Games No Longer Want To Be Games: An Identity Crisis Or A Maturing Industry?

  • 145 results
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3

This topic is locked from further discussion.

Avatar image for MonsieurX
#101 Posted by MonsieurX (37415 posts) -

[QUOTE="MonsieurX"][QUOTE="battlefieldfan4"]

It's 100x more mature than the pokemon-esque crap that epic and microsoft makes.

Gears of war: No intelligent sentences or quotes. Vocabulary level of all the characters combined is no greater than a 2-year-old. Game was specifically made for children such as yourselves.

Halo: Same as above.

battlefieldfan4

Don't see how BF is mature exactly

I do. Average storyline, dialogue seems like it was written by an adult unlike the dialogues in Halo and Gears. A **** 4-year-old wrote the dialogue for Gears and Halo. Anyone who has never playing Halo and Gears before only need to watch Teletubbies to know the kind of "intelligence" shown in gears and halo.

BF had a story? People actually played it for SP?
Avatar image for ms555
#102 Posted by ms555 (2660 posts) -
[QUOTE="battlefieldfan4"]

[QUOTE="MonsieurX"] Don't see how BF is mature exactlyMonsieurX

I do. Average storyline, dialogue seems like it was written by an adult unlike the dialogues in Halo and Gears. A **** 4-year-old wrote the dialogue for Gears and Halo. Anyone who has never playing Halo and Gears before only need to watch Teletubbies to know the kind of "intelligence" shown in gears and halo.

BF had a story? People actually played it for SP?

Bf3 is my favorite fps game and not even i touched single player haha
Avatar image for DarkLink77
#103 Posted by DarkLink77 (32731 posts) -
[QUOTE="battlefieldfan4"]

[QUOTE="MonsieurX"] Don't see how BF is mature exactlyMonsieurX

I do. Average storyline, dialogue seems like it was written by an adult unlike the dialogues in Halo and Gears. A **** 4-year-old wrote the dialogue for Gears and Halo. Anyone who has never playing Halo and Gears before only need to watch Teletubbies to know the kind of "intelligence" shown in gears and halo.

BF had a story? People actually played it for SP?

Battlefield has a campaign? :shock:
Avatar image for battlefieldfan4
#104 Posted by battlefieldfan4 (259 posts) -

[QUOTE="MonsieurX"][QUOTE="battlefieldfan4"]

I do. Average storyline, dialogue seems like it was written by an adult unlike the dialogues in Halo and Gears. A **** 4-year-old wrote the dialogue for Gears and Halo. Anyone who has never playing Halo and Gears before only need to watch Teletubbies to know the kind of "intelligence" shown in gears and halo.

ms555

BF had a story? People actually played it for SP?

Bf3 is my favorite fps game and not even i touched single player haha

You should. Battlefield is like Harry Potter while gears and halo are like twilight for little boys.

Avatar image for MonsieurX
#105 Posted by MonsieurX (37415 posts) -

[QUOTE="ms555"][QUOTE="MonsieurX"] BF had a story? People actually played it for SP?battlefieldfan4

Bf3 is my favorite fps game and not even i touched single player haha

You should. Battlefield is like Harry Potter while gears and halo are like twilight for little boys.

HP is for little boys...:|
Avatar image for finalstar2007
#106 Posted by finalstar2007 (27942 posts) -

Games are getting better and better for me personally, i love movie like ( see i said movie like not completly movies, games are still games but they are now MUCH more interesting than they used to be and how boring they used to be with stupid blocks moving around and sh*t ) experience in my games, i love cutscenes, i love romance stories, i love action, adventure, stories like going to find treasures, space and so on ( games like mass efffect, uncharted, god of war, etc) so if you cant handle it then you can either rage quit gaming all together or go play pacman and atari games.. very simple please do not ruin it for me and the millions others who like where games are at right now.

