My top 8 consoles or gaming microcomputers of all time

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Jackamomo

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#1 Jackamomo
Member since 2017 • 2157 Posts

This is my personal list of the top consoles or micro computers of all time in terms of games library and my personal experience.

Top games must be first released on that platform or be a unique version i.e. Ultima 4 is an AppleII game but the MS version is unique and Rez is a Dreamcast game despite being available on PS2.

1: Mega Drive (1990)

An overpowered Frankenstein of cutting edge microchips, ‘blast processing’ (TM) is actually a real thing and refers to a fast DMA (direct memory access) controller mode only ever used in Sonic 2 split screen. But the VDU (visual display unit) runs at 13Mhz on top of the core Motoroller 6800 cpu @ 7.6Mhz. Up until the Playstation, it’s graphics could not be beaten. It’s an arcade board in the home, designed largely from one of Sega’s own boards making ports smooth and the the 6800 architecture easy to program for.

Sound is excellent, even a GEMS sequenced track can sound good (Demolition Man).

  • Virtua Racing
  • Alien 3
  • Crack Down
  • Thunderforce 4
  • Desert Strike

2: Master System (1989)

Can’t afford a Mega Drive? Never mind, this £100 cheaper! If your 5, this blows your mind. I never got to own a Spectrum so now I had a proper console! The sound is kind of bad but all the games are there. Streets of Rage and even Mortal Combat are actually alright. Games are generally colourful and run smoothly with clear audio. It has a light gun and it can take game cards and 3d glasses. Stylish.

  • Wonder Boy in Monster Land
  • The Ninja
  • Ultima 4
  • Phantasy Star
  • Fantasy Zone
  • Basketball Nightmare

3: PlayStation (1994)

The first proper powerful console that made your Amstrad CPC 464 look a bit silly. First steps into 3d saw really innovative use in platform and driving games and every other kind of game was also available but in full colour and arcade level of sound output. I had a pc with a Voodoo 2 card though so meh.

  • Tenchu
  • Tekken 2
  • Wipeout
  • Super Puzzle Fighter
  • Gran Turismo

4: Dreamcast (1999)

Two year life span, 750ish games, maracas, fishing rods, keyboard and mouse, internet connection, light gun, displays on the controllers, vga box (if you had a computer monitor). I ignored it in disgust in 1999, thinking it would be a rip off and wait for the price to come down then completely forgot about it for 10 years throughout the whole PS2 life span until I’d finished college.

The games run pretty smoothly and generally look and sound better than the PS2 counterparts, really promoting the experience of what games can be with simple high quality hardware outputs (and a nice tv) and Sega again use a redesigned arcade board, making the hardware highly optimised and easy to program for in addition to Windows CE mode and C++ architecture. Noisy and slow to load, the disc drive is a fail though.

Loads of high res PlayStation ports is a bonus. But the sense of freedom in game design was evident in the daring genres being tested and crossover with the pc market with unreleased games like Tropico, The Movies and Black and White. This experimentation, sadly did not last into the PS2 generation.

  • Street Fighter 3: Third Strike
  • V-Rally 2: Expert Edition
  • Tennis 2k2
  • NBA 2K2
  • Metropolis Street Racer

5: Spectrum (1982)

Blip, bloop, dududududududududududududu. Ahh Speccy games. They are so cool. So British. Nowhere else do you get a system which had games made with the dry British sense of humour and marketed solely for a local market (given it wasn’t available anywhere else) and a Viz game with fart jokes. One colour every 8x8 pixel square did not deter games from having a visual impact. Jet black with bright neon magenta makes quite an impression on the eye. Probably over 20,000 games available. All copied onto Maxell cassettes. Grunge gaming.

  • Nether Earth
  • Boulderdash
  • Fruit Machine
  • Bomb Jack

6: Amiga (1985)

The greatest sound card ever made. Although not about gaming, Amiga tracker music is amazing and I listen to loads of it. The demo scene may as well have started with this computer which spawned some of the best developers. It was so much better than a pc or Acorn back in the late eighties and early 90’s. The output from British studios moving on from the Spectrum scene transformed the gaming industry, inventing a great many new genres and gameplay styles. Excellent sound, wide colour pallete and fast cpu make the Amiga an old god of gaming.

  • Lotus Esprit Turbo Challenge
  • Sensible Soccer
  • Populous
  • Syndicate
  • The Settlers
  • Turrican
  • Cannon Fodder
  • Worms

7: PS2 (2000)

15 years on the market and 150 million sold, every game made around this time is available on this console (1850+). Albeit with reduced texture resolutions, frame rates and poor video output. I spit on this console and what it did to gaming. Then play it because there’s one just kicking about and theres loads of good games… :|

  • Tekken 3
  • GTA: Vice City
  • Prince of Persia: Sands of Time
  • Baldurs Gate: Dark Alliance

8: SNES (1992)

The market leader in the US and Japan. Flopped a bit everywhere else. Some people did have them but shelf space was dominated by Sega here in blighty. The additional cost and huge size of the carts made the SNES seem brash to me and there were more buttons than were really needed on the small joypads. A wide range of inferior Mega Drive ports and 16bit games of the time are available in reduced aspect and frame rate but a wide colour palette makes some games quite attractive. Video output and low bitrate sound quality is a shame however.

