way that's a lot more familiar if you're used to platforms like D3D11. We started with the high-level one but eventually we moved to the low-level API because it suits our uses a little better," says O'Connor, explaining that while GNMX is a lot simpler to work with, it removes much of the custom access to the PS4 GPU, and also incurs a significant CPU hit.
At the Ubisoft E3 event, the PC version of The Crew was running at 30 frames per second, but the first working compilation of the PS4 codebase wasn't quite so hot, operating at around 10fps.
Face the facts, you're still wrong i.e. PS4's DX11 like API still incurs significant CPU hit.
@tormentos said:
Alien Isolation was a shitty cash grab on 5 platforms,it didn't have CPU problems barely had anything happening on screen and was 1080p on both platforms.
That's not a proper argument. Your argument doesn't remove the fact there's multiple draw calls per frame render events i.e. standing still while viewing a graphics view point still incurs draw calls. Your head hasn't overcome two workloads for physics simulation and API processing.
Intel Core i series CPU at 3.2 Ghz is already 2X faster than Jaguar at 1.6 Ghz. PC mobile CPUs has boost clock speed modes which is disabled for PS4 and XBO.
Intel Core i series CPU at 1.6 Ghz is already 2X IPC when compared to Jaguar at 1.6 Ghz.
AMD's Mantle API doesn't have GCN Intrinsic Function access and this was confirmed by BradW when talking with Doom 2016's programmer i.e. "little details" being revealed.
AMD's Mantle API almost mirrors Vulkan API.
AMD's GCN can't run DirectX11/12 API calls without a fuking translator. There's a gap between GCN shader intrinsics to Shader Model 5.x shader instructions.
On Xbox One, DirectX12 refers to the custom microcoding command processor usage while on PC's DirectX12 refers to lower latency API.
PC's DirectX12 hasn't removed the need for GCN shader intrinsics nor NVAPI shader intrinsics.
1. MS bundled DX12 narrative with Digital Foundry's Xbox One X narrative e.g. DirectX12 API processing via micro-coding command processor.
2. DX12/Vulkan was heavily pushed by AMD's marketing for their weak CPUs.
3. You have forgotten there's a gap between DirectX11 API calls to GCN's ASM regardless of PC's legacy API overheads, hence why GCN Intrinsic Function access exist in Vulkan API, DirectX11 and DirectX12.
Even with Vulkan API usage, IDsoftware's Doom 2016 used GCN Intrinsic Functions to further reduce latency between the CPU to GPU. GCN Intrinsic Functions are also used in XBO and PS4 for their respective Doom builds.
Xbox One's DirectX11.X API calls are NOT GCN instruction set! DX11 API/Shader Model 5 has existed before GCN. DirectX12 API is needed for XBO's DX12 command processor with microcoding usage.
Microcoding is a specific technical term for instruction translation or instruction decoding.
Microcoding term is use for X86's CISC translation to RISCy instructions hardware as an example.
PS4's lower latency DX11 like API is pretty slow. Read https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-how-the-crew-was-ported-to-playstation-4
Initially, The Crew game was ported to PS4's DX11 like API (aka GNMX API) and it was slow i.e. 10 fps results from PC's 30 fps results.
1-NO and they don't care about DX12 or making a parade about it anymore because they have the strongest console now no need for secret sauce.
2-Again this mean little since Ryzen wasn't the topic.
3-Stop your bullshit theories you were proven WRONG as simple as that,you quoted developers religiously trying to spin whatever crap they claim for the xbox one,we know what happen after your Rebellion quotes you banish from the forum for months because you claimed parity was achieve with sniper elite 3,and reality is that the PS4 version was as much as 30FPS faster than the xbox one version there was no freaking parity other than resolution.
Alien isolation is a shitty develop game,and you who love to love the words ""you didn't factor this or that"" it was you who didn't want to FACTOR in that developer screw up,and that games do come broken performance wise and that it is a FACT that many are fixed after launch.
