Want to immigrate legally? Get in line!!! Mexican line is 130 years long.

  • 86 results
  • 1
  • 2
Avatar image for Serraph105
#1 Posted by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -

So I was thinking about the large discussion we've been having about immigration and the reasons why immigrating legally are heavily problematic. It's been said that our system is broken, but I rarely hear about the reasons why it's broken. So I was listening to an old Planet Money episode on npr the other day, and it did list some of the problems.

The first problem is that we have the same cap limitof people legally allowed to immigrate from each country annually. That's great if you are from a small country with a low population because your odds of getting in are pretty good, but its terrible if you live in a place like Mexico or India. In fact low skill people from Mexico may need to wait an average 130 years to legally immigrate to the US. Even a computer programmer from India would have to wait around 35 years just to get here. This is problematic, not just for them, but for us. If we don't offer people a reasonable legal method of immigration, they will either lose interest decreasing the potential for diversity and intelligence to be in our country, or they will turn to other means of immigration.

The second problem is that our immigration system is, like most things, easier if you are rich. For instance in this episode one immigrant from Britain found out that he could immigrate by investing half a million dollars in a company expected to employ ten people. Certainly not a bad thing, but ten people is awfully small to grant something others may have to wait 130 years to obtain.

Avatar image for Inferman
#2 Edited by Inferman (140 posts) -

Geographically, the United States is finite.

The resources of the United States is finite.

We have poor and uneducated US citizens.

The United States can only fit and tend to so many people.

Therefore,

We should take care of those poor and uneducated US citizens before we start taking care of the world's poor and uneducated. kthx. What is Mexico doing by the way besides failing?

Avatar image for Serraph105
#3 Posted by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -

@Inferman: We're hurting ourselves by having a system that doesn't actually work. If people come in illegally we can't collect as much in taxes from them, and we provide them various services. This is not an argument that says let's take care of everyone, this is an argument that says we are not taking care of ourselves. Depending on the country you live in the only reasonable option they have to immigrate here is by doing so illegally, and if they do that they will get taken care of here without fully contributing to the systems that they are allowed to take advantage of.

Avatar image for Inferman
#4 Posted by Inferman (140 posts) -

@Serraph105 said:

@Inferman: We're hurting ourselves by having a system that doesn't actually work. If people come in illegally we can't collect as much in taxes from them, and we provide them various services. This is not an argument that says let's take care of everyone, this is an argument that says we are not taking care of ourselves. Depending on the country you live in the only reasonable option they have to immigrate here is by doing so illegally, and if they do that they will get taken care of here without fully contributing to the systems that they are allowed to take advantage of.

Illegal immigrants are not US citizens.

We should take care of those poor and uneducated US citizens before we start taking care of the world's poor and uneducated.

I don't care if it's difficult to get into the United States; that difficulty is on the shoulders of non-US citizens. My main concern are US citizens.

Geographically, the United States is finite.

The resources of the United States is finite.

We have poor and uneducated US citizens.

The United States can only fit and tend to so many people.

Avatar image for deactivated-5acfa3a8bc51d
#5 Posted by deactivated-5acfa3a8bc51d (7914 posts) -

Border wars is on National Geographic right now. If the borders were completely open it would be mayhem.

Avatar image for Serraph105
#6 Posted by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -

@Inferman: Way to copy/paste your last post and ignore my point.

Does anyone know if that counts as spam?

Avatar image for Master_Live
#7 Posted by Master_Live (19705 posts) -

System may or may not be broken, that doesn't mean people get to enter illegally or by "other means".

That's one of the reasons a significant portion of the US public can't get to amnesty for those that entered illegally: that sense of entitlement. That "you are godamn right, I'm here and I'm staying and you better get used to it". You can see how that would rub people the wrong way.

Avatar image for Serraph105
#8 Posted by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -

@playmynutz said:

Border wars is on National Geographic right now. If the borders were completely open it would be mayhem.

I'm definitely not arguing that we open the borders up completely. I'm arguing that our broken system is causing us problems, and pointing our some of the reasons why our immigration system is broken the first place. If there was a system at your workplace that everyone knew was broken and costing them money you would expect people there to fix it right?

Avatar image for deactivated-5acfa3a8bc51d
#9 Posted by deactivated-5acfa3a8bc51d (7914 posts) -

@Serraph105: government bureaucracy is outdated. That outdated machine of applying, possibly needing an attorney, lots of money, waiting for some guy at the other end to read the application and approve or deny.