  • Super Bomberman
  • Mario 3
  • Super Mario Kart
  • Street Fighter 2

Honourable mentions

Game Boy

All games played great. Responsive controls. Excellent sound. Good size and battery life. Can’t remember the games but if it’s not Pokemon, it will probably be fun.

C64

It’s a Spectrum but instead of looking like it was coloured in by a toddler with a square crayon, it’s 50 shades of pastel blue and purple with he greatest fm sound chip ever created.

Atari 2600

Pele Soccer was actually alright and I may not have played them, but I can see there are a lot of very fun games on this system.

NES

Way too many games. But from 2000 tonnes of silt there might be some diamonds. Good sound, muddy colours.

That’s all I know about consoles and the Dreamcast is the most up to date system I own.

I can’t tell the difference between Sony and Microsoft, PS3 onwards - they are too similar to separate for me. So Xbox, Xbox360, XboxOne/X, PS3, PS4/Pro all play pretty much the same, as hardware is so similar, with only the Wii offering an alternative hardware path, sacrificing power for new tech.

All consoles now offer the same thing. If the Steam boxes or Ouya took off that could have been an alternative but Sony and MS are going after the exact same demographics and alienate everyone else who isn’t the 15 to 35 male CoD fan bracket so development has been stale and many games are pc ports anyway.

I’m seeing nothing new in console gaming for the past ten years despite ever increasing tech specs, except maybe the ‘movie game’ (God of War, Just Cause, Shadow of the Colossus).

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Dr_Vancouver

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#2  Edited By Dr_Vancouver
Member since 2017 • 1046 Posts

Well, your list is a bit shit IMO. No offence intended. DC and SNES I don't disagree with, the rest of your list isn't what I would have ranked "top 8" but you know what they say aboot opinions...

*edit* I re-read the list. Both PS1 and PS2 might belong there.

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Litchie

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#3 Litchie
Member since 2003 • 34469 Posts

Pretty sure this is better suited as a blog dude.

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deactivated-642321fb121ca

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#4 deactivated-642321fb121ca
Member since 2013 • 7142 Posts

Yep, complete utter shit.

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Sevenizz

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#5 Sevenizz
Member since 2010 • 6462 Posts

But what did you have for breakfast?!?

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br0kenrabbit

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#6 br0kenrabbit
Member since 2004 • 17851 Posts

@jackamomo said:

1: Mega Drive (1990)

. Up until the Playstation, it’s graphics could not be beaten.

I owned and loved a Genesis (and 32X, and SegaCD, though not so much love for those last two), but the SNES definitely had the better graphics. Just compare any Street Fighter or Mortal Kombat. Or, you know, DKC and Segas pre-rendered reply Vector Man.

Sega killed it at sports and arcade-style games, but graphics gotta go to SNES.

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cainetao11

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#7 cainetao11
Member since 2006 • 38026 Posts

@Litchie said:

Pretty sure this is better suited as a blog dude.

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jcrame10

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#8 jcrame10
Member since 2014 • 6302 Posts

I haven’t heard of half these consoles. Before my time

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deactivated-5c18005f903a1

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#9  Edited By deactivated-5c18005f903a1
Member since 2016 • 4626 Posts

@jcrame10 said:

I haven’t heard of half these consoles. Before my time

Half of them are not consoles. The Spectrum for instance is a computer (not PC) from the mid 80's.

Games would be loaded off cassettes and take 5 - 10 min each time.

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Jackamomo

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#10  Edited By Jackamomo
Member since 2017 • 2157 Posts

@br0kenrabbit: graphics gotta go to SNES

Did you really buy all that 32x/SegaCD junk? You must be rich.

Whilst the SNES had 15-bit 32,768 colours (256 onscreen), the Genesis had the ability to move it's 9-bit 1526 colour palette (61 colours onscreen) much more briskly with it's fast DMA transfers and VDU sprite capabilities. The Mega Drive's 32/16 bit memory bandwidth compared to the SNES's 16/8 bit meant the SMD had 15.5Mhz speed RAM to the SNES's 2.7Mhz.

The theoretical colour palette in most SNES games however is not present due to memory limitations so do you need 24 bit colour in an early 90's game? No not really. It uses cpu and memory for more colour than you need.

https://segaretro.org/Blast_processing#Hardware_comparison

What this meant was that games mostly were smoother on the Mega Drive with full screen picture (many NIntendo games used square format). Street Fighter 2 plays faster on the Mega Drive so has better graphics given 96 onscreen colours from a palette of 1526 is enough.

