At some point will MS have to change its business model for Game Pass?

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SolidGame_basic

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Poll At some point will MS have to change its business model for Game Pass? (37 votes)

Yes, as the program gets bigger, it will need to be paid for somehow. 57%
Nah, MS just needs more subscribers to keep it alive. 43%
No Caption Provided

So basically, Game Pass Ultimate has the best value. For one year, it's $180, and that includes Gold ($60 value). And you can play wherever you want. Now, if you're not an online gamer, than it's $120 but you're locked to either console or PC then. Still, a great value. But can MS continue this business model? It seems like people rely a lot on the cheap game trials, but long term, what will MS need to do to keep the program alive? If the idea is that MS needs tons of people to join, then that may still be problematic. It's a very competitive market. For one, MS would need Xbox to outsell Sony and Nintendo. Not sure if that will happen. Then there's also the PC market, which is also competitive. Games go on sale pretty quickly and you can buy keys from tons of places.

So I ask you, SW, at some point will MS have to change its business model for Game Pass? I think so. I can see them doing a tiered membership like other subscription services. That way they can charge more to the more engaged users. What do you think?

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regnaston

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#1 regnaston
Member since 2008 • 2196 Posts

I am not sure at what price point/subscriber base they "break even." We do need to consider other things besides the subscriber numbers though. Especially sales generated through gamepass. Some people will buy the game outright after playing it on gamepass. Others who are playing it on gamepass (and may not have bought a certain game otherwise) might buy dlc or use micro-transactions in game.

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Pedro

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#2 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

I know deep down inside you are hoping that the model would fail but it wouldn't. This is a longterm view and it would survive just like other subscription models. I never understood why a very specific group is always concerned about the finances of a trillion dollar company.πŸ˜‚

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Ghost_of_Phobos

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#3  Edited By Ghost_of_Phobos
Member since 2020 • 1564 Posts

Honestly couldn't care if the model works or not. At this point it offers great value and as a consumer that's all I care for. Is like me strictly buying DVDs because one day Netflix might fail.

Microsoft absolutely doesn't need to surpass Sony for Gamepass to succeed. Different business can perfectly coexist with different models. They need a solid base of subscribers but if you make some basic math for an 8 year plan you'll see that they can get a good influx of money without having absurd numbers.

They already have a tiered model with Gamepass, Gmepass Ultimate and even Gold if they wish to make it kind of a Gamepass Silver.

Lastly I just find it hilarious that in an age of subscription services, where even Nintendo and Sony have them in some form, and Music and TV are completely dominated by them, one faction of "gamers" are completely obsessed because a brand they decided to hate offers the best deal in gaming and they just can't deal with it.

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SolidGame_basic

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#4 SolidGame_basic
Member since 2003 • 29920 Posts

@ghost_of_phobos: So if MS raised the price for Game Pass, you would have no problem with it?

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Pedro

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#5 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@ghost_of_phobos: OP is now playing with "what if scenarios". πŸ˜‚πŸ€£

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#6 GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 11416 Posts

They will definitely have to change their model, 100%. As Game Pass reaches a threshold they will have to turn from coaxing users to charging them. They need to reach a certain point where the amount of users they lose over an increase is insignificant compared to the additional revenue of increasing the price and decreasing the cost of swapping in new games. Right now they are trying to get people entrenched in the ecosystem, but it's guaranteed they will have to switch to focusing on profits in the future.

I'm wondering at this point if they will even let Zenimax games launch free on the service or treat them more as a 2nd party that isn't included in such moves, or let them decide independently if they want to launch there or charge full price to all.

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Pedro

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#7 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@girlusocrazy: Why do you all make up these already settled scenarios? Bethesda and all of its studios would be under Xbox Game Studios. All games made under this banner would be on GamePass day one.

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Ghost_of_Phobos

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#8 Ghost_of_Phobos
Member since 2020 • 1564 Posts

@SolidGame_basic: Depends in the value proposition. Like with every single thing.

You better quit gaming altogether since Sony increase their prices by more than 10% and was planning to raising it even more. Who knows if they won't charge you 200 per game!!!

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sealionact

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#9 sealionact
Member since 2014 • 6768 Posts

@girlusocrazy: They’re already charging. As less people are able to use the $1 offer, more people will be paying $180 a year. They have over 20 million subscribers, and if the quality stays good, they’ll have little reason to leave.

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#10  Edited By GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 11416 Posts

@sealionact: Can't you just create a new account, get the $1 offer, and share it with your real account? I have no idea I never tried it, but there seem to be some loopholes.

But yeah I get what you mean.

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#11 GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 11416 Posts

@Pedro: I'm not going to make any assumptions until they are specific about that. I'm not affirming any particular scenario, but I'm recognizing that the possibility exists.

