Trump: Government won't be open 'until we have a wall'

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#1 Edited by qx0d (333 posts) -

http://www.fox5dc.com/news/trump-democrats-at-impasse-on-christmas-over-border-wall-budget-amid-partial-government-shutdown

https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/politics/Schumer-Trump-Is-Plunging-the-Country-Into-Chaos-503284402.html

WASHINGTON (AP) - President Donald Trump said Tuesday that parts of the federal government will stay closed until Democrats agree to put up more walls along the U.S.-Mexico border to deter criminal elements. He said he's open to calling the wall something else as long as he ends up with an actual wall.

In a Christmas Day appearance in the Oval Office, Trump issued a lengthy defense of his desire for a wall, saying it's the only way to stop drugs and human traffickers from entering the country. In a nod to the political stakes he's facing, Trump said he wants the wall by "election time" in 2020.

"I can't tell you when the government's going to be open. I can tell you it's not going to be open until we have a wall or fence, whatever they'd like to call it," Trump said, referring to Democrats who staunchly oppose walling off the border.

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#2 Posted by Sevenizz (3846 posts) -

Good, the time to take border security seriously was decades ago. How the Left doesn’t see that is mind boggling.

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#3 Edited by watercrack445 (1568 posts) -

Wow, this is a hostage crisis. We are trapped and we can't do anything about it.

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#4 Posted by deeliman (4026 posts) -

Not American, so correct me if I'm wrong here, but isn't it basically impossible for Trump will get his wall without making any sort of compromise, since he will lose control of the house in january? And he can't really blackmail the dems with this shutdown because he himself said that he would own it, and that it's his shutdown.

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#5 Posted by nepu7supastar7 (5093 posts) -

@qx0d:

This is gonna crack alot sooner than later. I say the best thing to do is ride it out until Trump gives in. Either take the 1.6 billion compromise or no deal!

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#6 Posted by LJS9502_basic (166488 posts) -

@Sevenizz said:

Good, the time to take border security seriously was decades ago. How the Left doesn’t see that is mind boggling.

The left as in the last administration was toughest on illegal immigration. Why the right ignores facts is beyond me.

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#7 Posted by Serraph105 (33769 posts) -

Sure Donald, go ahead and further damage the economy, the one thing you have anyone (wrongly) convinced that you've been good for as president, and further screw up the only talking point you have left for the 2020 election.

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#8 Posted by HoolaHoopMan (10684 posts) -

The president was ready to sign something his party passed but he said no. He's owning this shutdown one way or another.

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#9 Edited by Needhealing (2042 posts) -

The economy is tanking, near bear market territory. A recession is imminent. Trust me, Trump will cave in. Democrats are not going to bargain on the wall to give him a victory and pretty much the political move actually hurts him more than anyone.

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#10 Posted by Needhealing (2042 posts) -

@LJS9502_basic said:
@Sevenizz said:

Good, the time to take border security seriously was decades ago. How the Left doesn’t see that is mind boggling.

The left as in the last administration was toughest on illegal immigration. Why the right ignores facts is beyond me.

Exactly. The only difference is they weren't racist about it.

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#11 Edited by TryIt (13157 posts) -

@Sevenizz said:

Good, the time to take border security seriously was decades ago. How the Left doesn’t see that is mind boggling.

and you know what is really funny about that?

I lived in Houston for 30 years, and I still think its not needed

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#12 Posted by warmblur (2381 posts) -

F Trump.

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#13 Posted by LJS9502_basic (166488 posts) -

Let's build a wall around the White House and block internet/cell phones. The country and the world will be better for it.............

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#14 Posted by Treflis (13639 posts) -

Guess the US government won't be open for a long time then.

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#15 Posted by deeliman (4026 posts) -
@LJS9502_basic said:
@Sevenizz said:

Good, the time to take border security seriously was decades ago. How the Left doesn’t see that is mind boggling.

The left as in the last administration was toughest on illegal immigration. Why the right ignores facts is beyond me.

