GG dev and others 'never going back to ''western white man games''

  • 125 results
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3

This topic is locked from further discussion.

Avatar image for pelvist
pelvist

7512

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 21

User Lists: 0

#51 pelvist
Member since 2010 • 7512 Posts

And no doubt when their woke games fail they will blame the toxic white men that they didn't make the games for, for not buying them.

Avatar image for Jag85
Jag85

13938

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 213

User Lists: 0

#52 Jag85
Member since 2005 • 13938 Posts

@pelvist: But it hasn't failed. Horizon Zero Dawn has sold 10 million copies.

Avatar image for Litchie
Litchie

24830

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 12

User Lists: 0

#53 Litchie
Member since 2003 • 24830 Posts

Uh-huh. Read some of his messages. He sounds like an idiot.

Avatar image for R4gn4r0k
R4gn4r0k

32113

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#54  Edited By R4gn4r0k
Member since 2004 • 32113 Posts

@davillain-: They are actually albino, not caucasian. But yeah anyway, like anyone cared what skin color they had. I wasn't playing a 'race' game, I was playing a shooter :p

I hope they do end up making Killzone 4. The studio that made Mercenaries was supposed to make it.

Avatar image for Pedro
Pedro

36135

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 64

User Lists: 0

#55  Edited By Pedro
Member since 2002 • 36135 Posts

Its always cute when folks have the audacity to tell others they shouldn't share their opinion and just do their job, in this case make games. 🤣😂 I can argue that why don't you STFU and play your game.😂

Avatar image for pelvist
pelvist

7512

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 21

User Lists: 0

#56  Edited By pelvist
Member since 2010 • 7512 Posts

@Jag85: I never said they had, I said when...

Avatar image for jg4xchamp
jg4xchamp

61882

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 14

User Lists: 0

#57 jg4xchamp
Member since 2006 • 61882 Posts

@xantufrog: hey don’t point out that the idiots here are too stupid to read shit properly because they gotta rep idiot bigot energy.

These goons can’t handle that much truth

Avatar image for r-gamer
R-Gamer

1202

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#58 R-Gamer
Member since 2019 • 1202 Posts

@Jag85: Nathan Drake, Joel and John Marston were all awesome characters in my opinion.

Avatar image for mojito1988
mojito1988

3759

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#59 mojito1988
Member since 2006 • 3759 Posts

@Jag85 said:

There was a time in Gen 7 when the protagonists of almost all the major Western AAA games looked like clones of the same dude...

Do you seriously want to go back to that? A little variety wouldn't hurt.

This. Boring.

Avatar image for Jag85
Jag85

13938

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 213

User Lists: 0

#60  Edited By Jag85
Member since 2005 • 13938 Posts

@r-gamer: They were memorable characters thanks to the writing of Amy Hennig in Uncharted and Neil Druckmann in TLOU (and whoever wrote RDR).

Avatar image for KillzoneSnake
KillzoneSnake

2592

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 36

User Lists: 0

#61  Edited By KillzoneSnake
Member since 2012 • 2592 Posts

@mojito1988 said:
@Jag85 said:

There was a time in Gen 7 when the protagonists of almost all the major Western AAA games looked like clones of the same dude...

Do you seriously want to go back to that? A little variety wouldn't hurt.

This. Boring.

Why would a game be boring is its a white guy? Europe and US are white majority and men are stronger so its is normal the main guy is a white guy. Simple math and common sense.

There was always diversity and never forced until now. All that is happening is attack towards white men and im not taking this crap anymore.

Avatar image for Litchie
Litchie

24830

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 12

User Lists: 0

#62  Edited By Litchie
Member since 2003 • 24830 Posts

@KillzoneSnake said:
@mojito1988 said:
@Jag85 said:

There was a time in Gen 7 when the protagonists of almost all the major Western AAA games looked like clones of the same dude...

Do you seriously want to go back to that? A little variety wouldn't hurt.

This. Boring.

Why would a game be boring is its a white guy? Europe and US are white majority and men are stronger so its is normal the main guy is a white guy. Simple math and common sense.

There was always diversity and never forced until now. All that is happening is attack towards white men and im not taking this crap anymore.

To be fair, I don't think they find white men boring. More that they find white men with a stubble and short brown hair boring. Since it's the the go to look developers use for their average protagonist, we see that look extremely often. Feels like you're the same dude in several games.

Avatar image for sancho_panzer
Sancho_Panzer

1006

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#63  Edited By Sancho_Panzer  Online
Member since 2015 • 1006 Posts

Dont panic. There will always be a market for buff dude games, if that's your particular bag.

Avatar image for mojito1988
mojito1988

3759

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#64 mojito1988
Member since 2006 • 3759 Posts

@Litchie said:
@KillzoneSnake said:
@mojito1988 said:
@Jag85 said:

There was a time in Gen 7 when the protagonists of almost all the major Western AAA games looked like clones of the same dude...

Do you seriously want to go back to that? A little variety wouldn't hurt.

This. Boring.

Why would a game be boring is its a white guy? Europe and US are white majority and men are stronger so its is normal the main guy is a white guy. Simple math and common sense.

There was always diversity and never forced until now. All that is happening is attack towards white men and im not taking this crap anymore.

To be fair, I don't think they find white men boring. More that they find white men with a stubble and short brown hair boring. Since it's the the go to look developers use for their average protagonist, we see that look extremely often. Feels like you're the same dude in several games.

This. White men within themselves are not boring. I just enjoy seeing all sorts of different things in games. I honestly do not understand why people get so irritated when people state that they would like to see more diversity in video games. It is hardly my top thing I look for, but when I look around my neighborhood I see a lot of different types of people, and the majority don't look like those guys above. To be honest I feel that the reason people get so irritated with the idea of diversity is the exact same reason that people want it in the first place. People want to have characters that they can relate to. White men are a large portion of the gaming community, so of course they do not want change. They are represented. Minorities/women would also like to see characters they relate more closely to. To be honest it all seems kind of obvious to me. People do not like change.

Avatar image for NoodleFighter
NoodleFighter

10630

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#65 NoodleFighter
Member since 2011 • 10630 Posts

@Litchie said:
@KillzoneSnake said:
@mojito1988 said:
@Jag85 said:

There was a time in Gen 7 when the protagonists of almost all the major Western AAA games looked like clones of the same dude...

Do you seriously want to go back to that? A little variety wouldn't hurt.

This. Boring.

Why would a game be boring is its a white guy? Europe and US are white majority and men are stronger so its is normal the main guy is a white guy. Simple math and common sense.

There was always diversity and never forced until now. All that is happening is attack towards white men and im not taking this crap anymore.