Avatar image for Lulekani
#107 Posted by Lulekani (2318 posts) -

Games are getting better and better for me personally, i love movie like ( see i said movie like not completly movies, games are still games but they are now MUCH more interesting than they used to be and how boring they used to be with stupid blocks moving around and sh*t ) experience in my games, i love cutscenes, i love romance stories, i love action, adventure, stories like going to find treasures, space and so on ( games like mass efffect, uncharted, god of war, etc) so if you cant handle it then you can either rage quit gaming all together or go play pacman and atari games.. very simple please do not ruin it for me and the millions others who like where games are at right now.

finalstar2007
Just Try and Stop Us, if you can. Besides if you think about it, your prefence to more cinematic gaming experiences ruins gaming for us who enjoy gameplay above all else. We can't give you an inch and you can't give us one either, theres just not enough room for both concepts to co-exist peacefully.
Avatar image for battlefieldfan4
#108 Posted by battlefieldfan4 (259 posts) -

[QUOTE="battlefieldfan4"]

[QUOTE="ms555"] Bf3 is my favorite fps game and not even i touched single player hahaMonsieurX

You should. Battlefield is like Harry Potter while gears and halo are like twilight for little boys.

HP is for little boys...:|

At least it's more sophisticated than teletubbies. That's who microsoft is trying to target with Halo: The teletubbies crowd.

Avatar image for Obviously_Right
#109 Posted by Obviously_Right (5331 posts) -

[QUOTE="MonsieurX"][QUOTE="battlefieldfan4"]

You should. Battlefield is like Harry Potter while gears and halo are like twilight for little boys.

battlefieldfan4

HP is for little boys...:|

At least it's more sophisticated than teletubbies. That's who microsoft is trying to target with Halo: The teletubbies crowd.

Noble team = Teletubbies?

Avatar image for PsychoLemons
#110 Posted by PsychoLemons (3180 posts) -

In other words: Experience vs having fun in playing games?

Avatar image for AdobeArtist
#111 Posted by AdobeArtist (24841 posts) -

In other words: Experience vs having fun in playing games?

PsychoLemons

That's rather misleading. The experience should be part of what makes the game fun, not disconnected from it.

Avatar image for jimmypsn
#112 Posted by jimmypsn (4425 posts) -

Xbox 360 just crushed PS3 in the NPD. Incredible and Amazing!

Avatar image for battlefieldfan4
#113 Posted by battlefieldfan4 (259 posts) -

[QUOTE="PsychoLemons"]

In other words: Experience vs having fun in playing games?

AdobeArtist

That's rather misleading. The experience should be part of what makes the game fun, not disconnected from it.

Excuse-me, but what experience do the xbox 360 exclusives provide except for vapid, mindless shooting with a terrible storyline that makes Digimon look as sophisticated as Rousseau's Second Discourse?

Avatar image for battlefieldfan4
#114 Posted by battlefieldfan4 (259 posts) -

Xbox 360 just crushed PS3 in the NPD. Incredible and Amazing!

jimmypsn

Still don't see any good games.

Avatar image for MSXBOX4EVER
#115 Posted by MSXBOX4EVER (604 posts) -

[QUOTE="jimmypsn"]

Xbox 360 just crushed PS3 in the NPD. Incredible and Amazing!

battlefieldfan4

Still don't see any good games.

Duh. That's why the 360 crushed the PS3. Because we still don't see any good games on the PS3.

Avatar image for GD1551
#116 Posted by GD1551 (9645 posts) -

[QUOTE="GD1551"]

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"]Identity Crisis more often. I'm not against cinematic games completely, but trying to be like the movies will consistently point out how much better film is as a medium at story telling. What we should be working on is doing things that only this medium can pull off. The interactivity/gameplay is what makes the medium what it is. If it's supposedly the art form that it is, then that needs to be driving force behind it. jg4xchamp

Yeah not really... maybe if you stack the best up against the best, but average to average they are about the same...

Why the hell would I care about the average work or hollywood filler? Best on best film wins, the same way TV wins, the same way literature wins, the same way music would win. Gaming being better than transformers on average(and even that feels like a stretch, it's more like a tie) is about as impressive as the worlds tallest midget.

