Since MS is flopping when it comes to games, heres a good article of the XBOX THE DUKE controller.

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daredevils2k

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#1 daredevils2k
Member since 2015 • 5001 Posts

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Search All Your College Degree Options HereOnline College Degree | Sponsored LinksIt's Like Amazon, but Everything Sells in 90 SecondsTophatterThe Fastest Way To Pay Off $10,000 In Credit Card DebtCompareacards.com By LendingTreeDenise Chaudhari had never touched a gamepad before stepping onto Microsoft's campus as a contractor. The first woman to join the Xbox team, Chaudhari had studied ergonomics and industrial design at the prestigious Rhode Island School of Design but didn't have any experience with joysticks. That's part of why Xbox's Jim Stewart was so excited to bring her on board: Her ideas wouldn't be based on preconceived notions of what a gamepad had to be.

It was early 2000, and the company was preparing to enter the gaming world with the Xbox. In Nov. 2001, the console was released in North America alongside the Duke, a controller that seemed comically large compared to its contemporaries. Within a year, the oversize gamepad was abandoned by Microsoft and replaced with a smaller model, but the Duke has had an impact on every controller since.

Rather than starting from scratch, Chaudhari had to work from Xbox creative director Horace Luke's concept sketches. They'd already been approved from up top, and a third-party supplier had built circuit boards based on those early drawings. Instead of coming up with the shape and ergonomics first and figuring out how to fit the device's internals into the shell after, Chaudhari needed to work backward.

She got to work, sculpting physical models with a wood-like modeling material called RenShape. You can see the legacy of Chaudhari's work in every Xbox gamepad that followed. Its A, B, X, Y face button layout and button style remain today, for starters. But it's the thumbstick placement that has made the most lasting impression on controller design. While the DualShock had parallel sticks at the bottom of the controller, the Duke's were offset, with the left sitting higher than the right by about two inches.

It wasn't until her conversations with Xbox architect Seamus Blackley, J Allard (the "father" of the console's follow-up, the Xbox 360) and her now ex-husband Rob Wyatt that Chaudhari realized the hand she'd been dealt: The circuit boards, already manufactured and ready to go, were comically oversized.

A large circuit board does two things. For one, it costs more to make. It also occupies more physical space. Looking over photos of the circuit board, longtime hardware hacker Ben Heck estimated that even in 2000, the board could've "easily" been a third smaller. He theorized that the circuit board's size was a necessity given the Duke's expansion slots for memory cards and an Xbox Live chat headset (also designed by Chaudhari).

"We were up against a wall," Chaudhari said. "The best thing we could do was create a case that was ergonomically comfortable. If it's gonna have to be that big, then it can at least feel good, right?" Case in point, the Duke's analog sticks are offset rather than parallel, positioned where your thumbs naturally rest.

"It was no secret to us that it was big."

According to Blackley, that decision was the result of a few Tony Hawk Pro Skater players on the team who thought it'd make virtual skateboarding more fun. Combined with developer Bungie's Halo: Combat Evolved as a launch title, the placement also helped make first-person shooters feel like a natural fit for a console, which was laughable up to that point.

Chaudhari spent most of her days working with electrical engineers, negotiating button layouts and placements, and generally doing whatever possible to shrink the gargantuan gamepad down to size, millimeters at a time. Blackley would come into her office almost daily to check her progress on the new prototypes. Each time, his reaction was the same: The controller wasn't small enough. Her immediate response never changed. She wanted to know how it felt in his hands. "And Seamus would say, 'It feels great, but it's huge,'" she recalled. "It was no secret to us that it was big." The final product was nearly three times larger than the PlayStation's DualShock controller.

At one point, the design team met with electronics supplier Mitsumi, which made the circuit boards for the DualShock. One of the reasons Sony's gamepads were so much smaller was because they used a two-part board that connected via a ribbon cable. The separate pieces of silicon sat perpendicular to one another and allowed for a more modest design overall. When Chaudhari asked Mitsumi if Xbox could have a similar-style board, she was flat-out refused, presumably because of Japan's nationalistic culture. "The takeaway was kind of like, 'Sony is a Japanese company; Mitsumi is a Japanese company. Xbox is an American company, and you don't get what you get because you want it, even if you're willing to pay for it,'" she said.

https://www.engadget.com/2018/03/23/xbox-controller-retrospective-hyperkin-duke-gamepad/

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QuadKnight

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#2 QuadKnight
Member since 2015 • 12916 Posts

More controllers than worthwhile exclusives. What a joke of a system.

