Sekiro vs Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order

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jahnee

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Poll: Sekiro vs Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order (47 votes)

Sekiro 38%
Sekiro vs Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order 28%
DMC V 28%
Other... Like... 6%

I am interested in a third person adventure/action platforming game. Which one sticks out?

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Litchie

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#1 Litchie
Member since 2003 • 24826 Posts

Sekiro.

Fallen Order if you're a child / casual gamer and DMC5 if you like hack'n'slash.

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pyro1245

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#2  Edited By pyro1245
Member since 2003 • 5569 Posts

I really like Jedi Fallen Order for the story and setting, but....

Sekiro is such a way better game it's not even close.

Both are worth playing IMO.

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Ghosts4ever

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#3 Ghosts4ever
Member since 2015 • 11143 Posts

Jedi fallen order.

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Litchie

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#4 Litchie
Member since 2003 • 24826 Posts

@ghosts4ever said:

Jedi fallen order.

lulz. Someone got owned by Sekiro.

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R4gn4r0k

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#5 R4gn4r0k
Member since 2004 • 32076 Posts

Jedi Fallen Order is my GOTY. Get it if you like Star Wars stuff.

@Litchie said:

Fallen Order if you're a child / casual gamer

@Litchie said:

lulz. Someone got owned by Sekiro.

We get it bro, you got gud.

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Ghosts4ever

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#6 Ghosts4ever
Member since 2015 • 11143 Posts
@R4gn4r0k said:

Jedi Fallen Order is my GOTY. Get it if you like Star Wars stuff.

@Litchie said:

Fallen Order if you're a child / casual gamer

@Litchie said:

lulz. Someone got owned by Sekiro.

We get it bro, you got gud.

He has not played jedi fallen order yet. its far more interesting than sekiro which is just wierd kind of game.

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R4gn4r0k

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#7 R4gn4r0k
Member since 2004 • 32076 Posts

@ghosts4ever said:

He has not played jedi fallen order yet. its far more interesting than sekiro which is just wierd kind of game.

He has. Though I don't see how anyone enjoying Jedi is worse off than someone enjoying Sekiro.

The way I see it in Dark Souls, Sekiro there is one way to beat enemies, and that is learning their weakspot and learning the enemy behaviour until you gid gud.

Meanwhile in Star Wars you have tons of way to approach combat. Helped by the great implementation of Force Powers.

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DaVillain-

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#8  Edited By DaVillain-  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 39388 Posts

I played both Sekiro: Shadow Die Twice and Star Wars: Jedi Fallen Order which by the way both of those games are on my top 10 play games of 2019. Between the 2, I personally enjoy both of these games but, if I must really pick the 1, it's: Star Wars: Jedi Fallen Order is my personal pick only "if" you are a Star Wars fan like me that is. I'd say, get both of these games, they are both great in my opinion.

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Archangel3371

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#9 Archangel3371
Member since 2004 • 28988 Posts

I’d say get Devil May Cry 5, the game is utterly fantastic. I haven’t played Sekiro or Jedi Fallen Order yet. Both look very good and quite interesting to me so I plan on playing them both eventually but I’d go with Fallen Order first.

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Litchie

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#10  Edited By Litchie
Member since 2003 • 24826 Posts

@ghosts4ever: I was wondering what complaint you'd have for Sekiro, other than it being too hard. Because there's nothing bad about the game. So we got "it's weird".

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jg4xchamp

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#11 jg4xchamp
Member since 2006 • 61860 Posts

Devil May Cry 5 if you value depth.

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Ghosts4ever

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#12 Ghosts4ever
Member since 2015 • 11143 Posts

@Litchie said:

@ghosts4ever: I was wondering what complaint you'd have for Sekiro, other than it being too hard. Because there's nothing bad about the game. So we got "it's weird".

its controlling is bad on KB/M. other than its setting is imo wierd fantasy type im not a fan of.

other than jedi fallen order is far from what you think "casual". it has confusing map, good level design, challenging combat.

definitely one of the best third person game to come out this gen. better than RE2 remake.

