@WitIsWisdom: Napster and Limewire are totally different than downloading old roms. The difference is new music that just came out were being downloaded before the Artist even made any profit. By the time emulators got really popular for consoles like the NES, SNES and Genesis the companies had already made their profit and discontinued those products. I'm not making excuses. I just think people need to stop being such squares. These companies are worth billions, so I highly doubt some illegally obtained roms from decades old systems is really cutting into their profits. People need to calm down with the legality of things.
SNES Classic reported to release this year.
@emgesp:
No, you should definitely get on Ebay and buy these marked up games from others, even if the game may be in shit condition, and even though the results will still be exactly the same for the companies that created them. Zilch.
jk
Yeah, this is getting into stupid territory. People trying to treat ancient roms as if it's equal to pirating a new and widely available release.
Super Street Fighter 2 Turbo for example. I forked tons of money into the arcade machines back in the day. I've bought SF2 versions on Genesis, SNES, and PS3. At this point I'm not going to feel any guilt about grabbing the arcade rom and hopping online with it via Fightcade. To this very day, Capcom still hasn't released an arcade perfect port. So grabbing the rom is literally the only way I can play the real game without buying a damn arcade cabinet. Which of course, even if I did buy a cabinet, Capcom will never see a single cent.
I'm more than willing to buy roms. I bought all the Sega roms released on Steam. I've bought a good amount of SNK roms on Steam. And when Nintendo has roms I want on the VC, I buy those too.
But we don't live in some dream world where every rom is available for purchase. There are thousands of games that you simply can't purchase from the source. But why the **** would I buy them from a re-seller online? If I get an itch to play Legacy of the Wizard it's not like my money will find its way back to Broderbund.
@WitIsWisdom said:
@emgesp said:
@WitIsWisdom said:
Yes they are. Resale is still a viable means of purchase. The games are still available for purchase, even if it isn't your preferred method.
I have no problem with you saying "rules be damned", sure.. I get that, if that's the way you or anyone else wants to feel about something, then all the power to you. That still doesn't make your statement that it isn't stealing true. I mean.. don't get me wrong, it's not like you are going in and pulling off a diamond heist, robbing a bank, or even stealing a CD from Walmart, but it's still stealing none the less. Now, I'm not trying to be all "citizens arrest" bullshit with you.. just saying.
I don't mind if people don't feel bad about the things they do that aren't exactly legal, but by saying "it doesn't hurt anyone" isn't even remotely true. Somewhere down the line it is hurting someone's bottom line. Anyone who steals a rom, pirates a copy of something, etc. Whether that be a collector, resale shop, mom and pop retro store, etc. It isn't always 1st party that is effected. If Nintendo doesn't want to continue marketing their older products then they don't have to, but that doesn't mean they have a monopoly on their older physical copies that others buy, sell, and trade... many who stake their livelihood on it. You want proof it hurts the smaller folk? Look no further than the fact that retro game stores are very sparse these days. People feeling entitled to just downloading everything they want for free has put them out of business, and has driven prices SKY HIGH for those that want the actual copies of the games... and why is this? Simple, they are trying to keep their heads above water any way they can.
Ummm, sorry, but second hand shops and ebay sellers are no concern of mine and I'm not obligated to support them. They are nothing but glorified pawn shops and they charge stupid Ebay prices for their games anyways. These products are second hand so no I'm not stealing from them. The only profit that matters for those games is the profit from Nintendo and the stores who bought those games from Nintendo to sell to consumers. That has long since been achieved. Also, emulation is not hurting physical copies of retro games. If the store has thought after games they will sell. The reason why stores are closing is because there is a crap ton of competition and a limited amount of supply out there.
Yeah, sorry, but you aren't the one making the rules. It doesn't matter what you do or don't like, or who is of concern to you. Tell yourself whatever you need to sleep at night though. No skin off my back. I'm sure if they were selling the games digitally for.. oh I don't know, $10 a pop you would get them all right? I mean right? Exactly... As long as you can justify your wrong doing by placing the blame and pointing the finger at someone else then it's A ok. Also, no, I don't care if you bought 5-20 eshop rematers, or NES classics... blah blah blah. How many Roms do you own that you didn't pay for?
