An Analysis: The gap between Wii U and PS4 is LARGER than 360/PS3 and Wii.

Mods, please do not lock this thread.  This is a very specific discussion, too broad to be discussed within the sticky.  It deserves its own topic.  This is a detailed analysis of the gap between both platforms. 

The PS4 has 8gb of GDDR5 ram.  The Wii U 2gb of DDR3.

The Wii U however dedicates 1gb of its 2gb of ram to the OS, leaving only 1gb for games.   

Rumors (the same ones that leaked the PS4 specs) put the PS4's OS overhead between 512mb to 1.5gb.  Lets average that out to an even 1gb.    

Assuming that the PS4's OS overhead ends up being an even 1gb, that is 7gb of ram purely for games on the PS4 versus 1gb for the Wii U. 

HOWEVER......that isnt taking into account the MASSIVE bandwidth differences between the two systems (and this isnt hyperbole it really is massive as you'll see).  

The Wii U has a memory bandwidth of 12.8gb/s.  Forget the PS4.  That is HALF the memory bandwidth of the 360 and PS3. Yes, the PS3 and 360 :|

Wii U = 12.8gb/s (+ edram)

360 = 22.4gb/s (+ edram)

PS3 = 22.6gb/s

It does not even approach the PS4's 176gb/s.  That is nearly FOURTEEN times the memory bandwidth.  In comparison, the 360/ps3 had only FOUR times the bandwidth of the original Wii's 5.6gb/s.  This is not only a LARGER gap between the Wii U/PS4 than there was between the 360/PS3 and the Wii, but the gap itself is nearly FOUR times larger.   :|

PS4: 176 (GB/s)

PS4's GPU has 1154 compute cores compared to 320 cores in the Wii U (PS4 = 18 CU, 1 CU = 64 cores)

but when you factor in:

-almost 4 times the physical amount of cores

-roughly (14x) FOURTEEN TIMES the memory bandwidth

-7 times the ACTUAL physical memory (7gb for games, vs 1gb)

-the fact that those 1154 PS4 cores are likely GCN2 cores, while the Wii U's 320 are based on a core architecture from 2008, 

-cores are clocked faster (800mhz vs 550mhz) EDIT: Fixed.

-Oh, and the Wii U's CPU cores are the same architecture as the Wii, which was the same as the Gamecube.  Wii U is directly using the same CPU cores as the Wii and Gamecube, just using MORE of them and clocked higher.  This architecture was created in 1999 :|

One thing we can agree on is that this is a pretty big f*cking gap.  A larger gap between the two systems, than there was between the PS3/360 and the Wii.

And the only thing left to say is

think your sig is a more appropriate thing to say.

One thing though, where did you find out that it has 1154 shader processors at 850ghz, and bandwidth of 176GB/s? The PDF only says "GPU : 1.84 TFLOPS, AMD next-generation Radeon based graphics engine"

Analysis on how much I care.

:O

Analysis on how much I care.

:O

OreoMilkshake

Do Sheeps even exist ? :o

think your sig is a more appropriate thing to say.

One thing though, where did you find out that it has 1154 shader processors at 850ghz? The PDF only says "GPU : 1.84 TFLOPS, AMD next-generation Radeon based graphics engine"

Inconsistancy

The official press release (as well as pretty much all the rumors corroborated before hand) stated 18 compute units in the PS4.

1 compute unit = 64 compute cores.

The PS4 GPU is just two CU's shy of the Radeon 7970m's 20 compute units. (rumors also predicted this as well.  They stated that it was based off the 7970m, but with 2 fewer CUs, thus the 18 that are in the officiall specs)

Radeon 7970m is the card the PS4's GPU is based off of (which itself is a 7870).  The PS4 GPU is directly in between a 7850 and a 7870.

Analysis on how much I care.

:O

OreoMilkshake

Deadlift, you are such a bandwagoning douche bag. Now you love Sony all of a sudden? What a fake.

Deadlift, you are such a bandwagoning douche bag. Now you love Sony all of a sudden? What a fake.

Master_ShakeXXX

Deadlift, you are such a bandwagoning douche bag. Now you love Sony all of a sudden? What a fake.

Master_ShakeXXX

And this surprises you? He used to be one of the biggest cows.