Avatar image for jun_aka_pekto
#10 Edited by jun_aka_pekto (25254 posts) -

Why the US all the time? The US is such a rotten country (so many problems). Why not immigrate to other countries such as Spain, Japan, New Zealand, Canada, etc?

If I was immigrating from Mexico, I'd skip the US and make a beeline for Canada...especially if I knew they'd be more welcoming to me.

Avatar image for Serraph105
#11 Posted by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -
@jun_aka_pekto said:

Why the US all the time? The US is such a rotten country (so many problems). Why not immigrate to other countries such as Spain, Japan, New Zealand, Canada, etc?

If I was immigrating from Mexico, I'd skip the US and make a beeline for Canada...especially if I knew they'd be more welcoming to me.

You would have to consider the weather of course. I mean if you are going to live somewhere like Canada you had better be happy or okay with a fair amount of snow.

Avatar image for Inferman
#12 Posted by Inferman (140 posts) -

@Serraph105 said:

@Inferman: Way to copy/paste your last post and ignore my point.

Does anyone know if that counts as spam?

Because you're not making any point.

Geographically, the United States is finite.

The resources of the United States are also finite.

The United States has poor, diseased, and uneducated.

However, despite the aforementioned, you think the United States should grant citizenship to millions of illegals, and make it easier for more immigrants to flood into the country.

How about we get rid of the poor, diseased, and uneducated US CITIZENS before we start working on other people? Kthx

Avatar image for R3FURBISHED
#13 Posted by R3FURBISHED (12408 posts) -

The US immigration laws, to put this simply, need work.

The deportation of Guadalupe García de Rayos in Phoenix, Arizona, may be giving the undocumented population in the U.S. its first sense of what the next four years will feel like. Rayos is a 35-year-old mother of two who has lived in the U.S. for 21 years. In 2008, local deputies caught her using a fake social security number after they raided her work, and since then she has been required by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) to show up at regular interviews. Every year she’s talked to an agent, then been released back to her family in the U.S. But Wednesday Rayos was arrested, and on Thursday agents put her in a van to be deported back to Mexico.

Source

That shouldn't be allowed to happen, a path to citizenship must exist

Avatar image for Inferman
#14 Posted by Inferman (140 posts) -

That shouldn't be allowed to happen, a path to citizenship must exist

Why must a path to citizenship exist?

Avatar image for Serraph105
#15 Posted by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -

@Inferman said:

That shouldn't be allowed to happen, a path to citizenship must exist

Why must a path to citizenship exist?

Because that's the point of having an immigration system.

Avatar image for Inferman
#16 Posted by Inferman (140 posts) -

Because that's the point of having an immigration system.

Why do we need an immigration system? We could close all immigration tomorrow.

Avatar image for ad1x2
#17 Posted by ad1x2 (7728 posts) -

@R3FURBISHED: She committed a felony when she was caught for identity theft, people who come here legally can face deportation for that. The fact that she was able to stay here as long as she did after being caught is surprising.

Avatar image for iandizion713
#18 Edited by iandizion713 (16025 posts) -

I know how to fix it, we take Mexico, problem solved. We need to find out why everyone is fleeing one of our neighbors. Its a sign of a weak neighbor and needs fixed.

Avatar image for Serraph105
#19 Posted by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -

@Inferman said:

Because that's the point of having an immigration system.

Why do we need an immigration system? We could close all immigration tomorrow.

If you wish to make the argument to just get rid of the system altogether feel free (people will come anyways of course so that's one issue), but I'm making the argument that a broken system hurts our country.

Avatar image for R3FURBISHED
#20 Posted by R3FURBISHED (12408 posts) -

@ad1x2 said:

@R3FURBISHED: She committed a felony when she was caught for identity theft, people who come here legally can face deportation for that. The fact that she was able to stay here as long as she did after being caught is surprising.

Which goes back to a path to citizenship, if you are brought to a country as a 14 year old (as is the case with de Rayos) there must be a way for you to obtain citizenship in a timely manner.

I don't mean to say that sporting a false social security number is ok, but if you are brought to a country and live there for decades you are a citizen -- and therefore shouldn't have to have false papers.

___

And the fact that half of Congress won't even entertain an immigration discussion is an enormous problem.

Avatar image for Inferman
#21 Edited by Inferman (140 posts) -

@Serraph105 said:
@Inferman said:

Because that's the point of having an immigration system.

Why do we need an immigration system? We could close all immigration tomorrow.

If you wish to make the argument to just get rid of the system altogether feel free (people will come anyways of course so that's one issue), but I'm making the argument that a broken system hurts our country.

Removing the immigration system completely would fix it. Are you for that? Me too.

