Is 1080p really needed in games ?

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#201 Posted by Bebi_vegeta (13558 posts) -

[QUOTE="iamrob7"]

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"]

zl5e94.jpg2lthb86.jpg

savagetwinkie

Your pictures are not identical, one is far smaller than the other and the second picture is being squeezed also. For a comparison you need two shots 1080p size with the 720p shot upscaled to 1080p so they are the same size. That's how it works, try again.

Thats stupid, than your not comparing a 720p image vs 1080p image, then your capming a rendered 1080p image with a modified image. the second is being squeezed by game spot but you can easily view the direct web page, I just posted the images but I don't think gamespot really has the capabilities for setting up a proper compare. i

Well to be fair, you didn't post any 1080p shoots.

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#202 Posted by RyviusARC (5653 posts) -

After I am done compressing a video I can do a 1080P vs 720P comparison with Assassins Creed 3.

The best way to see the difference is to take both screenshots and make them into a gif file that switches back and forth.

Higher resolutions will make a bigger difference when the scene being renedered has lots of fine details.

If the game is not that detailed then the difference won't be as large.

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#203 Posted by savagetwinkie (7981 posts) -
[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"][QUOTE="iamrob7"]

Your pictures are not identical, one is far smaller than the other and the second picture is being squeezed also. For a comparison you need two shots 1080p size with the 720p shot upscaled to 1080p so they are the same size. That's how it works, try again.

faizan_faizan
Thats stupid, than your not comparing a 720p image vs 1080p image, then your capming a rendered 1080p image with a modified image. the second is being squeezed by game spot but you can easily view the direct web page, I just posted the images but I don't think gamespot really has the capabilities for setting up a proper compare. i

A 1080P TV will always upscale 720P, The person who posted the Hitman Pics above has done the same and pretty good job.

An upscaled image is a modified image and is isn't a proper comparison if you trying to see how much detail is lost with 720p, upscaling it is completly invalidates the comparison. upscaled images can get smeared and appear to lose extra details depending on the TV, so again its a bad way to compare the image
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#204 Posted by savagetwinkie (7981 posts) -

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"][QUOTE="iamrob7"]

Your pictures are not identical, one is far smaller than the other and the second picture is being squeezed also. For a comparison you need two shots 1080p size with the 720p shot upscaled to 1080p so they are the same size. That's how it works, try again.

Bebi_vegeta

Thats stupid, than your not comparing a 720p image vs 1080p image, then your capming a rendered 1080p image with a modified image. the second is being squeezed by game spot but you can easily view the direct web page, I just posted the images but I don't think gamespot really has the capabilities for setting up a proper compare. i

Well to be fair, you didn't post any 1080p shoots.

the second picture is 1080 pc, just the forum down scaled it so you have to look at the link its posted to.

Edit: i just noticed tiny pic downsacled it also ;(

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#205 Posted by RyviusARC (5653 posts) -

An upscaled image is a modified image and is isn't a proper comparison if you trying to see how much detail is lost with 720p, upscaling it is completly invalidates the comparison. upscaled images can get smeared and appear to lose extra details depending on the TV, so again its a bad way to compare the imagesavagetwinkie

If you use photoshop it has a proper upscaling algorithm that will match the best of the best in what a TV can do with upscaling.

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#206 Posted by faizan_faizan (7869 posts) -
[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"][QUOTE="faizan_faizan"][QUOTE="savagetwinkie"] Thats stupid, than your not comparing a 720p image vs 1080p image, then your capming a rendered 1080p image with a modified image. the second is being squeezed by game spot but you can easily view the direct web page, I just posted the images but I don't think gamespot really has the capabilities for setting up a proper compare. i

A 1080P TV will always upscale 720P, The person who posted the Hitman Pics above has done the same and pretty good job.