So if you include frame rate, play speed, play area and sprite size into what you mean by 'graphics' the SNES is simply trounced.

Samurai Shodown: SNES then Genesis.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_video_game_console_palettes

Classic Game Room Street Fighter 2 Genesis vs SNES

Mortal Kombat Side by Side Comparison

Also, the effects in The Adventures of Batman and Robin would not be possible on the Super Nintendo, given it's slow cpu and it's 'modes' being mostly layer channels and sprite scaling.

The Adventures of Batman and Robin (Sega Genesis vs Snes) Side by Side Comparison

WARNING: The above link plays two channels at once so you need to open volume control and adjust the balance to left or right.

@Litchie "blog it"

This is where I post my blogs. Is there actually a blog section...?

@boycieGames would be loaded off cassettes and take 5 - 10 min each time.

The Spectrum could actually load cartridges but only a couple of games were made for them. Cassettes were basically free if copied or only about £5 new and with a sleeve from a shop.

EDIT: Turns out there is a blog section. Maybe I will next time Litchie. I wonder if anyone will read it...

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jcrame10

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#11 jcrame10
Member since 2014 • 6302 Posts

@boycie: see, I never even knew any of that. My first console was SNES.

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Jag85

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#12  Edited By Jag85
Member since 2005 • 19376 Posts

My top 5 consoles:

  • Sega Master System
  • Sega Mega Drive
  • SNES
  • PS1
  • PS2

My top 5 home computers:

  • BBC Micro
  • NEC PC-98
  • Amiga
  • Sharp X68000
  • FM Towns

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Jag85

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#13 Jag85
Member since 2005 • 19376 Posts

@jackamomo: Sega CD is a solid underrated system (if you ignore the FMV shovelware). But 32X is garbage.

But yeah, the Sega Mega Drive is the more powerful console. The SNES can do more colourful graphics, but the Mega Drive toasts it in almost every other way.

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br0kenrabbit

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#14 br0kenrabbit
Member since 2004 • 17851 Posts

@jackamomo said:

@br0kenrabbit: graphics gotta go to SNES

Did you really buy all that 32x/SegaCD junk? You must be rich

So if you include frame rate, play speed, play area and sprite size into what you mean by 'graphics' the SNES is simply trounced.

Yes, I bought them on launch. I was in high school with a job and no bills.

Look at Mortal Kombat 2. I had this game for the SNES, the Genesis, and the 32X. 32X version was the best, but that's not in play here.

Select Baraka on the SNES and you get blades out, a bow, and then he stands back up. Do it on the Genesis and you get blades out, a bow and....oh no out of memory, just keep him in a bow. And it wasn't just the character select screen that was dropping frames, either. A lot of fatalities dropped frames (victim does not slide down Barakas blades on the Genesis after impalement). But a lot of the attacks dropped frames, too, and this threw the whole timing off. That's something you do not want in a fighter.

And that's all aside from the muted colors and laryngitis voice.

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jun_aka_pekto

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#15  Edited By jun_aka_pekto
Member since 2010 • 25255 Posts

Commodore Amiga and only Commodore Amiga.

The capabilities of Motorola 68XXX computers (Commodore Amiga, Atari ST, Apple Macs) initially far exceeded the capabilities of PCs back then. But, most apps in the workplace were for the IBM-compatibles (aka the PC as we know it today). So, it was the PC marketshare that grew by leaps and bounds despite being the inferior platform.

I loved the 3DO. Few people bought it because of the high price (1993 $700 ~ +$1200 in 2018). I'm sure the idea of a $1200 console today would sound crazy.

But, when I bought one and placed it in the TV lounge of my dormitory, the other dorm rats couldn't leave it alone. It was in use almost 24/7. Most of them played Madden 3DO, Road Rash 3DO..... Someone bought Super Street Fighter 4 Turbo 3DO to play on it. The same guy bought the 3DO from me the following year.

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poptart

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#16  Edited By poptart
Member since 2003 • 7298 Posts

Biscuits tastes aside, that’s a pretty good list. The alterations I would make though are:

Replace the Spectrum with the C64 – it really felt a step above its rubber keyed brethren, and seemingly endless releases of great games up until the release of the Amiga.

Shout out to the Atari ST – its music capabilities were great (albeit non-music related mind you, i.e. its compatibility with Cubase).

Oh and Pele Soccer was rubbish. Admittedly I didn’t get around to playing until around 82/83, by which time International Soccer was released on the C64 which blew it out of the pond (i.e. you weren’t restricted to moving around in a triangle formation).

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Jackamomo

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#17 Jackamomo
Member since 2017 • 2157 Posts

@poptart: Pele Soccer was rubbish

Yeah but did you see the fireworks when you score a goal? Impressive for a 2600. But yeah a very simple football game but still playable.

Shout out to the Atari ST – its music capabilities were great (albeit non-music related mind you, i.e. its compatibility with Cubase).