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Pedro

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#12 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@girlusocrazy: The possibility exist if you are pursuing alternate realities.

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Archangel3371

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#13 Archangel3371
Member since 2004 • 33820 Posts

Yes? No? Maybe?

I mean does anyone here have any actual data and stats on well anything about Game Pass.

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#14 GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 11416 Posts

@Pedro: Where have they explicitly said they would put all Zenimax games on game pass day one?

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Ghost_of_Phobos

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#15 Ghost_of_Phobos
Member since 2020 • 1564 Posts

@girlusocrazy: They haven't said anything because the deal isn't done.

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Phlop_Spencer

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#16 Phlop_Spencer
Member since 2020 • 1476 Posts

@Pedro: hey look Pedro β€œI’m not a lem” white knighting for Microsoft again.

Tell me mr financial, break down how game pass revenue - game pass expenses currently equals profit for MS? Tell me how game pass rev translates to profit 4 years from now? How does Xbox recoup 7.5 bill black hole investment? I wanna hear it

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Pedro

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#17 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@girlusocrazy said:

@Pedro: Where have they explicitly said they would put all Zenimax games on game pass day one?

πŸ˜πŸ˜‘ Since 2018, ALL 1st party games will be released day one on Gamepass. Zenimax is going to be a 1st party developer for Xbox when the acquisition is complete. I am not sure which part you are struggling with.

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Pedro

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#18 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@phlop_spencer: Which part of gamers should not be concerned about the finances of a trillion dollar company you didn't understand? 😎

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SolidGame_basic

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#19 SolidGame_basic
Member since 2003 • 29920 Posts

@Pedro said:

@phlop_spencer: Which part of gamers should not be concerned about the finances of a trillion dollar company you didn't understand? 😎

So you think MS is not thinking about how Game Pass is doing financially?

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Pedro

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#20 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@SolidGame_basic: Which part of gamers should not be concerned about the finances of a trillion dollar company you didn't understand? 😎

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ConanTheStoner

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#21 ConanTheStoner  Online
Member since 2011 • 20429 Posts

lol

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Ghost_of_Phobos

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#22 Ghost_of_Phobos
Member since 2020 • 1564 Posts

@phlop_spencer: Not difficult if they sustain a minimum of 10 million users across PC and Xbox, plus game sales across several platforms (I don't think it makes sense to make Zenimax games exclusives, it's enough to put them day one on Gamepass and sell them full price on Playstation, etc), microtransactions and Gold. Make some rough calculations across a whole gen (8 years) and you'll find it's not that complicated.

For sure there's a risk and for sure they're not aiming at profitability at a medium time frame and they don't need to. All they need is to show growth and a solid enough base to ensure a massive revenue through years to come.

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Eoten

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#23 Eoten
Member since 2020 • 2894 Posts

I think they'll phase out Xbox Live and just go with Game Pass as an all inclusive subscription service. And they're making tons on Game Pass with users on PC, as well as Xcloud membership on mobile devices. Their customers go beyond Xbox owners at this point. I think them raising the cost of Xbox Live is to push that transition along.

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Pedro

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#24 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@eoten: They should covert all gold members to Gamepass and remove the online gaming pay wall. That is my stance. A win for gamers.

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#25  Edited By GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 11416 Posts

@Pedro: Just the part where they didn't explicitly say that includes the Zenimax studios, so the possibility is open. They said that before the acquisition, and didn't define the terms on which Zenimax games would fit in to that, so they'll have to update that statement to account for whether or not they are included. I'm not going to make any assumptions either way.

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Pedro

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#26 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@girlusocrazy said:

@Pedro: Just the part where they didn't explicitly say that includes the Zenimax studios, so the possibility is open. They said that before the acquisition, and didn't define the terms on which Zenimax games would fit in to that, so they'll have to update that statement to account for whether or not they are included. I'm not going to make any assumptions either way.

Zenimax is going to be part of Xbox Game Studios whether you like it or not. All game studios are under MS gaming division which is Xbox. You can spin to your hearts content. πŸ˜‚

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#27 GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 11416 Posts

@Pedro: I didn't say they weren't, what I'm saying is I'm not making any assumptions about whether or not the Zenimax games will release on Game Pass day one since their statement about first party games came before the acquisition of Zenimax. We'll have to wait for an update from MS either confirming or denying their release status for Game Pass.

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Livecommander

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#28  Edited By Livecommander
Member since 2009 • 1386 Posts

@Pedro: aren't you a programmer ? Without proper finical decisions/results , there are no games.

And mature gamers with high awareness skills are conscious of this.