Avatar image for nepu7supastar7
#22 Posted by nepu7supastar7 (5196 posts) -

@iandizion713:

Sure, we could take over Mexico but do we WANT to?

Avatar image for Serraph105
#23 Posted by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -

@Inferman said:
@Serraph105 said:
@Inferman said:

Because that's the point of having an immigration system.

Why do we need an immigration system? We could close all immigration tomorrow.

If you wish to make the argument to just get rid of the system altogether feel free (people will come anyways of course so that's one issue), but I'm making the argument that a broken system hurts our country.

Removing the immigration system completely would fix it. Are you for that? Me too.

Wouldn't that mean anyone could come here at any time? I mean no system means no rules, correct?

Avatar image for iandizion713
#24 Edited by iandizion713 (16025 posts) -

@killered3 said:

@iandizion713:

Sure, we could take over Mexico but do we WANT to?

I dont know, i kinda do. Would be sweet to unite Central and South America. We need some way to make them strong Nations.

Avatar image for nepu7supastar7
#25 Posted by nepu7supastar7 (5196 posts) -

@Inferman:

Removing the immigration system would destroy all of our defenses to combat it and keep it in check. Are you sure that's what you want?

Avatar image for nepu7supastar7
#26 Edited by nepu7supastar7 (5196 posts) -

@iandizion713: Well on the plus side, it would solve our immigration problem. And cheaper tequila and more drugs for every boy and gal!

Avatar image for Serraph105
#28 Posted by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -

@Inferman: Aww, where did your last post go? I wanted to see what stupid thing you said next.

Avatar image for Inferman
#29 Posted by Inferman (140 posts) -

@Serraph105 said:

@Inferman: Aww, where did your last post go? I wanted to see what stupid thing you said next.

Not sure why it was deleted... however, you know what it said. You just admitted to it.

But what I said was why don't we just close the border and stop all immigration? That would fix the "broken system that is hurting our country".

Avatar image for Serraph105
#30 Posted by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -

@Inferman said:
@Serraph105 said:

@Inferman: Aww, where did your last post go? I wanted to see what stupid thing you said next.

Not sure why it was deleted... however, you know what it said. You just admitted to it.

But what I said was why don't we just close the border and stop all immigration? That would fix the "broken system that is hurting our country".

I figured it was something along those lines, but for the record gamespot notified me of your post. By the time I looked however it was already gone. So now that you've clarified what you mean, tell me how you think that such a system could reasonably be enforced.

Avatar image for Inferman
#31 Edited by Inferman (140 posts) -

@Serraph105 said:
@Inferman said:
@Serraph105 said:

@Inferman: Aww, where did your last post go? I wanted to see what stupid thing you said next.

Not sure why it was deleted... however, you know what it said. You just admitted to it.

But what I said was why don't we just close the border and stop all immigration? That would fix the "broken system that is hurting our country".

I figured it was something along those lines, but for the record gamespot notified me of your post. By the time I looked however it was already gone. So now that you've clarified what you mean, tell me how you think that such a system could reasonably be enforced.

Remove troops from Middle East. Stick them on north and south border.

Avatar image for jhonMalcovich
#32 Posted by jhonMalcovich (7090 posts) -

@Inferman said:
@Serraph105 said:

@Inferman: Way to copy/paste your last post and ignore my point.

Does anyone know if that counts as spam?

Because you're not making any point.

Geographically, the United States is finite.

The resources of the United States are also finite.

The United States has poor, diseased, and uneducated.

However, despite the aforementioned, you think the United States should grant citizenship to millions of illegals, and make it easier for more immigrants to flood into the country.

How about we get rid of the poor, diseased, and uneducated US CITIZENS before we start working on other people? Kthx

When you try to be open-minded with liberals and say, "Well, I don't think they are saying we should let anybody in, right ? That would be completely nuts hahahaha". Then Inferman shows up and say we should let anybody in. And you understand you can't reason with people like that and give up

Next time Inferman instead of taking Gender Studies you should take courses such as Introduction to Bussines 1, Introduction to Bussines 2, Macroeconomy and Accounting. They explain pretty clearly that

Geographically, the United States is finite.

The resources of the United States are also finite.

And that Mexico and India should take care of their own citizens, this is why countries have been created in the first place.

Avatar image for Serraph105
#33 Edited by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -

@Inferman said:
@Serraph105 said:
@Inferman said:
@Serraph105 said:

@Inferman: Aww, where did your last post go? I wanted to see what stupid thing you said next.

Not sure why it was deleted... however, you know what it said. You just admitted to it.