An upscaled image is a modified image and is isn't a proper comparison if you trying to see how much detail is lost with 720p, upscaling it is completly invalidates the comparison. upscaled images can get smeared and appear to lose extra details depending on the TV, so again its a bad way to compare the image

You mean the imagery (720p) a 1080p TV shows is actually modified?
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#207 Posted by savagetwinkie (7981 posts) -

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"] An upscaled image is a modified image and is isn't a proper comparison if you trying to see how much detail is lost with 720p, upscaling it is completly invalidates the comparison. upscaled images can get smeared and appear to lose extra details depending on the TV, so again its a bad way to compare the imageRyviusARC

If you use photoshop it has a proper upscaling algorithm that will match the best of the best in what a TV can do with upscaling.

and its still wrong if you want to see the change in detail in the two different resolutions. Your processing the image and guessing what colors the missing pixels are supposed to be its going to
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#208 Posted by savagetwinkie (7981 posts) -
[QUOTE="faizan_faizan"][QUOTE="savagetwinkie"][QUOTE="faizan_faizan"] A 1080P TV will always upscale 720P, The person who posted the Hitman Pics above has done the same and pretty good job.

An upscaled image is a modified image and is isn't a proper comparison if you trying to see how much detail is lost with 720p, upscaling it is completly invalidates the comparison. upscaled images can get smeared and appear to lose extra details depending on the TV, so again its a bad way to compare the image

You mean the imagery (720p) a 1080p TV shows is actually modified?

yes, its run through algorithms to guess the missing pixels when up scaling the image. A 1080p TV has 1920x1080 pixels on it, the 720p sets have 1280x720 pixels.
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#209 Posted by YoshiYogurt (6008 posts) -
Hell no, try playing an n64 or gamecube game in 1080p. MMM good.
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#210 Posted by Cranler (8809 posts) -

[QUOTE="Cranler"][QUOTE="Ben-Buja"]

Probably using Sweet FX as well. Still proves the point that going 1080P makes a big difference, even when the graphics basically stay the same. Hell, even Gamecube games look pretty good at 1080P.

775ffc045175eecf0b530afbd4f8dcd01149e1c1

42603-the-legend-of-zelda-the-wind-waker

Bebi_vegeta

No way is that bottom pic 720p. This isnt about a straight comparison of 720p vs 1080p. Its about using all the power at you disposal on fixed hardware, 720p could have better lighting, shadows draw distance etc than the same game on the same hardware at 1080p/

Then why is 720p even considered the mininal... since you gave your example of COD4 being 600p and looking superior to COD2 720p ?

The thread is about 720p vs 1080p.
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#211 Posted by jun_aka_pekto (22285 posts) -

has any one taken a a PC game and taken a 720p picture then just turn it up to 1080p. So far I've seen a 480i image compared with 1080p image on an emulator, probably with extra settings A possible 720p picture that has washed out colors compared to a 1080p with better color, and what looks like heavier AFsavagetwinkie

Here's a Crysis 2 image. One was captured at 720p, opened with Paintshop Pro, and previewed fullscreen at 1080p. Then I made another screen capture of the preview at 1080p. The second image is 1080p native:

To view full-size of each, Right-Click, View Image.

crysis2sample720pupscal.jpg

crysis2samplenative1080.jpg

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#212 Posted by topgunmv (10747 posts) -

[QUOTE="faizan_faizan"][QUOTE="savagetwinkie"] An upscaled image is a modified image and is isn't a proper comparison if you trying to see how much detail is lost with 720p, upscaling it is completly invalidates the comparison. upscaled images can get smeared and appear to lose extra details depending on the TV, so again its a bad way to compare the imagesavagetwinkie
You mean the imagery (720p) a 1080p TV shows is actually modified?

yes, its run through algorithms to guess the missing pixels when up scaling the image. A 1080p TV has 1920x1080 pixels on it, the 720p sets have 1280x720 pixels.

That's half the point we're all trying to make, 1080p tvs are all there is going to be pretty soon, and as was pointed out, photoshop upscaling is going to match the best upscaling that the expensive sets have.

In other words all next gen console games are going to look like a smeary mess if they stick with 720p native unless you go ebay shopping for an old set.