To be fair, I don't think they find white men boring. More that they find white men with a stubble and short brown hair boring. Since it's the the go to look developers use for their average protagonist, we see that look extremely often. Feels like you're the same dude in several games.

A main reason that look was most common last gen was because it was so much easier to render a person like that. Rendering more full and luscious hair was a lot more taxing on hardware during that time which is why the hair on a lot of video games characters even females was pretty flat and stiff. The gruff look is easier to work with.

I agree with Killzonesnake there always was diversity in games. There is some great exaggeration people make with that picture even lumping in characters such as Geralt Of Rivia as a generic gruffy White man. I'm not even White and I can see this is BS.

The type of people that complain about the supposed lack of diversity in games are the same type of people that complain about lack of diversity in movies but refuse to look at anything that isn't a Hollywood blockbuster. It is why mediocre movies like Crazy Rich Asians get inflated with high scores because of its "groundbreaking" diversity and representation of Asians even though it is not relatable to the overwhelming majority of Asians and is really only groundbreaking in the Western world because Asia already pumps out a ton of films with their own people and cultures.

It's because of these SJW types recently infiltrating the industry and creating divisiveness that now people are starting to see any diversity as forced diversity and become hostile to it. They try to coerce developers like Warhorse studios into doing forced diversity and arrogantly lecturing them on their own country's history as if they know better.

Where were these people when Crysis 2 & 3 came out since they had POC as main characters? You played as a Hispanic man in Crysis 2 (Alcatraz/James Rodriguez) and you played as Prophet a Black man in Crysis 3 and most of the plot of the Crysis series revolves around Prophet. What about the Gears Of War series where the whole cast was pretty diverse and loved by all? The games had East Asian, Polynesian, Black and Hispanic characters yet all these people will focus on is Marcus being a gruff White dude even though he is accompanied by POC and women throughout the games that you can even play as them since it is a coop game and you can select them in multiplayer modes. Never mind that the big bad locust were lead by a woman and that the most dangerous of their race was their females. Same with Commander Shepard even though Commander Shepard can be anyone since you can customize him/her but all they focus on is the generic male Shepard.

Venturebeat made an article talking about how Prey 2017's Asian protagonist (technically half Asian) is breath of fresh air as if all the games with Asian protagonist made by Japanese devs suddenly don't exist. This is all too similar to when Western journalist were making a big deal about Faith Connor being an Asian (also mixed).

What about the all the smaller titles and indies that have women and POC as main protagonist? What about games being made in non Western countries representing their own people and cultures? If these people really cared they'd be promoting these games instead of just trying to force the big AAA games and developers to do it. In fact as a POC I find it insulting because they make it seem like it is the duty of White people to represent non Whites in mediums as if they're incapable of it themselves or as if it is only relevant if it comes from them. Similar to how movies outside of Hollywood don't count in representing non Whites. They're unknowingly creating a White savior complex.

Heck there is even a blog post that ignorantly labels video game characters such as Riddick a generic White male protagonist. The blogger even admitted to really only play 2 out of the 8 games/series listed having this trope. You tell just from looking at him that Riddick isn't White.

Avatar image for NoodleFighter
NoodleFighter

10630

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#66 NoodleFighter
Member since 2011 • 10630 Posts
@KillzoneSnake said:
@Juub1990 said:

@KillzoneSnake: I don’t think he means they’ll never go back to making a game with a white male protagonist, I think he’s saying he’s never going back to making only that. That they’re embracing diversity. At least that’s what I understood from the tweet.

It’s dumb nonetheless.

Yeh there can still be white people but never only. God forbid there is a team of 4 white guys, SJW alert, must force women/color people in or it is not allowed. This is why forced diversity is so bad now. So bad you end up having little teen girls beat up men, no powers needed lol. There was a time nobody even thought about these things... nobody ever complained Resident Evil 3 main was Jill. Metroid, Perfect Dark, San Andreas... games were always diverse... never forced. And one knows it is forced when devs themselves talk about it like an obsession.

This game here for example sucked, but im pointing out the characters/setting.. there is NO WAY that GG, ND, Santa Monica.. any of them would make a game like that good or bad. It would be classified as a white man game. To even bring race into it is extremely racist, how can they get away with this crap.

Interesting you bring up Shellshock because the new COD reflects what you're talking about. There is controversy of the campaign being propaganda because of the developers portrayal of the Russians and the fictional Middle Eastern country Urzikstan. They depicted the Russians in the game as completely monstrous villains doing things such as hanging gay people by cranes when in reality it is middle easterners doing that to gay people. They depicted the Russians doing other horrible things that was actually done by other groups. But if the devs were actually honest and depicted it realistically it be called racist and Islamophobic. It becomes more apparent when you realize that even though they have the game take place in a fictional country they use a real country as the villains. Another thing you realize that even though Russia does a lot of bad stuff none of it is mutually exclusive to that country yet you don't see other countries get depicted the same way.

Avatar image for Jag85
Jag85

13938

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 213

User Lists: 0

#67  Edited By Jag85
Member since 2005 • 13938 Posts

@NoodleFighter said:
@Litchie said:
@KillzoneSnake said:
@mojito1988 said:

This. Boring.

Why would a game be boring is its a white guy? Europe and US are white majority and men are stronger so its is normal the main guy is a white guy. Simple math and common sense.

There was always diversity and never forced until now. All that is happening is attack towards white men and im not taking this crap anymore.

To be fair, I don't think they find white men boring. More that they find white men with a stubble and short brown hair boring. Since it's the the go to look developers use for their average protagonist, we see that look extremely often. Feels like you're the same dude in several games.

A main reason that look was most common last gen was because it was so much easier to render a person like that. Rendering more full and luscious hair was a lot more taxing on hardware during that time which is why the hair on a lot of video games characters even females was pretty flat and stiff. The gruff look is easier to work with.

I agree with Killzonesnake there always was diversity in games. There is some great exaggeration people make with that picture even lumping in characters such as Geralt Of Rivia as a generic gruffy White man. I'm not even White and I can see this is BS.

The type of people that complain about the supposed lack of diversity in games are the same type of people that complain about lack of diversity in movies but refuse to look at anything that isn't a Hollywood blockbuster. It is why mediocre movies like Crazy Rich Asians get inflated with high scores because of its "groundbreaking" diversity and representation of Asians even though it is not relatable to the overwhelming majority of Asians and is really only groundbreaking in the Western world because Asia already pumps out a ton of films with their own people and cultures.

It's because of these SJW types recently infiltrating the industry and creating divisiveness that now people are starting to see any diversity as forced diversity and become hostile to it. They try to coerce developers like Warhorse studios into doing forced diversity and arrogantly lecturing them on their own country's history as if they know better.