Because most work is average? Infact let me ask a question, how is film a better medium for story telling than a video game?

Avatar image for GD1551
#117 Posted by GD1551 (9645 posts) -

[QUOTE="GD1551"]

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"]That still makes you just as wrong.DarkLink77

What a well thoughtout post, I commend such intelligence.

I really shouldn't have to explain why Skyfall and The Terminator have better writing than Transformers.

I really shouldn't have to explain my statement againt considering how easy it is to understand, stop mixing up story and execution please.

Avatar image for PsychoLemons
#118 Posted by PsychoLemons (3180 posts) -

[QUOTE="PsychoLemons"]

In other words: Experience vs having fun in playing games?

AdobeArtist

That's rather misleading. The experience should be part of what makes the game fun, not disconnected from it.

Hmmm. You do have a point there but it's not always the case and yet the term "experience" can mean others things as well. Example, my older brother defines that word in graphics, sound/music, scenery and etc. Anyways, I guess your meaning of experience is different as well.

Avatar image for DarkLink77
#119 Posted by DarkLink77 (32731 posts) -

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"][QUOTE="GD1551"]

What a well thoughtout post, I commend such intelligence.

GD1551

I really shouldn't have to explain why Skyfall and The Terminator have better writing than Transformers.

I really shouldn't have to explain my statement againt considering how easy it is to understand, stop mixing up story and execution please.

I understand the difference between story and execution just fine, thanks, so why don't we be honest and drop that argument. Saying that The Expendables and Transformers have stories of comparable quality to Rocky and Skyfall is out and out wrong. The later two actually put focus on plotting, character development, and attempt to explore themes. The former do not. Those things are not a matter of execution. That is a matter of the story itself.
Avatar image for GD1551
#120 Posted by GD1551 (9645 posts) -

I understand the difference between story and execution just fine, thanks, so why don't we be honest and drop that argument. Saying that The Expendables and Transformers have stories of comparable quality to Rocky and Skyfall is out and out wrong. The later two actually put focus on plotting, character development, and attempt to explore themes. The former do not. Those things are not a matter of execution. That is a matter of the story itself.DarkLink77

Again.. this is ALL execution. You don't think with the same story (if they were going for it), they could do everything you listed in expendables???????

Avatar image for Goyoshi12
#121 Posted by Goyoshi12 (9687 posts) -

[QUOTE="MonsieurX"][QUOTE="battlefieldfan4"]

I do. Average storyline, dialogue seems like it was written by an adult unlike the dialogues in Halo and Gears. A **** 4-year-old wrote the dialogue for Gears and Halo. Anyone who has never playing Halo and Gears before only need to watch Teletubbies to know the kind of "intelligence" shown in gears and halo.

DarkLink77

BF had a story? People actually played it for SP?

Battlefield has a campaign? :shock:

Yes and never play it.

NEVER....FVCKING...PLAY IT.

Avatar image for jg4xchamp
#122 Posted by jg4xchamp (61470 posts) -

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"][QUOTE="GD1551"]

Yeah not really... maybe if you stack the best up against the best, but average to average they are about the same...

GD1551

Why the hell would I care about the average work or hollywood filler? Best on best film wins, the same way TV wins, the same way literature wins, the same way music would win. Gaming being better than transformers on average(and even that feels like a stretch, it's more like a tie) is about as impressive as the worlds tallest midget.