But what I said was why don't we just close the border and stop all immigration? That would fix the "broken system that is hurting our country".

I figured it was something along those lines, but for the record gamespot notified me of your post. By the time I looked however it was already gone. So now that you've clarified what you mean, tell me how you think that such a system could reasonably be enforced.

Remove troops from Middle East. Stick them on north and south border.

Interesting, so do you know that 40% of illegal immigrants come over on airplanes and simply overstay their travel Visa's? Wouldn't that number just increase?

Do we keep all tourists out as well?

Avatar image for FireEmblem_Man
#34 Posted by FireEmblem_Man (19846 posts) -

@Serraph105: It didn't take my parents over 130 years to become U.S. Citizens! They became citizens last year with a green card for over 25 years.

Avatar image for FireEmblem_Man
#35 Posted by FireEmblem_Man (19846 posts) -

@iandizion713 said:

I know how to fix it, we take Mexico, problem solved. We need to find out why everyone is fleeing one of our neighbors. Its a sign of a weak neighbor and needs fixed.

You're just asking for the U.S. to become an Imperial Empire! All the world will hate us even more for that!

Avatar image for Inferman
#36 Edited by Inferman (140 posts) -

@Serraph105 said:
Interesting, so do you know that 40% of illegal immigrants come over on airplanes and simply overstay their travel Visa's? Wouldn't that number just increase?

Do we keep all tourists out as well?

We keep out anyone who is trying to permanently immigrate to the United States of America. My first action would be to remove troops from Middle Eastern countries and stick them on the borders of Mexico and Canada. Then I'd increase vetting at airports which would be very easy to do.

These would be my first steps towards fixing a "broken system that is hurting this country".

Presuming closing the border could work, would you agree with doing it?

Avatar image for jhonMalcovich
#37 Edited by jhonMalcovich (7090 posts) -

@jun_aka_pekto said:

Why the US all the time? The US is such a rotten country (so many problems). Why not immigrate to other countries such as Spain, Japan, New Zealand, Canada, etc?

If I was immigrating from Mexico, I'd skip the US and make a beeline for Canada...especially if I knew they'd be more welcoming to me.

Lol no. Spain probably is the only country that welcomes immigration, but Spain is broke as f*ck. Japan, New Zealand, Canada have very fierce immigration policies. Canada in this regard is the most hypocritical probably. You may believe that Canada is so welcoming, liberal and political correct, but they will deport your illegal ass in no time, believe me. We even have here a reality TV show on Deportations where they catch poor immigrants and deport their asses lol Yeah this is Canada. People live in their liberal bubbles and they don't know how the real world works.

Loading Video...

Avatar image for sonicare
#38 Posted by sonicare (56836 posts) -

I believe we should open up our borders to russia. Let them all in. For diverstiy sake.

Avatar image for iandizion713
#39 Edited by iandizion713 (16025 posts) -

@FireEmblem_Man said:
@iandizion713 said:

I know how to fix it, we take Mexico, problem solved. We need to find out why everyone is fleeing one of our neighbors. Its a sign of a weak neighbor and needs fixed.

You're just asking for the U.S. to become an Imperial Empire! All the world will hate us even more for that!

Well just give them sports teams and middle class status. Well call ourselves the United States of Americas.

Avatar image for sonicare
#40 Posted by sonicare (56836 posts) -

@iandizion713 said:
@FireEmblem_Man said:
@iandizion713 said:

I know how to fix it, we take Mexico, problem solved. We need to find out why everyone is fleeing one of our neighbors. Its a sign of a weak neighbor and needs fixed.

You're just asking for the U.S. to become an Imperial Empire! All the world will hate us even more for that!

Well just give them sports teams and middle class status.

You should google mexico, immigration, guatemala. Quite hypocritical on their part.

Avatar image for Serraph105
#41 Posted by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -
@FireEmblem_Man said:

@Serraph105: It didn't take my parents over 130 years to become U.S. Citizens! They became citizens last year with a green card for over 25 years.

Can I ask what was their country of origin, and how long it took them to get a green card in the first place?

I ask because when I googled how long it can take to get a green card in the first place I found that some people will wait up to two decades. Marriage is one way to increase the speed, but encouraging people to marry just so they can get in to the country seems misguided at best.

Avatar image for Serraph105
#42 Edited by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -

@Inferman said:
@Serraph105 said:
Interesting, so do you know that 40% of illegal immigrants come over on airplanes and simply overstay their travel Visa's? Wouldn't that number just increase?

Do we keep all tourists out as well?

