Is Denuvo DRM ruining gaming industry?

@tr_2016: Sorry, by claiming "it is" doesn't make it so. Either link your support or stay quiet.

It's quite obvious that you are just a desperate pirate who specifically created an account just to spread the forums with your pirate propaganda.

Pirates are very disgusting.

That's a pretty absurd claim... Pirate propaganda? Really in a freaking random video game forum? What would the goal be? Swaying any one here one way or the other will not some how make developers and publishers some how magically stop having drm.

I wanted to stress this point, I think it's a central part of why DRM is used but it's often overlooked in discussions like this. The real goal of DRM is not so much to make it impossible to pirate the game, but to slow down the pirates.

Most run of the mill games makes the bulk of their profit right after launch. If you look at sales numbers where available it's clear that it's not uncommon for a game to make more than 50% of its life time revenue in the first 7 days after it's launch. After a month it will typically have sold 80%-90%. The biggest exceptions to this general pattern is things like STEAM sales that can cause a big sales spike later on and good word to mouth that can keep the sales going longer. But overall, the bulk of a games profit potential lies in the first month after it is launched.

THAT is why Denuvo is such a big deal to publishers. While games eventually get cracked, so far it looks like it's succeeding in protecting the game for those vital first weeks to a month. This means that by the type the DRM is removed, the publisher has already made most of their money of the title.

It used to be common that pirated games were available before the game launched. People could get the game they really wanted for free before, or at the same time that they could get it for $50-$60. This way the publishers can sell the game freely to people who are excited by the game and are anxious to play it. The people who don't really care or want to 'try before they buy' can still pirate the game but they'll have to wait a month or two.

I dunno. Typically the games that employ this type of DRM are uninteresting AAA games.

I'd prefer games to omit DRM, but since I buy all my games it doesn't really make a difference to me. Still... I feel like DRM is very ineffective. I doubt it really affects pirates/sales and at worst it negatively affects game play. At best you don't notice it.

At any rate is doesn't really matter since, as I said before, the denuvo DRM is only used in AAA games. A good majority of which run like crap at launch anyway because big publishers are unreasonable. So who's to say what the root cause is.

I've played 3 denuvo games:

• Dragon Age: Inquisition - absolutely horrendous performance at launch; buggy as hell
• DOOM - Worked well at launch
• MGSV - didn't play at launch, worked well when I played it a few months ago

@sSubZerOo: As absurd as it sounds, it is happening. Don't ask me what logic falls in the minds of desperate pirates.

Previously on reddit's CrackWatch, the desperate pirates were creating waves trying to organise ways to spread propaganda and sabotage Denuvo (by attaching malware with it), and now they even have a Steam curator group just for anti-Denuvo titles.

I love how salty the freeloaders are now that there's an anti-piracy system that actually works pretty well.

You'd think it would be more effective and cheaper for publishers to flood the web with infected cracks and files for pirates to chew on instead of pumping millions into DRM. I'd imagine going through OS re-installs a couple of times would deter those legitimate potential customers.

It would be more effective, but also illegal and can get them sued.

Let's start with the claim that it impacts performance. Please provide reliable proof, not just some article "citing" another article that cites a doggy article from a Ukrainian website that has long pulled down the original article for false information (as it was the case for the original "Denuvo damages DRM" claim.

And remember, just because a game with Denuvo isn't performing well doesn't mean that Denuvo is the cause. There are plenty of games that are terribly optimised in the first place, similarly there are plenty of Denuvo titles that are very well optimised. For example, Rise of the Tomb Raider, Dragon Age Inquisition, DOOM, just to name a few.

even if it gives a graphical downgrade, that does not ruin gaming. The state of the industry does not hinge on that. The prevalence of piracy is a bigger factor

Honestly just stay away from the PC version at launch.

Because the thieves don't bother with games they can't play. Torrents is really your answer...seriously? That's what they want to prevent dude.

it's not ruining games, that just false narrative pushed by sourpuss gaming pirates who are upset they're going to have to start paying for their games for a change

In my view, the best type of DRM is releasing a game thats almost 100gb. It'd take me a month to download and cost me almost 200 dollars in bandwidth usage to download that with my crappy isp.... and anyone with fibre unlimited bandwidth can afford to buy the game anyways.