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with_teeth26

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#13 with_teeth26
Member since 2007 • 9759 Posts

I didn't finish either, Sekiro I just got my butt kicked and eventually gave up (made around 1/3-1/2 of the way through the game)

Fallen Order I just kinda lot interest after a while, I spent about 12 hours with the game so presumably I got fairly close to the end? I really enjoyed some sections but other times it was just tedious

If I had to choose i'd go with Sekiro, the combat just feels tighter and I prefer the setting, but in general I'm not a big fan of parry based combat systems and both these games have these so I wouldn't put either on my "top games of 2019" list

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pyro1245

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#14 pyro1245
Member since 2003 • 5569 Posts

Jedi fallen Order just can't hang with Sekiro because:

  • Jedi controls are very hit or miss - they just don't feel particularly great. Sekiro controls are dead nails and the game feels incredibly responsive.
  • Jedi has some really bad hitching. I tried 2 very good computers, one with a fresh install of Windows. In fact the game seemed to run better on the fresh install (no surprise I guess). Game mode enabled on both machines. Sekiro runs smooth no problem.

Both games nail the atmosphere and lore. The game part of Sekiro is just way better.

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Litchie

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#15  Edited By Litchie
Member since 2003 • 24826 Posts

@ghosts4ever said:
@Litchie said:

@ghosts4ever: I was wondering what complaint you'd have for Sekiro, other than it being too hard. Because there's nothing bad about the game. So we got "it's weird".

its controlling is bad on KB/M. other than its setting is imo wierd fantasy type im not a fan of.

other than jedi fallen order is far from what you think "casual". it has confusing map, good level design, challenging combat.

definitely one of the best third person game to come out this gen. better than RE2 remake.

Aah yeah dude, you played with M/KB. I've never tried with M/KB myself, but I can imagine it not being great. The setting was really cool I thought, but to each his own.

Never mind too much what I said about Fallen Order, it seems like a good game. Just wanted to poke some fun. But if you're a child or a casual, FO would be the better choice over Sekiro or DMC5. So I'm not wrong..

All three of these games are great, can't go wrong with any of them. But in my opinion, if you have the patience to get to know the mechanics of Sekiro and don't shy away from a good challenge, the game is bloody amazing. But I can of course see why it wouldn't be enjoyable to lots of people.

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Pedro

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#16 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 36072 Posts

Sekiro is just a mess. The world and level design is simply great but the rest of the game is just plain mediocre.

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mrbojangles25

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#17  Edited By mrbojangles25
Member since 2005 • 45029 Posts

They're both great, why not get both [eventually]?

Sekiro is definitely a more die-hard experience, while Fallen Order is an amalgamation of a bunch of different genres and is "soulsborne lite" (which I personally prefer because the trial and error of Soulsborne games is frustrating as hell)

I will say this, though: Fallen Order is probably the best Star Wars game since KOTOR 2. We've had a lot of mediocre and even bad SW games over the past decade or so, it's a breath of fresh air to play a Star Wars game that just oozes that Star Wars feeling throughout.

Oh and I know I will receive flak for this, but the droid in Fallen Order is the best SW droid of all time. Except for maybe Chopper.

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Chutebox

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#18 Chutebox
Member since 2007 • 44961 Posts

Going to tell you right now, at least for me, Sekiro is far harder than any Dark Souls game.

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TJDMHEM

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#19 TJDMHEM
Member since 2006 • 2739 Posts

Jedi Fallen Order

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R-Gamer

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#20  Edited By R-Gamer
Member since 2019 • 1157 Posts

I'd bought all 3. Those are all great games.

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#21  Edited By MirkoS77
Member since 2011 • 14672 Posts

@Litchie said:

Sekiro.

Fallen Order if you're a child / casual gamer and DMC5 if you like hack'n'slash.

Sekiro turned death from a consequence due to the improper implementation of skill and relegated it into a mechanic of learning. You have to die, over and over again, to get good at Sekiro. Not even to get good, but to just begin to understand what you're even dealing with. That's not good or hardcore game design, it's just fucking stupid, bang-your-head-on-the-wall masochism.