Where were these people when Crysis 2 & 3 came out since they had POC as main characters? You played as a Hispanic man in Crysis 2 (Alcatraz/James Rodriguez) and you played as Prophet a Black man in Crysis 3 and most of the plot of the Crysis series revolves around Prophet. What about the Gears Of War series where the whole cast was pretty diverse and loved by all? The games had East Asian, Polynesian, Black and Hispanic characters yet all these people will focus on is Marcus being a gruff White dude even though he is accompanied by POC and women throughout the games that you can even play as them since it is a coop game and you can select them in multiplayer modes. Never mind that the big bad locust were lead by a woman and that the most dangerous of their race was their females. Same with Commander Shepard even though Commander Shepard can be anyone since you can customize him/her but all they focus on is the generic male Shepard.

Venturebeat made an article talking about how Prey 2017's Asian protagonist (technically half Asian) is breath of fresh air as if all the games with Asian protagonist made by Japanese devs suddenly don't exist. This is all too similar to when Western journalist were making a big deal about Faith Connor being an Asian (also mixed).

What about the all the smaller titles and indies that have women and POC as main protagonist? What about games being made in non Western countries representing their own people and cultures? If these people really cared they'd be promoting these games instead of just trying to force the big AAA games and developers to do it. In fact as a POC I find it insulting because they make it seem like it is the duty of White people to represent non Whites in mediums as if they're incapable of it themselves or as if it is only relevant if it comes from them. Similar to how movies outside of Hollywood don't count in representing non Whites. They're unknowingly creating a White savior complex.

That only holds true for the hair. A clean shave is lot easier to render than a stubble. And the colours of the skin and hair textures make no difference at all. The "video game dude face" look was a creative decision (or rather, an uncreative decision), not a technical one.

It's true that video games were already diverse... up until Gen 7, when Western devs started lazily copy-pasting the same old "video game dude face" and "bald space marine" character designs over and over again. In other words, video games became less diverse in Gen 7. If anything, the "diversity push" in Gen 8 is simply restoring the balance, bringing back the diversity that video games lost in Gen 7.

In the movie industry, diverse movies have been eating up the box office lately, e.g. Black Panther, Crazy Rich Asians, Bohemian Rhapsody, Captain Marvel, Alita, Aladdin, Lion King, etc. Clearly, diversity sells. As for Crazy Rich Asians, that wasn't even made for Asian markets, but it's a movie made for Asian-Americans. There's clearly a cultural divide between Asian-Americans and Asians-in-Asia, which the movie itself points out. Hence why it became a blockbuster in the West and a failure in Asia. One of the few Asian markets where it did very well is Singapore, where it's set. But ironically, it got backlash in Singapore for not being diverse enough, failing to represent the country's Malay and Indian populations.

As for the rest of your post, I agree there is a tendency for many in the West (among the left and the right) to ignore the Asian industries. They only seem to care about diversity (or oppose diversity) when it involves Western media, while completely overlooking the Asian industries. Not only is this true for video games, but also for movies and music. For example, the Oscars and Grammys have been making a "diversity" push in recent years, but only when it involves the US or UK. Anime is mainstream in the West, yet great anime movies like Your Name get snubbed by the Oscars in favour of Hollywood trash like Boss Baby. And K-pop bands like BTS outsell US artists in their own backyward, yet the Grammys snub K-pop artists in favour of US/UK artists. But that's a whole different topic.

Avatar image for ten_pints
Ten_Pints

3944

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#68 Ten_Pints
Member since 2014 • 3944 Posts

The market decides what games are produced not retarded agenda driven developers/publishers.

Avatar image for nintendoboy16
nintendoboy16

36794

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 35

User Lists: 14

#69 nintendoboy16
Member since 2007 • 36794 Posts

@madrocketeer said:

Another day, another internet outrage wave. Typical.

I don't care. Diversity in itself isn't inherently a good or bad thing. Just gimme good games with well-written and executed stories and characters. I remember hearing about someone once questioning the casting Sir Patrick Stewart as Jean-Luc Picard in Star Trek: TNG; asking if a bald man would look out of place in the future, since baldness should be cured by then. The reply? "In the future, no one will care." I have taken that quote to heart.

Nor is political themes in video games. Personal beliefs informing how you craft stories is unavoidable. Again, not necessarily an inherently good or bad thing - it's all in the execution. Case in point; the recently released The Outer Worlds is basically a satire of hyper-capitalism gone mad. Yet it works because it's seamless, not preachy and is played for laughs, and as a result, it's great. You want to push boundaries? Fine, but do something interesting with it.

An artist's work should be judged on its merit based on the final product and the creator's specific intention for it, not through the lenses of obsessions and preconceptions of internet obsessives. I don't care what their politics are - and that goes to both the creators and the critics.

Yep... anti-SJW's further proving they are no better than their own enemies.

Avatar image for Jag85
Jag85

13938

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 213

User Lists: 0

#70  Edited By Jag85
Member since 2005 • 13938 Posts

@NoodleFighter said:
@KillzoneSnake said:
@Juub1990 said:

@KillzoneSnake: I don’t think he means they’ll never go back to making a game with a white male protagonist, I think he’s saying he’s never going back to making only that. That they’re embracing diversity. At least that’s what I understood from the tweet.

It’s dumb nonetheless.

Yeh there can still be white people but never only. God forbid there is a team of 4 white guys, SJW alert, must force women/color people in or it is not allowed. This is why forced diversity is so bad now. So bad you end up having little teen girls beat up men, no powers needed lol. There was a time nobody even thought about these things... nobody ever complained Resident Evil 3 main was Jill. Metroid, Perfect Dark, San Andreas... games were always diverse... never forced. And one knows it is forced when devs themselves talk about it like an obsession.

This game here for example sucked, but im pointing out the characters/setting.. there is NO WAY that GG, ND, Santa Monica.. any of them would make a game like that good or bad. It would be classified as a white man game. To even bring race into it is extremely racist, how can they get away with this crap.

Interesting you bring up Shellshock because the new COD reflects what you're talking about. There is controversy of the campaign being propaganda because of the developers portrayal of the Russians and the fictional Middle Eastern country Urzikstan. They depicted the Russians in the game as completely monstrous villains doing things such as hanging gay people by cranes when in reality it is middle easterners doing that to gay people. They depicted the Russians doing other horrible things that was actually done by other groups.