It's because the actual facts don't support their narritive.

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#16 Posted by Horgen (120478 posts) -

@Treflis said:

Guess the US government won't be open for a long time then.

2 years or so?

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#17 Posted by deeliman (4026 posts) -
@horgen said:
@Treflis said:

Guess the US government won't be open for a long time then.

2 years or so?

Let's see if they can best Beglium's record.

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#18 Posted by Horgen (120478 posts) -

@deeliman said:
@horgen said:
@Treflis said:

Guess the US government won't be open for a long time then.

2 years or so?

Let's see if they can best Beglium's record.

Does Trump know about this record?

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#19 Edited by Sevenizz (3846 posts) -

@LJS9502_basic: This just proves how uneducated the Left is. Democrats quietly changed the rules of deportation. Denying entry into the country for whatever reason (criminal record, improper paperwork, etc) were classified as deportations. They even lumped in vacationers in this category. The Democrats then touted to have strengthened the border based on these numbers when they actually did the opposite.

Please educate yourself on matters. I’m actually embarrassed for you and your uninformed ilk.

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#20 Posted by DaVillain- (36577 posts) -

OMFG! He knows he needs something to take to his base in 2020. I think a lot of them are still holding on to hope that Trump is going to make the wall happen. The longer he goes without delivering anything the more people are going to wake up to the fact that the wall is never happening.

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#21 Posted by TryIt (13157 posts) -

@davillain- said:

OMFG! He knows he needs something to take to his base in 2020. I think a lot of them are still holding on to hope that Trump is going to make the wall happen. The longer he goes without delivering anything the more people are going to wake up to the fact that the wall is never happening.

I think the only base left are people who would believe he was an alien from outer space if he said he was.

Although you are likely right that he is doing it thinking it will help his base but in reality I think it wouldnt matter, they are extreemly loyal and blind

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#22 Edited by mrbojangles25 (43977 posts) -

So much winning. Not tired of it yet.

Meanwhile, thousands (millions?) of government workers are having their pay furloughed.

@Sevenizz said:

Good, the time to take border security seriously was decades ago. How the Left doesn’t see that is mind boggling.

I believe in strong borders, but a wall is a bad idea and a waste of money. This isn't about a wall being built; this is about Trump's megalomania.

As for "the left" not seeing it, well, pretty sure there were a few (a significant amount?) of Republicans that voted against it as well.

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#23 Posted by jeezers (2875 posts) -

Shut it down, 20 bill for security is nothing compared to the 100 bill illegals cost america a year or the 36 bill we give Israel a year for thier wall.

Shut it down

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#24 Posted by DrLostRib (4904 posts) -

well that seems like a bad plan

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#25 Posted by hrt_rulz01 (18880 posts) -

Continues to prove what an imbecile he is... trying to please his simple-minded base.

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#26 Posted by tocool340 (21366 posts) -

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#27 Posted by blaznwiipspman1 (7189 posts) -

If it means the commie politicians will stop interfering in the free market for another day longer, then good. Hopefully trump never backs down on the wall. Too bad court orders don't also get shut down when government is shut down.

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#28 Posted by sonicare (56725 posts) -

@Sevenizz said:

Good, the time to take border security seriously was decades ago. How the Left doesn’t see that is mind boggling.

So give me a canadians perspective on immigration.

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#29 Edited by Icarian (1862 posts) -

Why is he doing that? Mexico is paying for the wall. Trump said so.

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#30 Posted by Horgen (120478 posts) -

@Sevenizz said:

@LJS9502_basic: This just proves how uneducated the Left is. Democrats quietly changed the rules of deportation. Denying entry into the country for whatever reason (criminal record, improper paperwork, etc) were classified as deportations. They even lumped in vacationers in this category. The Democrats then touted to have strengthened the border based on these numbers when they actually did the opposite.

Please educate yourself on matters. I’m actually embarrassed for you and your uninformed ilk.

Eh...