I'm not debating a topic that everyone (including yourself) knows that I am right about. Saying "it doesn't hurt anyone" and it isn't stealing is wrong. It doesn't matter where the hell it comes from... if you can BUY it then it is available to BUY. Period. Regardless of prices, or where it comes from, as long as it is a legal venture, which resale is, and downloading roms is not.
Like I said, it doesn't even really matter to me about the actual topic, it's just when people try to justify it and act like it's perfectly fine and legal that pisses me off. Like I said before, you do whatever you want, I'm sure everyone has downloaded a game, song, movie, or some other form of media without paying for that material, but you don't see 99.999% of them spouting off and telling others that it is perfectly fine. Just because you are disgruntled and upset that things aren't going your way doesn't mean that doing it makes you anymore right than anyone else.
So, to summarize things:
No fucks given about actually doing it. Just hate it when people act as though it's perfectly fine to do it, and tell others it is ok to do so. It is illegal even if you don't get caught. Hell, I'm sure everyone has jaywalked before, but if you wouldn't do it in front of a cop... chances are it's illegal. You don't see people going around saying jaywalking is perfectly legal. Hell, it might not be that big of a deal, but to go around saying it's perfectly fine and spreading falsities is ignorant.
Seeing you trying to justify this and saying it doesn't hurt sales or resale is a complete joke. I'm sure Napster and LimeWire didn't reduce album sales either, right?
Except it is perfectly fine to do it because not one single person or company will take any legal action against you and no one cares what you think. I have 6000 + roms total I think, over 200 gigs if I recall...where's the cops at? lol
@emgesp said:
@iandizion713 said:
@emgesp: Bro, you can get it for $30. Thats cheap as hell compared to what it cost back in the day.
Yeah for a reproduction, not for a legit copy. Go find me a legit copy of Turtles in Time for $30 and I'll happily pay for it.
Heres one for $47.99, still super cheap compared to how much they were back in the day.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Teenage-Mutant-Ninja-Turtles-IV-Turtles-In-Time-Authentic-Free-Shipping-/122452652025?hash=item1c82bf2ff9:g:xz4AAOSwWWxY9mty
And if your good with ebay, can get it even cheaper. These collectors always undercutting each other. You can get games and systems for good deals on ebay.
@emgesp said:
@WitIsWisdom: Napster and Limewire are totally different than downloading old roms. The difference is new music that just came out were being downloaded before the Artist even made any profit. By the time emulators got really popular for consoles like the NES, SNES and Genesis the companies had already made their profit and discontinued those products. I'm not making excuses. I just think people need to stop being such squares. These companies are worth billions, so I highly doubt some illegally obtained roms from decades old systems is really cutting into their profits. People need to calm down with the legality of things.
I'm calm as can be about it. I could care less if anyone owns some old roms. My point was in the wording.. Saying it is perfectly fine and legal isn't true. I guess the entitlement aspect of the way you acted struck a bit of a chord with me. It's not that I feel that it's a big concern, just not something I feel people should go about telling others to do and acting as though it's perfectly ok. Many people buy physical copies to collect and/or to get the full experience of a game. I have played many roms throughout the years, and they never recapture the feel of the original for some reason. Napster and LimeWire weren't totally different in all aspects, and obviously I wasn't referring to new releases... Anyways though, to each their own. I guess all I'm saying is that I feel things like that should be kept under wraps and not flaunted about as if the respective companies behind the games owe you a damn thing. It certainly doesn't give any of us the right to take their property (regardless of availability). While at the same time I feel we are all probably guilty to some extent, it sickens me to see those (especially a younger audience ((which you aren't)) feel entitled to these games without paying proper respect. Those of us who poured money into the games when they released, and have emptied thousands (if not more) into the industry? It doesn't bother me quite as much. Maybe I'm just a little old school when it comes to these types of things, but it even bothers me when people hack nooks for ebooks and things of that nature as well. I get what you are saying though. I just look at things from every angle... it's not the multi billion dollar businesses that come to mind in these types of things for me.
