A little insight on the Ratchet and Clank review from Jeff G. himself.

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LINKloco

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#1 LINKloco
Member since 2004 • 14514 Posts

Here's more insight of how GS games are reviewed from a post I found from Jeff Gerstmann in General Games Discussion. He spoke on the R&C review which is highlighted at the bottom. He also bashes people who debate over HD-DVD and BluRay and says10's are definitely possible at GS. LINK

Well, just to quickly address a few things I've seen in this thread...

- Should games be given scores at all?

Yes, most definitely. While some writers like to prattle on about a world without scores, that's a very narrow view. With the millions of people that visit this site in any given month, we encounter a lot of different types of player. Some people have all the time in the world to research a game and devour every single piece of content we produce. Others don't. Some people need that shortcut, and a score provides that quick check for some people that should either let them know that they probably don't need to know much more about a game or that they need to read more before making a purchasing decision. And make no mistake, that is the reason why our reviews exist: to assist people who are considering a game purchase.

- Does giving a game a score promote fanboyism?

Anything anyone does ever promotes the sad mentality that the Internet is fostering. The other day I read a full thread on another site of people arguing about Blu-Ray vs. HD-DVD with the exact same idiotic fervor that some people use here to "discuss" video games: by turning message boards into Debate Club Amateur Hour. Think about how insane that is for a minute...

"DUDE MY WAY OF WATCHING MOVIES IS SO MUCHMORE AWESOME AND MARKET SHARE AND ATTACH RATE AND OTHER BUSINESS TERMS THAT NO ONE SHOULD ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT!!!!"

"NO WAY U SUCK MY WAY OF WATCHING MOVIES WILL WIN!!!! ALSO I OWN A MAC SO I ALSO HATE YOU BECAUSE I HATE WINDOZE! DID YOU NOTICEI SPELLED IT WINDOZE ISN'T THAT FUNNY BECAUSE IT MAKES ME SLEEP IT IS SO DUMB! ALSO: MICRO$OFT! SEE WHAT I DID THERE??????"

...it used to be limited to local pockets of people complaining about how the Amiga is better than the PC, but our connected world now allows someone to spew nonsense that the entire globe can read about topics such as "WHY I THINK FIREFOX IS RADICAL AND THEREFORE YOU ARE SUCK." Seriously? We're going to waste time arguing about which freely available web browser is better? The relatively anonymity of the Internet is making the world uglier every day, and it's a real bummer. Also, pointing out that "you can format a disk on an Amiga and still use the OS" was never a very good argument for why it's better than the PC. But all that is probably a little off-topic for this discussion.

- Do review scores exist to help us figure out what to buy/spend our time on, or do they exist to validate our own opinions?

See above. We write reviews to assist people looking to purchase them. If you want to use them to try to validate your own opinions, go for it, but you're using them wrong. We're not here to make people feel better about games they pre-ordered because they saw a sweet trailer. We're here to cut through the TV ads and trailers and all the other stuff out there designed to get you to buy games blindly, and help you spend your money wisely.

"I do agree that a 10 should never be used, even though its in the scale. Main reason being that reviews and scores are subjective. A 10 would imply that a game is so great that everyone will love it and want to play it."

Maybe on your own double-secret personal review scale. On ours, it means that the game couldn't be improved upon in any meaningful way, given current standards for that game's platform. As part of the review change, we relabeled 10.0 as "Prime" instead of "Perfect." The meaning of the score hasn't really changed, but too many people couldn't handle the concept of perfect meaning "perfect... given current standards for that game's platform and blah blah blah blah blah." It was sort of silly and overly confusing that way, I agree. We will give a 10 again someday, by the way. I occasionally see people saying "GameSpot said they'd never give another 10." That's insane and we've never, ever said that.

But this touches on a larger point. Reviews are only a guide. They are not gospel. If you aren't filtering our reviews through your own personal likes and dislikes, you're eventually going to end up missing out on a game you'd like or buying one you hate. We assign reviews to qualified reviewers who are interested in that ****of game and, ideally, enter the review feeling cautiously optimistic about it. So when people say "I only play games that GameSpot gives a 9.0 or higher to," I'm a little bummed out. I mean, thanks for believing in us and all, but really, you're probably missing out on a ton of games that you'd love. If we give a game a 7.0 and it's a type of game that you usually love, you should probably read the review for more information. And while we certainly think extremely highly of a game that gets a 10, even that can't be a guarantee that it'll be one of your favorite games. Except for Tony Hawk 3, of course, which is one of your favorite games.

