Regarding Abs LOU2 (spoilers)

Just wondering, given the kerfuffle reactionary right-wingers have had at the horrid prospects of a muscular woman doing stuff, do you think when Last Of Us 2 is released the general (public) perception will be more positive? Or will this carry on to a wider audience at large?

I don't think it will personally, small, loud minority about to be quickly drowned out as the accolades pour in. Who knows.

It's nutty dog, so the game will get its 10s and dissenters will be lined up and shot regardless of how good it is.

What else is new.

The (anti-)hype will die down. And people will see the bigger picture. While there will be some annoyance, people will move on to like the product or look at itst bigger flaws. Perhaps, what has been shown will actually be shown in the game, making the reactionary Anita Sarkeesians look like even bigger fools than they already are.

Overreaction, as usual. Will sell lots. Journalists will like it. User score will be terrible. Great meme material, too.

@uninspiredcup said:

Just wondering, given the kerfuffle reactionary right-wingers have had at the horrid prospects of a muscular woman doing stuff, do you think when Last Of Us 2 is released the general (public) perception will be more positive? Or will this carry on to a wider audience at large?

I don't think it will personally, small, loud minority about to be quickly drowned out as the accolades pour in. Who knows.

Not sure what's being asked here?

I believe TLoU 2 will still garner mostly positive reception despite the reactions to the leaks and agenda by ND, sure. Of which there is, and I don't care what anyone else says. I'm one that loves TLoU's gameplay personally, and am looking forward to seeing its evolution in the sequel. But don't attempt to pass off to me that Abby's design isn't borne from the desire to appease the trans community.

Game will be good, more than likely excellent, and it will have an agenda. I can live with the two as they are not incompatible, only denied by the ideologically blinded.

I'm not even right wing. Why does everyone have to be either right wing or left wing? How about being conservative on some issues and liberal on others? I don't approve of sex reassignment surgery and don't want to play as an insanely muscular man-woman. If it were a true transformation, I would approve, but right now it's still too crude and primitive. It functions and looks like shit. I'm tolerant, but there's no way I would encourage someone to do that.

@freedomfreak: sounds about right. MC crtitic score will be double the user score.

A chunk of fans will screech about it on the forums while others defend it.

Nothing out of the ordinary

I think Abby should be able to compete against regular women in the Olympics. #StayWokeFam

Hi, the model for this character is taken from what would be deemed to your perceptions a "natural" woman.

Wither this person achieved this naturally or through steroid use, cannot comment on as not an expert in the field, however their are larger female builds than this.

@uninspiredcup:

Not right wing, but muscular women can be gross looking when it goes beyond toned and athletic.

I don't know the game is kinda all over the place. I suppose if the execution is good it will review well and the fans will carry it. I cant help think that it will not be as successful as it could have been. I have always thought ND popularity is a bit over inflated. GOW, Spiderman will outsell it especially in america npd.

I guess sometimes for companies like Sony the critical reception can matter more and ND are there best hitter when it comes to that.

Naughty Dog needs to go back to the bandicoot, when fun addictive gameplay was put before some lifetime drama story.

So after some intense 30 second googling, it appears Abby's body is modeled after a young lady by the name of "Colleen Fotsch" who is a drug free competing athlete.

@uninspiredcup: shes alot more attractive than Abby, why they make her face ugly, the real life version has attractive face and boobs. Abby looks like Elon Musk.

The people who like the game and story don't care about the people who don't.

Druckman Agenda!!!. Don't attack me this is actually a real thing. I'm on he can do whatever he wants and folks have the right to not like it.

@jeezers: I mean, wouldn't turn her down.

We could go watch action movies, have a few beers, arm wrestle and then follow it up with snu-snu.

In many ways, the ideal woman.

@ellos: yeah I think your right, lets be honest a female built like that is a pretty big rarity, so it already is alittle out of place, to then give her. A dude face on top of that and theres 0 boob. Maybe in the story they explain that she wraps em up tight because she doesnt like them,thats why she has a more flat muscular dude chest. But i doubt it, probably just designed her like that cus duckman hates boobs.