During Obama's first term, when he was laying the groundwork for what he hoped would be a comprehensive bargain on immigration, his administration aggressively enforced immigration law. ICE arrests peaked at more than 300,000 annually in 2010 and 2011. Deportations from the American interior -- in other words, not of people apprehended near the border — surpassed 200,000 in both those years, also about twice the number reached in 2017. Pro-immigrant groups took to calling Obama the "deporter in chief."

So... Spewing BS Sevenizz?

Source

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#31 Posted by LJS9502_basic (166488 posts) -

@Sevenizz said:

@LJS9502_basic: This just proves how uneducated the Left is. Democrats quietly changed the rules of deportation. Denying entry into the country for whatever reason (criminal record, improper paperwork, etc) were classified as deportations. They even lumped in vacationers in this category. The Democrats then touted to have strengthened the border based on these numbers when they actually did the opposite.

Please educate yourself on matters. I’m actually embarrassed for you and your uninformed ilk.

Yes please educate yourself. It's a fact that Obama deported many illegals found in the country and not just denying entry.

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2018-05-15/trump-is-deporting-fewer-immigrants-than-obama-did

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#32 Edited by blaznwiipspman1 (7189 posts) -

Obama went mad maxxx on the illegals. He was able to do it because Democrats have less pressure on them, less claims of racism, less of a spotlight on them when it comes to deportations. Trump on the other hand was going out of his way to support the KKK and of course people will be more focused on his actions and call into question his motivation for the deportation of illegals.

Personally I think trump should get his wall. Give him the 20 billion to put up a wall and if it doesn't work out then nobody really loses except for trump and his right wing base. I think it could be effective at keeping out illegals or at least minimizing the flow of illegals to some degree

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#33 Posted by Sevenizz (3846 posts) -

@LJS9502_basic: Did you even bother to read what I wrote?

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#34 Edited by TryIt (13157 posts) -

@Sevenizz said:

@LJS9502_basic: Did you even bother to read what I wrote?

I stopped reading at 'This just proves how uneducated the Left is.'

pro tip. lead with substance, not fluff. aka get to the F point

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#35 Edited by Serraph105 (33769 posts) -

@blaznwiipspman1 said:

Obama went mad maxxx on the illegals. He was able to do it because Democrats have less pressure on them, less claims of racism, less of a spotlight on them when it comes to deportations. Trump on the other hand was going out of his way to support the KKK and of course people will be more focused on his actions and call into question his motivation for the deportation of illegals.

Personally I think trump should get his wall. Give him the 20 billion to put up a wall and if it doesn't work out then nobody really loses except for trump and his right wing base. I think it could be effective at keeping out illegals or at least minimizing the flow of illegals to some degree

Would it ever be worth the 20 billion dollars though? The vast majority of people who come over illegally do so by plane and the one's who do come over by foot largely do not use up much resources or get high paying jobs. I'd bet the wall could be up for over a hundred years before it would ever save us $20 billion dollars, and that's not even factoring in the cost of upkeep.

Meanwhile that same money could go towards any number of measures that keep costs of the country down like preventative healthcare screenings, the funding of science, or building up countries via foriegn aid so we could do business with them later on.

Edit. We should have been tougher on Obama for deporting so many people. God knows how many families were broken up. I think that people were caught up in refuting the lie (a lie I will never understand considering they could have pissed off more people by just going with the truth) spread by republicans that Obama was essentially just letting millions of people flow in unchecked that people didn't really stop and think about whether it was actually good that he deported millions. That description definitely includes myself, and I too need to be better than that.

It probably helped his PR that Obama actively seeked immigration reform on multiple occassions and signed a big EO on letting millions of immigrants stay in the country so long as they weren't committing crime.

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#36 Posted by Horgen (120478 posts) -

@Sevenizz said:

@LJS9502_basic: Did you even bother to read what I wrote?

Can you back up your claim?