The game's fictional Russian invasion of "Urzikstan" is partly based on the very real Soviet invasion of Afghanistan in the 1980s. The Russians did, in fact, perpetrate monstrous atrocities in Afghanistan, including genocide against Afghans and killing a million civilians. And in more recent years, Russia has been perpetrating war crimes in Syria. As for homosexuality, Russia has a long history of persecuting gays, and it's still illegal in Russia to this day. Many of the Russian gamers/trolls/bots (and their alt-right allies in the West) attacking and review-bombing the game are clearly trying to whitewash Russia's crimes against humanity.

Avatar image for Pedro
Pedro

36135

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 64

User Lists: 0

#71 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 36135 Posts

@NoodleFighter said:

It's because of these SJW types recently infiltrating the industry and creating divisiveness that now people are starting to see any diversity as forced diversity and become hostile to it. They try to coerce developers like Warhorse studios into doing forced diversity and arrogantly lecturing them on their own country's history as if they know better.

It seems as though the concept that the people who are making games now are factually more diverse than ever before and the diversity is come through with the games is being lost on you. You ignore facts that developers are making the decision to be more inclusive and include more diversity simply because there team is made up of more than just white males.

I always find it odd that when devs make games that include minority they are pandering but when they exclude they are artists that are allowed to create their vision uninhibited as if these two concepts are mutually exclusive.

Avatar image for PernicioEnigma
PernicioEnigma

6160

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#72 PernicioEnigma
Member since 2010 • 6160 Posts

@xantufrog said:

Wtf is "mens day" and what's the rage about here? He didn't even say what you "quoted"

Here's what he said in proper paraphrase:

"People who actively oppose diversity in gaming can suck it. And fyi, it's been a long time in the making - games take a long time to make. So when you see some diversity that pisses you off this year, tough - we aren't going back and remaking a game we started in 2016 to make it only for you Mr white straight male. It's done. Decision was made."

Honestly, you basically just posted the mindset he's responding to. So, good for you. And what is this even referring to? Clearly someone (you?) was bitching at him about SJWs in 2019, such that he felt he needed to explain that a game featuring diversity in 2019 was actually in development for years and that this shift is a long time coming.

Yeah I agree. White male characters have effectively been the "default" choice of most game developers, and if developers want to try something different, that perfectly fine, and makes sense from a creative perspective. Just don't expect me to purchase a game simply because it has a lesbian protagonist, and don't assume a character is interesting simply because they aren't white and male, because that's not how it works.

Avatar image for MirkoS77
MirkoS77

14681

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 0

#73 MirkoS77
Member since 2011 • 14681 Posts

@PernicioEnigma said:

Yeah I agree. White male characters have effectively been the "default" choice of most game developers, and if developers want to try something different, that perfectly fine, and makes sense from a creative perspective. Just don't expect me to purchase a game simply because it has a lesbian protagonist, and don't assume a character is interesting simply because they aren't white and male, because that's not how it works.

Same.

Whittling one's individuality down to superficial aspects in the name of equality and representation in media doesn't automatically make them interesting. I don't relate to anyone in games to such a degree that I feel my existence is validated from their inclusion. If the majority of characters in gaming were black, I'd be curious as to why (and I'd be interested in viewing market demographics and would be willing to assign it to creative predilections long before bigotry or privilege), but wouldn't feel the need for my race to be represented because that one aspect doesn't encapsulate me. Nor does my sexual orientation. I'd much rather live with a gaming industry with games where I'm under represented (or not represented at all) than live with ones where I'm equally "represented", but only by the most shallow of identifiers.

If that were the case, I'd feel insulted such superficial metrics were lifted and used to try to represent me simply out of a desire to fill a political representative quota. This is why I oppose forced attempts at diversification and representation; because it's pulling one element off of a person that doesn't define their value as an individual, but only delineates them from another tribe through the most insignificant of criteria. That is exactly the mindset that enables racism/homophobia, etc.

Avatar image for NoodleFighter
NoodleFighter

10630

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#74 NoodleFighter
Member since 2011 • 10630 Posts
@Jag85 said:

The game's fictional Russian invasion of "Urzikstan" is partly based on the very real Soviet invasion of Afghanistan in the 1980s. The Russians did, in fact, perpetrate monstrous atrocities in Afghanistan, including genocide against Afghans and killing a million civilians. And in more recent years, Russia has been perpetrating war crimes in Syria. As for homosexuality, Russia has a long history of persecuting gays, and it's still illegal in Russia to this day. Many of the Russian gamers/trolls/bots (and their alt-right allies in the West) attacking and review-bombing the game are clearly trying to whitewash Russia's crimes against humanity.

But you can see in the game they make it clear as possible that their Al Qaeda stand in isn't performing any of these things or not as much of it because of their beliefs and that they're purely secular with noble intentions. While I am aware Russia does these horrible things why is that Russia only gets depicted this way when they're not the only country to do it? I think this has to do with not only America and Western Europe's history with Russia but the market itself and the fact that Russians are a safe/politically correct group to go after especially with how our news has been talking about it since the Trump election. You don't see China getting depicted the same way Russia does and not a chance in hell they will be in the future unless the people making it really want to make a statement. For example the 2012 Red Dawn movie at the last minute switched to making the villains North Koreans instead of the Chinese even though China is far more likely to be able to invade US soil.

@Pedro said:
@NoodleFighter said:

It's because of these SJW types recently infiltrating the industry and creating divisiveness that now people are starting to see any diversity as forced diversity and become hostile to it. They try to coerce developers like Warhorse studios into doing forced diversity and arrogantly lecturing them on their own country's history as if they know better.

It seems as though the concept that the people who are making games now are factually more diverse than ever before and the diversity is come through with the games is being lost on you. You ignore facts that developers are making the decision to be more inclusive and include more diversity simply because there team is made up of more than just white males.

I always find it odd that when devs make games that include minority they are pandering but when they exclude they are artists that are allowed to create their vision uninhibited as if these two concepts are mutually exclusive.

I am fully aware that dev teams are becoming more diverse and they chose to make these decisions but you seem to ignore that certain people come into the industry and create divisiveness. Whether they're game developers or critics. I pointed out Warhorse studios as example of game journalist tried to force them into putting Black people in the game even though Moors were mostly only in Spain and certain parts of Western/South Western Europe. These people demanding it can't even show any evidence that there was Moors in 1403 Bohemia. At best you'd get maybe a couple dozen in there during that time. But that didn't stop them from giving the game low review scores because of that.

Games were always diverse but this hostility towards it is something that has developed recently. I can't recall anyone bitching about the Turok games and Prey 2006 having Native American protagonist or games like Metroid, Resident Evil and Tomb Raider having female protagonist. Developers in the past simply just made games with diverse protagonist and character rosters instead of now where they pat themselves on the back announcing it to the world for doing it as if they did something groundbreaking and new. I'd imagine if developers simply just made these diverse protagonist and cast and didn't go about saying statements like in the OP they most likely wouldn't have been met with as much resistance or backlash. Like it or not White men are still a massive demographic of the video game market and industry and saying things like that they're outdated is of course going to be seen as an attack on them which will bring out hostility.

