GT5 P and its mediocre AI

First of all, dont be so defensive. Read what I have to say and if you still think that I should burn in hell for mentioning anything negative related to GT5 then feel free to let me know.

I have owned every single GT game that has come out (except prolouges and other special edition versions).

And I have to say that this game hasnt really evolved with the times properly. It seems as if that the companies idea of a sequal is better graphics and and more cars while almost all the other aspects of the game seems untouched, namely the AI.

GT1-GT4 had basically the same AI. I know thats not technically true but it sure feels that way. And even in the GT5P demo it seems as if the AI has no clue where the player is on the track. They still bumb into you just cause your in the way and the lack of damage turns the race into a unrealistic bumber car event.

I get the feeling that a lot of the stuff that will make GT5 fun has to do a lot with what your doing when your not racing (for example taking pics of your car, shopping for new cars and etc) and I think that is completely the wrong approach. The core of the fun and depth should be in the actually gameplay.

Its still an awesome series and Im totally getting GT5 when it comes out. But when you have been a fan as long as I have and followed each game, you tend to notice the similarities in the flaws that get carried over with each new installment.

The game still seems to cater to the people who are new to the series and cars in general; not the players who have been there and done that.

that is why there is over a million pre-oders already in the uk alone.

im sorry but if you think gt5 is the same game as gt1 then im sorry.

i also forgot that driving a car should be differant i mean comeon now the AI being differant what do you want them raming in the wall more than it did in the past. i trying to figure out what your trying to say here.

First of all, dont be so defensive. Read what I have to say and if you still think that I should burn in hell for mentioning anything negative related to GT5 then feel free to let me know.

I have owned every single GT game that has come out (except prolouges and other special edition versions).

And I have to say that this game hasnt really evolved with the times properly. It seems as if that the companies idea of a sequal is better graphics and and more cars while almost all the other aspects of the game seems untouched, namely the AI.

GT1-GT4 had basically the same AI. I know thats not technically true but it sure feels that way. And even in the GT5P demo it seems as if the AI has no clue where the player is on the track. They still bumb into you just cause your in the way and the lack of damage turns the race into a unrealistic bumber car event.

I get the feeling that a lot of the stuff that will make GT5 fun has to do a lot with what your doing when your not racing (for example taking pics of your car, shopping for new cars and etc) and I think that is completely the wrong approach. The core of the fun and depth should be in the actually gameplay.

Its still an awesome series and Im totally getting GT5 when it comes out. But when you have been a fan as long as I have and followed each game, you tend to notice the similarities in the flaws that get carried over with each new installment.

The game still seems to cater to the people who are new to the series and cars in general; not the players who have been there and done that.

smellati

which is exactly the same as in previous games. Its not a game of GAMEPLAY. If you want that go play Sega Rally or NFS. GT is a game for car fans, as myself.

I stopped reading after you said "prolouges". :D

But really, your argument doesn't really support your 'mediocre AI' statement. You've hardly persuaded me.

It seems as if that the companies idea of a sequal is better graphics and and more cars while almost all the other aspects of the game seems untouched, namely the AI.

Welcome to the world that has most games like this...Just saying :|. Not that I care; I dont even like G.T

zerovirus makes a good point. This time around i think it is all about the online thing. I have years and years of repressed GT ego built up and i just wanna get my HD awesome and amazing looking cars online and smoke some newbs! Honestly if the AI is a bit stale, or week or w/e who cares.

This is a game for car enthusiast and now with the online addition i personally dont care about single player all that much.

You do have a point. The Gran Turismo series has never been known for it's A.I. But keep in mind, it's not an artificial intelligence simulator. It's not even a racing simulator. It's a driving simulator, and so far, no other racing game has EVER come remotely close to the realism of Gran Turismo.

Plus, if you think about it, is the A.I. really that bad? If you've ever been to or watched an actual real life race, you'd have seen that the racers don't swerve all over the track, blocking each other and running each other off the road. That's not realistic. Racers stick to their racing lines usually, and most of the time, a real race does consist of some "bumper car" action, rather than violent, destructive manuevers. If that's what you're looking for, then this isn't the game for it!