Yes Atari ST's were in every music studio at the time. Amiga's were used for graphics with Deluxe Paint and Trackers made use of the 4 channel pcm sound card (no fm) where the ST had fm synth and midi out of the box and is where Cubase and Logic Pro started (wiki). The ST also used trackers, using the fm synth to create rapid notes in the chiptune style as well as the sequencing software like Cubase.

PS: I can't edit my original post any more but I just wanted to add Lemmings to the Amiga and Tom Clancy's Splinter Cell to the PS2.

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poptart

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#18  Edited By poptart
Member since 2003 • 7298 Posts

@jackamomo said:

@poptart: Pele Soccer was rubbish

Yeah but did you see the fireworks when you score a goal? Impressive for a 2600. But yeah a very simple football game but still playable.

Shout out to the Atari ST – its music capabilities were great (albeit non-music related mind you, i.e. its compatibility with Cubase).

Yes Atari ST's were in every music studio at the time. Amiga's were used for graphics with Deluxe Paint and Trackers made use of the 4 channel pcm sound card (no fm) where the ST had fm synth and midi out of the box and is where Cubase and Logic Pro started (wiki). The ST also used trackers, using the fm synth to create rapid notes in the chiptune style as well as the sequencing software like Cubase.

PS: I can't edit my original post any more but I just wanted to add Lemmings to the Amiga and Tom Clancy's Splinter Cell to the PS2.

TBH I haven't played it for well over 30 years. I just had a wee peek and confess I don't remember the fireworks at all. Lovely though - it's a shame they didn't implement some kind of rioting as well.

Yes the ST was great for Cubase. I know nothing else of its inner gurglings mind you, however I wrote my (astonishingly shit) GCSE music pieces using it back in the day. These days it seems like a right old pain in the arse compared to the likes of Logic.

Lemmings is a good call. Splinter cell on the PS2 mind you was just a bleached out version of the earlier Xbox version, but still decent I guess.

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R4gn4r0k

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#19 R4gn4r0k
Member since 2004 • 45993 Posts
@boycie said:

Half of them are not consoles. The Spectrum for instance is a computer (not PC) from the mid 80's.

Games would be loaded off cassettes and take 5 - 10 min each time.

Time to upgrade your PC, bro

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xantufrog

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#20 xantufrog  Moderator
Member since 2013 • 17875 Posts

I always preferred Sega, but I don't know how any list covering that era could exclude SNES. I prefer the Genesis, but the SNES has got to be indisputably one of the best platforms of all time. It oozes fun.

I play my Dreamcast all the time. With the VGA adapter, some games literally look like Wii games with maybe some more mediocre textures but sharper image. It was so ahead of its time

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uninspiredcup

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#21 uninspiredcup
Member since 2013 • 58643 Posts

Aside from Mario 3 (and maybe Mario 2) I always thought the NES was pretty shit compared to the MS.

The Master System is just full of wonderful memories, so kinda bias.

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Jackamomo

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#22  Edited By Jackamomo
Member since 2017 • 2157 Posts

@xantufrog: if the SNES oozes fun then why do you play your Dreamcast and not SNES. Why? Because Jurassic Park is why.

I looked at the top 100 and there’s nothing special in there.

For every game there is a much better version or game on the Mega Drive.

I only put it in because it’s an objectively good console. It’s just simply anaemic when compared to the SMD.

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xantufrog

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#23 xantufrog  Moderator
Member since 2013 • 17875 Posts

@jackamomo: i don't get it? Dreamcast is probably my favorite console, but that doesn't games like Super Mario World, DKC, Chrono Trigger, Mega Man X, Ogre Battle, etc aren't a blast...

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PAL360

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#24 PAL360
Member since 2007 • 30570 Posts

Great list TC. Here's mine:

1. Amiga 500

2. Megadrive

3. Playstation 4

4. Playstation 1

5. Snes

6. Nes

7. ZXSpectrum

8. Xbox (original)

9. Dreamcast

10. Xbox 360

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poptart

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#25 poptart
Member since 2003 • 7298 Posts

@xantufrog said:

@jackamomo: i don't get it? Dreamcast is probably my favorite console, but that doesn't games like Super Mario World, DKC, Chrono Trigger, Mega Man X, Ogre Battle, etc aren't a blast...

Oh to visit Ragol these days and to wander as lonely as a cloud...

Actually I used to love the DC dearly, although I only have a handful of games left mind you. What games do you feel really stand the test of time on the DC these days?