Another way to actually get people to buy the game is to offer fun online gameplay on top of the single player.

This be truth.

Steam is more intrusive, it takes up a shit ton of resource and can cause major issues with games. But it's easier to get around. This isn't, so bullshit under the guise of some Robin Hood nonsense, when really, it's just filthy scum, the stuff you scrape from the bottom of a dish washer.

They seem to be under the impression if they delude themselves they can delude everyone else. It's very embarrassing.

@lamprey263: Ding ding ding we have a winner! It's funny seeing all the pirates scrambling around trying to make their shitty ways seem legit.

you guys are blaming the game developers for the attempt to stop pirates from illegally using the game content, if it wasn't for the pirates the game developers wouldn't have had to resort to such a strategy.

sure some of the DRM are annoying and may make it it harder for some people to play etc always online drm...

but by saying that it would be nice for the publishers to inform what form of drm it has so if you havent got internet you dont waste a ridiculouse amount on a game you cant even play.

I'd say YouTube is, more than anything else.

It's got the ring of an uncomfortable truth, but I'm not sure why. I feel like I'm making a more informed choice thanks to YT and streaming. Isn't the harmful effect just people buying less of the games they wouldn't have enjoyed anyway?

Or maybe that's irony, I don't know, it's late~*.

Not by itself.

It's very much still a 3-way between intrusive DRM, Lazy Devs and Publishers, and cheap ass gamers.

@sancho_panzer:

Yes for unboxing videos, pickup videos(lol), watching people complain about shit they bought, referring to companies as singular entities, and food reviews.

Publisher have the right to protect there games but it doesn't mean the consumer should suffer for it. I think pirates feel entitled to games that they want to play but can't during the first day. Publisher want to try and push as many sales as possible during the early months.

CD Project would probably agree.

@profvannostrand: Oh yeah, in that case, fair point, lol.

Come to think of it, it's a fair complaint for linear, story-driven games too. There the line between that and streaming full movies on YT does get kind of thin. But then, that's a matter of taste if much is being ruined.

@GarGx1: +1

@True_Gamer_: Because the majority of a games sales occur within the first few weeks of launch and then afterward the pittle unless a major sale occurs.

Anti Pirate measures have also been shown in study after study to not reduce piracy or improve game sales. Reason is economics 101: You can't count a potential sale as a sale. If someone is not willing to purchase your game, but pirate it. They're not going to purchase it if they suddenly can't pirate it. Whole industry admitted this before jumping on the Denuvo bandwagon (whose shills you can see in this thread defending it).

Do you know why it took so long to crack? Denuvo was paying off crack teams in the tune of 100k a person. That's not a conspiracy the company admits to doing it along with Square Enix. The latest crew didn't take the money and also released a step by step method to cracking the game. Denuvo is finished, the industry will become really pro consumer for a while before they find another anti consumer DRM measure to implement and then the process will repeat itself, because 1) Investors are as greedy as they are stupid. 2) Consumers are absolute idiots. Case in point those defending a measure that means they can never own the game they paid money for and will no longer be able to play when Denuvo's servers go down, which given the recent security breach that included their next model denuvo and the fact it's followed the typical pattern for it's model (it's used in automotive repair software), should be in about a year, since pirates not break it in 3 days regardless if the game is worth pirating.

I think Uplay/Rockstar club is worse..

DRM is, has been and always will be a waste of damned time for any game that is not online only and run totally on a server somewhere in the world.

Ala Diablo 3.

It is past time that game developers realized that if they make a good game and price it at the level where the majority of people can afford to buy the game (20 dollars max for a AAA game) people will buy the game!

The vast majority of 'pirates' are poor people who simply cannot afford to buy the game at the exceedingly high costs that the game developers wish to charge for the game today.

Everything else has gone down in price: Why not computer and console games? Just no excuse for it. Sure, PC and console games have a lot more content and graphical prettiness today but considering that they are able to pump out games quicker and easier today no reason why the prices should stay flat or even increase.

As to Denuvo being a 'launch day protection', yeah. However when your game sucks on ice and gaming publications expose that, is your lack of sales due to 'pirates' or due to people realizing that your game sucks on ice!

@GarGx1 said:

I feel neutral to it.

But if you're interested what it does: https://whyisdenuvobad.github.io/

Necro bumps ruin these boards.