@uninspiredcup: she would protec me from bullies

@uninspiredcup: The media will not call this game out. They will 100% celebrate it for it “progressive message”.

That is a tranny btw.

Regardless, a woman cannot achieve a body like that without testosterone. It’s impossible. Rather you take my word for it or not is irrelevant. So my next question is, In a apocalyptic world, how is “she” able to..........

1. Find a medical center producing steroids.

2. Have equipment in good enough shape to workout at a high Level. It’s not not enough to just do push-ups and pull-ups and crunches and squats.

3. find enough food to maintain mass. We are talking 6,000-8,000 or more calories a day.

These are just a couple logical questions. You can claim she is drug free, but trust me she had help getting that big.

Very interesting typing's my freind.

I'll take it into consideration.

Because they're trying to make a big deal about transgenders. It's laughable.

I think it really depends on the details. Not so much the major spoiler stuff. I say that because Naughty Dog has been pretty good at establishing characters. So I expect them to set up the major spoiler stuff pretty well, somehow. There is one thing about the spoiled resolution of the game that could be an amateur storyteller mistake. We'll see if that's really how it ends.

(Keep in mind we haven't seen the whole game.)

But the game could easily, based on those spoilers, be overly preachy or plain insulting to players. That's the sense I got: that it was created to be insulting to the player. To create a fuss. To make people angry and prove a point in a skewed way by assuming what the anger is all about. This is based on some of the lines that are apparently in the game that I was taken aback by.

We'll see if that's the case, because that is definitely not confirmed. If that is the case I would not want to play the game. What we have seen may not even be in the final version so I reserve any and all judgement for now.

I also want to emphasise that insulting people is pretty OK. Especially if it's unintentional, when you're trying to make a point. It shouldn't be illegal. IMO it shouldn't even be bannable. I don't believe Naughty Dog should go to jail if they do choose to insult their customers. But I do believe people are free to spend their money the way they want to, so it may not be the smartest business move to do so. I do believe the angry reaction is grounded enough (barely) to have potentially a major impact on its sales. Which is only natural and justified, if it really turns out to be bad.

The only thing I know for sure is that I am not looking forward to this game's release because I don't think it'll go over well, one way or the other. Too many mines in the minefield. There are too many things that could be done terribly in the game.

His BFF Anita has been telling him for too many years that big breasts objectify women. Ironically, they're objectifying women by complaining about objectification, shaming women of certain proportions.

Game character and her model:

Dunno why you;re so adamant on defending this shit tier character. She's universally hated. I'm not sure if you're just a contrarian or one of those creepy male feminist

Heck yeah!

Thankfully, most people are not exclusively right or left wing. A very common position is to be pro-left on social issues while pro-right on economic issues.

You don't want to play a muscular woman? Fair enough. Personally I have played as pretty much anything and everything. So I couldn't care less about playing as a muscular woman. And depending on the expanded lore of the series, it may be possible for her to obtain such a physique.

You don't approve of sex re-assignment surgery? I do, as it has been statistically been proven to lead to better outcomes for those who need it. Not every Transgender person does though.

Meta-analysis showing that 52/56 (and the remaining 4 were neutral) lead to positive results following a transition: https://whatweknow.inequality.cornell.edu/topics/lgbt-equality/what-does-the-scholarly-research-say-about-the-well-being-of-transgender-people/

Longitudinal Study showing that while Transgender people are more unhappy, Sex Reassignment and Transitioning vastly improves their quality of life: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6223813/

This isnt a matter of between left or right. This is a case of Right vs Wrong, and objectively speaking, you are in the wrong. I could bring up WAY more sources (all academic), but this is the wrong forum for that.

Regardless, if Druckmann can get this to work. Let him. I want to see the whole story, before I judge. Besides, PLENTY of sequels have had swapped protagonists, and are widely lauded games.