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xantufrog

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#26 xantufrog  Moderator
Member since 2013 • 17875 Posts

@poptart: granted, many of these have newer ports, but I think games like Skies of Arcadia, Jet Set Radio, Ecco (still gorgeous and hard as hell), Wetrix are all just about as great as they were back in the day. Games like Legacy of Kain and Code Veronica are also great, although they're either not distinctly "Dreamcast" (the former) or haven't aged quite as well (the latter, but still worth a play)

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poptart

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#27 poptart
Member since 2003 • 7298 Posts

@xantufrog said:

@poptart: granted, many of these have newer ports, but I think games like Skies of Arcadia, Jet Set Radio, Ecco (still gorgeous and hard as hell), Wetrix are all just about as great as they were back in the day. Games like Legacy of Kain and Code Veronica are also great, although they're either not distinctly "Dreamcast" (the former) or haven't aged quite as well (the latter, but still worth a play)

Nice. I would like to revisit Ecco as I sold it after I discovered how bad I was at manoeuvring a dolphin. I recall it looked amazing at the time though. I always meant to play Skies of Arcadia but for whatever reason passed me by - I'll see if I can find it somewhere, and seeing as I found my old HOTD light gun, I'll grab that as well. The ones I have left probably haven't aged as well (Space Channel 5, Wacky Racers, Shenmue). The one I game I dust off to play more is worms world party - not the most DC game either mind you...

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Telekill

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#28 Telekill
Member since 2003 • 12061 Posts

Honestly, that's a nice list. Not sure why 8 systems but here's mine with some favorite titles listed. PS4 is my current favorite of all time for various reasons.

PS4 (obviously still have)

  • Uncharted series
  • RDR2
  • Horizon ZD
  • God of War
  • Tons of previous gen games

Genesis (still have)

  • Sonic
  • Jurassic Park
  • Streets of Rage
  • Earthworm Jim
  • Ninja Turtles HH

Game Gear / SMS (still have)

  • Sonic
  • Jurassic Park
  • Streets of Rage
  • Ecco the Dolphin
  • Mickey Land of Illusion

PS1

  • Resident Evil
  • Tomb Raider 2
  • Destruction Derby
  • Twisted Metal 2
  • Dino Crisis

Dreamcast

  • Shenmue
  • Ecco
  • Jet Grind Radio
  • Daytona
  • RE Code Veronica

Gamecube

  • Zelda series
  • Smash Bros
  • RE Remake
  • Star Fox Adventures
  • Mario Sunshine

NES

  • Ninja Turtles series
  • Double Dragon series
  • Micro Machines
  • Ducktales
  • Dodge Ball

PS2

  • Prince of Persia series
  • God of War
  • ICO
  • Max Payne
  • RE Outbreak series
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Jackamomo

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#29 Jackamomo
Member since 2017 • 2157 Posts

@poptart: Dreamcast games i’d like to play but stupidly can’t because my cd writer broke are Cannon Spike, Alien Front Online, Bangai-O, Aero Wings, Armada, Border Down, Bomberman Online, Elemental Gimmick Gear, F355 Challenge, Mark of the Wolves, maybe Frame Gride, Fur Fighters, MSR, GTA2, Makkan-X, Headhunter, Mr Driller, all the 2K games Rayman 2, Toejam and Earl 3 beta, Re-Volt, Rez, Slave Zero... Then look up Dreamcast NAOMI games and they should all be arcade perfect conversions.

Ecco was really boring albeit with nice control. It started slow, went on to be slow, then slowed towards then end.

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Jag85

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#30 Jag85
Member since 2005 • 19376 Posts

@jackamomo: The Atari ST's default Yamaha YM2149 sound chip wasn't FM synthesis, but was PSG chiptune. Did later models have FM synthesis?

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#31  Edited By ronvalencia
Member since 2008 • 29612 Posts

@jackamomo:

My Amiga with original chipset (I legally purchased Amiga Forever for licensed operating system ROMs)

Shadow Fighters

Elf Mania

Brian the Lion

Lionheart

Shadow of the Beast

Battle Squadron

Hybris

----

Mega Drive's CPU is 32bit ALU with 16 bit external bus Motorola 68000 not 6800

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#32  Edited By ronvalencia
Member since 2008 • 29612 Posts

@jun_aka_pekto said:

Commodore Amiga and only Commodore Amiga.

The capabilities of Motorola 68XXX computers (Commodore Amiga, Atari ST, Apple Macs) initially far exceeded the capabilities of PCs back then. But, most apps in the workplace were for the IBM-compatibles (aka the PC as we know it today). So, it was the PC marketshare that grew by leaps and bounds despite being the inferior platform.

I loved the 3DO. Few people bought it because of the high price (1993 $700 ~ +$1200 in 2018). I'm sure the idea of a $1200 console today would sound crazy.

But, when I bought one and placed it in the TV lounge of my dormitory, the other dorm rats couldn't leave it alone. It was in use almost 24/7. Most of them played Madden 3DO, Road Rash 3DO..... Someone bought Super Street Fighter 4 Turbo 3DO to play on it. The same guy bought the 3DO from me the following year.

Intel 386SX at 16 Mhz with 387 FPU at 33Mhz (one of my first OC) was close to Amiga 3000's 68030 with 68882 FPU at 25 Mhz when both running Imagine 3D.

Amiga 3000's 68882 OC to 50Mhz was jumper wire hack directly to motherboard's 50 Mhz crystal clock.