To use the Review of the Moment as an example, when we give Ratchet & Clank Future: Tools of Destruction a 7.5, we're not saying it's "average" or something. This isn't school, and a 7.5 doesn't translate to a C+. We're effectively saying that fans of these sorts of action platformers, and to an even greater extent, fans of the Ratchet series, will probably have a blast. But we're also saying that its appeal might not extendso far beyond that group due to issues mentioned in the review text.

And, really, that's the part that makes the whole "disagree with review -> let's riot" mentality so silly. In most cases, we're actually recommending the games that we supposedly "hate" and "were paid to score poorly" or whatever.

Jeff

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mtradr43

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#2 mtradr43
Member since 2005 • 5272 Posts
too bad on a lot of school scales, a 7.5 would be a C-, and even on the 90/80 scale, it will still be a normal C. Poor old Jeff must not have been too bright in his younger days.
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Dante2710

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#3 Dante2710
Member since 2005 • 63163 Posts
in before the "Lemspot, gamespot is baised........TP and MP3 are underrated comments"
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crazyjames1080

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#4 crazyjames1080
Member since 2006 • 7377 Posts

And while we certainly think extremely highly of a game that gets a 10, even that can't be a guarantee that it'll be one of your favorite games. Except for Tony Hawk 3, of course, which is one of your favorite games.

LINKloco

I lol'd.

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Bansheesdie

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#5 Bansheesdie
Member since 2004 • 15057 Posts
good thread
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casey7672

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#6 casey7672
Member since 2006 • 5348 Posts
GS gave R & C way too low of a score, plain and simple! Everywhere except them gave from 9.0-9.5. I think that says it all.
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Tnasty11

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#7 Tnasty11
Member since 2005 • 4497 Posts
how did Zelda TP and MP3 got AA on GS ?
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ultima-flare

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#8 ultima-flare
Member since 2003 • 2259 Posts
But the most of the "issues"(too much variety?) in the Ratchet review, weren't actually issues.
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dhjohns

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#9 dhjohns
Member since 2003 • 5105 Posts

too bad on a lot of school scales, a 7.5 would be a C-, and even on the 90/80 scale, it will still be a normal C. Poor old Jeff must not have been too bright in his younger days.mtradr43

Thanks for proving Jeff's point, and within two posts. Awesome. Maybe you should read it again.

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TekkenMaster606

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#10 TekkenMaster606
Member since 2006 • 10980 Posts

"You can't beat 100 percent" "You can't beat 100 percent"

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Heil68

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#11 Heil68
Member since 2004 • 58668 Posts
Yea, I really see in Aaron's bio he likes Rachet and Clank type games :|
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siggy3

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#12 siggy3
Member since 2005 • 453 Posts

GS gave R & C way too low of a score, plain and simple! Everywhere except them gave from 9.0-9.5. I think that says it all. casey7672

No, "everywhere" except them did not give it 9.0-9.5. Gamespot´s score isn´t even the lowest anymore.

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mattyomo99

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#13 mattyomo99
Member since 2005 • 3915 Posts
but sadly most people here dont realize that anything above a 7 is worth playing, they just see anything below an 8 as total crap... so sad really
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DivergeUnify

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#14 DivergeUnify
Member since 2007 • 15150 Posts
Jeff owned the fanboys. He was just trying to do it for street cred so people forget about the games he flopped :P
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Ontain

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#15 Ontain
Member since 2005 • 25501 Posts

Yea, I really see in Aaron's bio he likes Rachet and Clank type games :|Heil68

just because he didn't review them doesn't mean he doesn't like them.

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Homesrfan

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#16 Homesrfan
Member since 2006 • 5192 Posts

I don't think Gamespot will ever give another 10. It's stupid that it's even there... especially with the 10 point scale. Because if it's a 10, that doesn't necessarily mean it would have been a 10 on the old review scale.

Which is why .5 increments is a stupid idea.