Avatar image for Pedro
Pedro

36135

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 64

User Lists: 0

#75 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 36135 Posts

@NoodleFighter said:

I am fully aware that dev teams are becoming more diverse and they chose to make these decisions but you seem to ignore that certain people come into the industry and create divisiveness. Whether they're game developers or critics. I pointed out Warhorse studios as example of game journalist tried to force them into putting Black people in the game even though Moors were mostly only in Spain and certain parts of Western/South Western Europe. These people demanding it can't even show any evidence that there was Moors in 1403 Bohemia. At best you'd get maybe a couple dozen in there during that time. But that didn't stop them from giving the game low review scores because of that.

Games were always diverse but this hostility towards it is something that has developed recently. I can't recall anyone bitching about the Turok games and Prey 2006 having Native American protagonist or games like Metroid, Resident Evil and Tomb Raider having female protagonist. Developers in the past simply just made games with diverse protagonist and character rosters instead of now where they pat themselves on the back announcing it to the world for doing it as if they did something groundbreaking and new. I'd imagine if developers simply just made these diverse protagonist and cast and didn't go about saying statements like in the OP they most likely wouldn't have been met with as much resistance or backlash. Like it or not White men are still a massive demographic of the video game market and industry and saying things like that they're outdated is of course going to be seen as an attack on them which will bring out hostility.

Firstly, how are they forcing Warhorse Studios? I would like to know what manner of force your are referring to because if its just complaining, well anyone can complain.

If you mean games were always diverse in the sense that there were significantly more white men than females and other ethnic groups combine then your understanding of diverse is a bit skewed. Now you can argue that in the early stages of gaming the majority of characters' weren't even human, you will be correct but the moment we transition to people the most represented demographic was and still is white males. That doesn't mean there should be a removal of all white males from gaming. It simply means there is a lot of room for other groups. I can make only games that exclude white men for the rest of my life and it would barely make a dent.

This idea that they are announcing it to the world when they have a non white character feels awfully similar to the notion of "they are forcing their sexuality down our throats". Do you call out developers when they reveal a white male character as their main protagonist as "announcing it to the world for doing it" or there is not thought given? Genuinely ask yourself that.

The largest demographic in gaming is Chinese. ;)

Avatar image for caryslan2
caryslan2

2440

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#76 caryslan2
Member since 2005 • 2440 Posts

This fake diversity bullshit and everyone who drinks the kool-aid can go screw off and go away. It's a disease that has infected every aspect of our life to the point that everything has to have some half-assed message attached to it.

Want a chicken sandwich? I hope you like a side of political and religious debate with that! Want to watch a movie or tv show? Watch as some self-righteous asshole shoves his beliefs down your throat in the name of diversity. Well, their militant version of diversity that simply targets another ethnic group and gender while pumping up the one they support.

I agree that some work needs to be done when it comes to diversity and other things. But shaming people for being part of an ethnic group is BS and counterproductive to what these groups and people are trying to accomplish.

I want to eat my chicken sandwich from Chik-fil-a and watch my damn movies or play my games without some asshole trying to lecture me with some half-assed message about diversity while shaming me as a white male.

This SJW diversity BS needs to go away. I support diversity, but it needs to be done right.

Avatar image for Pedro
Pedro

36135

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 64

User Lists: 0

#77 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 36135 Posts

@caryslan2 said:

This SJW diversity BS needs to go away. I support diversity, but it needs to be done right.

What is this right way of doing diversity?

Avatar image for ButDuuude
ButDuuude

1486

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 0

#78  Edited By ButDuuude
Member since 2013 • 1486 Posts

First time I read anyone say Sony is pushing an “anti-men agenda” lol. I guess Kratos is not manly enough...

Avatar image for Jag85
Jag85

13938

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 213

User Lists: 0

#79  Edited By Jag85
Member since 2005 • 13938 Posts
@NoodleFighter said:

But you can see in the game they make it clear as possible that their Al Qaeda stand in isn't performing any of these things or not as much of it because of their beliefs and that they're purely secular with noble intentions. While I am aware Russia does these horrible things why is that Russia only gets depicted this way when they're not the only country to do it? I think this has to do with not only America and Western Europe's history with Russia but the market itself and the fact that Russians are a safe/politically correct group to go after especially with how our news has been talking about it since the Trump election. You don't see China getting depicted the same way Russia does and not a chance in hell they will be in the future unless the people making it really want to make a statement. For example the 2012 Red Dawn movie at the last minute switched to making the villains North Koreans instead of the Chinese even though China is far more likely to be able to invade US soil.

Pretty sure the Middle-East fighters are supposed to represent secular Kurdish fighters, not Al-Qaeda fundamentalists. Also, assuming it's partly based on the Soviet-Afghan War, there was no Al-Qaeda in the early stages of the war, but Afghanistan was a secular communist society at the time. It was in later stages of the war that Al-Qaeda was formed (with the CIA's help). Either way, it's not like there was any shortage of Arab terrorists perpetrating monstrous atrocities in earlier COD games.

A big reason why we may see more Russian or North-Korean villains in recent years simply comes down to business. Which is evident if you look at the video game market revenues:

  • China - $36 billion
  • MENA (Middle East & North Africa) - $4 billion
  • Russia - $1.6 billion
  • North Korea - Probably less than $100 million

As you can see, the Chinese and Arab markets are much more valuable than Russia and North Korea. So it makes a lot more financial sense to go with Russian or North-Korean villains rather than Chinese or Arab villains. Being banned in China or the MENA region would be a much bigger financial loss than being banned in Russia or North Korea.

Avatar image for jeezers
jeezers

3686

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 0

#80 jeezers
Member since 2007 • 3686 Posts

I got it

guys if we make every protagonist a bi racial trans dwarf I think we cover all our bases.

It'll be epic

Avatar image for NoodleFighter
NoodleFighter

10630

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#81 NoodleFighter
Member since 2011 • 10630 Posts

@Jag85: You make some good points on COD. I'll agree with your statement. But yeah China's huge market is what is going to stop companies from calling them out or doing anything that offends their government.