Because most work is average? Infact let me ask a question, how is film a better medium for story telling than a video game?

because the other mediums don't have to focus on any other element beyond the story itself. The story is the experience in that medium. In a game a dev has to not only make a story but a game as well. Parts of the story have to be made in a manner to service a gameplay scenario. Which creates a lot of the contrived nature of most videogame plots. That's the ultimate difference between these mediums and its also why a cinematic game gets exposed so easily from a story standpoint. As for most work being average I would say that's a sh*tty way at looking at things. With so many great works raising the bar I'd rather hold them to a bar of quality and not hey it's not as bad as transformers.
Avatar image for DarkLink77
#123 Posted by DarkLink77 (32731 posts) -

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"]

I understand the difference between story and execution just fine, thanks, so why don't we be honest and drop that argument. Saying that The Expendables and Transformers have stories of comparable quality to Rocky and Skyfall is out and out wrong. The later two actually put focus on plotting, character development, and attempt to explore themes. The former do not. Those things are not a matter of execution. That is a matter of the story itself.GD1551

Again.. this is ALL execution. You don't think with the same story if they were going for it, they could do the same in expendables???????

Not to the extent that Skyfall and Rocky do, no. Not at all. Because the stories in those films are built around the things they want to explore. The story in The Expendables, by contrast, is an excuse to blow things up. You're confusing story with plot. And story =/= plot. Plot is a series of events. A to B to C. Story is how those events happen. You might be able to do those things with the same plots, but with the same stories? No, because you'd actually have to write in things like character development. The Expendables would not be the same film if it put any kind of emphasis on the drug addiction that Gunner suffers from, or the loss of humanity that Tool touches on in that one monologue that Mickey Rourke hams up like he thinks its gonna win him an Oscar. So, no, this is not about execution. Execution is the way a story is told, and that is mainly affected by the techniques a writer chooses to use to tell it. Story is the meat of it. You cannot make those films do the things that you believe they are capable of doing without altering the meat of what they are, and thus changing their stories.
Avatar image for GD1551
#124 Posted by GD1551 (9645 posts) -

[QUOTE="GD1551"]

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"]

I understand the difference between story and execution just fine, thanks, so why don't we be honest and drop that argument. Saying that The Expendables and Transformers have stories of comparable quality to Rocky and Skyfall is out and out wrong. The later two actually put focus on plotting, character development, and attempt to explore themes. The former do not. Those things are not a matter of execution. That is a matter of the story itself.DarkLink77

Again.. this is ALL execution. You don't think with the same story if they were going for it, they could do the same in expendables???????

Not to the extent that Skyfall and Rocky do, no. Not at all. Because the stories in those films are built around the things they want to explore. The story in The Expendables, by contrast, is an excuse to blow things up. You're confusing story with plot. And story =/= plot. Plot is a series of events. A to B to C. Story is how those events happen. You might be able to do those things with the same plots, but with the same stories? No, because you'd actually have to write in things like character development. The Expendables would not be the same film if it put any kind of emphasis on the drug addiction that Gunner suffers from, or the loss of humanity that Tool touches on in that one monologue that Mickey Rourke hams up like he thinks its gonna win him an Oscar. So, no, this is not about execution. Execution is the way a story is told, and that is mainly affected by the techniques a writer chooses to use to tell it. Story is the meat of it. You cannot make those films do the things that you believe they are capable of doing without altering the meat of what they are, and thus changing their stories.

I think you are the one who got plot and story mixed up here...

Avatar image for jg4xchamp
#125 Posted by jg4xchamp (61470 posts) -

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"]

I understand the difference between story and execution just fine, thanks, so why don't we be honest and drop that argument. Saying that The Expendables and Transformers have stories of comparable quality to Rocky and Skyfall is out and out wrong. The later two actually put focus on plotting, character development, and attempt to explore themes. The former do not. Those things are not a matter of execution. That is a matter of the story itself.GD1551

Again.. this is ALL execution. You don't think with the same story (if they were going for it), they could do everything you listed in expendables???????

so? Execution is the difference between good and bad and the movies that executed better tell the better story and are the better film. Your argument is highly flawed.
Avatar image for DarkLink77
#126 Posted by DarkLink77 (32731 posts) -

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"][QUOTE="GD1551"]

Again.. this is ALL execution. You don't think with the same story if they were going for it, they could do the same in expendables???????

