Is Divinity 2 and Dragon Age Origins the best rpgs ever made?

If you remove your nostalgia lenses, if we check the best gameplay, story and balance, then these are the best rpgs ever created.

So why not Baldurs Gate 2 instead of Origins, you might ask? Well, BG2 had this annoying mechanic that you had to rest to recharge your spells, which was immensely detracting from the gameplay fun factor. Origins was basically BG2 successor, but had much better gameplay due to rechargable spells.

In turn, Divinity 2 has the best rpg XCOM combat, where you must plan carefully your actions and use the environment for a tactical advantage. Original Sin has a better a story and gameplay in my opinion, but Origins was in real time, so it had a better action fluidity, therefore they kinda balance each other.

Both games have immensely satisfying class leveling and party based RPG gameplay.

There is just no RPG gameplay as fun as these two games provide. This is why i consider these two games the best modern rpgs ever made.

Perhaps some of your favorite rpgs might have a better story or some other elements, but when it comes down to tactical rpg gameplay, Orgins and Original Sin 2 trumple their competition.

No. its these 2 are. 2 of best RPGs ever still and nothing come close.

Dragon Age Origins is pretty shite. It got propped up back then because we were desperate for classic RPG's and nobody realized yet that Bioware were a bunch of hacks.

Divinity? Series has always been underrated. The pre-Original Sin games you could get OP as **** and kill everything with minimal effott, but they had excellent writing. Like Fable, if it was actually funny.

Play and complete DA O now and then come back. DA I is better, and that is saying something.

Origins? Its redeeming factor is that it's less bad than the sequels

I have no foundation for saying so. I’ve not played either but am interested in Divinity 2.

My favorite game is FFIX, an RPG, but not because of its mechanics. So I could be persuaded off my perch with a sufficient argument.

DAO is easily one of the best RPGs I've ever played, 100% that game, replayed it 6 times with all Origins, loved the story and most of the characters.

Dragon Age Origins was pretty bad when it came out, and I don't think it has aged well since then. I wouldn't put it in my top 50 RPGs of all time.

The combat, party options, dungeon design, world design and difficulty curve are all *significantly* worse than BG2. Many of the main-quest dungeons were painful to play through - they were just so monotonous, without a shred of creativity or variety to them.

The only thing that Dragon Age Origins did better was...uh...lighting?

I need to play Divinity 2

You mean Divinity: original sin 2.

Divinity 2 also exists, nowhere close to the same game.

Haven't played DOS2. I need to. It looks rad. But there's no way in hell I'd rank DA:O that high. It's only "ok"

DoS 2 is amazing, Origins is meh.

you put Divinity and Dragon Age in the same sentence ?!!!

Lol Dragon Age. Good one.

My brother and I were looking at local coop games. We thought Divnity 2 was going to be something like Diablo or Gauntlet. Within 5 minutes of playing, we discovered it was one of those disgusting turned based RPGs. I quickly shut the game off and requested a refund from MS. Thank god that worked. I got Diablo 3 instead and we've been having a blast since.

I support a thread praising these two games.

Big thumbs up to Larian for being awesome.

Dragon Age Origins is indeed one of the best RPGs of all time in my opinion, great game.

Origins is one of my favorite games. Back when Bioware's games still had a soul. Great atmosphere, story, characters and soundtrack. Initially, the tactical combat turned me off but I got used it. Never played Divinity.

@misrespect: ...do you buy games without reading what they are often?

lol

KOTOR >>>> All. :P

Haven't played Origins yet, but Divinity OS2, The Witcher 3, and Kingdom Come Deliverance are up there, in my opinion.

@ghosts4ever said:

No. its these 2 are. 2 of best RPGs ever still and nothing come close.

Lol, you probably never played DOS2. Stop living in the past, these games have been surpassed.

@knight-k said:

@ghosts4ever said:

No. its these 2 are. 2 of best RPGs ever still and nothing come close.