@pimphand_gamer said:
@WitIsWisdom said:
@emgesp said:
@WitIsWisdom said:
Yes they are. Resale is still a viable means of purchase. The games are still available for purchase, even if it isn't your preferred method.
I have no problem with you saying "rules be damned", sure.. I get that, if that's the way you or anyone else wants to feel about something, then all the power to you. That still doesn't make your statement that it isn't stealing true. I mean.. don't get me wrong, it's not like you are going in and pulling off a diamond heist, robbing a bank, or even stealing a CD from Walmart, but it's still stealing none the less. Now, I'm not trying to be all "citizens arrest" bullshit with you.. just saying.
I don't mind if people don't feel bad about the things they do that aren't exactly legal, but by saying "it doesn't hurt anyone" isn't even remotely true. Somewhere down the line it is hurting someone's bottom line. Anyone who steals a rom, pirates a copy of something, etc. Whether that be a collector, resale shop, mom and pop retro store, etc. It isn't always 1st party that is effected. If Nintendo doesn't want to continue marketing their older products then they don't have to, but that doesn't mean they have a monopoly on their older physical copies that others buy, sell, and trade... many who stake their livelihood on it. You want proof it hurts the smaller folk? Look no further than the fact that retro game stores are very sparse these days. People feeling entitled to just downloading everything they want for free has put them out of business, and has driven prices SKY HIGH for those that want the actual copies of the games... and why is this? Simple, they are trying to keep their heads above water any way they can.
Ummm, sorry, but second hand shops and ebay sellers are no concern of mine and I'm not obligated to support them. They are nothing but glorified pawn shops and they charge stupid Ebay prices for their games anyways. These products are second hand so no I'm not stealing from them. The only profit that matters for those games is the profit from Nintendo and the stores who bought those games from Nintendo to sell to consumers. That has long since been achieved. Also, emulation is not hurting physical copies of retro games. If the store has thought after games they will sell. The reason why stores are closing is because there is a crap ton of competition and a limited amount of supply out there.
Yeah, sorry, but you aren't the one making the rules. It doesn't matter what you do or don't like, or who is of concern to you. Tell yourself whatever you need to sleep at night though. No skin off my back. I'm sure if they were selling the games digitally for.. oh I don't know, $10 a pop you would get them all right? I mean right? Exactly... As long as you can justify your wrong doing by placing the blame and pointing the finger at someone else then it's A ok. Also, no, I don't care if you bought 5-20 eshop rematers, or NES classics... blah blah blah. How many Roms do you own that you didn't pay for?
I'm not debating a topic that everyone (including yourself) knows that I am right about. Saying "it doesn't hurt anyone" and it isn't stealing is wrong. It doesn't matter where the hell it comes from... if you can BUY it then it is available to BUY. Period. Regardless of prices, or where it comes from, as long as it is a legal venture, which resale is, and downloading roms is not.
Like I said, it doesn't even really matter to me about the actual topic, it's just when people try to justify it and act like it's perfectly fine and legal that pisses me off. Like I said before, you do whatever you want, I'm sure everyone has downloaded a game, song, movie, or some other form of media without paying for that material, but you don't see 99.999% of them spouting off and telling others that it is perfectly fine. Just because you are disgruntled and upset that things aren't going your way doesn't mean that doing it makes you anymore right than anyone else.
So, to summarize things:
No fucks given about actually doing it. Just hate it when people act as though it's perfectly fine to do it, and tell others it is ok to do so. It is illegal even if you don't get caught. Hell, I'm sure everyone has jaywalked before, but if you wouldn't do it in front of a cop... chances are it's illegal. You don't see people going around saying jaywalking is perfectly legal. Hell, it might not be that big of a deal, but to go around saying it's perfectly fine and spreading falsities is ignorant.