GD1551

Not to the extent that Skyfall and Rocky do, no. Not at all. Because the stories in those films are built around the things they want to explore. The story in The Expendables, by contrast, is an excuse to blow things up. You're confusing story with plot. And story =/= plot. Plot is a series of events. A to B to C. Story is how those events happen. You might be able to do those things with the same plots, but with the same stories? No, because you'd actually have to write in things like character development. The Expendables would not be the same film if it put any kind of emphasis on the drug addiction that Gunner suffers from, or the loss of humanity that Tool touches on in that one monologue that Mickey Rourke hams up like he thinks its gonna win him an Oscar. So, no, this is not about execution. Execution is the way a story is told, and that is mainly affected by the techniques a writer chooses to use to tell it. Story is the meat of it. You cannot make those films do the things that you believe they are capable of doing without altering the meat of what they are, and thus changing their stories.

I think you are the one who got plot and story mixed up here...

Nope, that would be you.
Avatar image for GD1551
#127 Posted by GD1551 (9645 posts) -

because the other mediums don't have to focus on any other element beyond the story itself. The story is the experience in that medium. In a game a dev has to not only make a story but a game as well. Parts of the story have to be made in a manner to service a gameplay scenario. Which creates a lot of the contrived nature of most videogame plots. That's the ultimate difference between these mediums and its also why a cinematic game gets exposed so easily from a story standpoint. As for most work being average I would say that's a sh*tty way at looking at things. With so many great works raising the bar I'd rather hold them to a bar of quality and not hey it's not as bad as transformers.jg4xchamp

This is wrong, a show like avatar wouldn't get all the praise it got without the visual effects. Movies don't only have to worry about story, they have presentation as a huge factor as well. Only books don't have to worry about presentation (most of the time), furthermore you compared the ENTIRE medium, not just the best. Another question, would it be fair for me to say that movies are horrendous compared to books in the story telling department because the best books > the best movies/shows?

Avatar image for GD1551
#128 Posted by GD1551 (9645 posts) -

[QUOTE="GD1551"]

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"] Not to the extent that Skyfall and Rocky do, no. Not at all. Because the stories in those films are built around the things they want to explore. The story in The Expendables, by contrast, is an excuse to blow things up. You're confusing story with plot. And story =/= plot. Plot is a series of events. A to B to C. Story is how those events happen. You might be able to do those things with the same plots, but with the same stories? No, because you'd actually have to write in things like character development. The Expendables would not be the same film if it put any kind of emphasis on the drug addiction that Gunner suffers from, or the loss of humanity that Tool touches on in that one monologue that Mickey Rourke hams up like he thinks its gonna win him an Oscar. So, no, this is not about execution. Execution is the way a story is told, and that is mainly affected by the techniques a writer chooses to use to tell it. Story is the meat of it. You cannot make those films do the things that you believe they are capable of doing without altering the meat of what they are, and thus changing their stories.DarkLink77

I think you are the one who got plot and story mixed up here...

Nope, that would be you.

Ok then sir.

Avatar image for DarkLink77
#129 Posted by DarkLink77 (32731 posts) -

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"][QUOTE="GD1551"]

I think you are the one who got plot and story mixed up here...

GD1551

Nope, that would be you.

Ok then sir.

I mean, really, we could do this all day. But I provided a definition of plot and story for you, showed the differences, and explained why one =/= the other. I don't know what else you want here.
Avatar image for flashn00b
#130 Posted by flashn00b (3543 posts) -

"Interactive movies" is a bit of an exaggeration, though I see what you mean. I agree that some devs want flashier cutscenes than improving the gameplay. That said, improving the quality of cutscenes isn't bad so long as they also work on how the game plays.

Avatar image for GD1551
#131 Posted by GD1551 (9645 posts) -

[QUOTE="GD1551"]

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"] Nope, that would be you.DarkLink77

Ok then sir.

I mean, really, we could do this all day. But I provided a definition of plot and story for you, showed the differences, and explained why one =/= the other. I don't know what else you want here.

Except I was never talking about plot, so I really don't understand why you brought it up...

Avatar image for DarkLink77
#132 Posted by DarkLink77 (32731 posts) -

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"][QUOTE="GD1551"]

Ok then sir.