Lol, you probably never played DOS2. Stop living in the past, these games have been surpassed.

because i hate RPGs. and those 2 are also 2 of best games ever made too.

@xantufrog: didn't say anywhere it was turn based, dummy.

@ghosts4ever: Why should anyone take your opinion on rpgs serious then?

PS: love deus ex.

@misrespect: So you did 0 research on a game you purchased?

I don't know about "best ever made", but Dragon Age: Origins is certainly one of the best.

No

Dragon Age; Origins has too many flaws to be called the best RPG and everyone here knows I loved that game. Divinity 2 is a different game. Divinity: Original Sin 2 is different. If you are talking about Original Sin series then yeah I can agree along with few other titles.

@misrespect: what? Anyone who read about this game - which was one of the most publicised RPGs in recent years, would have immediately learned that information. Everyone and their mom has reviewed this game. It's one of the most highly ranked RPGs.

And you have the nerve/irony to call me a dummy for asking why you didn't know anything about the game before you bought it.

I'll ask again: do you buy games without reading what they are often?

*edit* here - literally the second "about this game" highlight on the front page

Not really.

Neither game is even part of the conversation.

Deus Ex > Your SOUL

Saying Dragon Age Origins is better than BG2 is like saying Kraft Mac and Cheese is better than melting authentic cheddar into noodles. I like Kraft well enough but it will never beat the real thing, let's be honest with ourselves.

Saying it isn't as good because you recharge spells by resting is honestly the worst criticism I have heard of an RPG in quite a while.

Never start a discussion with a ol' "nostalgia" dismissive bullshit that makes you look like you're not worth reading. If you're not worth reading, then what's the point in the time you wasted writing your post?

I disagree about Origins vs. Baldur's Gate 2, because Origins is 3D and controls/looks/plays significantly worse than its 2D counterpart, besides, its plot/characters/writing in general is significantly worse than in Baldur's Gate 2. Not even the same ballpark.

Haven't played Original Sin and Original Sin 2, they have absolutely nothing that can grab me unfortunately, alltho i do know their combat is praised and i do respect that.

There's nothing nostalgic personally speaking in mentioning these off the top of my head:

• Planescape: Torment
• Baldur's Gate 2: Shadow of Amn
• Gothic 2: Gold Edition
• Fallout/Fallout 2/Fallout: New Vegas
• Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines

And arguing they're some of the best role playing games ever made, i replay them often as well so i can keep the experience fresh in my mind, and they're brilliant because they transcend any face value bullshit a lot of video games are subject to because of trends.

Origins was not a good game.

Baldur's Gate 2 had better

• Controls
• Encounter design
• Enemy design
• Characters
• Quests
• Writing

DAO seemed to think, a lot of pausing does a good, deep and tactical game make. But DAO was really shallow. In BG2, you could pause, but you didnt need to pause all that much, especially since the martial characters were pretty much entirely automated and you didnt need to constantly check for cooldowns. And in BG2, spells were best for countering what your opponent did, not throwing them out nilly willy.

Pillars of Eternity got this stuff done so much better.

Divinity: Original Sin 2 was a good game. but it had 3 critical flaws that practically ruined my ability to enjoy it.

The armor system was poorly thought out. Encouraging mono builds, making mixed physical and magical damage nowhere near as effective as single damage types.

Random loot is still a thing, leading to uninspired drops.

The level/power curve was always awful.

I loved DA:O. It was very customizable and I think it was my first WRPG.

I miss the Macro/bot commands in that first game.

@hafnalas: Lol. So triggered you created an account to bump a year old thread?

Dragon Age sucks

Baldur's Gate II all the way.

DAO was a great experience and was worthy of multiple playthroughs, DA2 and DAI are not very good games imo and do not feel like DA particularly.

Best ever? dont know about that, but to this day the RPG I have put the most time in to remains KOTOR2, definitely not the best rpg ever made but goddamn if obsidian didn't craft something special.