@Pedro said:
@NoodleFighter said:

I am fully aware that dev teams are becoming more diverse and they chose to make these decisions but you seem to ignore that certain people come into the industry and create divisiveness. Whether they're game developers or critics. I pointed out Warhorse studios as example of game journalist tried to force them into putting Black people in the game even though Moors were mostly only in Spain and certain parts of Western/South Western Europe. These people demanding it can't even show any evidence that there was Moors in 1403 Bohemia. At best you'd get maybe a couple dozen in there during that time. But that didn't stop them from giving the game low review scores because of that.

Games were always diverse but this hostility towards it is something that has developed recently. I can't recall anyone bitching about the Turok games and Prey 2006 having Native American protagonist or games like Metroid, Resident Evil and Tomb Raider having female protagonist. Developers in the past simply just made games with diverse protagonist and character rosters instead of now where they pat themselves on the back announcing it to the world for doing it as if they did something groundbreaking and new. I'd imagine if developers simply just made these diverse protagonist and cast and didn't go about saying statements like in the OP they most likely wouldn't have been met with as much resistance or backlash. Like it or not White men are still a massive demographic of the video game market and industry and saying things like that they're outdated is of course going to be seen as an attack on them which will bring out hostility.

Firstly, how are they forcing Warhorse Studios? I would like to know what manner of force your are referring to because if its just complaining, well anyone can complain.

If you mean games were always diverse in the sense that there were significantly more white men than females and other ethnic groups combine then your understanding of diverse is a bit skewed. Now you can argue that in the early stages of gaming the majority of characters' weren't even human, you will be correct but the moment we transition to people the most represented demographic was and still is white males. That doesn't mean there should be a removal of all white males from gaming. It simply means there is a lot of room for other groups. I can make only games that exclude white men for the rest of my life and it would barely make a dent.

This idea that they are announcing it to the world when they have a non white character feels awfully similar to the notion of "they are forcing their sexuality down our throats". Do you call out developers when they reveal a white male character as their main protagonist as "announcing it to the world for doing it" or there is not thought given? Genuinely ask yourself that.

The largest demographic in gaming is Chinese. ;)

They tried getting the creative director at Warhorse studio fired by labeling him a racist and when that didn't work they just started defaming the studio in general. You can see in the Eurogamer review of Kingdom Come Deliverance that they still whine about no Black people being in the game and spend a good amount of the review talking about that.

Games did have women and POC as far back as the 80s but it did start becoming much more common in the 90s and early 2000s. Obviously games were a lot more dominated by White men pre 90s since they created the industry, women weren't into video games as much, non Western markets other than Japan were small or near non existent, and minority populations were also much smaller in the USA so minorities being apart of the development team was much less common. Outside of the USA non whites in Western countries are still small percentages of the population. That would be like complaining about anime being mostly dominated with Japanese characters. But hey if they want to make games with non White male protagonist they can go ahead and do it.

Chinese are the largest demographic but have been secluded up until a few years ago. You don't really see people demand East Asian representation in video games as much as other groups because there are already countless video games that come from East Asia with Asian protagonist from AAA to indie. I'm sure the Chinese, South Koreans, Japanese and etc will continue to develop games where they make up the majority of protagonist and no one will have a problem with it.

Not the same as "forcing sexuality down our throats" when back then and even in this decade we had non White male protagonist in games and developers/publishers didn't make a big deal about it. We especially have a lot more diversity going on now thanks to the indie gaming scene growing around the world and I don't see indie devs other than SJW types trying to make a big deal about the fact they have a non White male protagonist as something groundbreaking. And strangely I don't see these people that demand diversity promote these indie games doing it.

It isn't that having a non White male protagonist by default is announcing it to the world. It's that these developers and publishers go out of their way to actually announce to the world that them making a non White male protagonist is groundbreaking when at this point it isn't and they're clearly trying hard to make a statement when they put so much emphasis on it.

This twitter post sums it up and a guy tries to say that Battlefield V got backlash for having a woman on the cover, his argument immediately gets shot down when people point out other games that have women on their covers that received no backlash and did perfectly fine.

Also what exactly is this "revealing race/gender" because from my perspective I see the protagonist from the get go assuming it isn't first person only with no reflections of them or cutscenes showing their face/body. I can't recall any game I've played or known about doing that.

Guilty Gear Strives first teaser/reveal video at the end revealed a new character that is a Black man. I didn't think it was forced at all or "announcing it to the world". All I was thinking was about was that I thought he had a cool design and wanted to see what kind of moves he had. No one else complained about him either. Hell I was pretty hyped during the Half Life: Alyx gameplay reveal, the thought about playing as a Black woman didn't cross my mind once. I pretty much think nothing of non Whites and women being protagonist in games just like with White males.

Avatar image for Pedro
Pedro

36135

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 64

User Lists: 0

#82 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 36135 Posts

@NoodleFighter: What you pointed out was people/person complaining. Which is not the same as forcing the developer. You are amplifying a complaint to something much greater than it actual is. Do view the people who complain about females and minorities in games as forcing a developer to keep games with only white males? Are the people who complain that a female isn't sexy enough in a game forcing the developer to make sexy females only? As for the article you link to, I don't see the issue of pointing out the absence of africans in a game that was attempting to be realistic. The existence of Moors in the middle ages is not a fairy tale. If this one article is the crux of your argument that they were being forced to include blacks post game, then I am not entirely feeling your concern.

"Chinese, South Koreans, Japanese and etc will continue to develop games where they make up the majority of protagonist and no one will have a problem with it."

Because these countries have the least amount of ethnic diversity and are known to be the most homogeneous population in the world.

You keep claiming that developers are making a big deal about having non whites but have not provided evidence of this claim. Instead you show the tweet of some random guy that agrees with you. Show me where developers are making a big deal about having minorities or females. Don't point me to an article making a big deal about. Point me to developers (note the plurality) making a big deal about having a non white male character.

Avatar image for Ghost120x
Ghost120x

5442

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#83 Ghost120x
Member since 2009 • 5442 Posts

Gameplay > politics. Make a good game and no one will care what or who is in it.

The companies and movie studios making lousy trash are usually the ones bringing up irrelevant things to get attention because they know what they are making just isn't really good. The creators don't believe that the quality of their product will speak for itself and go to twitter to make fools of themselves. It's pretty sad and disrespectful when good things like diversity is used as a means to sell garbage.

Avatar image for faponte13
faponte13

67

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#84 faponte13
Member since 2013 • 67 Posts

Never seen a game a developer go hey look we have a black guy as our main character. But everytime I see a trailer for a game with none white or women characters as the main character and go to the comments. At least in the first 10 comments someone is complaining about sjw or some dumb shit.