GD1551

I mean, really, we could do this all day. But I provided a definition of plot and story for you, showed the differences, and explained why one =/= the other. I don't know what else you want here.

Except I was never talking about plot, so I really don't understand why you brought it up...

Because you were confusing the two terms? On a plot level, you're right, the films are about the same. On a story level? No.
Avatar image for GD1551
#133 Posted by GD1551 (9645 posts) -

[QUOTE="GD1551"]

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"] I mean, really, we could do this all day. But I provided a definition of plot and story for you, showed the differences, and explained why one =/= the other. I don't know what else you want here.DarkLink77

Except I was never talking about plot, so I really don't understand why you brought it up...

Because you were confusing the two terms? On a plot level, you're right, the films are about the same. On a story level? No.

No I wasn't confusing anything.

Avatar image for DarkLink77
#134 Posted by DarkLink77 (32731 posts) -

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"][QUOTE="GD1551"]

Except I was never talking about plot, so I really don't understand why you brought it up...

GD1551

Because you were confusing the two terms? On a plot level, you're right, the films are about the same. On a story level? No.

No I wasn't confusing anything.

Well, then, you're just wrong.

There's really no two ways about it.

Saying The Expendables' story = Rocky's story is laughable.

Avatar image for jg4xchamp
#135 Posted by jg4xchamp (61470 posts) -

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"]

because the other mediums don't have to focus on any other element beyond the story itself. The story is the experience in that medium. In a game a dev has to not only make a story but a game as well. Parts of the story have to be made in a manner to service a gameplay scenario. Which creates a lot of the contrived nature of most videogame plots. That's the ultimate difference between these mediums and its also why a cinematic game gets exposed so easily from a story standpoint. As for most work being average I would say that's a sh*tty way at looking at things. With so many great works raising the bar I'd rather hold them to a bar of quality and not hey it's not as bad as transformers.GD1551

This is wrong, a show like avatar wouldn't get all the praise it got without the visual effects. Movies don't only have to worry about story, they have presentation as a huge factor as well. Only books don't have to worry about presentation (most of the time), furthermore you compared the ENTIRE medium, not just the best. Another question, would it be fair for me to say that movies are horrendous compared to books in the story telling department because the best books > the best movies/shows?

the avatar as in the anime? Can't comment The film um it's consistently called out for a weak plot, but fantastic tech And yeah I would still take the entirety of film over games. Their best and the sheer quantity of good films is more than enough. The difference with books andfm as that their story telling is different entirely. Games emulating movies makes them comparable, and in those cases it looks completely awful. On the flip side you can't compare shadow of the colossus or what planescape achieves with from a story stand point because they don't do things on a cinamatic level; they do it on an interactive level. Which bringse back to my original comment. This mediums story telling needs to be gameplay driven or achieved in an interactive way, because the cinematic games get exposed. --------------- Anyway im on a phone so I'm sorry about if the text is jumbled. Also presentation is not the same as having to worry about a game. One services how you tell the story, the other is a completely different element(admittedly capable of telling a story) that can create a disconnect between story and game.
Avatar image for jg4xchamp
#136 Posted by jg4xchamp (61470 posts) -

[QUOTE="jg4xchamp"]

[QUOTE="AdobeArtist"]

It is true that games are an interactive medium, which should as JG said, be the driving force behind the story telling which you can't get from film. But let's not forget that video games are also a visual and artistic medium - the "video" in the games.

So why shouldn'twe want to see the presentation of the story and world advance in cinematic ways? When done right it enhances our interactivity by making it so much more immersive. In fact as a medium it not only encompasses art & visuals, and interaction, but out of its infancy (from those by gone arcade days) has grown to become a new form of story telling. A part of the equation that should not be forsaken.

What truly distinguishes games from film as a story telling medium, is that in film the screen is a barrier that seperates the viewer from events we can only passively observe, whereas in games the screen is our doorway to events that we get immersed in and become a part of through our avatar. And this is augmented by fleshed out and polished presentation that translates as the "cinematic" experience, just as good art direction in movies has us engrossed in its story.