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#213 Posted by savagetwinkie (7981 posts) -

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"]has any one taken a a PC game and taken a 720p picture then just turn it up to 1080p. So far I've seen a 480i image compared with 1080p image on an emulator, probably with extra settings A possible 720p picture that has washed out colors compared to a 1080p with better color, and what looks like heavier AFjun_aka_pekto

Here's a Crysis 2 image. One was captured at 720p, opened with Paintshop Pro, and previewed fullscreen at 1080p. Then I made another screen capture of the preview at 1080p. The second image is 1080p native:

To view full-size of each, Right-Click, View Image.

I posted two skyrim pics already, though I meant to say compare it to 720p, the upscaling process smears the image.

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#214 Posted by Cranler (8809 posts) -

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"]has any one taken a a PC game and taken a 720p picture then just turn it up to 1080p. So far I've seen a 480i image compared with 1080p image on an emulator, probably with extra settings A possible 720p picture that has washed out colors compared to a 1080p with better color, and what looks like heavier AFjun_aka_pekto

Here's a Crysis 2 image. One was captured at 720p, opened with Paintshop Pro, and previewed fullscreen at 1080p. Then I made another screen capture of the preview at 1080p. The second image is 1080p native:

To view full-size of each, Right-Click, View Image.

crysis2sample720pupscal.jpg

crysis2samplenative1080.jpg

This is a proper representation of the differeence between 720p and 1080p than that ridiculous Dark Souls gif or that kiddy game. Big question here is would a consolite rather have the 60fps at 720p or 30 at 1080p? Or 720p, 30fps and use that extra performance to improve the lighting, shadows, particle fx, tesselation etc?
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#215 Posted by topgunmv (10747 posts) -

[QUOTE="jun_aka_pekto"]

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"]has any one taken a a PC game and taken a 720p picture then just turn it up to 1080p. So far I've seen a 480i image compared with 1080p image on an emulator, probably with extra settings A possible 720p picture that has washed out colors compared to a 1080p with better color, and what looks like heavier AFCranler

Here's a Crysis 2 image. One was captured at 720p, opened with Paintshop Pro, and previewed fullscreen at 1080p. Then I made another screen capture of the preview at 1080p. The second image is 1080p native:

To view full-size of each, Right-Click, View Image.

This is a proper representation of the differeence between 720p and 1080p than that ridiculous Dark Souls gif or that kiddy game. Big question here is would a consolite rather have the 60fps at 720p or 30 at 1080p? Or 720p, 30fps and use that extra performance to improve the lighting, shadows, particle fx, tesselation etc?

Crysis 2 is a bad game to use as the default antialiasing already makes it blurry as hell.

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#216 Posted by savagetwinkie (7981 posts) -

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"][QUOTE="faizan_faizan"] You mean the imagery (720p) a 1080p TV shows is actually modified?topgunmv

yes, its run through algorithms to guess the missing pixels when up scaling the image. A 1080p TV has 1920x1080 pixels on it, the 720p sets have 1280x720 pixels.

That's half the point we're all trying to make, 1080p tvs are all there is going to be pretty soon, and as was pointed out, photoshop upscaling is going to match the best upscaling that the expensive sets have.

In other words all next gen console games are going to look like a smeary mess if they stick with 720p native unless you go ebay shopping for an old set.

pihotoshop doesn't have a single way to do this, they have a few resampling options, there are TV's with "game mode" to be more sloppy to keep the latency down. Though I think the TV's processors have gotten much better, I havn't shopped for a tv in over 5 years so I'm not sure what resampling option TV's come with now adays.
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#217 Posted by DumbOldDarrell (125 posts) -

I don't really care. Doesn't really matter to me what resolution my games are playing at. I don't even know what resolution my Wii, PS3 and 360 are at.

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#218 Posted by Cranler (8809 posts) -

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"][QUOTE="faizan_faizan"] You mean the imagery (720p) a 1080p TV shows is actually modified?topgunmv

yes, its run through algorithms to guess the missing pixels when up scaling the image. A 1080p TV has 1920x1080 pixels on it, the 720p sets have 1280x720 pixels.

That's half the point we're all trying to make, 1080p tvs are all there is going to be pretty soon, and as was pointed out, photoshop upscaling is going to match the best upscaling that the expensive sets have.

In other words all next gen console games are going to look like a smeary mess if they stick with 720p native unless you go ebay shopping for an old set.