PS4

WiiU

[QUOTE="OreoMilkshake"]

Analysis on how much I care.

:O

StrongDeadlift

[QUOTE="Inconsistancy"]

think your sig is a more appropriate thing to say.

One thing though, where did you find out that it has 1154 shader processors at 850ghz? The PDF only says "GPU : 1.84 TFLOPS, AMD next-generation Radeon based graphics engine"

StrongDeadlift

The official press release (as well as pretty much all the rumors corroborated before hand) stated 18 compute units in the PS4.

1 compute unit = 64 compute cores.

The PS4 GPU is just two CU's shy of the Radeon 7970m's 20 compute units. (rumors also predicted this as well.  They stated that it was based off the 7970m, but with 2 fewer CUs, thus the 18 that are in the officiall specs)

Radeon 7970m is the card the PS4's GPU is based off of (which itself is a 7870).  The PS4 GPU is directly in between a 7850 and a 7870.

It's just that the math doesn't add up, the official PDF says 1.84tflops. 1154@850mhz = 1.96tflops, 1154@800mhz = 1.84*, 1024@900mhz = 1.84* (7850+40mhz)

(based off the apparent math used to calculate mflops on wiki, shader * 2 * core clock = mflops, which seems to be the standard everywhere)

[QUOTE="StrongDeadlift"]

[QUOTE="Inconsistancy"]

think your sig is a more appropriate thing to say.

One thing though, where did you find out that it has 1154 shader processors at 850ghz? The PDF only says "GPU : 1.84 TFLOPS, AMD next-generation Radeon based graphics engine"

Inconsistancy

The official press release (as well as pretty much all the rumors corroborated before hand) stated 18 compute units in the PS4.

1 compute unit = 64 compute cores.

The PS4 GPU is just two CU's shy of the Radeon 7970m's 20 compute units. (rumors also predicted this as well.  They stated that it was based off the 7970m, but with 2 fewer CUs, thus the 18 that are in the officiall specs)

Radeon 7970m is the card the PS4's GPU is based off of (which itself is a 7870).  The PS4 GPU is directly in between a 7850 and a 7870.

It's just that the math doesn't add up, the official PDF says 1.84tflops. 1154@850mhz = 1.96tflops, 1154@850mhz = 1.84*, 1024@900mhz = 1.84* (7850+40mhz)

(based off the apparent math used to calculate tflops on wiki, shader * 2 * core clock = mflops, which seems to be the standard everywhere)

Come to think of it, I think I remember that same rumor that (correctly) predicted the 18 CUs also said that it was clocked lower, so probably an even 800mhz.  This is speculation on my part though.  Im sure its somewhere in that area.  

EDIT: Just did the math.  

800mhz * 2 * 1154 = 1.84.  

It must be clocked at 800mhz.  

Crappiness hasn't held the 3DS back. Most people have bad taste so, Nintendo, fear not.SolidSnake35

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"]Crappiness hasn't held the 3DS back. Most people have bad taste so, Nintendo, fear not.DropsofJupiter

lol

[QUOTE="DropsofJupiter"][QUOTE="SolidSnake35"]Crappiness hasn't held the 3DS back. Most people have bad taste so, Nintendo, fear not.SolidSnake35

YES the domination has won :cool: !!!

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"][QUOTE="DropsofJupiter"] Ah yes. 3DS, the system with the superior games, is somehow crappy. Brilliant. And of course, everyone has poor taste for liking the superior 3DS games. Never change, hardcore Sony fanboys. Never change.DropsofJupiter

[QUOTE="DropsofJupiter"][QUOTE="SolidSnake35"] What games? Mario Kart? Come on, we're not in the 90's anymore.OreoMilkshake

A sheep circlejerk. A rare sight. Neon_Noir

And here I was thinking they gone extinct.

think your sig is a more appropriate thing to say.

