New California declares 'independence' from California in bid to become 51st state

Okay, so apparently the majority of California counties are literally trying to cut itself off from the LA and other coast areas. The "founders" have evoked Article IV Section 3 of the United States Constitution as justification for establishing a new economy with a new state constitution.

This is the proposed split

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2018/01/16/new-california-declares-independence-california-bid-become-51st-state/1036681001/

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2018/01/17/new-california-movement-seeks-to-divide-golden-state-in-half.html

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/new-california-declares-independence-from-rest-of-state/

This is just stupid. And just as dangerous as Calexit, in that it will give the right wing too much of an edge throwing off an electoral balance in America.

The only "New California" I'd back is in a post-nuclear world, which, corrupt as they may be, at least are a better poison to a bunch of other factions (like ISIS in Ancient Roman cosplay and a con-man in a computer).

I shall leave this here and be on my way.

The original attempt back months or years ago was LITERALLY funded by the Russsians. The headquarters of the organization that started it was in Russia

true

LOL Good luck with that.

'Russian trolls' promoted California independence

http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-41853131

So Gerrymandering, only for states? That is silly. If a hundred thousand square miles of American citizens really do feel like their vote doesn't matter they should seek remedy. Let the counties vote for themselves.

Though to be honest I am darn sure this isn't getting off the ground. Even if it does make it to a vote, smart money says it face plants. Most of rural California isn't that red. The only way this happens is if supporting LA and the like is really that bad. I have a funny feeling this isn't the case. I have no data on the subject, but I think it is likely most of the money that makes California the sixth largest economy in the world comes from the deep blue areas.

What a shame it´s not true.

Most of California deserves to be on their own and become independent.

You must really dream of seeing the United States getting f***ed over, don't you?

I hope the best for this change. Or some similar separation. California has just become too big for bureaucracy to effectively manage.

Yes they deserve to split off from the main reasons why California is the 6th largest economy in the world. It would be a terrible move for the United States and a terrible move for "New California". If I didn't care about this country I think it would be fun to watch them fall on their faces after splitting off, but sadly I wouldn't be able to enjoy it.

Well that's dumb

so his russian overlords can finally take over

By what?

California is a nuisance more than it's a benefit to America.

You may want to go read up on what California actually costs every other tax-payer in America.

They are a burden more than anything.

How so?

umm guys...

I will just post this one more time so its not spamming but I think everyone should look into it.

'Russian trolls' promoted California independence

http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-41853131

By costing America more money than they actually bring to the table.

Not forgetting the higher number of illegals than in any other state.

lol..

the entire agenda being created by the Russians aside for the moment, did you know that a HUGE amount of the GDP as well as taxes generated by California is coming from...wait for it...illegals.

California's net GDP to the united states is mega huge. It would devastate the country which is EXACTLY why Russia funds the idea

That is definitely a lie and I can't fathom where you came up with such blatant falsehoods.

California's economic output and tax dollars give to the economy more than it takes out.

https://wallethub.com/edu/states-most-least-dependent-on-the-federal-government/2700/ California here is the 46th most dependent state on the government.

The tax foundation also has California as #43 https://taxfoundation.org/states-rely-most-federal-aid/

Notice how the states most dependent on the government are majority Republican states?

Lol the irony! California wanted to leave the US and part of California wants to leave California.

lol. they made sure to encompass the san jose / silicon valley area in new california.... can't lose that tax revenue...

The first was paid for a funded by the Russians, the headquarters of the organization was in russia.

I would not remotely be surprised that this one is as well

@perfect_blue: also makes a lot of food

@perfect_blue: Blue states also have the most Debt and no California cost the US way more then it brings in.

Nice try Blue but you may want to actually know a thing or two about America before you bring your canadian knowledge to the table.

If you take the medicare/medicade/federal subsidies and put it up against the federal tax revenue generated by California, they are actually costing money.

But i admire your googling , it´s fun to watch.

What is your obsession with where he's from?

No, the links I provided show the bolded is incorrect. Medicare, medicaid, and federal subsidies are ALL programs from the federal government... which California is low on the dependence scale compared to other states. If you have contradictory evidence to what I've provided, please feel free and post it.

Please provide evidence of that statement.

Good luck.

That is pretty funny. Don't they know how many liberal elitists and illegals live in San Jose?

Are you saying the only way we can create a new state is if we create two states at a time? Does that mean the prospects for Puerto Rico's statehood relies soley on whether or not someone else also gets to become a state?

@perfect_blue: https://www.usgovernmentdebt.us/state_debt_rank

New York cost the US more then anyone. California is the middle Notice all the blue states at the top of the list.

You can provide links up the wazoo if you want Blue. It does not change the facts, that California is by far in terms of Federal Revenue a expenditure more than they are a actual net profit.