Third, you said that Gran Turismo seems to focus on the newcomers and the people that don't know much about cars in general. Are you serious? Yes, sure you can hop on Gran Turismo and start playing right away but you'll never be the best you can be that way. More experienced Gran Turismo fans (like myself) tweak every aspect of the car so that it feels and handles exactly the way they want it to. I guarantee that online play will clarify this. Put a noob up against somebody that has fine tuned their vehicle? Prepare to see the noob blown off the track.

I know you weren't bashing the series, but come on, give it it's due credit at least. To say that the A.I. hasn't changed a bit from the first game is absurd. As far as realism and versatility goes, Gran Turismo just can't be beat. It can't.

Ah, I almost forgot. In Gamespot's GT5: Prologue review, they said that there was an A.I. setting that you can adjust. Have you tried doing that yet? They said that the default is 18, but that it goes up to 100. Surely bumping it up that high has to make things more difficult.

What a load. Seriously you claim to be a fan of the series and say there are no apparent differences in the A.I. from 1 to 4... I hardly even want to dignify that with a response. Using that basis to claim the gameplay is poor is ridiculous. I can agree that the GT series is killing itself by not having damage, but that is where the shortcomings stop. The actual physics and interpretation of varying handling characteristics from different car models, drivetrains, weight, and power are reproduced with a near perfect accuracy. The Physics is what PERSONALLY makes GT the #1 racing series that I have ever played. GT was never about impressive A.I., they never make that claim. Besides A.I. only can do so much in a realistic racing simulation. Holding the fast line often takes priority over taking people out or whatever people are expecting the A.I. to do...warbmxjohn

lol at people saying "it doesnt need decent racing a.i cuz its a driving sim" HELLO you race against other cars on a track. At least they could do something more than follow the same racing line. You know, like maybe try to protect their postion, or braking instead of just shunting you out the way on corners?

Im not expecting too much am i? If GT is the best sim out there, then it should equal or better what has been a mainstay in racing games for years.

that is why there is over a million pre-oders already in the uk alone.

GARRYTH

Forza2 has real driving physics all aids off (not the unrealistic oversteer and magic breaks 'joyride' of GT5 Prologue), and the car will be damaged and malfunction if you bump into others. I tried both extensively. As for realism, Forza2 comes out on top, no doubt about that. Now, give me the regular fanboy rant.Ozzie234

[QUOTE="GARRYTH"]

that is why there is over a million pre-oders already in the uk alone.

X_CAPCOM_X

Well to be fair you cant go off sales. I mean look at Falo. It sells somehow lol.

[QUOTE="X_CAPCOM_X"][QUOTE="GARRYTH"]

that is why there is over a million pre-oders already in the uk alone.

truenextgen

Well to be fair you cant go off sales. I mean look at Falo. It sells somehow lol.

And you have played GT5p AND Forza2??? I doubt it, because then you would KNOW GT5 (at present state) is a *joke* simulation wise compared to (all aids off) Forza2.... and whatever complaint you would have on Forza2, it has to come tenfolded for GT5. Forza2 has better ai where the opponents fight back, and changes his race line when needed to fight his place. Also the opponent adapt to your agresiveness, so if you bump or ram a car off its race line, they will do the same to you!! It has *much* better physics (car setups really do make a difference), and realistic damage. Add to that more customizable cars. GT5 is a "simulation" for kids, where you can miss a breaking point by 50 yards and still by "magic" breaks handle the corner, whereas in Forza2 such a move will have you go STRAIGHT OFF while turning, just like a *real* car would behave. Face it, GT5 is eye candy.