Seeing you trying to justify this and saying it doesn't hurt sales or resale is a complete joke. I'm sure Napster and LimeWire didn't reduce album sales either, right?
Except it is perfectly fine to do it because not one single person or company will take any legal action against you and no one cares what you think. I have 6000 + roms total I think, over 200 gigs if I recall...where's the cops at? lol
Entitled clowns like you are the people I was referring to, so thanks for proving my point. Also, just so you know, I never said the cops were coming or even ever alluded to. Try understanding what you read before posting, it might help at some point in your life.
@WitIsWisdom: When did I say it was legal? All I said was Nintendo ain't going to do shit about it. They use to try and stop sites from hosting roms/emulators, but they ended that war years ago. Its not worth it to them. All they care about is new games and making sure those aren't pirated which is totally understandable.
@emgesp said:
@WitIsWisdom: When did I say it was legal? All I said was Nintendo ain't going to do shit about it. They use to try and stop sites from hosting roms/emulators, but they ended that war years ago. Its not worth it to them. All they care about is new games and making sure those aren't pirated which is totally understandable.
When you said several different times that it wasn't stealing, and implied it was perfectly ok? I get what you are saying though.. I do. I also agree Nintendo isn't going to do shit about it... mainly because it's an unwinnable battle this day and age.
but it's all good man. I think that you think that I care more about this than I do. I have already stated my case. It isn't people like you that sicken me, but there is a good example within this very topic that does.. lol
Personally I would rather own a physical copy anyways, so it doesn't effect me in the least either way. I have nothing to lose or gain by feeling the way I do... I just feel that there is a new sense of entitlement that has been going around the past few years that is getting way out of hand, and this, by far, isn't the only example.
@WitIsWisdom said:
@emgesp said:
@WitIsWisdom: When did I say it was legal? All I said was Nintendo ain't going to do shit about it. They use to try and stop sites from hosting roms/emulators, but they ended that war years ago. Its not worth it to them. All they care about is new games and making sure those aren't pirated which is totally understandable.
When you said several different times that it wasn't stealing, and implied it was perfectly ok? I get what you are saying though.. I do. I also agree Nintendo isn't going to do shit about it... mainly because it's an unwinnable battle this day and age.
but it's all good man. I think that you think that I care more about this than I do. I have already stated my case. It isn't people like you that sicken me, but there is a good example within this very topic that does.. lol
Personally I would rather own a physical copy anyways, so it doesn't effect me in the least either way. I have nothing to lose or gain by feeling the way I do... I just feel that there is a new sense of entitlement that has been going around the past few years that is getting way out of hand, and this, by far, isn't the only example.
I own legit copies too, but no way am I going to pay $100+ for a freaking game, so I'm gonna either emulate them, or buy a repro.
@WitIsWisdom said:
@pimphand_gamer said:
@WitIsWisdom said:
@emgesp said:
@WitIsWisdom said:
Yes they are. Resale is still a viable means of purchase. The games are still available for purchase, even if it isn't your preferred method.
I have no problem with you saying "rules be damned", sure.. I get that, if that's the way you or anyone else wants to feel about something, then all the power to you. That still doesn't make your statement that it isn't stealing true. I mean.. don't get me wrong, it's not like you are going in and pulling off a diamond heist, robbing a bank, or even stealing a CD from Walmart, but it's still stealing none the less. Now, I'm not trying to be all "citizens arrest" bullshit with you.. just saying.
I don't mind if people don't feel bad about the things they do that aren't exactly legal, but by saying "it doesn't hurt anyone" isn't even remotely true. Somewhere down the line it is hurting someone's bottom line. Anyone who steals a rom, pirates a copy of something, etc. Whether that be a collector, resale shop, mom and pop retro store, etc. It isn't always 1st party that is effected. If Nintendo doesn't want to continue marketing their older products then they don't have to, but that doesn't mean they have a monopoly on their older physical copies that others buy, sell, and trade... many who stake their livelihood on it. You want proof it hurts the smaller folk? Look no further than the fact that retro game stores are very sparse these days. People feeling entitled to just downloading everything they want for free has put them out of business, and has driven prices SKY HIGH for those that want the actual copies of the games... and why is this? Simple, they are trying to keep their heads above water any way they can.
