Rise of the Tomb Raider - Games like this need to die off

2 minutes into Rise of the Tomb Raider your hit with your first QTE

5 minutes in your treated to a scripted disaster sequence where the only skill involved is pressing left or right on the joystick. No matter how many times you play this sequence, it will be exactly the same scripted event.

7 minutes in your presented with the challenge of scaling ice, except its not challenging. Your told where to go and the only path you can take is about as linear as the worst tunnel simulators

And people eat this stuff up? Why?

I refuse to hate on MGSV that much because its core gameplay mechanic was about encouraging player choice, and not holding your hand through everything.

Im not saying everything has to be openworld or sandbox, but why not give the player something that resembles choice? If Im suppose to climb something, why not let me try to do it through various methods of trial and error, rather then holding my hand and forcing me to do it one way?

Im just gutted this game got such high scores, but it tells the industry we want more of this. I dont.

I like the original '96 Tomb Raider where after the first cinematic with the wolves eating your sherpa friend, you're ushered into a cave with no idea what the hell to do.

Now that's legit tomb raiding, and you feel like a badarse when you finish the level.

1: Not all games need to be the same

2: Not all games need to actually entertain you.

I like shitting on a lot of games as much as the next guy, the desire to have them not exist, isn't necessarily one I agree with though. They more than earn their keep by virtue of the fact that people will spend their money on it. You don't like it, don't play it and play something that fits the things you like.

On the topic of Tomb Raider: I think it sucks that in 2015 a franchise that was once about exploring tombs and puzzle solving, has gotten to a point where instead of improving on that, they turned it into more of an action game (albeit they also did fix the combat of Tomb Raider from hot turd to actually good), where the puzzle solving and tombs are a tertiary element of the game. That and I'd rather have old Lara, or at least a Tomb Raider that knows its pulp versus one that takes itself so seriously.

That said, og Tomb Raider was never that good, so I'm not holding that big of a torch for those old games. It's just concept wise, instead of finally making those games good, they just said **** it and made a shooter.

It's casual pish.

What needs to die off is people worshipping these supposed icons of the past who aren't interesting characters. Lara Croft, Gordon Freeman, Mario, Master Chief, Marcus Fenix...whilst the games may have been good the characters are all useless

those games were always shooters, just really shitty ones. now they just made a shooter that doesn't suck.

If you played more than the first 15 minutes, you'd see it's a lot more than that.

@FrozenLiquid: Even the bad aspects of poor camera angles gave a leap of faith quality to platforming, it was exciting.

You could've just said "characters not on playstation" and saved yourself some words.

Unfortunately "gamers" these days are largely casuals who want easy, tightly scripted, mindless blockbuster experiences.

They're a cancer on the industry, and they really hurt the potentials games have as an artistic medium. They're easy to make, they're easy to market, and lots of casuals really enjoy them. A lot of self-titled "hardcore gamers" only play stuff like this; they're really just casuals who don't know as much about vidya as they think they do.

OP, check out /v/ on one of the big chans. The posting culture on /v/ is a little bit more knowledgeable about games and not as silly as this board. Also, totally anonymous posting, so no morons who think their opinions are better because they have a higher post count.

And yet you praise UC...

Well, you don't need to buy it. I agree, the trend is annoying, but there are some good games that have that annoying setup (Far Cry 3, which is a very fun sandbox game with emergent gameplay).

Well I'm having a blast so far. It's entertaining me a hell of a lot. I guess threads like these need to die. Who are you to decide what people should like or not. Who are you to dictate what games should or shouldn't be?

You see, if I don't like a game or a particular style of game play, I don't buy it. I don't run around saying games like this to die because I don't like it. Get over it and move on to another game you do like.

Agreed, the game also feels TOO linear and i love linear games, the game completely holds your hand and all you pretty much do is climb and shoot...and there is A LOT of shooting, where the **** are the puzzles, exploration? Something the past older games had. While uncharted has similar experiences, it's done better....feels better and isn't boring.

Don't get me started on the scripted action set peices.....they are over done to death.

I like that style game. I'm sure I'll play it multiple times.

MGS5:TPP gameplay is awesome once you get past that first hump of the beginning of the game, but that intro is horrible and much worse than Rise of the Tomb Raider, and here you are judging one game for its first few minutes of gameplay but totally giving a free pass to another who did everything you hated on and worse. I get it, salty cows be salty. Can you get any saltier?