And you have played GT5p AND Forza2??? I doubt it, because then you would KNOW GT5 (at present state) is a *joke* simulation wise compared to (all aids off) Forza2.... and whatever complaint you would have on Forza2, it has to come tenfolded for GT5. Forza2 has better ai where the opponents fight back, and changes his race line when needed to fight his place. Also the opponent adapt to your agresiveness, so if you bump or ram a car off its race line, they will do the same to you!! It has *much* better physics (car setups really do make a difference), and realistic damage. Add to that more customizable cars. GT5 is a "simulation" for kids, where you can miss a breaking point by 50 yards and still by "magic" breaks handle the corner, whereas in Forza2 such a move will have you go STRAIGHT OFF while turning, just like a *real* car would behave. Face it, GT5 is eye candy.

Ozzie234

What are you basing this CRAP off of? Nothing but your opinion, fanboy. Forza has DIFFERENT A.I...not better. Whether it is better or not is your opinion. Like I said in my previous post, Gran Turismo is not meant to have aggressive A.I. because most real life races aren't like that. To say that Forza has better physics is ignorant and idiotic. It is a FACT, that Gran Turismo has the most realistic physics. They've done studies using GT cars vs. real life cars. Look it up. As far as customization goes, the only thing Forza does better in this department is purely cosmetic, which IMO, leans it more toward kids, who probably care more about how their vehicle looks than anything else. Real racers aren't entirely consumed with the LOOK of their vehicle.

I don't know what version of Gran Turismo you THINK you've played but, if you miss a breaking point by 50 yards, you're not going to handle the corner, you're going to go off the road or into a wall. As far as it being for kids? Please. Most kids wouldn't have any idea how to properly customize their cars. (and by customize I mean actually customize, not add neat paints and rims)

I won't argue the fact that GT5 is eye candy, because it DOES look insanely better than Forza. However, every other aspect of it is also better as well so, it's kick ass graphics are merely a bonus.

Some gamers just aren't cut out to handle Gran Turismo's realism. They don't understand that this isn't a game where you can do 300 MPH through cities and wreck your car into a million bits and fly around corners and etc. REAL car manufacturers don't enjoy seeing their products wrecked to bits. Why do you need car damage so bad? If you're driving how you're supposed to, realistically, you should rarely crash or run into anything. Gran Turismo is, ONCE AGAIN, a driving simulator. To any dumbass that says "you keep calling it a driving sim but you race against other cars!", of course you do. What fun would the game be just driving around an empty track on your own?

it is rather funny how gt5 prologue which isn't even the final version of the game is being compared to forza 2 which is a final product. Since it is a realistic racing game, yes the graphics have to be good. You should wait until the FULL version comes out to judge. The U.S amd Euro versions are different than the Japanese version so how about waiting until those come out to judge a demo. Ok maybe a bit more than a taste, but I am pretty that everything has not been finalized yet. As far as fanboyism goes, don't you think it is a little fanboyish to compare a full version of a game to taster version game. I mean people buy what they like and that is that.

I am not even into racing sims, but I will still stick up for something when it's not even completely done yet.

As far as this whole 360 vs ps3 goes. Both have games on them. Tje 360 has a lot of similar ones and strong online and ps3 has games that are all a different type and pretty good online. Just buy both and call it a day.

I feel the same way, I played a of of GT3 and still play a lot of GT4. Every time I set the game to the hardest setting and still the driving of the AI is way under that I my skill level. I often times find my self stoping on the side of the road halfway though the race to let the cars pass me so that I can have a little fun in trying to get back into first place.

When your in first place for most of the game, That is just driving. When your busting you're balls to get from 7th to 1st that is a race.

[QUOTE="Ozzie234"]

And you have played GT5p AND Forza2??? I doubt it, because then you would KNOW GT5 (at present state) is a *joke* simulation wise compared to (all aids off) Forza2.... and whatever complaint you would have on Forza2, it has to come tenfolded for GT5. Forza2 has better ai where the opponents fight back, and changes his race line when needed to fight his place. Also the opponent adapt to your agresiveness, so if you bump or ram a car off its race line, they will do the same to you!! It has *much* better physics (car setups really do make a difference), and realistic damage. Add to that more customizable cars. GT5 is a "simulation" for kids, where you can miss a breaking point by 50 yards and still by "magic" breaks handle the corner, whereas in Forza2 such a move will have you go STRAIGHT OFF while turning, just like a *real* car would behave. Face it, GT5 is eye candy.