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hrt_rulz01

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#3  Edited By hrt_rulz01
Member since 2006 • 22372 Posts

@quadknight said:

More controllers than worthwhile exclusives. What a joke of a system.

You are one sad, salty person aren't you... lmao.

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BenjaminBanklin

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#4 BenjaminBanklin
Member since 2004 • 11084 Posts

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EyeBoonsEyebrow

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#5 EyeBoonsEyebrow
Member since 2018 • 280 Posts

@hrt_rulz01: he's not wrong

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Chutebox

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#6 Chutebox
Member since 2007 • 50556 Posts

wtf, the Duke is the name for the official NFL football!

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QuadKnight

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#7  Edited By QuadKnight
Member since 2015 • 12916 Posts
@hrt_rulz01 said:
@quadknight said:

More controllers than worthwhile exclusives. What a joke of a system.

You are one sad, salty person aren't you... lmao.

Says the butthurt lem that hasn't had a worthwhile AAA game release on his console since 2016.

"? B....bu.....but muh 4K chickens!!!!1"

Keep chasing those chickens in Sea of Flops ??????.

?

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Creepywelps

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#8  Edited By Creepywelps
Member since 2015 • 2964 Posts

@Chutebox: I smell a lawsuit.

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hrt_rulz01

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#9 hrt_rulz01
Member since 2006 • 22372 Posts

@quadknight said:
@hrt_rulz01 said:
@quadknight said:

More controllers than worthwhile exclusives. What a joke of a system.

You are one sad, salty person aren't you... lmao.

Says the butthurt lem that hasn't had a worthwhile AAA game release on his console since 2016.

"? B....bu.....but muh 4K chickens!!!!1"

Keep chasing those chickens in Sea of Flops ??????.

?

Lol, do you just copy & paste your responses? They all sound so... infantile.

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UssjTrunks

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#10  Edited By UssjTrunks
Member since 2005 • 11299 Posts

It's crazy to me how long it took for console manufacturers to make good controllers.

PS1 - PS3 = designed for hobbit hands, zero attention paid to ergonomics (just SNES controller with hand grips).

Xbox Duke = the exact opposite of DS1-3, made for users 7 feet and over only

Gamecube = missing crucial inputs, terrible d-pad

Xbox 360 = worst d-pad ever made

Wii = SNES controller with analog sticks

Wii U = parallel analog sticks above all the buttons... wtf?

They've finally figured out how to make ergonomic controllers this generation, with all 3 feeling great to hold, but there are still issues.

PS4 = shortest battery life in the history of lithium ion devices

X1 = Uses AA batteries... where the **** would someone even buy AA batteries in 2018?

Switch = tied with 360 for worst d-pad ever made, plus went back to digital triggers...

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sealionact

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#11 sealionact
Member since 2014 • 9816 Posts

@UssjTrunks: You....don't have batteries where you live?

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UssjTrunks

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#12  Edited By UssjTrunks
Member since 2005 • 11299 Posts

@sealionact said:

@UssjTrunks: You....don't have batteries where you live?

It's fucking 2018. I haven't bought a battery in over 10 years. Everything is rechargeable these days.

I remember the Gameboy days when I needed to have drawers full of batteries. Thankfully, Nintendo solved that problem in 2003 with a rechargeable battery. Microsoft still hasn't gotten the memo.

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Archangel3371

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#13 Archangel3371  Online
Member since 2004 • 44147 Posts

The Xbox One controller is easily my favourite controller of all time. I got the original Xbox later on in its lifecycle so I missed the whole ‘Duke’ controller phase.

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JoshRMeyer

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#14 JoshRMeyer
Member since 2015 • 12571 Posts

@UssjTrunks: As much as I hate the concept of AAA batteries in a controller, where do you live that you can't find them? They are literally in every store here in the U.S.... even gas stations have them. The 6 hour battery life of the ds4 sucks, but it's way better than buying a battery pack(in addition to the controller)(I have 4), or constantly buying AAAs. I still don't know why 6 hours(the newer controllers) are that big of deal. Always have one plugged in the system and swap. Even if you plan on playing for more than 6 hours, use any old cell phone cord plugged into a wall outlet next to you or straight into the console if your cords long enough. But yeah, all 3 controllers are pretty good this gen.

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hrt_rulz01

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#15 hrt_rulz01
Member since 2006 • 22372 Posts

@Archangel3371 said:

The Xbox One controller is easily my favourite controller of all time. I got the original Xbox later on in its lifecycle so I missed the whole ‘Duke’ controller phase.

Yeah, the XB1 controller is the best controller of all time.