Motorola didn't offer integrated 68020/68882 FPU as alternative to falling price low end 486DX and late/expensive 68040.

68020 and 68030 has similar IPC with main difference are cache and integrated MMU.

Many 68K platform vendors was looking to RISC alternatives after Motorola dumps post-68060 road map i.e. Motorola killed their own 68K market.

Motorola didn't not respect backward compatibility like Intel, hence many issues with legacy software support on faster 68K CPUs e.g. 68010 or 68012 can cause compatibility issues let alone 68020 and above 68K CPUs.

Commodore didn't sufficiently upgrade their CPU IP with 65xx series CPUs after dominating the 8bit era micro-computers.

I used my Amiga 500 for school presentation (connected to school's large CRT TV) when everybody else has paper posters. Amiga 500 was semi-portable.

Our school's art department has Amiga 3000 machine. I remember using MacOS on my Amiga 3000 :p.

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Jackamomo

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#33 Jackamomo
Member since 2017 • 2157 Posts

@Jag85: I looked PSG and it means ‘programmable sound generator’ and uses multiple waveforms to generate sound using envolopes etc and the Amiga uses PCM (pulse code modulation) which is 4 channel samples. The ST has 3 channels.

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#34 poptart
Member since 2003 • 7298 Posts

@jackamomo said:

@poptart: Dreamcast games i’d like to play but stupidly can’t because my cd writer broke are Cannon Spike, Alien Front Online, Bangai-O, Aero Wings, Armada, Border Down, Bomberman Online, Elemental Gimmick Gear, F355 Challenge, Mark of the Wolves, maybe Frame Gride, Fur Fighters, MSR, GTA2, Makkan-X, Headhunter, Mr Driller, all the 2K games Rayman 2, Toejam and Earl 3 beta, Re-Volt, Rez, Slave Zero... Then look up Dreamcast NAOMI games and they should all be arcade perfect conversions.

Ecco was really boring albeit with nice control. It started slow, went on to be slow, then slowed towards then end.

Ha - that's a fair list. I remember buying Bangai-O and wondering why exactly I was playing it or what the purpose of it was - a curious indulgence as it were. I thought headhunter looked interesting, as did Maxen-X. One day I'll give them a bang.

As for Ecco, yeas I agree it was slow, but that didn't stop me from being utterly rubbish at it, and its never pleasant watching a dolphin die :(

I've just had a look for Skies of Arcadia. £80 on Amazon - bah :/

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#35 deactivated-5f4e2292197f1
Member since 2015 • 1374 Posts

I think its weird when people tell you why they loved a system, but then just tell you stats...feels more like a history lesson.

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#36 poptart
Member since 2003 • 7298 Posts

@saltslasher said:

I think its weird when people tell you why they loved a system, but then just tell you stats...feels more like a history lesson.

I 87% agree with this

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#37  Edited By Star67
Member since 2005 • 5166 Posts

I can understand if you want to debate that the Mega drive/Genesis was more fun; but aside from a few games the SNES had better graphics.....and I'm a SEGA guy

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#38 PAL360
Member since 2007 • 30570 Posts

@Star67: That's not that linear. Snes could handle much more colors on screen, but Megadrive usually offered a smoother experience, better animations, more sprites, etc, which are also part of graphics aspect. Streets of Rage 2 vs any Snes beat em up is a good example of that.

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#39  Edited By Jackamomo
Member since 2017 • 2157 Posts

@Star67: but aside from a few games the SNES had better graphics

This comment is true if you reverse the statement. The SNES had a few games which had better graphics.

You had to be a master of programming the system though. The SNES Ricoh chip had a complicated instruction set and you had to master the various modes then build a game around that pretext before you can get Mega Man X level of graphics.

You are always going to get your Beethoven's on SNES and Back to the Future 3's on SMD but at baseline, mid level of game visuals the SMD has a higher mean point average of graphics compared to the SNES.

Otherwise, if it's a port, it will always be inferior. Weirdly, Desert Strike runs most smooth of all the versions but is let down by explosion sprites and low quality sound samples.

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#40 Archangel3371
Member since 2004 • 43988 Posts

The SNES is probably my all time favourite system. So many amazing games on it that I had a great time with.

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#41  Edited By Jag85
Member since 2005 • 19376 Posts
@jun_aka_pekto said:

The capabilities of Motorola 68XXX computers (Commodore Amiga, Atari ST, Apple Macs) initially far exceeded the capabilities of PCs back then. But, most apps in the workplace were for the IBM-compatibles (aka the PC as we know it today). So, it was the PC marketshare that grew by leaps and bounds despite being the inferior platform.

It's also worth mentioning another 68k-based computer, the Sharp X68000, which was the most powerful home gaming system of the 1980s. It was capable of almost arcade-quality graphics, so much so that Capcom used it as a development machine for CPS arcade games like Street Fighter and Final Fight, as the X68000 came close to CPS1 specs. The X68000 was not surpassed by any home gaming system up until the Neo Geo released in 1990.