rhyumavampire

What are you basing this CRAP off of? Nothing but your opinion, fanboy. Forza has DIFFERENT A.I...not better. Whether it is better or not is your opinion. Like I said in my previous post, Gran Turismo is not meant to have aggressive A.I. because most real life races aren't like that. To say that Forza has better physics is ignorant and idiotic. It is a FACT, that Gran Turismo has the most realistic physics. They've done studies using GT cars vs. real life cars. Look it up. As far as customization goes, the only thing Forza does better in this department is purely cosmetic, which IMO, leans it more toward kids, who probably care more about how their vehicle looks than anything else. Real racers aren't entirely consumed with the LOOK of their vehicle.

I don't know what version of Gran Turismo you THINK you've played but, if you miss a breaking point by 50 yards, you're not going to handle the corner, you're going to go off the road or into a wall. As far as it being for kids? Please. Most kids wouldn't have any idea how to properly customize their cars. (and by customize I mean actually customize, not add neat paints and rims)

I won't argue the fact that GT5 is eye candy, because it DOES look insanely better than Forza. However, every other aspect of it is also better as well so, it's kick ass graphics are merely a bonus.

Some gamers just aren't cut out to handle Gran Turismo's realism. They don't understand that this isn't a game where you can do 300 MPH through cities and wreck your car into a million bits and fly around corners and etc. REAL car manufacturers don't enjoy seeing their products wrecked to bits. Why do you need car damage so bad? If you're driving how you're supposed to, realistically, you should rarely crash or run into anything. Gran Turismo is, ONCE AGAIN, a driving simulator. To any dumbass that says "you keep calling it a driving sim but you race against other cars!", of course you do. What fun would the game be just driving around an empty track on your own?

wow it's so obvious you're the fanboy here(in fact i dont think youve even played forza). I've played Gran turismo since before it was released in america, and unfortunately forza2 beats GT in every aspect, except maybe graphics to a degree. You can drop in different engines in forza, eg. put an S2000 engine into a Del sol crx(making it into a rear wheel drive car), and causing all customization options to completely change.

[QUOTE="rhyumavampire"][QUOTE="Ozzie234"]

And you have played GT5p AND Forza2??? I doubt it, because then you would KNOW GT5 (at present state) is a *joke* simulation wise compared to (all aids off) Forza2.... and whatever complaint you would have on Forza2, it has to come tenfolded for GT5. Forza2 has better ai where the opponents fight back, and changes his race line when needed to fight his place. Also the opponent adapt to your agresiveness, so if you bump or ram a car off its race line, they will do the same to you!! It has *much* better physics (car setups really do make a difference), and realistic damage. Add to that more customizable cars. GT5 is a "simulation" for kids, where you can miss a breaking point by 50 yards and still by "magic" breaks handle the corner, whereas in Forza2 such a move will have you go STRAIGHT OFF while turning, just like a *real* car would behave. Face it, GT5 is eye candy.

neovalkyr

What are you basing this CRAP off of? Nothing but your opinion, fanboy. Forza has DIFFERENT A.I...not better. Whether it is better or not is your opinion. Like I said in my previous post, Gran Turismo is not meant to have aggressive A.I. because most real life races aren't like that. To say that Forza has better physics is ignorant and idiotic. It is a FACT, that Gran Turismo has the most realistic physics. They've done studies using GT cars vs. real life cars. Look it up. As far as customization goes, the only thing Forza does better in this department is purely cosmetic, which IMO, leans it more toward kids, who probably care more about how their vehicle looks than anything else. Real racers aren't entirely consumed with the LOOK of their vehicle.