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anshul89

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#17 anshul89
Member since 2006 • 5705 Posts

The meaning of the score hasn't really changed, but too many people couldn't handle the concept of perfect meaning "perfect... given current standards for that game's platform and blah blah blah blah blah." It was sort of silly and overly confusing that way, I agree. We will give a 10 again someday, by the way. I occasionally see people saying "GameSpot said they'd never give another 10." That's insane and we've never, ever said that.


Jeff

Does that mean Crysis will get a 10 ? :D

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yodariquo

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#18 yodariquo
Member since 2005 • 6631 Posts
"We're effectively saying that fans of these sorts of action platformers, and to an even greater extent, fans of the Ratchet series, will probably have a blast. But we're also saying that its appeal might not extendso far beyond that group due to issues mentioned in the review text." He makes it sounds as if the review score is a measure of how mass market a game is and that any niche title cannot possibly garner a particularly high score.
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iunderstand

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#19 iunderstand
Member since 2006 • 3201 Posts

I think a lot of people missed the point of what he was saying. They don't give scores to merit how great the actual game is. They are more concerned about whether the game is good value for your money. They mentioned that due to the amount of variety in the game, many of the elements added to the game felt out of place and unnecessary. They never complained solely that variety was the issue.

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iunderstand

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#20 iunderstand
Member since 2006 • 3201 Posts

"We're effectively saying that fans of these sorts of action platformers, and to an even greater extent, fans of the Ratchet series, will probably have a blast. But we're also saying that its appeal might not extendso far beyond that group due to issues mentioned in the review text." He makes it sounds as if the review score is a measure of how mass market a game is and that any niche title cannot possibly garner a particularly high score.yodariquo

Or he's saying that people generally not into the R&C games probably wouldn't find much value in the game.

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Newnab

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#21 Newnab
Member since 2006 • 3081 Posts
SMG might be a ten! Interesting.
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Firelore29

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#22 Firelore29
Member since 2007 • 4158 Posts

Honestly though what he is saying doesn't make sense. He's saying that they review games based off what everyone would think of the game. He's basically saying that if everyone played Tony Hawk 3 they would love it because it got a 10. First off that is not the case about Tony Hawk but that simply doesn't fly.

Manhunt 2 for the PS2 and Rachet and Crank for the PS3 both got a 7.5.The simple fact is that I would never play Manhunt 2 and neither would my children. Rachet and Clank,however, is accessible by about anyone. If they are going to rate games based off how many people would like them then games like Mario Galaxcy would always get a 10 and games like Resident Evil should only get a 6 or 7.

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xTHExJUICEx

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#23 xTHExJUICEx
Member since 2007 • 3126 Posts
Man GS reviews are so confusing, their old review system was much better due to the fact that they try and make their reviews as fact.
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Firelore29

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#24 Firelore29
Member since 2007 • 4158 Posts

[QUOTE="yodariquo"]"We're effectively saying that fans of these sorts of action platformers, and to an even greater extent, fans of the Ratchet series, will probably have a blast. But we're also saying that its appeal might not extendso far beyond that group due to issues mentioned in the review text." He makes it sounds as if the review score is a measure of how mass market a game is and that any niche title cannot possibly garner a particularly high score.iunderstand

Or he's saying that people generally not into the R&C games probably wouldn't find much value in the game.

Why didn't Wii Sports get a 10 then? Honestly everyone who plays that game thinks it's fun and there is a lot of reply value. The fact of the matter is that he simply misreviewed Ratchet and Clank and now he's climbing the excuse tree.

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iunderstand

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#25 iunderstand
Member since 2006 • 3201 Posts

Honestly though what he is saying doesn't make sense. He's saying that they review games based off what everyone would think of the game. He's basically saying that if everyone played Tony Hawk 3 they would love it because it got a 10. First off that is not the case about Tony Hawk but that simply doesn't fly.

Manhunt 2 for the PS2 and Rachet and Crank for the PS3 both got a 7.5.The simple fact is that I would never play Manhunt 2 and neither would my children. Rachet and Clank,however, is accessible by about anyone. If they are going to rate games based off how many people would like them then games like Mario Galaxcy would always get a 10 and games like Resident Evil should only get a 6 or 7.