You claimed the PS4 version of The witcher 3 had CPU problems because the xbox one was a few frames faster at 900p while the PS4 version was 1080p,when the game was fix at the end the PS4 ended beating the xbox one version frame wise as well killing yours and many lemmings arguments.
Fact is Alien Isolation ran at 89FPS on a shitty low budget g1820 celeron CPU It was impossible that the Jaguar inside the PS4 or even xbox one would have problems with that game,so rule out that the game was DEMANDING CPU wise in any way,the other option is simple a screw up game.
CPUs with four or more cores need not apply -- Alien: Isolation is seeking an affordable dual-core Core i3 processor but will also accept lowly Celeron, FX or Phenom II chips. Of course, that could change when running either SLI or Crossfire, but throwing that kind of GPU power at Alien: Isolation is a waste.
https://www.techspot.com/review/903-alien-isolation-benchmarks/page5.html
Techspot analysis of CPU usage on Alien Isolation,more things on screen have many other games that not only look better than AL but also run better,AI was a screw up game and you don't admit it because you are a hard headed moron who can't lose an argument with dignity. Hahahahaa
@tormentos: Sorry to tell you Tomato but your the one that's wrong. The picture of the new CPU and GPU was posted all over the internet, you must have been still under your rock!
No you are wrong.
There were several CPU and GPU changes the 90NM ones were the most problematic,but 65NM one were also problematic.
There were 4 Xenos 90NM (2005 - 2006)
Zephyr 90NM (2006 - 2007)
Opus 65MN (2007)
Falcon 65NM (2007 - 2008)
Jasper 65NM (all fat models after October 14 2008)
You claimed RROD was fixed with 2007 consoles,MS had 3 different chips made in their 2007 consoles and non was the final design which stick with the console until the slim arrived,Zephyr,Opus and Falcon were all release in 2007 non were as reliable as Jasper which was much better but again also could RROD.
You know so little about RROD that you think it was just a problem of the CPU and GPU,but that is not true at all,RROD was a bunch of codes identifying different problems,the biggest culprit was heat and the shitty xbox 360 design from CPU and GPU to ventilation inside the console.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xbox_360_technical_problems
From 4 main problems there only 1 is CPU and GPU related RROD was not just a CPU and GPU problem hell E74 wasn't initially cover by the 3 year extended warranty.
Microsoft extends Xbox 360 "Red Ring of Death" warranty to cover E74 error
Microsoft has extended the three year "Red Ring of Death" warranty cover it offered to Xbox 360 owners to cover a new fault - the E74 fault.
https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-extends-xbox-360-red-ring-of-death-warranty-to-cover-e74-error/
E74 wasn't even cover by MS until freaking 2009,2 years almost after the 2007 warranty extension,which mean any console with E74 error which was a general hardware failure wasn't even cover by the extended warranty for almost 4 freaking years..
So please stop your denial and damage control RROD were multiple problems with the xbox hardware not just one that just a CPU GPU change would stop.
It made it a huge success el tormented. From 24M- 85M+ and it put MS on the map. Meanwhile Sony went from 150M to 85M+ and LOST it's market share. Yeah I'd call that a failure but more importantly I bet so did Sony. They changed their approach for the PS4 after all. Yep absolute failure
Look that absolute failure to comprehend. I said 85M-90M since I'm not really sure but I know it's was at the very least 85M. My point still stands and your reading comprehension is still just as bad as ever.
Where is your proof of those rebuys el tormented? Not everyone is as dumb as you and your fellow cows. Most people used the warranty, oh wait, they didn't have a warranty. Everyone ran out and bought another 360 and when that failed they ran out and bought another one. That went on for 4-5 years right el tormented? Hhahaha deluded fanboy confirmed
So now the price difference was $300? $599 vs $399 == $300? Or $499 vs $399 == $300? Is your math just as bad as your reading comprehension? It would appear so
From 24 million to 85 million with a 50% fail rate that sparked millions of rebuy units.
Then the wii jumped from 23 million to 102 millions without any RROD problems and somehow you see just MS somehow taking costumer with sony,did you take into consideration that the market expanded last gen.?