Both of those games are pretty bad.

Dragon Age Origins was a single player MMORPG with godawful pacing. Copy Paste Encounter Design, and Cooldowns which made combat even more clunky than it already was.

Divinity Original Sin 2 had a plethora of issues, ranging from the Armor System, The Itemization, The Power Curve, The Writing, The DPS Meta, The Sameiness of every Build because of that Meta, How the Terribad balance makes all of the combat engine's strengths null and void.

Edit: ... Necro Thread.

Dude, BG2 never took itself seriously, and Irenicus was a mediocre character made great by his excellent delivery. Yes Minsc was very dumb, but he was Memorable, I cannot say I remember a single character from DAO.

Revealing villains only until the last moment is pretty dull writing. It doesnt make them more terrifying. It makes them barely contribute to the narrative. Oftentimes I would forget the archfiend even existed. It is one of the reason Dragon Quest, barring 4 and 9 have such terrible villains. Opinions are opinions, I found the entirety of DA:Os areas forgettable. The Areas of BG2 were a love letter to any D&D Fans, exactly how a lot of us would visualize areas we had in a D&D setting.

BG2 isn't perfect, of course, nor is it even close to the best RPG ever made, nor the best D&D licensed game (Temple of Elemental Evil, Pool of Radiance, Knights of the Chalice and Planescape Torment are all better D&D licenced RPGs). But unlike DAO, it actually held my interest.

OP must be relatively new to genre, or....

Anyone played Disco Elysium. It does qualify as an RPG doesn't it?

I'm a huge Baldur's Gate, Planescape: Torment and Icewind Dale fan but it was required to remove our nostalgia lenses. With them on, Planescape: Torment wins in my book.

Defining characteristic of a RPG isn't the combat system, not even a story even tho it plays a huge factor. It's the freedom of choice, character customization.

Really if you haven't check Disco Elyisum.

@hankmulder: This thread was created a long time before Disco Elusium came out. But sure, it's certainly part of the conversation.

@Maroxad:

Divinity, Original Sin's plus points: -

1. Exceptional combat. We feel both relaxed and strategic. In Real time games, combat is usually either very easy or involves pausing, which IMO is a downgrade for gameplay. Either you become like "Kohan" or "Praetorians" two obscure games which had awesome real time combat (doable because game's pace was much slower) or you play turn based. Fast real time combat like Age of Empires or BG2 is only good for either pausing or playing like a speed freak. Or maybe turn it into Diablo 2, clickfest.

2. World is really beautifully made (disregarding a few cartoonish skeletons/orcs)

3. Mechanics are enjoyable, never is stealing so satisfying and solving murders makes you feel like Sherlock holmes.

Its only downgrades are imo is that its a bit too wordy and its camera is a bit weird.

Dude, BG2 never took itself seriously, and Irenicus was a mediocre character made great by his excellent delivery. Yes Minsc was very dumb, but he was Memorable, I cannot say I remember a single character from DAO.

Irenicus's voice was great but his antics and his whole persona was childish. A sulky wannabe god elf (with a physique bigger than a barbarian) performs soul experiments? Where are the details? Where is the ladder leading to us unlocking his secrets? Where is the step by step reveal of his plans? His plans are :- 1. Steal soul 2. Become god. Pretty childish.

Minsc, Anomen, Nalia and Jan were too annoying. Korgan was just gibberish. Keldorn was one of the few good characters in BG2 imo. And the Eyeless cult , Watchers Keep a few of the good locations.

You may not remember, but compare the cosplays, videos, posts, concept art of Alistair, Morrigan and Leliana, the 3 most remembered characters of DAO with anyone from BG2. This game probably also coaxed a large number of female gamers to move into RPGs, as women were simply fascinated by it along with the fantasy nerds.