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#37 Posted by blaznwiipspman1 (7189 posts) -

@Serraph105: I won't say what Obama did was wrong. He did what Americans expected of him even if it was dirty. Obama did the RIGHT thing, one of the few things I can compliment him on. The thing with the dreamers I think was a harder pill to swallow. Most of those people came as young children and are just as much American as anyone else. Deporting them to a country they don't even remember would have been cruel so I think Obama definitely did a good job there also.

I don't think the wall is a good idea either. I think if the war on drugs ended or scaled back then many of these countries would naturally become better places to live and the illegal would also drop off. The wall would have some effect in my opinion but it definitely won't stop all illegals as you said. Alot of people fly in and over stay. In my view the best way to stop illegals is to dry up the market for them. This can be done in a few ways, but the easiest would be by raising federal minimum wage enough so that it doesn't make sense to hire illegals any more. If anyone is hiring people under the table they would be reported and made to pay a fine. Maybe put out a bounty, so that anyone who correctly reports an employer that hires illegals gets paid $10k. That money would be paid as a fine by the employer.

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#38 Edited by DrLostRib (4904 posts) -

@horgen said:
@Sevenizz said:

@LJS9502_basic: Did you even bother to read what I wrote?

Can you back up your claim?

Well if he takes after the President, probably not

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#39 Posted by vl4d_l3nin (1849 posts) -

https://globalnews.ca/news/4801674/donald-trump-pay-freeze-2019/

He aint giving up!

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#40 Posted by Drunk_PI (2796 posts) -

The wall is dumb and won't solve a goddamn thing. More emotional bullshit from the crybaby in chief, his pathetic cronies, and his cultists.

This country is being ruled by an idiotic minority and the majority of Americans are getting shat on.

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#41 Posted by Jacanuk (18493 posts) -

@drunk_pi said:

The wall is dumb and won't solve a goddamn thing. More emotional bullshit from the crybaby in chief, his pathetic cronies, and his cultists.

This country is being ruled by an idiotic minority and the majority of Americans are getting shat on.

Well, tell that to the East Germans who built a wall or Israel.

But it´s all about symbolism.

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#42 Posted by LJS9502_basic (166488 posts) -

@Jacanuk said:
@drunk_pi said:

The wall is dumb and won't solve a goddamn thing. More emotional bullshit from the crybaby in chief, his pathetic cronies, and his cultists.

This country is being ruled by an idiotic minority and the majority of Americans are getting shat on.

Well, tell that to the East Germans who built a wall or Israel.

But it´s all about symbolism.

USSR built the wall. And Germans on both sides hated it.

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#43 Posted by HoolaHoopMan (10684 posts) -

And he's freezing federal workers pay for 2019 now. Saying we can't pay for it but gutting our tax revenue at the same time, can't make this nonsense up.

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#44 Edited by Jacanuk (18493 posts) -

@LJS9502_basic said:
@Jacanuk said:
@drunk_pi said:

The wall is dumb and won't solve a goddamn thing. More emotional bullshit from the crybaby in chief, his pathetic cronies, and his cultists.

This country is being ruled by an idiotic minority and the majority of Americans are getting shat on.

Well, tell that to the East Germans who built a wall or Israel.

But it´s all about symbolism.

USSR built the wall. And Germans on both sides hated it.

No shit , they hated it because it worked.

Which is kinda the point with a wall. You don´t build it to have someone pass it on a whim.

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#45 Posted by Vaasman (13679 posts) -
@Jacanuk said:
@LJS9502_basic said:

USSR built the wall. And Germans on both sides hated it.

No shit , they hated it because it worked.

Which is kinda the point with a wall. You don´t build it to have someone pass it on a whim.

An estimated 5000 people directly got past the Berlin wall, which does not include people who simply migrated the long ways out of East Germany/Berlin.

Not to mention the Southern border of America is hundreds of times longer through uninhabited wasteland, and has oceans on either side, with much better and more regular air travel and interstate commerce. It's hardly accurate to use the Berlin Wall as a metric of success for our own proposed wall.

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#46 Posted by mattbbpl (17135 posts) -

@HoolaHoopMan: Surprised? Pissing on the little guy in order to secure more for themselves is his party's MO.