It doesnt work that way. TV's upscale very well. 720p content will look identical on a 720p or 1080p set. May even look better on a 1080p since they are usually higher end anyways. You do realize that all broadcast tv programs and most streaming in the US is at 720p right?
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#219 Posted by Cranler (8809 posts) -

[QUOTE="Cranler"][QUOTE="jun_aka_pekto"]

Here's a Crysis 2 image. One was captured at 720p, opened with Paintshop Pro, and previewed fullscreen at 1080p. Then I made another screen capture of the preview at 1080p. The second image is 1080p native:

To view full-size of each, Right-Click, View Image.

topgunmv

This is a proper representation of the differeence between 720p and 1080p than that ridiculous Dark Souls gif or that kiddy game. Big question here is would a consolite rather have the 60fps at 720p or 30 at 1080p? Or 720p, 30fps and use that extra performance to improve the lighting, shadows, particle fx, tesselation etc?

Crysis 2 is a bad game to use as the default antialiasing already makes it blurry as hell.

Its all relative though. A blurry game at 1080p will have even more blurriness at 720p and a sharp game will be a little less sharp at 720p.
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#220 Posted by savagetwinkie (7981 posts) -
[QUOTE="topgunmv"]

[QUOTE="Cranler"] This is a proper representation of the differeence between 720p and 1080p than that ridiculous Dark Souls gif or that kiddy game. Big question here is would a consolite rather have the 60fps at 720p or 30 at 1080p? Or 720p, 30fps and use that extra performance to improve the lighting, shadows, particle fx, tesselation etc?Cranler

Crysis 2 is a bad game to use as the default antialiasing already makes it blurry as hell.

Its all relative though. A blurry game at 1080p will have even more blurriness at 720p and a sharp game will be a little less sharp at 720p.

This is why comparing an upscaled image is bad, there are too many unknowns in the upscaling and what kind of tv you have and how much processing it will do to. Or consider something like the 360 that comes with its own hardware upscaler and then outputs a 1080p image and wouldn't rely on the TV to upscale it.
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#221 Posted by topgunmv (10747 posts) -

[QUOTE="topgunmv"]

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"] yes, its run through algorithms to guess the missing pixels when up scaling the image. A 1080p TV has 1920x1080 pixels on it, the 720p sets have 1280x720 pixels.Cranler

That's half the point we're all trying to make, 1080p tvs are all there is going to be pretty soon, and as was pointed out, photoshop upscaling is going to match the best upscaling that the expensive sets have.

In other words all next gen console games are going to look like a smeary mess if they stick with 720p native unless you go ebay shopping for an old set.

It doesnt work that way. TV's upscale very well. 720p content will look identical on a 720p or 1080p set. May even look better on a 1080p since they are usually higher end anyways. You do realize that all broadcast tv programs and most streaming in the US is at 720p right?

Incorrect, some channels are 1080i, unless you're referring to over air broadcast in which case I have no idea.

On the 5 or 6 1080p sets that I've played console games on ranging from big to small, cheap to expensive, none have looked as good as a native 720p set, they've all had the signature blurring effect (I suppose some people might consider that an increase in quality though, similar to a post process AA filter).

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#222 Posted by Kinthalis (5502 posts) -

[QUOTE="topgunmv"]

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"] yes, its run through algorithms to guess the missing pixels when up scaling the image. A 1080p TV has 1920x1080 pixels on it, the 720p sets have 1280x720 pixels.Cranler

That's half the point we're all trying to make, 1080p tvs are all there is going to be pretty soon, and as was pointed out, photoshop upscaling is going to match the best upscaling that the expensive sets have.

In other words all next gen console games are going to look like a smeary mess if they stick with 720p native unless you go ebay shopping for an old set.

It doesnt work that way. TV's upscale very well. 720p content will look identical on a 720p or 1080p set. May even look better on a 1080p since they are usually higher end anyways. You do realize that all broadcast tv programs and most streaming in the US is at 720p right?

OK so now you're just lying. How do you propose the TV scalar can reproduce the missing information? Magic? Upscaling algorythmsbcan only do so much, therefore, no, a 720p image will NOT look "identical" to a 1080p one.