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#22  Edited By Pedro
Member since 2002 • 36072 Posts

@MirkoS77 said:

Sekiro turned death from a consequence due to the improper implementation of skill and relegated it into a mechanic of learning. You have to die, over and over again, to get good at Sekiro. Not even to get good, but to just begin to understand what you're even dealing with. That's not good or hardcore game design, it's just fucking stupid, bang-your-head-on-the-wall masochism.

Some people need to feel special. Don't take it away from him. :)

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jg4xchamp

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#23 jg4xchamp
Member since 2006 • 61860 Posts

ITT: people making a whole lot of excuses for playing poorly.

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Litchie

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#24 Litchie
Member since 2003 • 24826 Posts

@MirkoS77: I mean, it's harder than most games. But I don't see how it's stupid. It just sounds like you thought it took it too far with the difficulty. I personally don't.

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#25  Edited By MirkoS77
Member since 2011 • 14672 Posts

@Litchie said:

@MirkoS77: I mean, it's harder than most games. But I don't see how it's stupid. It just sounds like you thought it took it too far with the difficulty. I personally don't.

Nah I don't mind difficulty, but the game doesn't even barely allow you to learn. You have to die and die and die and die and die some more to even get to the point of understanding how to implement skillful play. Wanna learn timing? DIE! Oh, you were a tad slow? DIE!

Give me some margins game, or **** off. Ninja Gaiden Black was perfect in its execution and balance of difficulty and demanding skill from the player, Sekiro is garbage. The penalty compared to what is gained is wildly imbalanced.

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#26 mtron32
Member since 2006 • 3983 Posts

@Litchie said:

Sekiro.

Fallen Order if you're a child / casual gamer and DMC5 if you like hack'n'slash.

What's the rationale behind this? I wasn't aware of Sekiro before this thread, will be buying both.

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#27  Edited By mtron32
Member since 2006 • 3983 Posts
@pyro1245 said:

Jedi fallen Order just can't hang with Sekiro because:

  • Jedi controls are very hit or miss - they just don't feel particularly great. Sekiro controls are dead nails and the game feels incredibly responsive.
  • Jedi has some really bad hitching. I tried 2 very good computers, one with a fresh install of Windows. In fact the game seemed to run better on the fresh install (no surprise I guess). Game mode enabled on both machines. Sekiro runs smooth no problem.

Both games nail the atmosphere and lore. The game part of Sekiro is just way better.

Sekiro's setting looks great from what I saw in the video review just now, looking forward to it. There are a lot of really good single player games out there right now.

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#28 cainetao11
Member since 2006 • 37039 Posts

Sekiro is GOTY

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lundy86_4

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#29 lundy86_4
Member since 2003 • 54333 Posts

Fallen order over Sekiro for that Star Wars goodness. Sekiro over Star Wars for gameplay.

DMC5 over everything for being beyond excellent.

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#30 clone01
Member since 2003 • 27618 Posts

@Litchie said:
@ghosts4ever said:

Jedi fallen order.

lulz. Someone got owned by Sekiro.

Oooo, tough guy.

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#31 clone01
Member since 2003 • 27618 Posts
@Chutebox said:

Going to tell you right now, at least for me, Sekiro is far harder than any Dark Souls game.

true that, even if you take away Dark Soul's summon capability.

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#32  Edited By jg4xchamp
Member since 2006 • 61860 Posts

@MirkoS77 said:

Nah I don't mind difficulty, but the game doesn't even barely allow you to learn.

This empirically false.

The deflect timing is lenient as shit at 30 frames, given that most games give you a dodge window with attacks that have to have 10 (a universal acceptance in game design as when stuff can be considered reactable) frames of start up or more, it's generous as hell. From Software's previous games have dodge windows a lot tighter than than by comparison, and you can't exactly buffer your dodges the way you can the parry.

There is more than enough footage out there of goons beating that game one shotting bosses, it's plenty manageable to follow attack animations and respond accordingly as few attacks if any would fall into unreactable territory. Command grabs are certainly worth pointing out, but this notion that you can't learn is misleading as hell, and it's not like you get hit any harder in Sekiro than you do in Souls games. Trial and error is a perfectly acceptable wall to put in front of the player, players who simply adapt faster, especially because this game lends itself to people who play Action games and specifically were aggressive with parrying in Souls games/Bloodborne, learned quicker as a result.