Yeah they were about as much shooters as Zelda is Devil May Cry. Yeah you shoot a T-rex, and shit, but you spent most of your time in those games in tombs, puzzle solving, doing that platforming, and all that jazz.

That got toned down, and they went more action game.

@DarthaPerkinjan: I look forward to your Uncharted 4 hate thread as well.

**** this condescending, elitist, myopic bullshit. What garbage.

I enjoy games of all types. David Cage games, games such as Journey, and everything in between. I grew up playing Lucasarts games such as Full Throttle and the Indiana Jones point and click "pixel hunt" games along with many others, which are not all that dissimilar of which you refer to as being so inferior. The only real "cancer" on this industry is people who hold perspectives like you do, who think games should fit into some arbitrarily given criteria that I doubt even you could define sufficiently if pressed.

This medium has room for all types of experiences, and your position is the only real threat here. People also screamed to high heavens when films introduced sound and color. If you don't like it, then don't buy it. It's simple. But don't stand there on your soapbox and attempt to dictate what constitutes "real" games and by extension "real" gamers. A real gamer is open-minded to all forms and welcomes diversity. You have spoken on which side you lay, and it isn't real or admirable in any sense of the word.

Blame Uncharted. When those came out, and Tomb Raider was still releasing games in the older style, everyone said Tomb Raider should follow Uncharted. They did that and now everyone says they aren't enough like the old games. They can't do both styles, so make your minds up.

Too bad for you. I am enjoying the game. Joy, fun. That's why I play them.

Completely get where you're coming from, but after the first hour the game actually lets you play and eases up on the cinematic flair.

The immediate difference between 2013 and Rise is the fact there are more tombs. I'm not even done yet, but Tombs and exploration has taken precedence over combat in this one imo.

I realize unlike many here, I am an easily pleased gamer. At my age I usually know what I like and haven't been let down too often. I am enjoying this game.

I totally agree with you in regards these games have their place. People get so asshurt about this stuff. There are so many games made every year, I refuse to believe people cant find something to their liking. TC needs to realize his preference isn't that of others, and that doesn't make others wrong for it. Its called being an adult.

Lara Croft and Gordon Freeman are both on PlayStation.

@DarthaPerkinjan: if you don't like it, don't buy it....

Boy, you're really buttmad huh? That's an awful lot of salt.

The mental gymnastics of folks like you are amazing. Here we have clear, provable examples of games getting shittier and you just keep parroting "muh diversity" and "muh open-mindedness!" like the brainwashed little skag you are.

I'm sorry that you were too stupid to beat adventure games. I guess you were a kid though, so I can't blame you.

Now that wouldn't be true now would it? I would have added whoever the main character of Resistance was and Sackboy onto the list however both those games wern't big enough to be recognised by everyone. The point is, you fanboys get your panties all in a bunch as soon as someone criticises an excluvive of your but in this case even saying a character from one of your exclusives isnt all that big of a deal can set it off...

Can't you see I'm a PC gamer so I couldn't care less which console is better, still doesn't change the fact that Lara Croft, Gordon Freeman, Master Chief, Marcus Fenix, Mario are not good characters. Whilst Half Life 2, Halo, Gears of War and Mario games may be brillant, doesn't necessarily mean the characters are too.

Its good that games have diversity to cater to different tastes, I'm all for choices and stuffs like that.

But I'm also sick to death of the typical "BLOCKBUSTER MOVIE GAMEZ" where it all feels like the devs actually wanted to make a CG movie than a game. Thats not the main problem I have with movie gamez though, its the apparent industry fixation on it. Huge amount of resources from multiple publishers and studios are being poured into making what is essentially simplistic game that don't bring anything new to the gaming community, its the same shit every year, just shinier and costlier to make. Scripted bullshit and handholding at the expense of any serious meaningful or innovative gameplay. IIRC Warren Spector spoke out against this, that man is right.

@Big_Red_Button: brainwashed? That's the highest irony if I've ever encountered it. You are the cancer you so deride. Perhaps one day you will strike (and begrudgingly endure) puberty in your journey to this realization, but I can't claim my hope doesn't wane.