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#223 Posted by jimkabrhel (15625 posts) -

It's great to have, but ultimately not necessary.

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#224 Posted by jimkabrhel (15625 posts) -

It's great to have, but ultimately not necessary.

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#225 Posted by Cranler (8809 posts) -

[QUOTE="Cranler"][QUOTE="topgunmv"]

That's half the point we're all trying to make, 1080p tvs are all there is going to be pretty soon, and as was pointed out, photoshop upscaling is going to match the best upscaling that the expensive sets have.

In other words all next gen console games are going to look like a smeary mess if they stick with 720p native unless you go ebay shopping for an old set.

Kinthalis

It doesnt work that way. TV's upscale very well. 720p content will look identical on a 720p or 1080p set. May even look better on a 1080p since they are usually higher end anyways. You do realize that all broadcast tv programs and most streaming in the US is at 720p right?

OK so now you're just lying. How do you propose the TV scalar can reproduce the missing information? Magic? Upscaling algorythmsbcan only do so much, therefore, no, a 720p image will NOT look "identical" to a 1080p one.

WTH???? Nice reading comprehension. Maybe reread it a few times, including what I was replying too as well. Nowhere did I say that 720p content looks as good as 1080p content. Although I still say a console game in 720p with as many graphical bells and whistles possible at 30fps would beat a 1080p game on the same hardware since 1080 means sacrificing other aspects of the graphics.
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#226 Posted by RyviusARC (5653 posts) -

and its still wrong if you want to see the change in detail in the two different resolutions. Your processing the image and guessing what colors the missing pixels are supposed to be its going to savagetwinkie

It's the best way it can be done though.

And the algorithm will be the best.

You might find an equal on TV but nothing will be more accurate.

Showing one image in 720P then another in 1080P won't do well enough.

The only other option is to set your monitor to match the resolution of each but that still doesn't beat upscaling it in photoshop then putting both images in some gif format to switch between them.

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#227 Posted by deactivated-583e460ca986b (7240 posts) -
2560x1440 should be the standard. I have been gaming at that resolution for a while now. Microsoft probable wont go that far but I'm sure Sony will go all out.
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#228 Posted by Cali3350 (16134 posts) -

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"]has any one taken a a PC game and taken a 720p picture then just turn it up to 1080p. So far I've seen a 480i image compared with 1080p image on an emulator, probably with extra settings A possible 720p picture that has washed out colors compared to a 1080p with better color, and what looks like heavier AFjun_aka_pekto

Here's a Crysis 2 image. One was captured at 720p, opened with Paintshop Pro, and previewed fullscreen at 1080p. Then I made another screen capture of the preview at 1080p. The second image is 1080p native:

To view full-size of each, Right-Click, View Image.

crysis2sample720pupscal.jpg

crysis2samplenative1080.jpg

Tho bottom pic is noticeably more crisp.
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#229 Posted by NoodleFighter (8752 posts) -

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"][QUOTE="faizan_faizan"] You mean the imagery (720p) a 1080p TV shows is actually modified?topgunmv

yes, its run through algorithms to guess the missing pixels when up scaling the image. A 1080p TV has 1920x1080 pixels on it, the 720p sets have 1280x720 pixels.

That's half the point we're all trying to make, 1080p tvs are all there is going to be pretty soon, and as was pointed out, photoshop upscaling is going to match the best upscaling that the expensive sets have.

In other words all next gen console games are going to look like a smeary mess if they stick with 720p native unless you go ebay shopping for an old set.

What about all the 4k TVs in production?

Avatar image for fernandmondego_
#230 Posted by fernandmondego_ (3170 posts) -

[QUOTE="topgunmv"]

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"] yes, its run through algorithms to guess the missing pixels when up scaling the image. A 1080p TV has 1920x1080 pixels on it, the 720p sets have 1280x720 pixels.NoodleFighter

That's half the point we're all trying to make, 1080p tvs are all there is going to be pretty soon, and as was pointed out, photoshop upscaling is going to match the best upscaling that the expensive sets have.