As long as the interaction and the presentation work in tandem, and not clash with one another, gaming continues to become a more and more engaging experience for us. The two need not collide in a zero sum manner.

On the flip side while old school games (from PacMan, to Centipede, Missle Command, and even games of the 8bit era like Mario and the original Zelda) may be "pure" as a form of gaming, they can never achieve the heights of immersion we have today. I see no reason to sacrifice immersion for the sake of "gameyness" when it can enhance the gaming experience in ways old titles could never realize.

AdobeArtist

Except in large cases it doesn't add in immersion as much as it creates a disconnect between game and story.

Major offenders being obvious stuff like MEtal Gear Solid, or even pretty good cinematic stuff like GTA 4/RDR. Where you can go around being an outlaw causing all kinds of mayhem(because the gameplay is still a major chunk of the experience, and as such tells a story), but then in plot sequences they are a completely different character from the one causing carnage.

I'm not in the SW camp of b1tch about accessible/cinematic games. I understand the appeal, and the type of audience it attracts. But it doesn't help the medium as an art form, as much as it exposes its many short comings while its fanbase keeps abusing the "videogames have so much potential". The mediums best and most powerful work has been stuff where you the player had a say in the matter. Even in a franchise like lets say Metal Gear Solid.

The Boss's death(MGS3) is one of the more powerful sequences in the entire franchise, but shooting her yourself is what makes that scene. Yes Kojima could have done it in cutscene, but it was the part where the player is the one that has to pull that trigger that makes it a memorable sequence. Again I'm not against cinematic games, hell I don't mind a game like heavy rain(as much as I want better execution), but for this medium to be that art form. It's gotta be able to convey its emotion on a more interactive level. Because making me a passive viewer in this medium takes away the "massive potential" this medium has in the first place.

Like I said, cinemtic presentation enhancing the immersion of the gameplay hinges on the designers implementing it properly, that the two elements (presentation and interactivity) don't get in the way of each other. When done right, where the visual presentation dynamically complements the players actions, it really immerses them in the experience.

Except you don't need to be cinematic to be immersive, and the more immersive experiences are the games that let go of their cinematic nature.

Half Life, Bioshock, Metroid Prime, Shadow of the Colossus, Demon's Souls. etc. Those experiences are far more immersive than the likes of Uncharted, Assassin's Creed, or even the Mass Effect series.

Avatar image for Mario1331
#137 Posted by Mario1331 (8929 posts) -

i dont get how people can compare video games to movies...they focus on completely different goals beside the goal of entertainmemt

Avatar image for jg4xchamp
#138 Posted by jg4xchamp (61470 posts) -

i dont get how people can compare video games to movies...they focus on completely different goals beside the goal of entertainmemt

Mario1331

As a story telling medium? Easy because the concept consistently gets brought up "what game told this sto"....and it's like...why should I only hold videogame stories to the low bar of video game stories? There are plenty of films, books, and other mediums that have touched similar plot points/themes and done it better. I'm going to enjoy a story that is universally good, not so much "good for a videogame story"

Plus the main argument is that gamings being cinematic is an extension of games trying too much to be like movies. Which is not in the best interest of videogame as an art form or even as better videogames. Trying to emulate a passive medium is going to take away the one thing that makes this medium special: The interactivity.

None of this is to say I don't like some videogame stories, or videogames can't tell good stories. Hell television(my current love) wasn't nearly as effective as it has gotten over the last decade and a half.

Avatar image for deactivated-5acbb9993d0bd
#139 Posted by deactivated-5acbb9993d0bd (12449 posts) -

[QUOTE="MBirdy88"][QUOTE="Ravenshout"] The game in your avatar could not live up to its hype since it attempted to put a lot of focus on storytelling but failed in the execution. Banal story is no better than no story at all. In fact, having far less focus on story would free up the game and could have made it what it was supposed to be.