Revealing villains only until the last moment is pretty dull writing. It doesnt make them more terrifying. It makes them barely contribute to the narrative. Oftentimes I would forget the archfiend even existed. It is one of the reason Dragon Quest, barring 4 and 9 have such terrible villains. Opinions are opinions, I found the entirety of DA:Os areas forgettable. The Areas of BG2 were a love letter to any D&D Fans, exactly how a lot of us would visualize areas we had in a D&D setting.

It does. If you remember Dracula, (the novel), there are hints here and hints there given at each step of Jonathan Harker's journey which make the reader more terrified of the place, where Jonathan is going. That is called subtle immersion. Bringing you face to face with the mastermind is like reading a Wikipedia summary instead of watching the whole movie. Basically you already knew who Irenicus is, what he is capable of and what are his plans. Boring!

Yes, because Archdemon isn't alluded to at a lot of places, instead the blight is. I still remember the words "Maker! The Dragon is at the head of the horde" in the very end, where Riordan and Arl Eamon are discussing saving Denerim.

Exactly, BG2 fanboys are D&D fanboys as well. If you analyze BG2 from a subtle narrative perspective, or a cinematic perspective, it doesn't hold a candle to the great masterpieces. Only because it was a pioneer in its genre, a mammoth of a game, and a sequel to a loved RPG, is what made it so popular. You like it because it maybe stimulates your imagination and fuels your nostalgia. But nostalgia does't make a game, objectively great. Hell, i prefer English folk tales (pixies, brownies, goblins) to High Fantasy of Tolkien purely because of nostalgia. But it doesn't take away the quality and timelessness of Tolkien.

BG2 isn't perfect, of course, nor is it even close to the best RPG ever made, nor the best D&D licensed game (Temple of Elemental Evil, Pool of Radiance, Knights of the Chalice and Planescape Torment are all better D&D licenced RPGs). But unlike DAO, it actually held my interest

I started RPGs with Icewind Dale and Dragon Age Origins. That's why they hold a special place in my heart. But no one seems to remember Icewind Dale, a quaint little game with great narrative and engaging atmosphere. Yet its not nice to color a game's quality by the sheer power of nostalgia. I recognize the fact that icewind dale isn't considered great(despite my liking it) but BG2 fanboys don't seem to understand this fact.

Atmosphere was also severely lacking in BG2. Witcher 1 by comparison, had a melancholy and haunting atmosphere, especially in the first 2 chapters. DAO had an epic "save the world journey" type atmosphere. Icewind dale had a "mystery in the air" kind. Yet BG2 had "mishmash of the most powerful and unique D&D monsters and planes to showcase our programming capabilities" type atmosphere. It never really felt as one game. It had brilliant locations like Watchers Keep to boring drudgery like Athkatla Slums.

No. Not for their time, and not all time.

I agree that RTwP is a step down from turn based. RPGs were afterall built from turn based war games. And DAO was a nightmare to micromanage, since they gave physical characters skills too (and they were of the boring deal extra damage variety).

Irenicus was a lovable throwback to a typical D&D villain how he was for most of the part one step ahead of you. Anomen was extremely forgettable, but I did like his arc about learning to differentiate from lawful stupid and lawful good. But BG2's strengths never lied in its characters it was its worldbuilding, and Encounter Design. Having fans doesnt make them good. Justin Beiber also has fans.

Dracula was a lot more intelligently than the archfiend. The archfiend came across as a completely generic stock fantasy villain. Dracula had that prescence throughout, you just didnt feel the same way with DAOs villain. A generic stock fantasy villain isnt exactly to be feared.

I have no nostalgia for BG2. BG2 had the atmosphere of a fun and goodfy showcasing the Forgotten Realms. It is basically the Super Mario RPG of D&D. That is why the goofy dialogue worked so well for BG2. And DAO wasnt exactly what I would call atmospheric, the leprosy everyone seemed to have kinda ruined it for me. It just reeked of generic. I liked Icewind dale too as well, it was an excellent dungeon crawler.