Metal Gear Solid 2

Donkey Kong Country 2 (DK himself got kidnapped in this one)

Donkey Kong Country 3

Super Mario Land 3

Pokemon Gen 2 The protagonist from the original game was the final boss, and that was cool as ****. ND are much more talented writers than Game Freak

Character face reference differing from the overall body model is fairly common.

We know next to nothing about the character even with the leaked footage.

Generally speaking, people, especially grown men, losing their minds with 11-20 pages of ranting at the prospect of a marginalized group being represented like it's about to be the downfall of Western civilization as we know it...

Well.. that is actually, kind of creepy.

Depressing as well, shows how far we haven't come.

I blame you.

Lol what am I even reading. You're deranged. I would think you're trolling if you hadn't picked Blaze in SoR4 to fight these same imaginary evil right wingers. I just think you need to lay off the kool aid. Did something happen with Trump that triggered you? I haven't been following politics.

Apparently, Neil Druckmann has a self-insert spitting on Joel's body... Could defo be a stretch, buuuuuut... I wouldn't be shocked.

@uninspiredcup:they need to go back to the bandicoot cup, keep in mind your making threads and complaining about people complaining at this point. It can all be fixed tho, i have the golden answer to make everyone happy,

ND goes back to making good games about bandicoots. Think about it, its what sony is missing anyway, remember sly cooper, ratchet and clank, parappa the rappa, jak and daxter, I dont need a lifetime drama that shows revenge with mean butch chicks, why are we even talking about transgenders this is stupid, i play games to have fun . Lets go back to these types of games.

why did this happen

The fact that some actually typed this phrase is insane. You say you don't follow politics, but you hold some very specific and peculiar identity politics.

The idea of Cup somehow getting triggered about Trump, only to transform into a feminism activist bro... that's the wildest timeline lol.

Pretty sure Cup just likes boobs and only gets triggered by the mishandling of Star Trek.

Just watch how Last of US 2 and cyberpunk 2077 get treated differently. I'm sure most left-wing gaming journalists will like it but there will be other left-wing journalists that won't like because of that one whole incident of dev making a tranny joke. The journalists that will praise Last of US 2 will probably criticize Cyberpunk 2077 even if it is a little out of nowhere criticism(gaming media has and had some type of agenda towards cyberpunk 2077 but not much now than before). This won't be constructive criticism but more like hate criticism. Those journalists would become basically hypocrites. Cyberpunk 2077 will have more trannies than Last us of 2 and also you could switch genitals of V in Character Creator.

I'm guessing the people here saying "eww, she has an ugly face and no boobs" or "she must be a tranny"...are the same people who also say things like "how dare they try to insert a feminist agenda into my games!" and "gaming culture doesn't have a problem with female representation".

You're all acting like horny 13 year olds, upset that a character in a videogame isn't hot enough for you. It makes me embarrassed to be a gamer.

@fedor said:

@uninspiredcup:

Seriously lol

Well, it's definitely a guess.

@uninspiredcup said:

@ezekiel43 said:

I'm not even right wing. Why does everyone have to be either right wing or left wing? How about being conservative on some issues and liberal on others? I don't approve of sex reassignment surgery and don't want to play as an insanely muscular man-woman. If it were a true transformation, I would approve, but right now it's still too crude and primitive. It functions and looks like shit. I'm tolerant, but there's no way I would encourage someone to do that.

@Guy_Brohski said:

I think Abby should be able to compete against regular women in the Olympics. #StayWokeFam

Hi, the model for this character is taken from what would be deemed to your perceptions a "natural" woman.

Wither this person achieved this naturally or through steroid use, cannot comment on as not an expert in the field, however their are larger female builds than this.

You can be almost certain that Asian women is taking steroids. Most men can't get that muscular and lean. I do agree the controversy over how muscular Abbie looks and the debate over whether she's trans is dumb. The general reaction to the leaks has been embarrassing and it's something I hate about gaming culture and internet culture as a whole.

I have several friends who refuse to associate with gamers, because they find the gamer culture way too embarassing.

Why? Just look at the outrage culture in regards to how upset gamers are in terms of Abby pondering whether she is transgender or not.