Ummm, sorry, but second hand shops and ebay sellers are no concern of mine and I'm not obligated to support them. They are nothing but glorified pawn shops and they charge stupid Ebay prices for their games anyways. These products are second hand so no I'm not stealing from them. The only profit that matters for those games is the profit from Nintendo and the stores who bought those games from Nintendo to sell to consumers. That has long since been achieved. Also, emulation is not hurting physical copies of retro games. If the store has thought after games they will sell. The reason why stores are closing is because there is a crap ton of competition and a limited amount of supply out there.
Yeah, sorry, but you aren't the one making the rules. It doesn't matter what you do or don't like, or who is of concern to you. Tell yourself whatever you need to sleep at night though. No skin off my back. I'm sure if they were selling the games digitally for.. oh I don't know, $10 a pop you would get them all right? I mean right? Exactly... As long as you can justify your wrong doing by placing the blame and pointing the finger at someone else then it's A ok. Also, no, I don't care if you bought 5-20 eshop rematers, or NES classics... blah blah blah. How many Roms do you own that you didn't pay for?
I'm not debating a topic that everyone (including yourself) knows that I am right about. Saying "it doesn't hurt anyone" and it isn't stealing is wrong. It doesn't matter where the hell it comes from... if you can BUY it then it is available to BUY. Period. Regardless of prices, or where it comes from, as long as it is a legal venture, which resale is, and downloading roms is not.
Like I said, it doesn't even really matter to me about the actual topic, it's just when people try to justify it and act like it's perfectly fine and legal that pisses me off. Like I said before, you do whatever you want, I'm sure everyone has downloaded a game, song, movie, or some other form of media without paying for that material, but you don't see 99.999% of them spouting off and telling others that it is perfectly fine. Just because you are disgruntled and upset that things aren't going your way doesn't mean that doing it makes you anymore right than anyone else.
So, to summarize things:
No fucks given about actually doing it. Just hate it when people act as though it's perfectly fine to do it, and tell others it is ok to do so. It is illegal even if you don't get caught. Hell, I'm sure everyone has jaywalked before, but if you wouldn't do it in front of a cop... chances are it's illegal. You don't see people going around saying jaywalking is perfectly legal. Hell, it might not be that big of a deal, but to go around saying it's perfectly fine and spreading falsities is ignorant.
Seeing you trying to justify this and saying it doesn't hurt sales or resale is a complete joke. I'm sure Napster and LimeWire didn't reduce album sales either, right?
Except it is perfectly fine to do it because not one single person or company will take any legal action against you and no one cares what you think. I have 6000 + roms total I think, over 200 gigs if I recall...where's the cops at? lol
Entitled clowns like you are the people I was referring to, so thanks for proving my point. Also, just so you know, I never said the cops were coming or even ever alluded to. Try understanding what you read before posting, it might help at some point in your life.
Of course I'm entitled considering the fact that I can obtain it. If I could get a Ferrari for free then that also means I am entitled to it doesn't it? That's what entitled means, a privilege....so what? You speak as though that is a bad thing but that comes off as jealousy. However in this case you too are privileged to also download at your discretion. Congrats on understanding entitlement, no reason to keep crying about what is a terrific thing to have...privilege.
@pimphand_gamer said:
@WitIsWisdom said:
@pimphand_gamer said:
@WitIsWisdom said:
Yeah, sorry, but you aren't the one making the rules. It doesn't matter what you do or don't like, or who is of concern to you. Tell yourself whatever you need to sleep at night though. No skin off my back. I'm sure if they were selling the games digitally for.. oh I don't know, $10 a pop you would get them all right? I mean right? Exactly... As long as you can justify your wrong doing by placing the blame and pointing the finger at someone else then it's A ok. Also, no, I don't care if you bought 5-20 eshop rematers, or NES classics... blah blah blah. How many Roms do you own that you didn't pay for?