In other words all next gen console games are going to look like a smeary mess if they stick with 720p native unless you go ebay shopping for an old set.

What about all the 4k TVs in production?

4K? I want 8K damn it.

Avatar image for savagetwinkie
#231 Posted by savagetwinkie (7981 posts) -

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"]and its still wrong if you want to see the change in detail in the two different resolutions. Your processing the image and guessing what colors the missing pixels are supposed to be its going to RyviusARC

It's the best way it can be done though.

And the algorithm will be the best.

You might find an equal on TV but nothing will be more accurate.

Showing one image in 720P then another in 1080P won't do well enough.

The only other option is to set your monitor to match the resolution of each but that still doesn't beat upscaling it in photoshop then putting both images in some gif format to switch between them.

so which type of resampling are you using to sharpen the image? How do you know its the same as a TV? Or you just resizing the image which is essentially the same as MS paint you can't compare the detail on the images properly after you've processed one of them. It would actually be easier to just focus on some intricate details in a game, and take a shot at 720p and 1080p, then jsut cut the focused sections out. And put them side by side or in a gif.
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#232 Posted by Exxite (171 posts) -

[QUOTE="jun_aka_pekto"]

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"]has any one taken a a PC game and taken a 720p picture then just turn it up to 1080p. So far I've seen a 480i image compared with 1080p image on an emulator, probably with extra settings A possible 720p picture that has washed out colors compared to a 1080p with better color, and what looks like heavier AFCali3350

Here's a Crysis 2 image. One was captured at 720p, opened with Paintshop Pro, and previewed fullscreen at 1080p. Then I made another screen capture of the preview at 1080p. The second image is 1080p native:

To view full-size of each, Right-Click, View Image.

Tho bottom pic is noticeably more crisp.

Yes indeed. Just like when you take a small image and increase the resolution it gets grainy, pixelized, etc... The only way to avoid this is to have source image match the display resolution then it fits pixel:pixel. No little chip inside my tv or game console with less processing power than my 4 year old blackberry then won't have to decide, "hmmmm how do I make this 1280x720 image fit into a space of 1920x1080."

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#233 Posted by topgunmv (10747 posts) -

[QUOTE="topgunmv"]

[QUOTE="savagetwinkie"] yes, its run through algorithms to guess the missing pixels when up scaling the image. A 1080p TV has 1920x1080 pixels on it, the 720p sets have 1280x720 pixels.NoodleFighter

That's half the point we're all trying to make, 1080p tvs are all there is going to be pretty soon, and as was pointed out, photoshop upscaling is going to match the best upscaling that the expensive sets have.

In other words all next gen console games are going to look like a smeary mess if they stick with 720p native unless you go ebay shopping for an old set.

What about all the 4k TVs in production?

I think people are idiots for buying them unless they plan on hooking it up to a computer.

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#234 Posted by scottahuch (1580 posts) -

Pft 720p is too fancy, I mean do we really need anything better than a res of 1x1 to play games?

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#235 Posted by Cranler (8809 posts) -

[QUOTE="NoodleFighter"]

[QUOTE="topgunmv"]

That's half the point we're all trying to make, 1080p tvs are all there is going to be pretty soon, and as was pointed out, photoshop upscaling is going to match the best upscaling that the expensive sets have.

In other words all next gen console games are going to look like a smeary mess if they stick with 720p native unless you go ebay shopping for an old set.

topgunmv

What about all the 4k TVs in production?

I think people are idiots for buying them unless they plan on hooking it up to a computer.

Even then its a waste if you prefer 60fps gaming. Even crossfired 7970's wont be get 60+ on all games.
Avatar image for fernandmondego_
#236 Posted by fernandmondego_ (3170 posts) -

[QUOTE="NoodleFighter"]

[QUOTE="topgunmv"]

That's half the point we're all trying to make, 1080p tvs are all there is going to be pretty soon, and as was pointed out, photoshop upscaling is going to match the best upscaling that the expensive sets have.

In other words all next gen console games are going to look like a smeary mess if they stick with 720p native unless you go ebay shopping for an old set.

topgunmv

What about all the 4k TVs in production?

I think people are idiots for buying them unless they plan on hooking it up to a computer.