One thing though, where did you find out that it has 1154 shader processors at 850ghz, and bandwidth of 176GB/s? The PDF only says "GPU : 1.84 TFLOPS, AMD next-generation Radeon based graphics engine"

Inconsistancy

'Wii U is directly using the same CPU cores as the Wii and Gamecube, just using MORE of them and clocked higher. This architecture was created in 1999' Is this true? If it is :lol: and they're asking 350$n for THIS!? Nintendo is a such a laughing stock these days i don't know what's going onsilversix_

[QUOTE="silversix_"]'Wii U is directly using the same CPU cores as the Wii and Gamecube, just using MORE of them and clocked higher. This architecture was created in 1999' Is this true? If it is :lol: and they're asking 350$n for THIS!? Nintendo is a such a laughing stock these days i don't know what's going onStrongDeadlift

[QUOTE="StrongDeadlift"][QUOTE="silversix_"]'Wii U is directly using the same CPU cores as the Wii and Gamecube, just using MORE of them and clocked higher. This architecture was created in 1999' Is this true? If it is :lol: and they're asking 350$n for THIS!? Nintendo is a such a laughing stock these days i don't know what's going onnchan

That has nothing to do with the power or how modern the CPU is.

[QUOTE="DropsofJupiter"][QUOTE="SolidSnake35"]Crappiness hasn't held the 3DS back. Most people have bad taste so, Nintendo, fear not.SolidSnake35

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"][QUOTE="DropsofJupiter"] Ah yes. 3DS, the system with the superior games, is somehow crappy. Brilliant. And of course, everyone has poor taste for liking the superior 3DS games. Never change, hardcore Sony fanboys. Never change.DropsofJupiter

Alot of ports and inferior console experiences on your list. The 3DS seems to have more in common with the Vita then I thought. :o

All that power and not a single game in sight.

Sony has a knack for disappointment.

I'm not sure what's sadder, the fact that you went to the trouble to make this thread, or the fact that you are using the two systems' RAM to compare their power.DropsofJupiter

All that power and not a single game in sight.

Sony has a knack for disappointment.

ChubbyGuy40

Destiny and Watch Dogs looks pretty impressive to me :|

Mods, please do not lock this thread. This is a very specific discussion, too broad to be discussed within the sticky. It deserves its own topic. This is a detailed analysis of the gap between both platforms.

The PS4 has 8gb of GDDR5 ram. The Wii U 2gb of DDR3.

The Wii U however dedicates 1gb of its 2gb of ram to the OS, leaving only 1gb for games.

Rumors (the same ones that leaked the PS4 specs) put the PS4's OS overhead between 512mb to 1.5gb. Lets average that out to an even 1gb.

Assuming that the PS4's OS overhead ends up being an even 1gb, that is 7gb of ram purely for games on the PS4 versus 1gb for the Wii U.

HOWEVER......that isnt taking into account the MASSIVE bandwidth differences between the two systems (and this isnt hyperbole it really is massive as you'll see).

The Wii U has a memory bandwidth of 12.8gb/s. Forget the PS4. That is HALF the memory bandwidth of the 360 and PS3. Yes, the PS3 and 360 :|

Wii U = 12.8gb/s (+ edram)

360 = 22.4gb/s (+ edram)

PS3 = 22.6gb/s

It does not even approach the PS4's 176gb/s. That is nearly FOURTEEN times the memory bandwidth. In comparison, the 360/ps3 had only FOUR times the bandwidth of the original Wii's 5.6gb/s. This is not only a LARGER gap between the Wii U/PS4 than there was between the 360/PS3 and the Wii, but the gap itself is nearly FOUR times larger. :|

PS4: 176 (GB/s)

PS4's GPU has 1154 compute cores compared to 320 cores in the Wii U (PS4 = 18 CU, 1 CU = 64 cores)

but when you factor in:

-almost 4 times the physical amount of cores

-roughly (14x) FOURTEEN TIMES the memory bandwidth

-7 times the ACTUAL physical memory (7gb for games, vs 1gb)

-the fact that those 1154 PS4 cores are likely GCN2 cores, while the Wii U's 320 are based on a core architecture from 2008,

-cores are clocked faster (800mhz vs 550mhz) EDIT: Fixed.

-Oh, and the Wii U's CPU cores are the same architecture as the Wii, which was the same as the Gamecube. Wii U is directly using the same CPU cores as the Wii and Gamecube, just using MORE of them and clocked higher. This architecture was created in 1999 :|

One thing we can agree on is that this is a pretty big f*cking gap. A larger gap between the two systems, than there was between the PS3/360 and the Wii.