Firelore29

Well of course you wouldn't buy Manhunt 2 for your kids. That's what ESRB ratings are for.

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Saturos3091

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#26 Saturos3091
Member since 2005 • 14937 Posts
Excellent post; I still disagree with the .5 system though.
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Firelore29

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#27 Firelore29
Member since 2007 • 4158 Posts
[QUOTE="Firelore29"]

Honestly though what he is saying doesn't make sense. He's saying that they review games based off what everyone would think of the game. He's basically saying that if everyone played Tony Hawk 3 they would love it because it got a 10. First off that is not the case about Tony Hawk but that simply doesn't fly.

Manhunt 2 for the PS2 and Rachet and Crank for the PS3 both got a 7.5.The simple fact is that I would never play Manhunt 2 and neither would my children. Rachet and Clank,however, is accessible by about anyone. If they are going to rate games based off how many people would like them then games like Mario Galaxcy would always get a 10 and games like Resident Evil should only get a 6 or 7.

iunderstand

Well of course you wouldn't buy Manhunt 2 for your kids. That's what ESRB ratings are for.

Well that's the point isn't it. He's saying that fans ofRatchet and Clankwill like Ratchet and Clankbut anyone beyond that will not really enjoy it much. Well the people who like Manhunt are a very select group so obviously the people who like Manhunt 2 are the same group. He's essentually saying that non Manhunt fans would like the game to the same degree thatnon Ratchet and Clank fans would like Ratchet and Clank.

Because Ratchet and Clank is much more accessible and mainstreem then Manhunt 2 is that is simply not a true statement.

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mistervengeance

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#28 mistervengeance
Member since 2006 • 6769 Posts
if the score doesn't mean much like jeff said, why do they even score games
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BumFluff122

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#29 BumFluff122
Member since 2004 • 14853 Posts
This sounds like a rather good albeit different way of reviewing games. The scores depends specifically on how great a population the reviewer thinks the game would be good for, not for the game itself.
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iunderstand

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#30 iunderstand
Member since 2006 • 3201 Posts
[QUOTE="iunderstand"]

Well of course you wouldn't buy Manhunt 2 for your kids. That's what ESRB ratings are for.

Firelore29

Well that's the point isn't it. He's saying that fans ofRatchet and Clankwill like Ratchet and Clankbut anyone beyond that will not really enjoy it much. Well the people who like Manhunt are a very select group so obviously the people who like Manhunt 2 are the same group. He's essentually saying that non Manhunt fans would like the game to the same degree thatnon Ratchet and Clank fans would like Ratchet and Clank.

Because Ratchet and Clank is much more accessible and mainstreem then Manhunt 2 is that is simply not a true statement.

7.5 is saying it's a good game. It's up to you the consumer to read the review and make the informed decision whether the game is right for your tastes.

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Firelore29

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#31 Firelore29
Member since 2007 • 4158 Posts
[QUOTE="Firelore29"][QUOTE="iunderstand"]

Well of course you wouldn't buy Manhunt 2 for your kids. That's what ESRB ratings are for.

iunderstand

Well that's the point isn't it. He's saying that fans ofRatchet and Clankwill like Ratchet and Clankbut anyone beyond that will not really enjoy it much. Well the people who like Manhunt are a very select group so obviously the people who like Manhunt 2 are the same group. He's essentually saying that non Manhunt fans would like the game to the same degree thatnon Ratchet and Clank fans would like Ratchet and Clank.

Because Ratchet and Clank is much more accessible and mainstreem then Manhunt 2 is that is simply not a true statement.

7.5 is saying it's a good game. It's up to you the consumer to read the review and make the informed decision whether the game is right for your tastes.

That's not what he said at all. You need to read his post:

We're effectively saying that fans of these sorts of action platformers, and to an even greater extent, fans of the Ratchet series, will probably have a blast. But we're also saying that its appeal might not extendso far beyond that group due to issues mentioned in the review text.

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xTHExJUICEx

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#32 xTHExJUICEx
Member since 2007 • 3126 Posts
[QUOTE="iunderstand"][QUOTE="Firelore29"][QUOTE="iunderstand"]

Well of course you wouldn't buy Manhunt 2 for your kids. That's what ESRB ratings are for.