Avatar image for Jag85
Jag85

13938

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 213

User Lists: 0

#85  Edited By Jag85
Member since 2005 • 13938 Posts

@NoodleFighter: I somewhat agree that the KCD controversy was overblown. The game already represented Turks, the only non-white group with a significant presence in the region at the time. Black people were very rare in the region at the time, and are still uncommon in the region to this day. However, it's worth noting that there was no such controversy over Witcher 3, which didn't have black people either. So why did Warhorse Studios get criticized and not CDPR? I think the reason has a lot to do with Warhorse Studios expressing support for Gamergate. That's what really led to backlash against Warhorse Studios. So it's their own fault for supporting Gamergate. They had it coming.

@Pedro: Fascinating list. The US ranks a lot lower on the diversity index than I thought. We are often led to believe the US is the most diverse country in the world, yet it barely cracks the top 90 in ethnic diversity and top 65 in linguistic diversity. But where the US does rank highly is religious diversity, at #2, just below South Africa. However, the list doesn't seem to include genetic diversity, which is where I think the US would rank highly, although I think African countries would still come out on top there, due to Africa having more genetic diversity than the rest of the world combined.

Avatar image for uninspiredcup
uninspiredcup

36527

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 85

User Lists: 2

#86  Edited By uninspiredcup
Member since 2013 • 36527 Posts

@Jag85 said:

@NoodleFighter: I somewhat agree that the KCD controversy was overblown. The game already represented Turks, the only non-white group with a significant presence in the region at the time. Black people were very rare in the region at the time, and are still uncommon in the region to this day. However, it's worth noting that there was no such controversy over Witcher 3, which didn't have black people either. So why did Warhorse Studios get criticized and not CDPR? I think the reason has a lot to do with Warhorse Studios expressing support for Gamergate. That's what really led to backlash against Warhorse Studios. So it's their own fault for supporting Gamergate. They had it coming.

When reviews themselves become a platform to dish out perceived vendettas, then that's really not good at all in my opinion. You end up with a Spanish Inquisition mentality where it jumps from being morally aware to gate-keeping puritans actively seeking people to torch.

Which is basically what gaming has devolved into. A big old civil war with dip-shits throwing rocks at other dip-shits. Being left isn't a get-out-of-jail pass for being a huge dipshit just as it is some asshole using "only a joke bro" for spouting out thinly veiled hateful shit.

Websites like Polygon, Kotaku and similar ilk actively push and encourage Gamergate friction to exist in the first place just as it benefits assholes like The Quartering or numbskulls like JosephblaWatson, outrage the business of the day, keep the narrative going you keep the gravy-train tootin' along.

The thing that gets on my tits is how they try to disguise it as righteousness when they quite clearly as lowly and as petty as the fuckwits they are railing against.

The Quartering shitting out 4, 10 minute videos a day complaining about womans, meanwhile Kotaku farting out loli porn.

Joe Rogan is probably the only reasonable person on the internet.

Avatar image for r-gamer
R-Gamer

1202

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#87  Edited By R-Gamer
Member since 2019 • 1202 Posts

@Jag85: None of the movies you mentioned did well because of diversity. Maybe with the exception of Black Panther which became a ridiculously over hyped cultural event. The fact is anything with Marvel on it right now will be successful.

And Alita battle angel was actually a massive flop along with Ghostbusters, Terminator:Dark Fate, Charlie's Angel's the Fantastic 4 reboot etc. Forced pandering is usually a fail.

Avatar image for r-gamer
R-Gamer

1202

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#88  Edited By R-Gamer
Member since 2019 • 1202 Posts

@Pedro: When the people bitching about diversity are the people reviewing your game the complaints seem to carry more weight. Days Gone got ripped apart on gamespot and other sites because they hated they protagonist for being a white male biker.

Avatar image for Jag85
Jag85

13938

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 213

User Lists: 0

#89  Edited By Jag85
Member since 2005 • 13938 Posts

@r-gamer said:

@Jag85: None of the movies you mentioned did well because of diversity. Maybe with the exception of Black Panther which became a ridiculously over hyped cultural event. The fact is anything with Marvel on it right now will be successful.

And Alita battle angel was actually a massive flop along with Ghostbusters, Terminator:Dark Fate, Charlie's Angel's the Fantastic 4 reboot etc. Forced pandering is usually a fail.

Nearly all of the movies I mentioned over-performed at the box office thanks to diversity and/or representation...

  • Black Panther - Highest-grossing solo superhero movie of all time, thanks to strong African representation.
  • Crazy Rich Asians - Highest-grossing rom-com of the decade, thanks to Asian-American representation. Nothing to do with Marvel.
  • Bohemian Rhapsody - Highest-grossing drama of all time, about a bisexual South-Asian refugee played by a Middle-Eastern actor. Again, nothing to do with Marvel.
  • Captain Marvel - One of the top 5 highest-grossing solo superhero movies of all time, thanks to strong female representation.
  • Aladdin - A movie set in the Middle East, with a diverse cast of Middle-Eastern, South-Asian and Black actors. Again, nothing to do with Marvel.
  • Lion King - A movie set in Africa, with mostly a Black voice cast. Again, nothing to do with Marvel.

The only debatable one is Alita. We still don't know whether it flopped or broke even. But it beat the box office projections and broke records for a movie based on anime, far surpassing previous white-washed anime-based movies. And surprisingly, Alita won over the alt-right crowd (the same lot that always complain about diversity), who deemed Alita to be the "right kind" of diversity (whatever that's supposed to mean) and pit it against Captain Marvel.

Avatar image for Jag85
Jag85

13938

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 213

User Lists: 0

#90 Jag85
Member since 2005 • 13938 Posts

@uninspiredcup:

Eh? How is a journalist expressing a personal opinion in a review comparable to the Spanish Inquisition in any way? No one is forcing Warhorse to stop making video games. It's just a journalist expressing a personal opinion in a review. That's what free speech is all about.

I don't even agree with that Eurogamer review, but the author of that review has every right to express their personal opinion. And that's ultimately what a review is. It's just an opinion of what a journalist or critic thinks or feels about a product. People need to stop taking video game reviews so seriously... or Metacritic, for that matter. Fanboys and fangirls wouldn't be so worked-up over reviews if it wasn't for Metacritic.

P.S. I quite like the Joe Rogan show. You have good taste, my friend.

Avatar image for uninspiredcup
uninspiredcup

36527

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 85

User Lists: 2

#91 uninspiredcup
Member since 2013 • 36527 Posts

@r-gamer: I'm not familiar with American biker culture, but aren't the vast overwhelming majority of bikers white dudes?

Or is that just racist person thinking?

Avatar image for jeezers
jeezers

3686

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 0

#92  Edited By jeezers
Member since 2007 • 3686 Posts

@uninspiredcup: American bikers are diverse, indian, asian, black, white, doesnt really matter, I will say my white friends tend to like Harleys and my black friends tend to prefer the street bikes like Kawasaki, but thats not a definite just a generalization.