And it does not matter if there are federal programs , it´s still being used by californians and it´s a cost

Considering the size and population of California they only bring in 10.000$ per capita which makes them 16th state on the list. So again when you only bring in 400mil and cost 405 mill it's not that hard to see that they are a cost.

We weren't talking about debt, though. California doesn't even do that poorly compared to some other states and has been running budget surpluses in the last few years.

We were talking on dependence on the government and comparing how much states take in and out. I'll bold the relevant bit from your last post:

This is what I want proof for.

What tax? You do know that those "rich liberals" are also among the best to hide their income overseas.

Apple last report hid something like 90+% of their profits overseas and away from any tax. Musk pretty much does the same and Amazon´s ceo now the richest man ever , is no different.

Can you prove that? You haven't done anything besides post assertions or what you think. Where is your proof/data/evidence?

where are the sources? and how is california so much of a nuisance compared to other states that it should be removed?

Uh, no. Not when they're one of the most populous states on the continent AND when it's one of the largest economic states. They split or leave, we're f***ed. Nothing beneficial AT ALL!

Honestly, I couldn't tell you how making a state works entirely besides Puerto Rico's continuous votes to become one (though why under this administration, I don't know, especially after the Hurricane). All my point was (besides a certain game reference) is that California either splitting itself or seceding the union would spell disaster, both politically (giving the edge to the right wing, especially the alt-right, contrary to what Steve Bannon said) and financially.

To quote you "why would i do your work, im not going to educate you when you are to lazy to do it yourself"

No he can't, he literally is looking at facts and choosing to ignore them while still pushing his false ideas. He will not provide any proof of it because he doesn't have any. He got caught in a lie and is desperately trying to get out.

The 6th largest economy in the world is bad for america, lol gtfo.

@Jacanuk:I already looked for proof of what you claimed and couldn’t find it. So if neither us can prove your claim I guess that means it‘s false.

Okay, I’m glad we have that confirmed.

@Nick3306: Oh trust me, I’m well aware of what he’s doing lol.

Nice deflection.

There is prove, so come on show us your awesome google skills.

You may want to read up on tax revenue.

Or go on and show your ignorance , at least you provide a good laugh.

But just to prove you wrong

state	Total IRS Tax Collected
	California	$405.9

That is the actual federal tax collector from California.

@Jacanuk: You’ve been deflecting this entire time from posting proof of your own claim, lmao

@perfect_blue: Except they didn't run a surplus.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mercurynews.com/2017/01/18/1-8-billion-error-adds-to-california-deficit-projection/amp/

There federal income per a person isnt bad because they have a younger population (less ss and medicaid) and pay loads of federal taxes. That alone causes California to break even.

However whats not included in your links is the cost the federal goverment has to pay for illegal immigrants. Which California has more so then any state in the country.

https://fairus.org/issue/publications-resources/fiscal-burden-illegal-immigration-united-states-taxpayers

These cost are not divided by state and not included in your links.

Oh you mean like you in the other thread.

I hope you can see your own hypocrisy here. Or wait let me guess you can´t.

But no i'm not deflecting , the information is out there, i even said what you need to look for.

Is the illegal immigration cost making them net takers from the government or not? Also, Texas is the same as California in this instance that it has a very high population of illegal immigrants. Would you be willing to make the same argument with regards to Texas?

What hypocrisy? I provided reading material in every thread if asked for it, it’s not my fault that you didn’t go back and check lol.

Frankly, I’m amazed you’re persisting in this thread despite being made to look like a fool and demonstrably wrong. You really should just quit while you’re behind.

@Jacanuk said:

@Nick3306 said:

@perfect_blue said:

@Jacanuk said:

You can provide links up the wazoo if you want Blue. It does not change the facts, that California is by far in terms of Federal Revenue a expenditure more than they are a actual net profit.

And it does not matter if there are federal programs , it´s still being used by californians and it´s a cost

Considering the size and population of California they only bring in 10.000$ per capita which makes them 16th state on the list. So again when you only bring in 400mil and cost 405 mill it's not that hard to see that they are a cost.

Can you prove that? You haven't done anything besides post assertions or what you think. Where is your proof/data/evidence?

No he can't, he literally is looking at facts and choosing to ignore them while still pushing his false ideas. He will not provide any proof of it because he doesn't have any. He got caught in a lie and is desperately trying to get out.

The 6th largest economy in the world is bad for america, lol gtfo.

You may want to read up on tax revenue.

Or go on and show your ignorance , at least you provide a good laugh.

But just to prove you wrong

state	Total IRS Tax Collected
California	$405.9

That is the actual federal tax collector from California.

I'm not sure what you think you posted but you basically just posted nothing with no sources. So Ill ask again, please support your claim that the 6th largest economy in the world hurts our country.

@Nick3306: Maybe read what i posted.

Also didn't you claim to be a master economist at one point?