Firelore29

Well that's the point isn't it. He's saying that fans ofRatchet and Clankwill like Ratchet and Clankbut anyone beyond that will not really enjoy it much. Well the people who like Manhunt are a very select group so obviously the people who like Manhunt 2 are the same group. He's essentually saying that non Manhunt fans would like the game to the same degree thatnon Ratchet and Clank fans would like Ratchet and Clank.

Because Ratchet and Clank is much more accessible and mainstreem then Manhunt 2 is that is simply not a true statement.

7.5 is saying it's a good game. It's up to you the consumer to read the review and make the informed decision whether the game is right for your tastes.

That's not what he said at all. You need to read his post:

We're effectively saying that fans of these sorts of action platformers, and to an even greater extent, fans of the Ratchet series, will probably have a blast. But we're also saying that its appeal might not extendso far beyond that group due to issues mentioned in the review text.

no wonder FPSs score so high here at GS, casuals love their FPSs.

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iunderstand

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#33 iunderstand
Member since 2006 • 3201 Posts
[QUOTE="iunderstand"]

7.5 is saying it's a good game. It's up to you the consumer to read the review and make the informed decision whether the game is right for your tastes.

Firelore29

That's not what he said at all. You need to read his post:

We're effectively saying that fans of these sorts of action platformers, and to an even greater extent, fans of the Ratchet series, will probably have a blast. But we're also saying that its appeal might not extendso far beyond that group due to issues mentioned in the review text.

Yes, I did read it. My point is, 7.5 can only say so much about the game. It's up to your the reader to decide whether Manhunt 2 or R&C better suits your tastes by the points mentioned in the review.

The score is simply there to help you sort through the games, the purchase ultimately is up to you the consumer.

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Firelore29

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#34 Firelore29
Member since 2007 • 4158 Posts
[QUOTE="Firelore29"][QUOTE="iunderstand"]

7.5 is saying it's a good game. It's up to you the consumer to read the review and make the informed decision whether the game is right for your tastes.

iunderstand

That's not what he said at all. You need to read his post:

We're effectively saying that fans of these sorts of action platformers, and to an even greater extent, fans of the Ratchet series, will probably have a blast. But we're also saying that its appeal might not extendso far beyond that group due to issues mentioned in the review text.

Yes, I did read it. My point is, 7.5 can only say so much about the game. It's up to your the reader to decide whether Manhunt 2 or R&C better suits your tastes by the points mentioned in the review.

The score is simply there to help you sort through the games, the purchase ultimately is up to you the consumer.

If that's what Gamespot belives then that's not whatwas conveyed in that interview.

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deactivated-5dd711115e664

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#35 deactivated-5dd711115e664
Member since 2005 • 8956 Posts

So if I understand his explanation correctly...R&C got a 7.5 because it won't appeal to people who already don't like R&C? Because people who only play FPS may not like it?

That's just stupid. I'm sorry.

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Firelore29

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#36 Firelore29
Member since 2007 • 4158 Posts

So if I understand his explanation correctly...R&C got a 7.5 because it won't appeal to people who already don't like R&C? Because people who only play FPS may not like it?

That's just stupid. I'm sorry.

ZIMdoom

And yet Mario Party 8 got a 6.5. I think my dog can even have fun with that game.

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cosmostein77

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#37 cosmostein77
Member since 2004 • 7043 Posts

- Do review scores exist to help us figure out what to buy/spend our time on, or do they exist to validate our own opinions?

See above. We write reviews to assist people looking to purchase them. If you want to use them to try to validate your own opinions, go for it, but you're using them wrong. We're not here to make people feel better about games they pre-ordered because they saw a sweet trailer. We're here to cut through the TV ads and trailers and all the other stuff out there designed to get you to buy games blindly, and help you spend your money wisely.

Jeff

And there you have it,

Reviews not written for renters means that games that are easy or six hours long should not have praised heaped upon it just because the "Graphics PWN"

Like I have told folks over the last two weeks, if I rated the first hour of playing R&C I would have handed it a 9 no question just as I would have handed Bioshock a 10,

But once the credits roll you have a but of time to reflect on the game itself, while I think the 7.5 is rather low the reality is if you are going to get a single game this Holiday season for PS3 is R&C really the one that will keep you busy for months on end? not really.

