"government" lied in indictment against Butina

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Jacanuk

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#1  Edited By Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts

Well, ups, the prosecutors lied in their indictment.

Prosecutors said Friday that they misunderstood text messages used as the basis of a claim that Maria Butina offered to trade sex for access -- an extraordinary admission that threatens to undercut the government's cloak-and-dagger portrayal of the young Russian accused of working to infiltrate American political circles.

The government made the explosive allegation that Butina offered "sex in exchange for a position within a special interest organization" in a filing in July -- a claim that has been hotly disputed by her lawyer."I want the government's walk back to get as much coverage, as prominently, as their initial false allegation," said Robert Driscoll, Butina's attorney.The government acknowledged its error in a filing released just before midnight Friday but said there was still reason to question the depth of Butina's commitment to her boyfriend, Paul Erickson. Erickson is a South Dakota conservative political operative who CNN has identified as "U.S. Person 1" in government filings. He has not been charged with any wrongdoing.

Hopefully, this will make some hardliners aware that an indictment is nothing but a rubber stamp and not proof that what is said is actually also a reality.

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/09/08/politics/maria-butina-court-filing/index.html

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Jacanuk

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#3 Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts

@joebones5000 said:

So desperate for it to not be Russia. lol

Eh? this is not about Russia but about certain individuals on the far-left claiming that things in an indictment are cut in stone.

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TryIt

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#4 TryIt
Member since 2017 • 13157 Posts

@Jacanuk said:

Well, ups, the prosecutors lied in their indictment.

Prosecutors said Friday that they misunderstood text messages used as the basis of a claim that Maria Butina offered to trade sex for access -- ....

I had to stop there.

The sex for access is the LEAST important part of this case, in fact its not even important.

too funny

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Jacanuk

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#5 Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts

@tryit said:
@Jacanuk said:

Well, ups, the prosecutors lied in their indictment.

Prosecutors said Friday that they misunderstood text messages used as the basis of a claim that Maria Butina offered to trade sex for access -- ....

I had to stop there.

The sex for access is the LEAST important part of this case, in fact its not even important.

too funny

Well, since you claimed so many times before that an indictment is built on ironclad evidence, i see how it must hurt to find out the truth.

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TryIt

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#6  Edited By TryIt
Member since 2017 • 13157 Posts

@Jacanuk said:
@tryit said:
@Jacanuk said:

Well, ups, the prosecutors lied in their indictment.

Prosecutors said Friday that they misunderstood text messages used as the basis of a claim that Maria Butina offered to trade sex for access -- ....

I had to stop there.

The sex for access is the LEAST important part of this case, in fact its not even important.

too funny

Well, since you claimed so many times before that an indictment is built on ironclad evidence, i see how it must hurt to find out the truth.

I never said that, when you argue I see elements of desperation in your replies. You like to change things like 'misunderstanding' to mean 'liying' when you dont even have to. its a sign you are desperate.

What i said was, you dont need a jury and a court case to know for a fact that the earth revolves around the sun. Its not like that is an unsettled question only until there is a trial.

THAT is what I said. are you saying that is inaccurate? that we would never know for sure that the earth revolves around the sun? only if we have a trail on it?

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Jacanuk

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#7 Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts

@tryit said:
@Jacanuk said:
@tryit said:
@Jacanuk said:

Well, ups, the prosecutors lied in their indictment.

Prosecutors said Friday that they misunderstood text messages used as the basis of a claim that Maria Butina offered to trade sex for access -- ....

I had to stop there.

The sex for access is the LEAST important part of this case, in fact its not even important.

too funny

Well, since you claimed so many times before that an indictment is built on ironclad evidence, i see how it must hurt to find out the truth.

I never said that, when you argue I see elements of desperation in your replies. You like to change things like 'misunderstanding' to mean 'liying' when you dont even have to. its a sign you are desperate.

What i said was, you dont need a jury and a court case to know for a fact that the earth revolves around the sun. Its not like that is an unsettled question only until there is a trial.

THAT is what I said. are you saying that is inaccurate? that we would never know for sure that the earth revolves around the sun? only if we have a trail on it?

Nah, you did not say it in so many posts that it would take a team of 400 a year to find them all.

And "misunderstanding" is lying, they put the charges forward, used them in an indictment and spread it in the media to make their case stronger.

Also, no indictment is built around ironclad evidence, so nice try that.

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TryIt

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#8  Edited By TryIt
Member since 2017 • 13157 Posts

@Jacanuk said:
@tryit said:
@Jacanuk said:
@tryit said:

I had to stop there.

The sex for access is the LEAST important part of this case, in fact its not even important.

too funny

Well, since you claimed so many times before that an indictment is built on ironclad evidence, i see how it must hurt to find out the truth.

I never said that, when you argue I see elements of desperation in your replies. You like to change things like 'misunderstanding' to mean 'liying' when you dont even have to. its a sign you are desperate.

What i said was, you dont need a jury and a court case to know for a fact that the earth revolves around the sun. Its not like that is an unsettled question only until there is a trial.

THAT is what I said. are you saying that is inaccurate? that we would never know for sure that the earth revolves around the sun? only if we have a trail on it?