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Archangel3371

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#16  Edited By Archangel3371  Online
Member since 2004 • 44147 Posts

@hrt_rulz01: Yeah it’s pretty much perfect. Love the asymmetrical analog stick placement and the triggers feel fantastic. Has a very solid feel and nice weight to it. The contoured design feels extremely comfortable as well.

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hrt_rulz01

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#17 hrt_rulz01
Member since 2006 • 22372 Posts

@Archangel3371 said:

@hrt_rulz01: Yeah it’s pretty much perfect. Love the asymmetrical analog stick placement and the triggers feel fantastic. Has a very solid feel and nice weight to it. The contoured design feels extremely comfortable as well.

Yep... and I know cows will jump on this like a pack of vultures, but I actually prefer having the AA batteries. It gives you more flexibility. I use Panasonic Eneloop rechargeable batteries that last for days & it's fantastic. Compare that to having to recharge the stupid DS4 every few hours.

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#18 Archangel3371  Online
Member since 2004 • 44147 Posts

@hrt_rulz01: Agreed.

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deactivated-5c0b07b32bf03

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#19 deactivated-5c0b07b32bf03
Member since 2014 • 6005 Posts

@hrt_rulz01 said:
@quadknight said:

More controllers than worthwhile exclusives. What a joke of a system.

You are one sad, salty person aren't you... lmao.

Except...he's absolutely right. MS got sh_t for exclusives this gen.

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sealionact

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#20 sealionact
Member since 2014 • 9816 Posts

@UssjTrunks: So having the choice of standard AA batteries - which last longer than the ps4s charge - and using rechargeable AAs which last as long as the PS4 charge is a bad thing?

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#21 QuadKnight
Member since 2015 • 12916 Posts

@hrt_rulz01 said:
@quadknight said:
@hrt_rulz01 said:
@quadknight said:

More controllers than worthwhile exclusives. What a joke of a system.

You are one sad, salty person aren't you... lmao.

Says the butthurt lem that hasn't had a worthwhile AAA game release on his console since 2016.

"? B....bu.....but muh 4K chickens!!!!1"

Keep chasing those chickens in Sea of Flops ??????.

?

Lol, do you just copy & paste your responses? They all sound so... infantile.

Dat asshurt. Don’t you have some skeletons to fight ?????

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mandzilla

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#22 mandzilla  Moderator
Member since 2017 • 4686 Posts

Having motion controls and HD rumble on the Switch Pro controller is pretty nice though, plus that 40 hour battery life. It's my fave controller so far, though admittedly I have never had an Xbox One or PS4 to compare.

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#23  Edited By UssjTrunks
Member since 2005 • 11299 Posts

@mandzilla said:

Having motion controls and HD rumble on the Switch Pro controller is pretty nice though, plus that 40 hour battery life. It's my fave controller so far, though admittedly I have never had an Xbox One or PS4 to compare.

The d-pad is an insult to humanity. That thing is Xbox 360 levels of awful, if not worse.

The controller also lacks analog triggers. That's fine since Switch games don't use analog triggers, but it means you can't use it for racing games on the PC (if you wanted to).

Otherwise, it's great. Perfect ergonomics (although DS4 and X1 are just as good) and the battery is fantastic (easily the best of the three). I really wish I could have loved it, but the absolutely horrendous d-pad forced me to return it. I'm using a DS4 with my Switch instead.

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#24 UssjTrunks
Member since 2005 • 11299 Posts

@sealionact said:

@UssjTrunks: So having the choice of standard AA batteries - which last longer than the ps4s charge - and using rechargeable AAs which last as long as the PS4 charge is a bad thing?

The rechargeable battery costs an additional $30.

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sealionact

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#25  Edited By sealionact
Member since 2014 • 9816 Posts

@UssjTrunks: I use standard rechargeable AA batteries. Have 2 charging, and use 2 to play with....they don't cost $30.

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#26 UssjTrunks
Member since 2005 • 11299 Posts

@sealionact said:

@UssjTrunks: I use standard rechargeable AA batteries. Have 2 charging, and use 2 to play with....they don't cost $30.

They still sell those? I literally having used those since the 90s...

I was talking about the rechargeable battery you can buy from MS.

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#27 sealionact
Member since 2014 • 9816 Posts

@UssjTrunks: You could do that as another choice too. Batteries are everywhere - rechargeable or not ...not sure how else people power remotes in 2018.

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#28 mandzilla  Moderator
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@UssjTrunks: Ah well yup, I agree with you that it certainly has it's shortcomings and you're right to point them out. The d-pad could be better, but compared to the joycons it is a good step up at least.