Its a great game but its a great game I could have received the same value out of had I rented it for a weekend rather then bought it.

If you want your fanboy bias polished go to 1up or IGN they hand out 9's like they are sweet candy, if you want a sober second thought from reviews that actually finish the games before they review them GS is the way to go.

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haunt9

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#38 haunt9
Member since 2006 • 206 Posts

So if I understand his explanation correctly...R&C got a 7.5 because it won't appeal to people who already don't like R&C? Because people who only play FPS may not like it?

That's just stupid. I'm sorry.

ZIMdoom

Someone must have skipped the reading comprehension course in high school.

He is saying that fans of ratchet and clank will probably enjoy the game being that it is a ratchet and clank game, nothing more nothing less, but because of the issues that kept it from scoring higher people who aren't fans of the games probably won't have their minds changed and need to pick it up.

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iunderstand

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#39 iunderstand
Member since 2006 • 3201 Posts
[QUOTE="iunderstand"]

Yes, I did read it. My point is, 7.5 can only say so much about the game. It's up to your the reader to decide whether Manhunt 2 or R&C better suits your tastes by the points mentioned in the review.

The score is simply there to help you sort through the games, the purchase ultimately is up to you the consumer.

Firelore29

If that's what Gamespot belives then that's not whatwas conveyed in that interview.

So I guess you intend to buy random games because you see a score of 7.5 without bothering to read the review? How is a 7.5 supposed to tell you whether or not Manhunt 2 is right for your children? It's not! That's what ESRB ratings are for. That isn't GameSpot's job to weigh in any personal religious beliefs or political affiliation into the score. All the score is is a red flag to interest possible buyers.

If you are already a Ratchet fan or platformer fan, you're already reading the review. If you aren't, you probably would have skipped over it.

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Medjai

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#40 Medjai
Member since 2003 • 3839 Posts

[QUOTE="Jeff"]

- Do review scores exist to help us figure out what to buy/spend our time on, or do they exist to validate our own opinions?

See above. We write reviews to assist people looking to purchase them. If you want to use them to try to validate your own opinions, go for it, but you're using them wrong. We're not here to make people feel better about games they pre-ordered because they saw a sweet trailer. We're here to cut through the TV ads and trailers and all the other stuff out there designed to get you to buy games blindly, and help you spend your money wisely.

cosmostein77

And there you have it,

Reviews not written for renters means that games that are easy or six hours long should not have praised heaped upon it just because the "Graphics PWN"

Like I have told folks over the last two weeks, if I rated the first hour of playing R&C I would have handed it a 9 no question just as I would have handed Bioshock a 10,

But once the credits roll you have a but of time to reflect on the game itself, while I think the 7.5 is rather low the reality is if you are going to get a single game this Holiday season for PS3 is R&C really the one that will keep you busy for months on end? not really.

Its a great game but its a great game I could have received the same value out of had I rented it for a weekend rather then bought it.

If you want your fanboy bias polished go to 1up or IGN they hand out 9's like they are sweet candy, if you want a sober second thought from reviews that actually finish the games before they review them GS is the way to go.

Agreed good post...

I personally don't see what people are having a problem with here I get what Jeff was trying to say and I don't have a problem with the way GS is currently reviewing their games (aside from the .5 increments)

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iamacn

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#41 iamacn
Member since 2005 • 25 Posts

Super Mario Sunshine - 8.0

Kameo - 8.7

Ratchet & Clank Future - 7.5

Your review of R&C was way off. Tools of destruction is one of (if not) the best action platformers ever made. You actually complain about the variety of gameplay. :roll:

FISSION MAILED.

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deactivated-5dd711115e664

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#42 deactivated-5dd711115e664
Member since 2005 • 8956 Posts
[QUOTE="ZIMdoom"]

So if I understand his explanation correctly...R&C got a 7.5 because it won't appeal to people who already don't like R&C? Because people who only play FPS may not like it?

That's just stupid. I'm sorry.

Firelore29

And yet Mario Party 8 got a 6.5. I think my dog can even have fun with that game.