PS2+ xbox + GC + DC = 212 million units combined.
Xbox 360 + wii + PS3 =273 million units combined the market expanded by more than 60 million units,while sony loss like 60 million consumer there were also many more into the gen,and that also has to factor in RROD re buys.
Look at it this way if the PS3 was a failure so was the 360 which has millions of rebuy units.
If you see the PS3 numbers when the hack happen the PS3 had like 50+ million units but somehow 77 million PSN accounts were stolen odd isn't it? That is because the PSP also added several accounts that you could open with your PC.
On xbox 360 it was all the contrary.
I'll give you an example.
Microsoft Has Sold 55 Million Xbox 360s Worldwide
https://techcrunch.com/2011/06/03/microsoft-has-sold-55-million-xbox-360s-in-the-us/
The xbox one arriving at 55 million units yet xbox live accounts were only 35 millions.
You may claim that not everyone had a gold account on xbox 360,but fact is those were not live gold accounts those were live and silver,silver were free accounts and were accounted by MS in total xbox live figures,somehow from those 55 million units sold 20 million were not took even once online somehow,which is a total joke considering the xbox 360 was a more popular console for online than the PS3 and was associated with online more than the PS3.
If you look on every figure where MS announce xbox 360 numbers the hardware numbers were always much higher than xbox live numbers.
So maybe from those 55 millions sold,the number of rebuy units could be 20 or maybe 15 millions,it is impossible if you asked me that someone would buy an xbox 360 and never once took it online.
That bold part is the most stupid and moronic attempt that at damage controlling RROD.
First you are a total MORON or want to play one,RROD warranty was 3 years repeat after me 3 freaking years by the time it was implemented everyone who bought a machine on 2005 had only 1 year and 4 or 5 months left on their warranty do you know how to freaking ad? MS was selling fat xbox 360 models until late 2010 or more when the stock units were finally sold and only slim models were sold.
Anyone who bought a 360 by December 2007 was already out of warranty by December 2010 same year the slim hit the market,you are trying to act as if the damn warranty was eternal,the warranty was 3 years and while many millions went and repair their console many more than 3 times,many did ended buying a new one because their were out of warranty.
The xbox 360 lasted until 2016 when it was discontinued,from mid 2010 and on slim models were sold,before that all models were RROD pron,in fact by the time MS introduced the slim model they already had sold like 42 million fat models,and they continue to sell a few million more until stocks were clear.
So don't freaking act like the xbox 360 was only sold after the Slim model and don't try to act was millions of xbox 360 owners didn't end without warranty after 3 years,by 2010 the worst models ever made were all out of warranty,hell the very worst models Xenos and Zephyr by 2008 and 2009 were all out of warranty,the xbox 360 went on to live 8 years more after 2008 you know.
Play stupid you moron,because there wasn't a core 360 at $299 who people could grab over a $600 PS3 and that doesn't make the difference some how $300 by your shitty math.
@kingtito: You called that trigger? Sounds like you are very desperate for attention it seems. If you really are that bored, just go play some games, problem solve.
Yeah I'd say you're triggered. Nah kid it's far from attention seeking. You cows are so easy to triggered and easily butthurt that I can't help it. Cows have and always will be entertainment. So stay triggered cow.
Play games at work? Sorry cow but that's not possible. I will continue to respond to cows especially those so easily triggered by anything I say and obviously that includes you.
Oh please it is you the one that comes running into any thread that say even the smallest thing bad about MS,then you don't refute any claims,or even try to make a point,you just slam into cows at 150 miles per hour with a terrible damage control,calling people kids..lol
I don't think the word trigger would fit anyone better than you in this moment here,basically you have been the dynamitecop or blackace of this place this past few years..hahahaa
Now do the Cell/Emotion Engine.
OK.
Here we have Cell a 2005 CPU beating the PS4 2013 one in compute with just 5 SPE,and taking a huge piss all over the Xenon CPU on 360,oh and if the test would have use 1 more SPE it would have beat the xbox one result as well,damn that Cell was great.
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