Btw wild hogs is a horrible dumpster fire of a movie lol should have posted easy rider or torque.. Anything else lol

Avatar image for lundy86_4
lundy86_4

54351

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 0

#93 lundy86_4
Member since 2003 • 54351 Posts

Diversity is more than fine. Forced diversity is something different. Most media is leaning toward the forced aspect. If something is natural within the story, then go fucking nuts.

Avatar image for r-gamer
R-Gamer

1202

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#94 R-Gamer
Member since 2019 • 1202 Posts

@Jag85: If you honestly think any of those movies did well because of diversity your delusional. The one exception was black Panther which was ridiculously overhyped.

Captain marvel although it sold well lost to Spiderman: Far from home which is funny considering it's his 7th movie. If you think she can lead marvel movies going forward your going to be terribly disappointed.

Crazy rich Asians made massive profit but romantic comedys aren't exactly world beaters. It's 6th all time in the genre meaning movies outsold it that came out 10 years ago.

Aladdin and Lion king are Disney remakes which were guaranteed to be successful. Will see how the new little mermaid does with black Ariel.

And Alita was a flop

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.indiewire.com/2019/02/alita-battle-angel-200-million-box-office-flop-fox-1202041681/amp/

And nobody gave a shit about Freddy Mercury's race. You honestly think Bohemian Rhapsody did well because of diversity and not the fact that it was a movie about one of the greatest rockstars in history?

Again it's not that diversity is bad it's just when its forced people are getting tired of it and it showed in all the flops I listed earlier.

Avatar image for uninspiredcup
uninspiredcup

36527

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 85

User Lists: 2

#95  Edited By uninspiredcup
Member since 2013 • 36527 Posts

@jeezers said:

@uninspiredcup: American bikers are diverse, indian, asian, black, white, doesnt really matter, I will say my white friends tend to like Harleys and my black friends tend to prefer the street bikes like Kawasaki, but thats not a definite just a generalization.

Btw wild hogs is a horrible dumpster fire of a movie lol should have posted easy rider or torque.. Anything else lol

I see, interesting.

Days Gone probably would have been GOTY contender if Martin Lawrence was in it, cracking wacky jokes about zombies or some such.

Tim Allen, with his bag of cocaine.

Avatar image for Pedro
Pedro

36135

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 64

User Lists: 0

#96 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 36135 Posts

@r-gamer said:

@Pedro: When the people bitching about diversity are the people reviewing your game the complaints seem to carry more weight. Days Gone got ripped apart on gamespot and other sites because they hated they protagonist for being a white male biker.

A reviewer can complain about diversity in the same manner people can complain about females on the box cover or females not looking as sexy. Yes! Some reviews have more weight than angry internet trolls but these review complaints seems rather inconsistent for me to take this specific issue as seriously. If folks were more critical of reviews in general and how it negatively affect games, I would be more open to the discussion of the unfairness of reviews. But, since this is only call into question when race and gender is called out, it just doesn't read as a genuine concern.

Avatar image for Pedro
Pedro

36135

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 64

User Lists: 0

#97 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 36135 Posts
@lundy86_4 said:

Diversity is more than fine. Forced diversity is something different. Most media is leaning toward the forced aspect. If something is natural within the story, then go fucking nuts.

What is forced diversity?

Avatar image for Jag85
Jag85

13938

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 213

User Lists: 0

#98  Edited By Jag85
Member since 2005 • 13938 Posts

@r-gamer: No offence, but you are clearly ignorant about how the box office and market demographics work. The whole point of this "diversity movement" (or whatever you want to call it) is to pull in new larger audience demographics that wouldn't normally go watch your movies.

  • Black Panther - pulled in record numbers of African and African-American audiences.
  • Captain Marvel - pulled in record numbers of female audiences.
  • Crazy Rich Asians - pulled in record numbers of Asian-American audiences.
  • Bohemian Rhapsody - pulled in record numbers of LGBT and Asian audiences.
  • Aladdin - pulled in record numbers of Asian and Middle-Eastern audiences.
  • The Lion King - pulled in record numbers of African-American audiences.

You could say the "diversity" marketing strategy is somewhat similar to Nintendo's "blue ocean" strategy with the DS and Wii. Nintendo demonstrated that you could reap a ton of rewards if you target an untapped "blue ocean" of audiences beyond your usual demographics. And this is what movie studios and game publishers are more-or-less doing now with this whole "diversity" strategy.

And are you seriously comparing Captain Marvel to Spider-Man? Dude, Spider-Man is a household name and the biggest superhero on the planet. Whereas Captain Marvel is a superhero that most people had previously never heard of before. It's actually pretty damn impressive that she came so close to Spider-Man with her first movie. Which is clearly because of the large female audiences that her movie pulled in.

As for Alita, did you even bother to read your own source before posting? Your source is from before the movie even came out, and is a prediction of how much they think it's going to gross. You might want to learn how to do some basic Googling. The movie's actual gross ended up over-performing well beyond those early predictions. Recent sources state that there is no final verdict on whether or not the movie broke even. But even if Alita did fail, that would just be a damning indictment of the "anti-diversity movement" (or whatever they call themselves), since they were the ones claiming that Alita is "good diversity" and Captain Marvel is "forced diversity", while block-voting Alita and review-bombing Captain Marvel.

Avatar image for r-gamer
R-Gamer

1202

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

#99  Edited By R-Gamer
Member since 2019 • 1202 Posts

@Jag85: Are you just randomly spouting shit off at this point? Do you have a link that it was record numbers of middle easterners going to see Aladdin? Are we also going to ignore the fact that The Lion King was one of Disneys most successful cartoons in the 90s?

And yes Alita battle angel was a flop

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/scottmendelson/2019/03/26/alita-battle-angel-box-office-why-400-million-worldwide-isnt-big-enough/amp/

My point is these movies would have been successful regardless. Captain Marvel did well because it was released right before infinity war. Do you think Star Wars sales well becuse of diversity? Or is it because it's Star Wars? If people crave female action movies so much why did Ghostbusters, Charlie's Angel's, Terminator Dark Fate all flop?

It's one thing to tell a story that features diverse characters that appeals to everyone its another thing to shove it in peoples face at the expense of the core audience. You don't seem to know the difference between the two.

Avatar image for Pedro
Pedro

36135

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 64

User Lists: 0

#100 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 36135 Posts

@r-gamer said:

... its another thing to shove it in peoples face at the expense of the core audience. You don't seem to know the difference between the two.

What is an example of this?