Nah, you did not say it in so many posts that it would take a team of 400 a year to find them all.

And "misunderstanding" is lying, they put the charges forward, used them in an indictment and spread it in the media to make their case stronger.

Also, no indictment is built around ironclad evidence, so nice try that.

1. yes I did say that you do not need a court trial to be sure that the earth revolves around the sun. period. I did not say that every single solitary count on every indictment somewhat kinda sorta tied to Trump possibly is 'iron clad'

2. 'misunderstanding' is not 'lying' period end of story, its absurdly funny to say that as if you keep saying it will not make you look more absurd.

3. 'we know for a fact that Trump is in with Russia' does not depends on 'did Buitna get her access that she got to do the things she did by offering sex', period end of story and again, suggesting otherwise just makes you look absurd.

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Jacanuk

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#9 Jacanuk
Member since 2011 • 20281 Posts

@tryit said:

1. yes I did say that you do not need a court trial to be sure that the earth revolves around the sun. period. I did not say that every single solitary count on every indictment somewhat kinda sorta tied to Trump possibly is 'iron clad'

2. 'misunderstanding' is not 'lying' period end of story, its absurdly funny to say that as if you keep saying it will not make you look more absurd.

3. 'we know for a fact that Trump is in with Russia' does not depends on 'did Buitna get her access that she got to do the things she did by offering sex', period end of story and again, suggesting otherwise just makes you look absurd.

You sure a funny guy.

That link just proved that the prosecutors went into a grand jury and got an indictment based partly on false evidence, so stop trying to compare apples and wind power.

If i misheard you and claimed you said Potato when you said Apple, then yes that would be a simple misunderstanding. When a prosecutor walks into a grand jury and presents evidence to a grand jury that is false, that is not a "misunderstanding" that is a lie.

And no you know jack shit, Trump has never been proven to have one single thing to do with Russia, you keep claiming that but when even Mueller comes out and says he is no longer a suspect, and then goes after him on a completely different thing,. Well, you can hopefully without lying paint the rest of the picture.

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TryIt

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#10 TryIt
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@Jacanuk said:
@tryit said:

1. yes I did say that you do not need a court trial to be sure that the earth revolves around the sun. period. I did not say that every single solitary count on every indictment somewhat kinda sorta tied to Trump possibly is 'iron clad'

2. 'misunderstanding' is not 'lying' period end of story, its absurdly funny to say that as if you keep saying it will not make you look more absurd.

3. 'we know for a fact that Trump is in with Russia' does not depends on 'did Buitna get her access that she got to do the things she did by offering sex', period end of story and again, suggesting otherwise just makes you look absurd.

You sure a funny guy.

That link just proved that the prosecutors went into a grand jury and got an indictment based partly on false evidence,...

holy smokes! a more honest and more accurate assertion.

well done.

Lets see how much that one aspect affects the overall trial. Me thinks the METHOD that a Russian working with Putin infiltrates the NRA is going to be less important then if they actually did infiltrated the NRA. If you are lucky the 'does the earth revolve around the sun' will get thrown out due to HOW it was done rather than it being done.

but..given that this isnt related to Trump...

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#13 TryIt
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@joebones5000 said:
@Jacanuk said:
@joebones5000 said:

So desperate for it to not be Russia. lol

Eh? this is not about Russia but about certain individuals on the far-left claiming that things in an indictment are cut in stone.

Eh? You're so desperate for it to not be Russia. lol

thing is, if the Right was clever (tactically speaking) they would stop with the 'no Russia!' and instead go with 'why is partnership with Russia a bad thing guys?'

but they cant flip between the two, it has to be one or ther other, I think tactically the later is better stradegy

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#14  Edited By IvanGrozny
Member since 2015 • 1841 Posts

Apparently leftists forget about women rights and political correctness when it comes down to Russian ethnicity. I am appaled and disgusted with leftists racism in the 21st century. A bunch of hipocrates that persecute innocent Russian civilians, like they used to persecute Black people? This trial smells like a lynching mob attempt. Good thing there are still sensible people in America that won't let them hurt an innocent.

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#16 TryIt
Member since 2017 • 13157 Posts

@joebones5000 said:
@tryit said:
@joebones5000 said:
@Jacanuk said:
@joebones5000 said:

So desperate for it to not be Russia. lol

Eh? this is not about Russia but about certain individuals on the far-left claiming that things in an indictment are cut in stone.

Eh? You're so desperate for it to not be Russia. lol

thing is, if the Right was clever (tactically speaking) they would stop with the 'no Russia!' and instead go with 'why is partnership with Russia a bad thing guys?'

but they cant flip between the two, it has to be one or ther other, I think tactically the later is better stradegy

A few of my friends have tried that line of bull with me - "being friends with russia is a good thing". How quickly they have changed. lol

I could work for the GOP and give them tons of tips on how to make that work.

Reason is because most americans dont know jack shit about Russia and they rarely are challenged to the conduct of the U.S. itself as a compassion.

I watched 'the putin interviews' a long documentary and Putin makes some good points, sure they might be obfuscation but they are still clever