Say its your personal choice to not care but to say it isn't smart to just isnt true.

The Knicks are my favorite team , im dum for caring about what they spend they salary cap on ?

Am I dum for caring who they draft ? Whos the next general manager ?

Live in bliss when it comes to the business side of games if you want. But to say there's no point on a general level is stupid.

You'll have people thinking their favorite games grow on tress and will always be available at the same levels of production etc.

We not 17 Pedro. You dont have to have stock in a company to care and properly anticipate its moves instead of blindly waiting and anticipating things that will never come.

Next thing you know you buy a system that was destine to fail or no longer have the production capabilities you wanted.

Not everybody's rich like you Pedro lol

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Pedro

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#29  Edited By Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@girlusocrazy said:

@Pedro: I didn't say they weren't, what I'm saying is I'm not making any assumptions about whether or not the Zenimax games will release on Game Pass day one since their statement about first party games came before the acquisition of Zenimax. We'll have to wait for an update from MS either confirming or denying their release status for Game Pass.

Once they are first party their games will be released day one on GamePass. That stance was made known to the world since 2018. Every 1st part game is released day 1 on GamePass. Again, you are trying to spin but that doesn't change reality.

@Livecommander said:

@Pedro: aren't you a programmer ? Without proper finical decisions/results , there are no games.

And mature gamers with high awareness skills are conscious of this.

Say its your personal choice to not care but to say it isn't smart to just isnt true.

The Knicks are my favorite team , im dum for caring about what they spend they salary cap on ?

Am I dum for caring who they draft ? Whos the next general manager ?

Live in bliss when it comes to the business side of games if you want. But to say there's no point on a general level is stupid.

You'll have people thinking their favorite games grow on tress and will always be available at the same levels of production etc.

We not 17 Pedro. You dont have to have stock in a company to care and properly anticipate its moves instead of blindly waiting and anticipating things that will never come.

Next thing you know you buy a system that was destine to fail or no longer have the production capabilities you wanted.

Not everybody's rich like you Pedro lol

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PC_Rocks

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#30 PC_Rocks
Member since 2018 • 5155 Posts

TC's the same cow who was hyping the comment about Jack Ryan that Sony will have something like GamePass. Didn't see his concern then for Sony.

He flip flops worse than tormeltdowns...well, almost.

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#31  Edited By GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 11416 Posts

@Pedro: OK, but their acquisition of Zenimax which was made after that statement may or may not fall into that plan. I'll wait for them to make an official statement on whether they are updating their plans to include Zenimax or not, you are free to make your assumptions.

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SolidGame_basic

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#32 SolidGame_basic
Member since 2003 • 29920 Posts

@Livecommander: excellent post, man

@pc_rocks said:

TC's the same cow who was hyping the comment about Jack Ryan that Sony will have something like GamePass. Didn't see his concern then for Sony.

He flip flops worse than tormeltdowns...well, almost.

As usual, I don't think you actually read what I wrote in that thread πŸ˜„ I mentioned that Sony already has PS Now and could offer a tiered service. That supports what I wrote in my OP.

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Livecommander

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#33 Livecommander
Member since 2009 • 1386 Posts

@Pedro: which part are you confused about ?

You just finish telling solid basic that gamers should not worry about the finances of gaming companies.

If the xbox division alone was worth a trillion it still would be worth keeping track off

What confuses people like you is target audience.

Sells and finances only stop mattering when the target audiences the different companies dont match up. There other situations i think off too but yea

This is for the non vocals who are on the fence of thinking your make sense lol

Im not even truly responding to you lol

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Pedro

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#34 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@Livecommander: Just like your initial comment, you are just writing much about nothing.

@girlusocrazy said:

@Pedro: OK, but their acquisition of Zenimax which was made after that statement may or may not fall into that plan. I'll wait for them to make an official statement on whether they are updating their plans to include Zenimax or not, you are free to make your assumptions.

There is no assumption, that is there current policy. You are making assumptions and playing with "what ifs".

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SolidGame_basic

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#35  Edited By SolidGame_basic
Member since 2003 • 29920 Posts
@Pedro said:

@Livecommander: Just like your initial comment, you are just writing much about nothing.

Nope, he respectfully provided a substantial response to your comment, and you're just deflecting and diverting as usual. πŸ€·β€β™‚οΈ

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Pedro

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#36 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@SolidGame_basic: You have a tendency of being in tuned with nonsense especially when it is the nonsense you tend to peddle but typically through others. So, I understand why you think his nonsense is substantial. 😎

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#37  Edited By GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 11416 Posts

@Pedro: Their policy was stated prior to their acquisition of Zenimax, and they have not explicitly stated how Zenimax fits into this. I'll wait for them to officially state whether or not they're included in the Game Pass release plans. We have just witnessed how MS can change their plans, so even if you held the belief their statements prior to Zenimax still applied to all future acquisitions (which they also did not state), I would still take the position that until it happens it isn't guaranteed. You're free to make those assumptions if you want.