@Maroxad: it's time for ND to go back to making fun bandicoot games, the more people talk about this tlou2 the more I hate it, and cows wonder why people call thier exclusives "movie games".

This movie got leaked and now a chunk of players arent going to the theater on opening day.

ND be better off making those badass bandicoot games again, loved those games.

I have played so much Super Mario Maker 2 in the past few days.

I would absolutely love another Mascot Platformer by Naughty Dog.

Whether it is a Spiritual Successor or a Sequel (Doesn't Activision own the IP? Might be difficult to take it off their hands).

The appearance of the potentially trans (but probably not?) lady with the big muscles funnily enough is the one part of all of this that I think I'd have no problems with. I haven't seen a character like that very often so it interests me. And maybe it is explained in some way because TLOU 1 felt pretty grounded in these ways for a video game.

(And I do have to say I have seen some terrible comments about this in places. I guess there are always some bad comments which is natural. I don't think that 'woke' culture is based on solid reasoning, and I have a lot of problems with it mainly because I think it is dangerously counterproductive. But that doesn't mean that some people on the other side of the argument don't have bad ideas either.

I saw someone say that: "They are tailoring to the .5% and trans people don't play games anyway." Firstly, I think trans people play games just like other people do. If anything I bet a disproportionate amount of trans people play games because of its escapism. And if a game gives a group of people special service or attention that can be a really cool gesture. It doesn't need to be a minority or some such, but let's say they made a game to cater specifically to people who are called Naomi I think that would be pretty fun. Especially for people called Naomi. It doesn't mean other people can't enjoy it. (If other people cannot enjoy it, then there is a problem.) Whether that is a smart business decision, that is another story. And would it be smart to do this in the second part of a beloved franchise? Maybe not so much. But we don't even know that they are doing that, yet.

Of course it's OK to be upset about things, but I think it's important to not get upset about things in ways that make no sense, or to get so upset about things that are assumed that you will look silly if it turns out to be a wrong assumption.)

The bolded underlined is exactly the problem for me. It'd be one thing if Abby were trans, I'd accept that, but for ND to keep her female while also taking huge steps towards the androgynous in blurring gender distinctions, is, IMO, the wrong message to send.

It's as if ND is attempting to lessen and obfuscate the definition of male and female entirely to portray the sexes through a very ambiguous and malleable lens. If they had made Abby trans that wouldn't have been possible.....they would have still needed to abide the distinction of the sexes that're blatantly apparent through physiological traits, traits that would've needed to be handled through things such as hormonal treatments and surgery. But if she's not and is actually a biological woman with the physical traits of a man? Then the physical distinction remains, but the focus is now placed on what defines the terms "male" and "female" instead, workable within those traits.

It's essentially shifting the goalposts from operating within the boundaries of biological physical distinction (trans) into questioning and redefining what that distinction actually is, biological or otherwise. Gender isn't binary, I'm on board with that one, but biological sex (unless you're hermaphroditic) very much is, and there are large differences (generally speaking) between them based on those differences.

The "anti-SJWs" have become that which they have criticized. Obnoxiously omnipresent in fandom message boards but non-existent in the real world. Screeching about agendas, blind to any criticism of the mythology that has been entirely concocted from their misshapen heads.

Blasting a game for its woke SJW messaging because of a trans character without confirmation of that character being trans kinda proves some of you are transphobic, right? And now we are here arguing about how muscular a women can get naturally? Y’all need help

I don’t understand the problem. Naughty Dog wrote the story and can make the characters whatever sexual orientation they want. They didn’t ask you.

And we don't have to buy it either. Yet the woke among us will blame the regular people anyway if it fails.

And yeah, nobody is perfect. We all have phobias, biases somewhere in our hearts.

She's designed to be trans-friendly, which is the same fucking thing. She doesn't even have a feminine physique. The CGI pictures up there are very misleading. It's obvious what Druckmann was trying to do with her. I don't remember the last time I saw any woman that looked like her. She makes Brienne of Tarth look quite womanly.