Why not? They are about to start getting a ton of content for it soon.
Avatar image for Exxite
#237 Posted by Exxite (171 posts) -

[QUOTE="topgunmv"]

[QUOTE="NoodleFighter"]

What about all the 4k TVs in production?

Cranler

I think people are idiots for buying them unless they plan on hooking it up to a computer.

Even then its a waste if you prefer 60fps gaming. Even crossfired 7970's wont be get 60+ on all games.

You'd only be right if you meant eyefinity or nvidia surround. These cards are crazy http://hardocp.com/article/2012/12/04/gtx_680_vs_radeon_hd_7970_multidisplay_showdown/1 . That setup with a single monitor at 1920x1200 would probably be solid 60fps if not more on every single game they ran. If not using resolutions like 5760x1200.

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#238 Posted by topgunmv (10747 posts) -

[QUOTE="topgunmv"]

[QUOTE="NoodleFighter"]

What about all the 4k TVs in production?

fernandmondego_

I think people are idiots for buying them unless they plan on hooking it up to a computer.

Why not? They are about to start getting a ton of content for it soon.

They are? Like what?

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#239 Posted by Bebi_vegeta (13558 posts) -

[QUOTE="Bebi_vegeta"]

[QUOTE="Cranler"] No way is that bottom pic 720p. This isnt about a straight comparison of 720p vs 1080p. Its about using all the power at you disposal on fixed hardware, 720p could have better lighting, shadows draw distance etc than the same game on the same hardware at 1080p/Cranler

Then why is 720p even considered the mininal... since you gave your example of COD4 being 600p and looking superior to COD2 720p ?

The thread is about 720p vs 1080p.

Hey you're the one who mentionned 600p...

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#240 Posted by fernandmondego_ (3170 posts) -

[QUOTE="fernandmondego_"][QUOTE="topgunmv"]

I think people are idiots for buying them unless they plan on hooking it up to a computer.

topgunmv

Why not? They are about to start getting a ton of content for it soon.

They are? Like what?

Well, all Hollywood movies are already filmed in 4K, they just haven't been released at the resolution. Sony just said they intend to release their movie in 4K starting this summer.
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#241 Posted by Cranler (8809 posts) -

[QUOTE="Cranler"][QUOTE="Bebi_vegeta"]

Then why is 720p even considered the mininal... since you gave your example of COD4 being 600p and looking superior to COD2 720p ?

Bebi_vegeta

The thread is about 720p vs 1080p.

Hey you're the one who mentionned 600p...

Because its a relevant analogy. Comparing 480i to 1080p is just plain stupid.
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#242 Posted by 04dcarraher (22775 posts) -

[QUOTE="topgunmv"]

[QUOTE="NoodleFighter"]

What about all the 4k TVs in production?

Cranler

I think people are idiots for buying them unless they plan on hooking it up to a computer.

Even then its a waste if you prefer 60fps gaming. Even crossfired 7970's wont be get 60+ on all games.

Your goofy This simple animation shows the difference

http://boallen.com/fps-compare.html

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#243 Posted by jun_aka_pekto (22285 posts) -

Is it final that the next-gen consoles will have games only at 720p? I would think some of the more "shallow" games (eg Bulletstorm-type games) will be able to run at 1080p smoothly enough (not necessarily at 60 fps).

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#244 Posted by Cranler (8809 posts) -

[QUOTE="Cranler"][QUOTE="topgunmv"]

I think people are idiots for buying them unless they plan on hooking it up to a computer.

04dcarraher

Even then its a waste if you prefer 60fps gaming. Even crossfired 7970's wont be get 60+ on all games.