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Pedro

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#38 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@girlusocrazy said:

@Pedro: Their policy was stated prior to their acquisition of Zenimax, and they have not explicitly stated how Zenimax fits into this. I'll wait for them to officially state whether or not they're included in the Game Pass release plans. We have just witnessed how MS can change their plans, so even if you held the belief their statements prior to Zenimax still applied to all future acquisitions (which they also did not state), I would still take the position that until it happens it isn't guaranteed. You're free to make those assumptions if you want.

You are being silly. Nothing is guaranteed besides death. But that is not the issue here. MS has a policy that all their first party games are going to released day 1 on GamePass but for some unfounded reason how Zenimax acquisition fits into this policy is a blur. πŸ˜‚

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#39  Edited By GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 11416 Posts

@Pedro: Since it isn't explicitly stated how it applies to Zenimax following their acquisition, I'll wait to see how that applies going forward. You're free to make assumptions if you want.

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#40 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@girlusocrazy: You are free to assume that for unfounded reasons that the policy is going to change because you don't like the great value proposition of GamePass combined with EA and Bethesda. 😎

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#41  Edited By GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 11416 Posts

@Pedro: Since their position on how it applies to Zenimax hasn't yet been defined since their acquisition, I will wait for an official comment on the matter. You are free to make assumptions if you want.

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#42 Phlop_Spencer
Member since 2020 • 1476 Posts

@Pedro: wow about 19 posts in here from you and non explain the sustainability of game pass in the long run. You’re the number 1 corporate shill on these forums. Pathetic

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Pedro

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#43 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@girlusocrazy said:

@Pedro: Since their position on how it applies to Zenimax hasn't yet been defined since their acquisition, I will wait for an official comment on the matter. You are free to make assumptions if you want.

You are free to assume that for unfounded reasons that the policy is going to change because you don't like the great value proposition of GamePass combined with EA and Bethesda. 😎

@phlop_spencer said:

@Pedro: wow about 19 posts in here from you and non explain the sustainability of game pass in the long run. You’re the number 1 corporate shill on these forums. Pathetic

"I never understood why a very specific group is always concerned about the finances of a trillion dollar company.πŸ˜‚"

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#44  Edited By GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 11416 Posts

@Pedro: It hasn't been yet defined to include Zenimax following their acquisition of Zenimax. The definition of their policy was made prior to the acquisition. I'll wait for an official statement clarifying this. You're free to make assumptions if you want.

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#45 Phlop_Spencer
Member since 2020 • 1476 Posts

@Pedro: repeating bullshit from your buddy Phil spencer (pathological liar) is just making you look as pathetic as a lem as you can get.

Thanks for conceding that you don’t know what you’re talking about and you’re only here to shill for MS

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#46 Phlop_Spencer
Member since 2020 • 1476 Posts

@Pedro:

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#47 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@girlusocrazy said:

@Pedro: It hasn't been yet defined to include Zenimax following their acquisition to Zenimax. The definition of their policy was made prior to the acquisition. I'll wait for an official statement clarifying this. You're free to make assumptions if you want.

It has been made very clear that the acquisition is about bring their games to GamePass, just like ALL Xbox first party.

You are free to assume that for unfounded reasons that the policy is going to change because you don't like the great value proposition of GamePass combined with EA and Bethesda. 😎

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#48  Edited By GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 11416 Posts

@Pedro: They didn't state if it would include Zenimax following their acquisition of Zenimax. The definition of their policy was made prior to the acquisition. I'll wait for an official statement clarifying this. There is nothing to change if how it pertains to Zenimax hasn't yet been defined. What remains to be seen is how it is defined in regards to the acquisition of Zenimax. You can't grandfather something in if it happens in the future. You're free to make assumptions if you want.

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#49 Pedro
Member since 2002 • 47070 Posts

@girlusocrazy said:

@Pedro: They didn't state if it would include Zenimax following their acquisition of Zenimax. The definition of their policy was made prior to the acquisition. I'll wait for an official statement clarifying this. You're free to make assumptions if you want.

"Microsoft previously confirmed all new Bethesda titles will launch day and date into Xbox Game Pass."

You are free to assume that for unfounded reasons that the policy is going to change because you don't like the great value proposition of GamePass combined with EA and Bethesda. 😎

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#50  Edited By GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 11416 Posts

@Pedro: I won't make the assumption that their statements at the time included future as-yet unannounced actions. You're free to make that assumption.