Also it's true that the analog triggers sort of hold it back when it comes to having realistic racing games on the Switch, but things like MarioKart are still fun with just the face buttons. I had a lot of fun with Burnout, Gran Turismo etc on the PS2 so I guess that's why I don't really have a problem with the way they designed the triggers. It's probably not the best choice of controllers for the PC if you're going to be playing racing games, or GTA and that sort of thing though.

Having said that, the motion controls are hands down the best thing about it! Playing Skyrim and the enemy dodges to the left while you're aiming your bow at him? No problem, just tilt your controller over a little and never miss a shot. Also for first person shooters it's amazing. Playing Doom or Splatoon 2 with motion controls is very fluid, and you don't need to constantly make minor adjustments with the analog sticks when aiming. It feels almost as precise as mouse and keyboard in my opinion.

And yeah definitely, all three of the controllers have the ergonomics pretty much perfected this time around! ?

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UssjTrunks

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#29 UssjTrunks
Member since 2005 • 11299 Posts

@mandzilla said:

@UssjTrunks: Ah well yup, I agree with you that it certainly has it's shortcomings and you're right to point them out. The d-pad could be better, but compared to the joycons it is a good step up at least.

Also it's true that the analog triggers sort of hold it back when it comes to having realistic racing games on the Switch, but things like MarioKart are still fun with just the face buttons. I had a lot of fun with Burnout, Gran Turismo etc on the PS2 so I guess that's why I don't really have a problem with the way they designed the triggers. It's probably not the best choice of controllers for the PC if you're going to be playing racing games, or GTA and that sort of thing though.

Having said that, the motion controls are hands down the best thing about it! Playing Skyrim and the enemy dodges to the left while you're aiming your bow at him? No problem, just tilt your controller over a little and never miss a shot. Also for first person shooters it's amazing. Playing Doom or Splatoon 2 with motion controls is very fluid, and you don't need to constantly make minor adjustments with the analog sticks when aiming. It feels almost as precise as mouse and keyboard in my opinion.

And yeah definitely, all three of the controllers have the ergonomics pretty much perfected this time around! ?

Motion controls are what I miss most about not using it. The DS4 has motion controls, but they aren't as precise (not sure if its the controller itself or the adapter). It's still usable, but the pro controller was perfect.

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jaydan

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#30 jaydan
Member since 2015 • 8414 Posts

Xbox fans, I really hope you all get to enjoy your new controller.

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#31 BluFalconUltra
Member since 2014 • 459 Posts

@jaydan said:

Xbox fans, I really hope you all get to enjoy your new controller.

But what are they going to play?

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#32  Edited By jaydan
Member since 2015 • 8414 Posts

@blufalconultra said:
@jaydan said:

Xbox fans, I really hope you all get to enjoy your new controller.

But what are they going to play?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Xbox_One_games

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#33 BluFalconUltra
Member since 2014 • 459 Posts

@jaydan said:
@blufalconultra said:
@jaydan said:

Xbox fans, I really hope you all get to enjoy your new controller.

But what are they going to play?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Xbox_One_games

Can you list the exclusives for me? I don't see them.

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daredevils2k

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#34 daredevils2k
Member since 2015 • 5001 Posts

@quadknight said:

More controllers than worthwhile exclusives. What a joke of a system.

LOL , I forgot lems hype controllers now. its gotta suck not having any game :(

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#35 BluFalconUltra
Member since 2014 • 459 Posts

@daredevils2k said:
@quadknight said:

More controllers than worthwhile exclusives. What a joke of a system.

LOL , I forgot lems hype controllers now. its gotta suck not having any game :(

Having controllers with no games is like having a girlfriend and no sex...man my stomach hurts LOLOLOLOLOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLOL!

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#36  Edited By daredevils2k
Member since 2015 • 5001 Posts

@blufalconultra said:
@daredevils2k said:
@quadknight said:

More controllers than worthwhile exclusives. What a joke of a system.

LOL , I forgot lems hype controllers now. its gotta suck not having any game :(

Having controllers with no games is like having a girlfriend and no sex...man my stomach hurts LOLOLOLOLOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLOL!

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jaydan

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#37 jaydan
Member since 2015 • 8414 Posts

@blufalconultra said:
@jaydan said:
@blufalconultra said:
@jaydan said:

Xbox fans, I really hope you all get to enjoy your new controller.

But what are they going to play?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Xbox_One_games

Can you list the exclusives for me? I don't see them.

Don't ask stupid questions and then screwball it the moment you get an answer. You asked what they are gonna play and there's a big list for you.