Your goofy This simple animation shows the difference

http://boallen.com/fps-compare.html

Youre stupid. More reading comprehension fails lol. I say 4k is a waste because 60 fps is unattainable and you link a framerate comparison site.
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#245 Posted by Cranler (8809 posts) -

Is it final that the next-gen consoles will have games only at 720p? I would think some of the more "shallow" games (eg Bulletstorm-type games) will be able to run at 1080p smoothly enough (not necessarily at 60 fps).

jun_aka_pekto
NMothing has been said either way afaik. Carmack did say he expects most console games to remain at 30fps which is good for pc gaming. 720p/30fps console standard would be best for the pc gaming community.
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#246 Posted by Exxite (171 posts) -

Is it final that the next-gen consoles will have games only at 720p? I would think some of the more "shallow" games (eg Bulletstorm-type games) will be able to run at 1080p smoothly enough (not necessarily at 60 fps).

jun_aka_pekto

I hope at the start they aim for 1920x1080@60fps minimum. If it dips below 60fps occasionally that's not big deal. I'd rather late into next console gen developers have to start dialing some effects down to get more of another effect in or vice versa. The technology exists to do it right now. So it would be nice to at least start off not much behind the pc.

Look at these frame rates guys http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/508?vs=555 . In batman arkham city at 1920x1200 at extreme quality and 4xaa both cards are over 90fps average. Cheaper cards aren't much slower.

For the consoles to settle for less would just suck. I like my ps3 and will probably get a ps4 so I'm hoping for great looking games with minimal upscaling.

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#247 Posted by NoodleFighter (8752 posts) -

[QUOTE="fernandmondego_"][QUOTE="topgunmv"]

I think people are idiots for buying them unless they plan on hooking it up to a computer.

topgunmv

Why not? They are about to start getting a ton of content for it soon.

They are? Like what?

Isn't there 4k blu ray in the works?

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#248 Posted by Exxite (171 posts) -

[QUOTE="topgunmv"]

[QUOTE="fernandmondego_"]Why not? They are about to start getting a ton of content for it soon.NoodleFighter

They are? Like what?

Isn't there 4k blu ray in the works?

Bluray is just the disc media. You can put whatever type of video you want on a bluray. Now for it to play on a blurray player it needs to be using codecs that the player understands, but as long as the codec allows for the resolution of 4k and the decoder inside the bluray player can decode it fast enough sure why not.

The only other issue is the size the video must actually fit on the disc. I dunno how much a 4k resolution video in h.264@ 3 hours takes up for size. My guess would be 50gb or so just randomly throwing that out there.

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#249 Posted by Cranler (8809 posts) -

[QUOTE="Cranler"][QUOTE="topgunmv"]

That's half the point we're all trying to make, 1080p tvs are all there is going to be pretty soon, and as was pointed out, photoshop upscaling is going to match the best upscaling that the expensive sets have.

In other words all next gen console games are going to look like a smeary mess if they stick with 720p native unless you go ebay shopping for an old set.

topgunmv

It doesnt work that way. TV's upscale very well. 720p content will look identical on a 720p or 1080p set. May even look better on a 1080p since they are usually higher end anyways. You do realize that all broadcast tv programs and most streaming in the US is at 720p right?

Incorrect, some channels are 1080i, unless you're referring to over air broadcast in which case I have no idea.

On the 5 or 6 1080p sets that I've played console games on ranging from big to small, cheap to expensive, none have looked as good as a native 720p set, they've all had the signature blurring effect (I suppose some people might consider that an increase in quality though, similar to a post process AA filter).

Most of the broadcast content I watch is 720p. I have 2 1080p tv's and a 720p and 720p content looks just as good on the 1080p sets. The smeary mess you speak of is probably the blur filter most console games have to cover up the jaggies.

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#250 Posted by NoodleFighter (8752 posts) -

[QUOTE="NoodleFighter"]

[QUOTE="topgunmv"]

They are? Like what?

Exxite

Isn't there 4k blu ray in the works?

Bluray is just the disc media. You can put whatever type of video you want on a bluray. Now for it to play on a blurray player it needs to be using codecs that the player understands, but as long as the codec allows for the resolution of 4k and the decoder inside the bluray player can decode it fast enough sure why not.

The only other issue is the size the video must actually fit on the disc. I dunno how much a 4k resolution video in h.264@ 3 hours takes up for size. My guess would be 50gb or so just randomly throwing that out there.

Well what I actually meant was that 4k versions of movies for Blu ray are in the works and some are coming out this year like the Amazing Spiderman, The Other Guys, Total Recall, Battle: Los Angeles