And the only thing left to say is

StrongDeadlift

GCN's 64 cores per CU doesn't include it's scalar unit. The purpose for scalar unit is to shield scalar workloads from vector/SIMD units. The GCN design is more efficient compared to the older VLIW type Radeon HD.

GCN's CU core count is actually, 65 cores per CU.

From http://techreport.com/review/24086/a-first-look-at-amd-radeon-hd-8790m

Radeon HD 8790M with 384 cores with GCN (6 CU) vs Radeon HD 7690M with 480 cores (6 CU, VLIW5). Wii U's GPU uses the older VLIW5 type Radeon HD.

On effective per CU performance, the gap will be larger than the basic core count vs core count.

[QUOTE="Inconsistancy"]

think your sig is a more appropriate thing to say.

One thing though, where did you find out that it has 1154 shader processors at 850ghz? The PDF only says "GPU : 1.84 TFLOPS, AMD next-generation Radeon based graphics engine"

The official press release (as well as pretty much all the rumors corroborated before hand) stated 18 compute units in the PS4.

1 compute unit = 64 compute cores.

The PS4 GPU is just two CU's shy of the Radeon 7970m's 20 compute units. (rumors also predicted this as well.  They stated that it was based off the 7970m, but with 2 fewer CUs, thus the 18 that are in the officiall specs)

Radeon 7970m is the card the PS4's GPU is based off of (which itself is a 7870).  The PS4 GPU is directly in between a 7850 and a 7870.

[QUOTE="StrongDeadlift"]

[QUOTE="Inconsistancy"]

think your sig is a more appropriate thing to say.

One thing though, where did you find out that it has 1154 shader processors at 850ghz? The PDF only says "GPU : 1.84 TFLOPS, AMD next-generation Radeon based graphics engine"

The official press release (as well as pretty much all the rumors corroborated before hand) stated 18 compute units in the PS4.

1 compute unit = 64 compute cores.

The PS4 GPU is just two CU's shy of the Radeon 7970m's 20 compute units. (rumors also predicted this as well.  They stated that it was based off the 7970m, but with 2 fewer CUs, thus the 18 that are in the officiall specs)

Radeon 7970m is the card the PS4's GPU is based off of (which itself is a 7870).  The PS4 GPU is directly in between a 7850 and a 7870.

It's just that the math doesn't add up, the official PDF says 1.84tflops. 1154@850mhz = 1.96tflops, 1154@800mhz = 1.84*, 1024@900mhz = 1.84* (7850+40mhz)

(based off the apparent math used to calculate mflops on wiki, shader * 2 * core clock = mflops, which seems to be the standard everywhere)

[QUOTE="StrongDeadlift"][QUOTE="silversix_"]'Wii U is directly using the same CPU cores as the Wii and Gamecube, just using MORE of them and clocked higher. This architecture was created in 1999' Is this true? If it is :lol: and they're asking 350$n for THIS!? Nintendo is a such a laughing stock these days i don't know what's going onnchan

I think the general idea in here was that PS4 & Xbox720 would clearly have superior hardware compared to WiiU..

But I dont remember Nintendo claiming they will release a powerhouse of a console when announcing the WiiU..

Yeah, but all these parameters have diminishing returns.

Not having HD capability on Wii makes the gap to PS360 far worse.

Lol no.

Analysis on how much I care.

:O

OreoMilkshake

Is the 360 an PS3 have more power than the Wii U. Why Most Wanted on Wii U looks better?

PS4

 

WiiU

call_of_duty_10

Oh Come on WiiU Aint Yamcha no Console deserves that title Yamcha is ****:P WiiU can be..Krillian.

It's much smaller, actually.

People forget that the average people (Aka casuals) can't notice the difference between 720p and 1080p. So we are less than 5%. And remember what nintendo do with the Wii weak hardware (SMG series, Prime 3 and some other good looking games). Now that they have some power, is better to wait. Everybody here knows that the PS4 and the next Xbox are more powerfull, Thats clear, But we cant forget that Nintendo have some of the most talent first party devs, And Nintendo knows how to use their hardware to the max. I going to buy all 3 consoles. Next gen looks good for gamers :). I cant wait to see the next Gran turismo, Uncharted, Metroid, Zelda and Forza.