I don't have a problem with those kind of games. If they make them it's because people buy them after all.

casual gamers have always been the bulk of the gaming audience anyway. This is nothing new. If it weren't for casual gamers I don't think there would be a game industry right now.

lol no need to be buttmad lem, I said a long time ago that ROTTR was copying off that formula that UC2 had....UC2 from last generation.

That is exactly the narrative that is being described here and something that all lems like yourself bashed last gen for the SAME thing the TC is talking about now, NOT UC4 which is a current gen title and not sticking to the same formula it had 6 years ago.

This thread is funny because the main crusaders against Uncharted using the same arguments the TC has given for not liking ROTTR are up in arms defending it...fancy that. Mass flip flop and 180 by the whole lem and hermit populous when the same argument they used to hate on Uncharted is made for a non PS exclusive.

All you guys have proven in this thread is that all your rants about how games like *Uncharted* needed to die using the same argument the TC has for ROTTR was all just jealousy and bitter fanboy hatred because it was an exclusive to a system you weren't a blind fanboy of.

Hypocrites exposed

@cainetao11: @MirkoS77: @kingtito: @oflow: @clyde46: @Snugenz: @jcrame10: @mems_1224:

Thank you TC, this thread is so revealing.

Lol yeah... he's definitely not a PS fan boy at all.

Anyway, I'm loving Tomb Raider. It's brilliant.

@kinectthedots: hypocrisy of what? Elaborate? I've no trouble with Uncharted. Articulate your position, because it's meaningless as is.

Agree. TR2013 was an atrocious game, one of the most overrated games i have ever seen and sadly purchased. This one has zero improvements. QTE's, moaning, cut scenes and linear exploration/scavenging is your TR, a mediocre game that is on par with Ass Creed when it comes to quality.

Who cares?

There has been more platforming, puzzle solving and exploring than there has been combat in my first 8 hours with this game. there has been maybe 3 of those chase sequences so far. Just because the shooting doesn't fucking blow anymore doesnt mean that the other elements have taken a back seat, its just a lot more fun to actually play now. i never finished the original tomb raider games because they're awful games but tomb raider legend was decent and that game had way more combat

While I have said in the past that I feel the Uncharted series is one of the most overrated, I own and have enjoyed every game in the series including the Vita game. The Tomb Raider reboot was HEAVILY influenced by Uncharted and in many ways was a better game. My comment was a jab at TC because Uncharted 4 will likely be similar to what Rise of the Tomb Raider is and if TC is going to be critical of Tomb Raider, he needs to be just as critical of Uncharted. And if you think Uncharted is going to be a huge departure from what Naughty Dog has released in the past, you are just fooling yourself. There is a reason Naughty Dog insists this is the last Uncharted game. They are done with the QTE heavy, autopilot platforming, Indiana Jones games.

Also, I can't be "buttmad." I own all of the consoles and have a 99th percentile PC. I'm also not a Lem because I buy all console multiplats on PS4(minus some sports titles), prefer PS4 (minus the controller) and buy the rest of the multiplats on PC. That doesn't seem very Lem-like does it? COD BLOPS 3? PS4. Battlefront? PS4. Fallout 4? PC. Nice try.

LOL

Here is a prime example of someone who takes videogames far too seriously.

People like what they like. Who gives a shit?

Yeah I can't stand that stuff at all. They feel like complete and utter wastes of time. The game really doesn't need you there yet it forces you to "play" it. Uncharted 2 was horrible for this stuff.

I like how lems criticise UC for being scripted, linear, cinematic yet praise TR. shows just how much of a fanboy and hypocrites you are.

Anyway you can enjoy all types of games, but if you dislike one type or get bored of it, just give it a rest and perhaps when you return you'll enjoy it. That is if you're tired of it. But if you don't like it in the first place just don't go back. I haven't played a MOBA in years for example and I will never play one again.

Okay. I'll buy it after I've spent some time with Fallout 4 and MGS5, and continue to not give a rat's ass what the TC thinks.

@a-new-guardian: tomb raider isn't nearly as scripted and cinematic as uncharted and unlike uncharted it has exploration

it doesnt need to die off since lems love it, just like the uncharted series.. Oh wait.... this is SW, where everyone's a hypocrite but never admit it

It also has a bunch of over done and forced set pieces just to try to make the game seem exciting and epic.