Ravenshout

Your takin crap, Diablo failed because of the bad NEW game design choices, nothing to do with the story focus. and why do you bring it up evrey time? I like the character.

Deciding on how much story should be emphasized is a design choice. They decided to focus more on story than the previous games, and the result didn't sit well with their intention. It made the game less randomized, and more funneled than ever before. I brought the game up just to point out how much of a hypocrite you are.

Oh yes, because the story completely modified the loot system, the champion system, the auction house, that was allll to do with the story :roll: PLEASE.... its only slightly more linear than previous diablos, there is barely a difference in that depart,ment. How am I a hypocrit? my original post stated both ways of gaming are fine and somehow you have transformed that into something else based on my avatar. You are a tool.
Avatar image for dreman999
#140 Posted by dreman999 (10824 posts) -

Games becoming more and more like movies is the worst possible thing that can happen to this medium and anyone who disagrees is, quite frankly, wrong.

DarkLink77
Wait, who said it becoming more like movies? It more like we are getting more ways to interact with the games world.
Avatar image for Ravenshout
#141 Posted by Ravenshout (1265 posts) -

[QUOTE="Ravenshout"]

[QUOTE="MBirdy88"] Your takin crap, Diablo failed because of the bad NEW game design choices, nothing to do with the story focus. and why do you bring it up evrey time? I like the character.MBirdy88

Deciding on how much story should be emphasized is a design choice. They decided to focus more on story than the previous games, and the result didn't sit well with their intention. It made the game less randomized, and more funneled than ever before. I brought the game up just to point out how much of a hypocrite you are.

Oh yes, because the story completely modified the loot system, the champion system, the auction house, that was allll to do with the story :roll: PLEASE.... its only slightly more linear than previous diablos, there is barely a difference in that depart,ment. How am I a hypocrit? my original post stated both ways of gaming are fine and somehow you have transformed that into something else based on my avatar. You are a tool.

Changing your avatar is easy breezy, and going so will remove your hypocritical appearance.

Avatar image for deactivated-5acbb9993d0bd
#142 Posted by deactivated-5acbb9993d0bd (12449 posts) -

[QUOTE="MBirdy88"][QUOTE="Ravenshout"] Deciding on how much story should be emphasized is a design choice. They decided to focus more on story than the previous games, and the result didn't sit well with their intention. It made the game less randomized, and more funneled than ever before. I brought the game up just to point out how much of a hypocrite you are.

Ravenshout

Oh yes, because the story completely modified the loot system, the champion system, the auction house, that was allll to do with the story :roll: PLEASE.... its only slightly more linear than previous diablos, there is barely a difference in that depart,ment. How am I a hypocrit? my original post stated both ways of gaming are fine and somehow you have transformed that into something else based on my avatar. You are a tool.

Changing your avatar is easy breezy, and going so will remove your hypocritical appearance.

OR, you could just accept that its about Tyrael and is not product indorsment, or can you not comprehend the obvious?
Avatar image for BlbecekBobecek
#143 Posted by BlbecekBobecek (2932 posts) -

On the bright side, there are still games that are as gamey as gaming gets. Demons / Dark Souls is a perfect example, as well as Zelda Twilight Princess or Metroid Prime Corruption.

Avatar image for LegatoSkyheart
#144 Posted by LegatoSkyheart (29703 posts) -

and that's why as long as we have this

632934_20120913_640screen003.jpg

We will have our Games.

Avatar image for DarkLink77
#145 Posted by DarkLink77 (32731 posts) -
[QUOTE="DarkLink77"]

Games becoming more and more like movies is the worst possible thing that can happen to this medium and anyone who disagrees is, quite frankly, wrong.

dreman999
Wait, who said it becoming more like movies? It more like we are getting more ways to interact with the games world.

I think the "games are becoming more like movies" thing is overblown to an extent, and I'm just as guilty of that as anyone else. That said, it's the worst possible thing that could happen to games, because as Champ said, the thing that makes games special is that they're interactive.