We keep out anyone who is trying to permanently immigrate to the United States of America. My first action would be to remove troops from Middle Eastern countries and stick them on the borders of Mexico and Canada. Then I'd increase vetting at airports which would be very easy to do.

These would be my first steps towards fixing a "broken system that is hurting this country".

Presuming closing the border could work, would you agree with doing it?

No I think that's a silly idea at best due to an inability to enforce such matters, and because I think of immigration as a net benefit to our country.

Avatar image for jhonMalcovich
#43 Posted by jhonMalcovich (7090 posts) -

@Serraph105 said:
@Inferman said:
@Serraph105 said:
@Inferman said:
@Serraph105 said:

@Inferman: Aww, where did your last post go? I wanted to see what stupid thing you said next.

Not sure why it was deleted... however, you know what it said. You just admitted to it.

But what I said was why don't we just close the border and stop all immigration? That would fix the "broken system that is hurting our country".

I figured it was something along those lines, but for the record gamespot notified me of your post. By the time I looked however it was already gone. So now that you've clarified what you mean, tell me how you think that such a system could reasonably be enforced.

Remove troops from Middle East. Stick them on north and south border.

Interesting, so do you know that 40% of illegal immigrants come over on airplanes and simply overstay their travel Visa's? Wouldn't that number just increase?

Do we keep all tourists out as well?

So they break the law. In Canada, people like that are being deported without any mercy. Canadians are very polite and politically correct, but they also follow the law to the letter. Overextending you visa in Canada would you get deported PLUS you will be permanently banned to travel to Canada ever again. Besides, Canadian immigration officers will interview you on the border, and god save you from saying something like you will try to find a job having a tourist and visitor visa, they will put you back on the plane and send you home. So many travelers fall for this ruse. A friendly C ?anadian officer asks an innocent question, "So what's up dude. Will you try to find a job in Canada ?", if you say yes then they will have you arrested and deported. I am just showing as an example how Canada works, which you, liberals, regard with such respect and reverence, thinking it's some sort of liberal paradise LOL

Avatar image for Serraph105
#44 Posted by Serraph105 (34045 posts) -

@jhonMalcovich: Why do you believe that I think of Canada as a "liberal paradise"? Furthermore why do you think all liberals think any one thing about certain topics? Is this a mistaken concept of a liberal hive mind when people don't work that way?

Avatar image for jhonMalcovich
#45 Posted by jhonMalcovich (7090 posts) -

@Serraph105 said:

@jhonMalcovich: Why do you believe that I think of Canada as a "liberal paradise"? Furthermore why do you think all liberals think any one thing about certain topics? Is this a mistaken concept of a liberal hive mind when people don't work that way?

I am just exaggerating lol. Several American celebrities said they will immigrate to Canada after Donald Trump election. Well good luck as Canada doesn't let any unqualified workers in and an application process is very long. You must have a verifiable and recognized University education, work experience, plus you must show on how you will contribute to the Canadian economy. Most Americans wouldn't qualify for Canadian immigration : (

Avatar image for FireEmblem_Man
#46 Posted by FireEmblem_Man (19846 posts) -

@Serraph105: they're from Mexico

Avatar image for iandizion713
#47 Edited by iandizion713 (16025 posts) -

@jhonMalcovich: Everyone i know says they want to go to Cali. I also come from a place where below 65 degrees is cold. So yeah, screw Canada.

Avatar image for jhonMalcovich
#48 Posted by jhonMalcovich (7090 posts) -

@iandizion713 said:

@jhonMalcovich: Everyone i know says they want to go to Cali. I also come from a place where below 65 degrees is cold. So yeah, screw Canada.

I worked in California for a few month. I have wanted to come back ever since lol. It was the nicest climate I have ever experienced. When I finish my contract here in Canada, I will probably try to settle down in California or Miami. I am so tired of winter, I am fluent in Spanish and I I have got some job offers from there. I am an Informatic Security engineer. I shouldn't have problem to find a job or contract in San Francisco, Palo Alto.

Avatar image for n64dd
#49 Posted by N64DD (11989 posts) -

@iandizion713 said:

I know how to fix it, we take Mexico, problem solved. We need to find out why everyone is fleeing one of our neighbors. Its a sign of a weak neighbor and needs fixed.

I usually disagree with you 100 percent, but you have a point i've brought up. Correct me if I misread what you said. We should make Mexico part of the United States, send down the national guard and take care of the drug cartels when we do and put the people in limbo into the system. You don't have illegal immigrants because everybody is now part of the US and we can work on putting them to work.

Avatar image for iandizion713
#50 Edited by iandizion713 (16025 posts) -

@n64dd: Pretty much, theyd just be added States.