I don't even own the Xbox One and have no desires to have one either.

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QuadKnight

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#38 QuadKnight
Member since 2015 • 12916 Posts

@daredevils2k said:
@blufalconultra said:
@daredevils2k said:
@quadknight said:

More controllers than worthwhile exclusives. What a joke of a system.

LOL , I forgot lems hype controllers now. its gotta suck not having any game :(

Having controllers with no games is like having a girlfriend and no sex...man my stomach hurts LOLOLOLOLOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLOL!

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#39 BluFalconUltra
Member since 2014 • 459 Posts

@jaydan said:
@blufalconultra said:
@jaydan said:
@blufalconultra said:
@jaydan said:

Xbox fans, I really hope you all get to enjoy your new controller.

But what are they going to play?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Xbox_One_games

Can you list the exclusives for me? I don't see them.

Don't ask stupid questions and then screwball it the moment you get an answer. You asked what they are gonna play and there's a big list for you.

I don't even own the Xbox One and have no desires to have one either.

If you can't answer the question thoroughly then don't reply lol. Why get upset if you don't own an Xbox? Strange.

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jaydan

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#40  Edited By jaydan
Member since 2015 • 8414 Posts

@blufalconultra said:
@jaydan said:
@blufalconultra said:
@jaydan said:
@blufalconultra said:

But what are they going to play?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Xbox_One_games

Can you list the exclusives for me? I don't see them.

Don't ask stupid questions and then screwball it the moment you get an answer. You asked what they are gonna play and there's a big list for you.

I don't even own the Xbox One and have no desires to have one either.

If you can't answer the question thoroughly then don't reply lol. Why get upset if you don't own an Xbox? Strange.

Sorry, I couldn't savor your conformist fanboy needs.

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jaydan

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#41 jaydan
Member since 2015 • 8414 Posts

@blufalconultra: It's just that...you tried screwballing what was already a stupid question after I told Xbox fans to enjoy their new controller.

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deactivated-5f9e3c6a83e51

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#42 deactivated-5f9e3c6a83e51
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I bet the duke would please more women than you

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#43  Edited By mrbojangles25
Member since 2005 • 58300 Posts

As someone with huge (yuge?) hands, I might actually like such a large controller. I often find the xbox, Steam, and PS controllers too small.

but god damn is it ugly

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deactivated-6092a2d005fba

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#44 deactivated-6092a2d005fba
Member since 2015 • 22663 Posts

@sealionact said:

@UssjTrunks: You....don't have batteries where you live?

No his vibrator is electric :P

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HitmanActual

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#45 HitmanActual
Member since 2013 • 1351 Posts

@sonicare said:

I bet the duke would please more women than you

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N64DD

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#46  Edited By N64DD
Member since 2015 • 13167 Posts

@hrt_rulz01 said:
@Archangel3371 said:

@hrt_rulz01: Yeah it’s pretty much perfect. Love the asymmetrical analog stick placement and the triggers feel fantastic. Has a very solid feel and nice weight to it. The contoured design feels extremely comfortable as well.

Yep... and I know cows will jump on this like a pack of vultures, but I actually prefer having the AA batteries. It gives you more flexibility. I use Panasonic Eneloop rechargeable batteries that last for days & it's fantastic. Compare that to having to recharge the stupid DS4 every few hours.

The ps4 controllers battery is shit.

I'm correcting you by the way, the Xbox one ELITE controller is the best controller.

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#47 BluFalconUltra
Member since 2014 • 459 Posts

@jaydan said:

@blufalconultra: It's just that...you tried screwballing what was already a stupid question after I told Xbox fans to enjoy their new controller.

Yet you replied and seem to be angry about it and keep replying. Stupid recognize stupid I guess.

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#48 Archangel3371  Online
Member since 2004 • 44147 Posts

@n64dd: Yeah I would imagine that the Elite controller is better but I haven’t used one yet myself.

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#49  Edited By jaydan
Member since 2015 • 8414 Posts

@blufalconultra said:
@jaydan said:

@blufalconultra: It's just that...you tried screwballing what was already a stupid question after I told Xbox fans to enjoy their new controller.

Yet you replied and seem to be angry about it and keep replying. Stupid recognize stupid I guess.

Speak for yourself, lol.

I'm actually doing quite good. Doing some editing work tonight for some of my productions. Sipping the coffee with Steely Dan and a couple tabs open like SW to enjoy a little shit-show. I'm pretty calm and amused, otherwise. Thank you for your psychological assessment, however.

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#50  Edited By BluFalconUltra
Member since 2014 • 459 Posts