I'm not debating a topic that everyone (including yourself) knows that I am right about. Saying "it doesn't hurt anyone" and it isn't stealing is wrong. It doesn't matter where the hell it comes from... if you can BUY it then it is available to BUY. Period. Regardless of prices, or where it comes from, as long as it is a legal venture, which resale is, and downloading roms is not.
Like I said, it doesn't even really matter to me about the actual topic, it's just when people try to justify it and act like it's perfectly fine and legal that pisses me off. Like I said before, you do whatever you want, I'm sure everyone has downloaded a game, song, movie, or some other form of media without paying for that material, but you don't see 99.999% of them spouting off and telling others that it is perfectly fine. Just because you are disgruntled and upset that things aren't going your way doesn't mean that doing it makes you anymore right than anyone else.
So, to summarize things:
No fucks given about actually doing it. Just hate it when people act as though it's perfectly fine to do it, and tell others it is ok to do so. It is illegal even if you don't get caught. Hell, I'm sure everyone has jaywalked before, but if you wouldn't do it in front of a cop... chances are it's illegal. You don't see people going around saying jaywalking is perfectly legal. Hell, it might not be that big of a deal, but to go around saying it's perfectly fine and spreading falsities is ignorant.
Seeing you trying to justify this and saying it doesn't hurt sales or resale is a complete joke. I'm sure Napster and LimeWire didn't reduce album sales either, right?
Except it is perfectly fine to do it because not one single person or company will take any legal action against you and no one cares what you think. I have 6000 + roms total I think, over 200 gigs if I recall...where's the cops at? lol
Entitled clowns like you are the people I was referring to, so thanks for proving my point. Also, just so you know, I never said the cops were coming or even ever alluded to. Try understanding what you read before posting, it might help at some point in your life.
Of course I'm entitled considering the fact that I can obtain it. If I could get a Ferrari for free then that also means I am entitled to it doesn't it? That's what entitled means, a privilege....so what? You speak as though that is a bad thing but that comes off as jealousy. However in this case you too are privileged to also download at your discretion. Congrats on understanding entitlement, no reason to keep crying about what is a terrific thing to have...privilege.
I sure hope your entire account is nothing but troll satire, because I find it nearly impossible for anybody to sound as ignorant as you are coming across without truly trying. I could easily dissect every point (if you can even call them that...) you make, but it is a insult to anyone with even an average intelligence level, so I wont debase myself and even attempt to lower myself to such a demeaning level.
You and your "understanding" of the terms you use make you come across like a millennial child throwing a fit. Read up on the topic concerning apples and oranges, it may do you some good, and don't forget to take your trophy on the way out the door so you don't cry.
probably be more than $60 this time, and be much better supplied (hopefully). I'd like a list like this:
Super Mario World
Yoshi's Island
Donkey Kong Country (or would this have Rare conflict?)
Legend of Zelda: Link to the Past
Super Metroid
Castlevania 4
Kirby Super Star
Sim City
Final Fantasy 6
Chrono Trigger
Super Mario RPG
Ogre Battle
Super Street Fighter II Turbo
F Zero
Mario Kart
Mega Man 7
Mega Man X
Contra III
Star Fox
Super Bomberman II
Super Double Dragon
Super Ghouls and Ghosts
R-Type 3
NHL 94
NBA Jam
WWF Royal Rumble
Super Punch Out
@emgesp said:
@GunSmith1_basic:
It costing a bit more won't stop scalpers as they will still be able to make a decent profit on Ebay.
yeah? So what? Things get scalped on eBay. What does that have to do with this product compared to others?
And yes, if the mini snes is for real, it will be better supplied, and that will take away the scalping factor that plagued the nes mini. I mainly brought up the price because snes games are much more expensive on the the vc, but that will also limit demand and therefore scalping.
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