Additionally you can straight up interrupt attack strings in Sekiro in a way you straight up can't in Souls, as you can cause stagger situations for full punish on enemies/bosses.

The game's combat has other problems, like being a bit too simon says and it's a far cry from offering the depth that Devil May Cry 5's systems provide, but your complaint is are 100% on you to adapt or not tolerating trial and error stuff.

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jeezers

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#33 jeezers
Member since 2007 • 3662 Posts

DMCV

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Pedro

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#34 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 36072 Posts

@jg4xchamp: You said he is false but you literally confirmed what he stated. Which is odd, especially when you preface your explanation that he is wrong.

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#35 jg4xchamp
Member since 2006 • 61860 Posts

@Pedro said:

@jg4xchamp: You said he is false but you literally confirmed what he stated. Which is odd, especially when you preface your explanation that he is wrong.

?

Nothing I stated confirmed his point. His premise is lousy as if he isn't being punished for poor positioning, poor timing, poor reaction, lack of patience, etc which are all skills, not whatever else you could call them. His premise is that the game doesn't allow you to learn, which is false. Compared to other games of its ilk, the main primary defensive mechanic has the most generous window out of any of them, even late deflects keep the player safe.

Making learning enemy attack patterns more viable on first attempts than the previous from software game, where your only real option is dodge that shit, and the dodge window is significantly less than 30 frames.

You have more ways to interrupt enemy patterns as well.

Beyond that I chimed in on the idea of downplaying trial and error in general, hard games by nature are going to have trial and error. It isn't that hard of a game if you just run right through it one shotting it and know the answers well in advance. Even easier games require a bit of feeling a scenario out, and working through your mistakes. They simply don't punish as hard, more difficult games naturally do punish you for your mistakes harder, and expect longer stretches of consistent play.

That's not invalid design decision and is absolutely on the player, and their short comings. Like most examples of people wanting to argue the game was unfair, nah it wasn't, it's on you.

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DragonfireXZ95

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#36 DragonfireXZ95
Member since 2005 • 25734 Posts

I'd say Sekiro is a better game, but it is much harder. If you played Dark Souls, you basically have to forget any muscle memory retained from those games.

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Cloud_imperium

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#37 Cloud_imperium
Member since 2013 • 15047 Posts

Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order

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jahnee

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#38  Edited By jahnee
Member since 2005 • 4010 Posts

After reading through all the comments I feel that I will first get Jedi Fallen Order, but will settle for all three eventually with second DMC V and then finally Sekiro. It's Star Wars season and I like a bit of an easy learning curve game at the moment. Thanks for the discussion guys it was a good read!

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Litchie

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#39 Litchie
Member since 2003 • 24826 Posts

@MirkoS77: Ok. So Megaman is shit too then. Plus lots of other great games. I highly disagree. I can understand people disliking the game because it's too hard. But I don't really follow when people try to come up with other reasons as to why the game is bad.

You say you don't mind a challenge, but then you went on to complain about dying too much. Which means you do mind a challenge. "It's imbalanced". No, it's hard. Obviously too hard for you to enjoy.

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Litchie

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#40 Litchie
Member since 2003 • 24826 Posts

@mtron32: Sekiro doesn't have an easy setting.

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IgGy621985

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#41 IgGy621985
Member since 2004 • 5577 Posts

I call myself a "casual" gamer; I didn't have enough patience for Sekiro, but I also got bored with Jedi: FO rather quickly. Boring and repetitive level design, repetitive combat...

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#42  Edited By Vaasman  Online
Member since 2008 • 14079 Posts

Sekiro is a singularly focused game with rich world design that sets out to deliver a very specific concept in a narrowed viable playstyle. The developers very clearly want to have you playing a certain way against a punishing game and to get certain things out of it. If you don't get those things out of it, then they're fully content to leave you the player frustrated and unhappy.