As for IBM-compatible PCs, in the '80s they couldn't even handle scrolling as well as the NES. John Romero and John Carmack mentioned how smooth NES-like scrolling wasn't possible on PC (i.e. IBM-compatible) until Carmack came up with the "adaptive tile refresh" algorithm for a Super Mario Bros clone, which became the basis for Commander Keen in 1990. It was only after getting past this roadblock that Romero and Carmack were eventually able to create fast-scrolling FPS games like Wolfenstein 3D and Doom for PC in the early '90s.

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#42  Edited By ronvalencia
Member since 2008 • 29612 Posts

@Jag85 said:
@jun_aka_pekto said:

The capabilities of Motorola 68XXX computers (Commodore Amiga, Atari ST, Apple Macs) initially far exceeded the capabilities of PCs back then. But, most apps in the workplace were for the IBM-compatibles (aka the PC as we know it today). So, it was the PC marketshare that grew by leaps and bounds despite being the inferior platform.

It's also worth mentioning another 68k-based computer, the Sharp X68000, which was the most powerful home gaming system of the 1980s. It was capable of almost arcade-quality graphics, so much so that Capcom used it as a development machine for CPS arcade games like Street Fighter and Final Fight, as the X68000 came close to CPS1 specs. The X68000 was not surpassed by any home gaming system up until the Neo Geo released in 1990.

As for IBM-compatible PCs, in the '80s they couldn't even handle scrolling as well as the NES. John Romero and John Carmack mentioned how smooth NES-like scrolling wasn't possible on PC (i.e. IBM-compatible) until Carmack came up with the "adaptive tile refresh" algorithm for a Super Mario Bros clone, which became the basis for Commander Keen in 1990. It was only after getting past this roadblock that Romero and Carmack were eventually able to create fast-scrolling FPS games like Wolfenstein 3D and Doom for PC in the early '90s.

VGA has chunky pixel graphics format hence PC has the correct choice for Doom type games which ultimately dominated the industry to this day.

X68000 was release on March 1987 with 369,000Â¥, approximately $3,000 (US) at the time which is not home gaming system price.

Commodore wasted their R&D resources on Commodore 65 chipset which has 256 colors from 4096 color pallet which should have been allocated to Amiga's chipset upgrades instead of half baked ECS upgrade.

Commodore 65 (1990 to 1991) was seen to be operational. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commodore_65#/media/File:C65.jpg

My Amiga 3000 relied on 24 bit graphics card add-on which is based on PC SVGA chipsets..

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#43  Edited By scatteh316
Member since 2004 • 10273 Posts

I like this statement in regards to the Dreamcast

The games run pretty smoothly and generally look and sound better than the PS2 counterpart

Errr.... no.... DC versions were downgraded compared to PS2 versions and quite heavily in some cases.

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#44 poptart
Member since 2003 • 7298 Posts

@scatteh316 said:

I like this statement in regards to the Dreamcast

The games run pretty smoothly and generally look and sound better than the PS2 counterpart

Errr.... no.... DC versions were downgraded compared to PS2 versions and quite heavily in some cases.

Crazy taxi maybe? I mean the PS2 kind of slithered out like an insipid damp guff, which was kind of sad after Sony lauded its emotion engine - everyone expected it to smash the DC out of the park.

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#45  Edited By scatteh316
Member since 2004 • 10273 Posts
@poptart said:
@scatteh316 said:

I like this statement in regards to the Dreamcast

The games run pretty smoothly and generally look and sound better than the PS2 counterpart

Errr.... no.... DC versions were downgraded compared to PS2 versions and quite heavily in some cases.

Crazy taxi maybe? I mean the PS2 kind of slithered out like an insipid damp guff, which was kind of sad after Sony lauded its emotion engine - everyone expected it to smash the DC out of the park.

It did smash the DC out the park......... I think people need to remind themselves of how bad DC games actually looked.

Just look at the Digital Foundry Unreal Tournament video they did on DC and PS2.... the difference between the 2 is huge and PS2 is miles ahead.

DC did have a clearer output in some games but in terms of the actual graphics themselves, DC was miles behind.

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#46 poptart
Member since 2003 • 7298 Posts

@scatteh316 said:
@poptart said:
@scatteh316 said:

I like this statement in regards to the Dreamcast

The games run pretty smoothly and generally look and sound better than the PS2 counterpart

Errr.... no.... DC versions were downgraded compared to PS2 versions and quite heavily in some cases.

Crazy taxi maybe? I mean the PS2 kind of slithered out like an insipid damp guff, which was kind of sad after Sony lauded its emotion engine - everyone expected it to smash the DC out of the park.

It did smash the DC out the park......... I think people need to remind themselves of how bad DC games actually looked.

Just look at the Digital Foundry Unreal Tournament video they did on DC and PS2.... the difference between the 2 is huge and PS2 is miles ahead.