BUt according to the explanation, fun has nothing to do with it. Unless a game is able to bring in people who would normally not like that game, it gets a low score.

So it makes no difference how much fun Mario Party 8 may be...it won't appeal to people who play FPS so it gets a low score.

Basically, you don't even need to play ANY game according to this new review policy. Just ask yourself, would this game appeal to FPS addicts and/or lemmings? If no...give the game a low score.Controls, fun factor, game length, graphics, etc...all those are pretty much irrelevant according to this explanation.

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Medjai

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#43 Medjai
Member since 2003 • 3839 Posts
[QUOTE="ZIMdoom"]

So if I understand his explanation correctly...R&C got a 7.5 because it won't appeal to people who already don't like R&C? Because people who only play FPS may not like it?

That's just stupid. I'm sorry.

haunt9

Someone must have skipped the reading comprehension course in high school.

He is saying that fans of ratchet and clank will probably enjoy the game being that it is a ratchet and clank game, nothing more nothing less, but because of the issues that kept it from scoring higher people who aren't fans of the games probably won't have their minds changed and need to pick it up.

thats exactly the point he was making...the new Rachet & Clank doesn't improve the series enough to extend its appeal to people who already don't like that sort of game...its not going to change anyones opinion about the series if a person has already made their mind up about the series

again I really don't see why ppl are not getting what he is saying and are still **tt hurt over a favorite game of theirs on their system of choice scoring below what they had hoped for

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Firelore29

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#44 Firelore29
Member since 2007 • 4158 Posts
[QUOTE="Firelore29"]

If that's what Gamespot belives then that's not whatwas conveyed in that interview.

iunderstand

So I guess you intend to buy random games because you see a score of 7.5 without bothering to read the review? How is a 7.5 supposed to tell you whether or not Manhunt 2 is right for your children? It's not! That's what ESRB ratings are for. That isn't GameSpot's job to weigh in any personal religious beliefs or political affiliation into the score. All the score is is a red flag to interest possible buyers.

If you are already a Ratchet fan or platformer fan, you're already reading the review. If you aren't, you probably would have skipped over it.

I'm not changing his words or anything here. I'm simply repeating and using examples forget Manhunt 2 lets take a different example. He's saying that fans of Ratchet and Clank will probably like Ratchet and Clank but other gamers won't necessarily like it much. That's the methodology they use to rate games but their reviews don't match that.

Wii Sports, for example, could be picked up by anyone and throughly enjoyed because it's extreemely accessible and virtually anyone can enjoy it for a extremely long time. The game got a 7.8. What he is saying doesn't match up with the way they review their other video games.

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Medjai

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#45 Medjai
Member since 2003 • 3839 Posts

I loved the COD4 beta and if somehow COD4 scores below an 8 I am not going to cry myself to sleep. I am still going to get it because I love the game even if gamespot doesn't think it does enough to make people who don't already like FPS's play COD4 or it doesn't do enough to differenciate itself from other FPS's out there or it doesn't improve enough on pervious COD games to garner AAA

I enjoy COD games and I loved the beta so I know I am going to love COD4 even if gamespot flops it

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deactivated-5dd711115e664

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#46 deactivated-5dd711115e664
Member since 2005 • 8956 Posts
[QUOTE="haunt9"][QUOTE="ZIMdoom"]

So if I understand his explanation correctly...R&C got a 7.5 because it won't appeal to people who already don't like R&C? Because people who only play FPS may not like it?

That's just stupid. I'm sorry.

Medjai

Someone must have skipped the reading comprehension course in high school.

He is saying that fans of ratchet and clank will probably enjoy the game being that it is a ratchet and clank game, nothing more nothing less, but because of the issues that kept it from scoring higher people who aren't fans of the games probably won't have their minds changed and need to pick it up.

thats exactly the point he was making...the new Rachet & Clank doesn't improve the series enough to extend its appeal to people who already don't like that sort of game...its not going to change anyones opinion about the series if a person has already made their mind up about the series

again I really don't see why ppl are not getting what he is saying and are still**tt hurt over a favorite game of theirs on their system of choice scoring below what they had hoped for

Personally, I don't care at all what score R&C got. I've never commented in any of the previous score threads and never called GS biased or criticised their score. HOwever, I do feel that if GS is going to offer an explanation to attemp to calm the outcry, then it should be a real explanation, an intelligent explanation. What they offered here was a terrible explanation that makes no sense at all.