JFO is a hodgepodge of everyone else's ideas mushed into one game. I don't mean that as a bad thing necessarily, plenty of great games are that. It's a crowdpleasing catchall that you can feel fairly sure will be very entertaining (at least, maybe after a couple more patch cycles clamp down the ai and animation bugs) no matter your preferences. Of course, being homogeneous means you'll ultimately not remember it exists in 2 years.

Therefore the correct answer of which to buy, is Bayonetta 2.

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Litchie

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#43 Litchie
Member since 2003 • 24826 Posts

@Vaasman: lol. Great post.

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#44 Subspecies
Member since 2018 • 938 Posts

Sekiro is hardcore. And freaking great.

JFO is Star Wars. Star Wars is corny, trite garbage. And so is the game.

So.

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___gamemaster__

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#45 ___gamemaster__
Member since 2009 • 2689 Posts

sekiro is the best game ive played this year. but im a darksouls fan so i may be bias. hard to play another game which offers the same experience as these games. il patiently wait for nioh 2

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mtron32

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#46 mtron32
Member since 2006 • 3983 Posts

@Litchie said:

@mtron32: Sekiro doesn't have an easy setting.

Oh is that all? I'll gladly set a game on easy so I can blast through it as fast as possible and see the story. If the game just has a default setting like Control which I'm playing through now, it needs to be balanced enough offer a challenge without being annoying. If all that means is intelligent AI then great, I can get down with that; but if I need to pump 2-3 clips into an enemies head before I can advance yet they one shot kill me then that game is getting sold.

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#47 lamprey263
Member since 2006 • 36290 Posts

Though Fallen Order shares many design choices of a Souls game, it is far from the challenge of one. Sekiro is the exact opposite in that they took that "get good" frustrating difficulty and said that's kids stuff.

In end I enjoyed Fallen Order more, probably because I managed to beat it, whereas I gave up on Sekiro when I couldn't progress any further.

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#48  Edited By MirkoS77
Member since 2011 • 14672 Posts

@Litchie said:

@MirkoS77: Ok. So Megaman is shit too then. Plus lots of other great games. I highly disagree. I can understand people disliking the game because it's too hard. But I don't really follow when people try to come up with other reasons as to why the game is bad.

You say you don't mind a challenge, but then you went on to complain about dying too much. Which means you do mind a challenge. "It's imbalanced". No, it's hard. Obviously too hard for you to enjoy.

I don't mind death, but when I feel it's largely in vain due to the fact that the game is so merciless in its damage allocation that each encounter isn't giving me enough leeway to learn, much less practice, it's nothing but frustrating (speaking on the bosses). Getting the feeling for timing with parrying, for dodging, for enemy combos, to play around with differing abilities to see which works. I wouldn't feel this way so much if you could restart the boss fight immediately, but it's made all the more enjoyable by oftentimes being kicked back to have to run through a bunch of enemies to try a boss again that you may, hey, last twenty seconds against this time as opposed to ten. Good fun. Not enough? Here, deal with some rot for your continual bothers, bitch.

Sekiro feels frankly insulting in the way it handles its challenge. I can be trying to learn Chinese and have a teacher allow me some time to actually study it and then flunk me when I fail to construct a grammatically correct sentence, or I can have a teacher smack me across the knuckles every time I fail to understand a single Chinese character. Will I learn both ways eventually? Sure. Doesn't change the fact that one method is challenging due to it utilizing a sensible way to learn and apply knowledge, and the other is masochistic and known as "stupidly difficult".

It's not too difficult for me to enjoy, it's the game's design that makes it difficult that is my issue. Giving people more room to make mistakes isn't negating the challenge, it's affording them the chance to learn how to overcome it without creating tedium and unnecessary, frustrating repetition.

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PC_Rocks

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#49 PC_Rocks
Member since 2018 • 2779 Posts

DMC fucking V.

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#50  Edited By Litchie
Member since 2003 • 24826 Posts

@mtron32 said:
@Litchie said:

@mtron32: Sekiro doesn't have an easy setting.

Oh is that all? I'll gladly set a game on easy so I can blast through it as fast as possible and see the story.

That's lame. To me, that's wasting a game. But whatever floats thy boat.