DC did have a clearer output in some games but in terms of the actual graphics themselves, DC was miles behind.

For me it took until GTA3 before I really noticed (or maybe GT3) it was a step up. Until then I didn't really feel there was much in it tbh, and by the time the PS2 really got in its stride the GC and Xbox demo's were coming out so it was a bit hey-ho. I don't think it smashed the DC out of the park, and certainly it wasn't the powerhouse that everyone was expecting.

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#47  Edited By scatteh316
Member since 2004 • 10273 Posts
@poptart said:
@scatteh316 said:
@poptart said:
@scatteh316 said:

I like this statement in regards to the Dreamcast

The games run pretty smoothly and generally look and sound better than the PS2 counterpart

Errr.... no.... DC versions were downgraded compared to PS2 versions and quite heavily in some cases.

Crazy taxi maybe? I mean the PS2 kind of slithered out like an insipid damp guff, which was kind of sad after Sony lauded its emotion engine - everyone expected it to smash the DC out of the park.

It did smash the DC out the park......... I think people need to remind themselves of how bad DC games actually looked.

Just look at the Digital Foundry Unreal Tournament video they did on DC and PS2.... the difference between the 2 is huge and PS2 is miles ahead.

DC did have a clearer output in some games but in terms of the actual graphics themselves, DC was miles behind.

For me it took until GTA3 before I really noticed (or maybe GT3) it was a step up. Until then I didn't really feel there was much in it tbh, and by the time the PS2 really got in its stride the GC and Xbox demo's were coming out so it was a bit hey-ho. I don't think it smashed the DC out of the park, and certainly it wasn't the powerhouse that everyone was expecting.

Tekken Tag was way a head of anything on Dreamcast and it was a launch title.

PS2 had double the memory of Dreamcast so it was never going to be able to compete with PS2.

Games like Burnout, SSX, Final Fantasy 10....... would take massive hits to the visuals to run on DC.

Heck look at the PS2 vs DC articles comparing Quake 3 ports on both...... PS2 smashes it.... it's not even close... PS2 could handle more textures, more polygons, more particles, more lighting.......just more of everything.

PS2 was a powerhouse, it just took it's time to show it due to it's hardware design.

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#48 robert_sparkes
Member since 2018 • 7181 Posts

Dreamcast amazed me at the time as it was the first console to allow me to play arcade perfect games at home. The ps2 definitely midway through the lifecycle showed it's power.

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#49 Bond007uk
Member since 2002 • 1633 Posts

The Amiga 500 was a dream computer I'd wanted for ages growing up - alas, I was stuck with a C64 in the 80's.

I had a Sega Mega Drive for a couple of years in the early 90's, then my brother's friend was selling an Amiga 500+ in 1994 with 30 odd games. It was a purchase well made. I only had it for a few years when I finally got a PC. But I have fond memories of that A500+

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#50 poptart
Member since 2003 • 7298 Posts

@scatteh316 said:
@poptart said:
@scatteh316 said:
@poptart said:
@scatteh316 said:

I like this statement in regards to the Dreamcast

The games run pretty smoothly and generally look and sound better than the PS2 counterpart

Errr.... no.... DC versions were downgraded compared to PS2 versions and quite heavily in some cases.

Crazy taxi maybe? I mean the PS2 kind of slithered out like an insipid damp guff, which was kind of sad after Sony lauded its emotion engine - everyone expected it to smash the DC out of the park.

It did smash the DC out the park......... I think people need to remind themselves of how bad DC games actually looked.

Just look at the Digital Foundry Unreal Tournament video they did on DC and PS2.... the difference between the 2 is huge and PS2 is miles ahead.

DC did have a clearer output in some games but in terms of the actual graphics themselves, DC was miles behind.

For me it took until GTA3 before I really noticed (or maybe GT3) it was a step up. Until then I didn't really feel there was much in it tbh, and by the time the PS2 really got in its stride the GC and Xbox demo's were coming out so it was a bit hey-ho. I don't think it smashed the DC out of the park, and certainly it wasn't the powerhouse that everyone was expecting.

Tekken Tag was way a head of anything on Dreamcast and it was a launch title.

PS2 had double the memory of Dreamcast so it was never going to be able to compete with PS2.

Games like Burnout, SSX, Final Fantasy 10....... would take massive hits to the visuals to run on DC.

Heck look at the PS2 vs DC articles comparing Quake 3 ports on both...... PS2 smashes it.... it's not even close... PS2 could handle more textures, more polygons, more particles, more lighting.......just more of everything.

PS2 was a powerhouse, it just took it's time to show it due to it's hardware design.

Tekken Tag way ahead? Ha no - there's an argument for whether it looked even better the Soulcalibre. Perhaps the UK version did, but there really isn't much in it, and certainly it didn't arrive with the fanfare the original demo suggested. Sure it got going and as I mentioned it did feel like a step up by the time GTA3 came out, but then the GC and Xbox came along and stepped it up again.