I'm just calling it as I see it.

As for my reading comprehension, I thin both of you should read what he said. I mean read the actual words and language and not just what you WANT to see. He didn't say that this brings nothing new to R&C. He said that fans of R&C and platoformers and games of the genre will "have a balst." Now, add to this his comments on the graphics and controls and fun factor (all of which were very positive).

So after all of this, why does he give the game a low score? His exact words are because it won't appeal to someone who already doesn't like...not R&C...but essentially the whole genre. That's like saying Mario should score 7 because only Mario and Nintendo fans will like it; lemmings will call it kiddy and won't like the game. It's like giving a horror movie a bad review because people who don't like being scared won't be drawn to see it.

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Drakier

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#47 Drakier
Member since 2004 • 1444 Posts
A question for Jeff: You've reviewed every Ratchet and Clank game before Tools of Destruction so I'm wondering why you didn't review this one?
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Firelore29

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#48 Firelore29
Member since 2007 • 4158 Posts
[QUOTE="Firelore29"][QUOTE="ZIMdoom"]

So if I understand his explanation correctly...R&C got a 7.5 because it won't appeal to people who already don't like R&C? Because people who only play FPS may not like it?

That's just stupid. I'm sorry.

ZIMdoom

And yet Mario Party 8 got a 6.5. I think my dog can even have fun with that game.

BUt according to the explanation, fun has nothing to do with it. Unless a game is able to bring in people who would normally not like that game, it gets a low score.

So it makes no difference how much fun Mario Party 8 may be...it won't appeal to people who play FPS so it gets a low score.

Basically, you don't even need to play ANY game according to this new review policy. Just ask yourself, would this game appeal to FPS addicts and/or lemmings? If no...give the game a low score.Controls, fun factor, game length, graphics, etc...all those are pretty much irrelevant according to this explanation.

I think we are saying the same thing here just using different words. Appeal is pretty well equivilant to fun. Anyways yes if they are really rating games that way they have seriously lost it.

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supermanfarr

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#49 supermanfarr
Member since 2006 • 888 Posts

I think a lot of people missed the point of what he was saying. They don't give scores to merit how great the actual game is. They are more concerned about whether the game is good value for your money. They mentioned that due to the amount of variety in the game, many of the elements added to the game felt out of place and unnecessary. They never complained solely that variety was the issue.

iunderstand



Well if thats tru this whole flop crap on systems wars is a joke, and flops should be decided by game rankings. NO this is not abou rc Im over it. This is for future games 
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deactivated-5dd711115e664

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#50 deactivated-5dd711115e664
Member since 2005 • 8956 Posts
[QUOTE="iunderstand"][QUOTE="Firelore29"]

If that's what Gamespot belives then that's not whatwas conveyed in that interview.

Firelore29

So I guess you intend to buy random games because you see a score of 7.5 without bothering to read the review? How is a 7.5 supposed to tell you whether or not Manhunt 2 is right for your children? It's not! That's what ESRB ratings are for. That isn't GameSpot's job to weigh in any personal religious beliefs or political affiliation into the score. All the score is is a red flag to interest possible buyers.

If you are already a Ratchet fan or platformer fan, you're already reading the review. If you aren't, you probably would have skipped over it.

I'm not changing his words or anything here. I'm simply repeating and using examples forget Manhunt 2 lets take a different example. He's saying that fans of Ratchet and Clank will probably like Ratchet and Clank but other gamers won't necessarily like it much. That's the methodology they use to rate games but their reviews don't match that.

Wii Sports, for example, could be picked up by anyone and throughly enjoyed because it's extreemely accessible and virtually anyone can enjoy it for a extremely long time. The game got a 7.8. What he is saying doesn't match up with the way they review their other video games.

It has nothing to do with fun or accessibility. That is what makes his comments lame. He basically penalized the game because it wouldn't appeal to people who already don't like that type of game. Of course it won't any more than Halo 3 appeals to non-FPS fans such as myself. Did Halo 3 win over anyone who already didn't love Halo or FPS? I doubt it.