I don't know what version of Gran Turismo you THINK you've played but, if you miss a breaking point by 50 yards, you're not going to handle the corner, you're going to go off the road or into a wall. As far as it being for kids? Please. Most kids wouldn't have any idea how to properly customize their cars. (and by customize I mean actually customize, not add neat paints and rims)

I won't argue the fact that GT5 is eye candy, because it DOES look insanely better than Forza. However, every other aspect of it is also better as well so, it's kick ass graphics are merely a bonus.

Some gamers just aren't cut out to handle Gran Turismo's realism. They don't understand that this isn't a game where you can do 300 MPH through cities and wreck your car into a million bits and fly around corners and etc. REAL car manufacturers don't enjoy seeing their products wrecked to bits. Why do you need car damage so bad? If you're driving how you're supposed to, realistically, you should rarely crash or run into anything. Gran Turismo is, ONCE AGAIN, a driving simulator. To any dumbass that says "you keep calling it a driving sim but you race against other cars!", of course you do. What fun would the game be just driving around an empty track on your own?

wow it's so obvious you're the fanboy here. I've played Gran turismo since before it was released in america, and unfortunately forza2 beats GT in every aspect, except maybe graphics to a degree. You can drop in different engines in forza, eg. put an S2000 engine into a Del sol crx, and then all customization options complete change.

i think that you are some fanboy of forza...if you think that forza beats gt in every aspect....360 fans will never admit gt is better than forza even though they know it...and they know ps3 is better but will never admit that....

do you own both games? I own GT , GT2 , GT3 , two prologues. GT4. and forza2.

i think that you are some fanboy of forza...if you think that forza beats gt in every aspect....360 fans will never admit gt is better than forza even though they know it...and they know ps3 is better but will never admit that....

neovalkyr

do you own both games?

i think that you are some fanboy of forza...if you think that forza beats gt in every aspect....360 fans will never admit gt is better than forza even though they know it...and they know ps3 is better but will never admit that....

neovalkyr

do you own both games? I own GT , GT2 , GT3 , two prologues. GT4. and forza2.

[QUOTE="neovalkyr"]

i think that you are some fanboy of forza...if you think that forza beats gt in every aspect....360 fans will never admit gt is better than forza even though they know it...and they know ps3 is better but will never admit that....

planbfreak4eva

do you own both games?

so your opinion doesnt matter. And i cant be an xbox fanboy if i prefer my ps3. All im saying is that GT basically invented the simulation car genre, so from the creator's point of view they feel they dont need to make any drastic changes. Theres so much room for improvement in GT but everyones so satisfied with less, that theres no point in making those changes. I feel this really just comes down to american developers vs japanese developers. American developers strive to push the envelope, while japanese developers basically like to stick to the tried and true.

[QUOTE="neovalkyr"][QUOTE="rhyumavampire"][QUOTE="Ozzie234"]

And you have played GT5p AND Forza2??? I doubt it, because then you would KNOW GT5 (at present state) is a *joke* simulation wise compared to (all aids off) Forza2.... and whatever complaint you would have on Forza2, it has to come tenfolded for GT5. Forza2 has better ai where the opponents fight back, and changes his race line when needed to fight his place. Also the opponent adapt to your agresiveness, so if you bump or ram a car off its race line, they will do the same to you!! It has *much* better physics (car setups really do make a difference), and realistic damage. Add to that more customizable cars. GT5 is a "simulation" for kids, where you can miss a breaking point by 50 yards and still by "magic" breaks handle the corner, whereas in Forza2 such a move will have you go STRAIGHT OFF while turning, just like a *real* car would behave. Face it, GT5 is eye candy.

planbfreak4eva

What are you basing this CRAP off of? Nothing but your opinion, fanboy. Forza has DIFFERENT A.I...not better. Whether it is better or not is your opinion. Like I said in my previous post, Gran Turismo is not meant to have aggressive A.I. because most real life races aren't like that. To say that Forza has better physics is ignorant and idiotic. It is a FACT, that Gran Turismo has the most realistic physics. They've done studies using GT cars vs. real life cars. Look it up. As far as customization goes, the only thing Forza does better in this department is purely cosmetic, which IMO, leans it more toward kids, who probably care more about how their vehicle looks than anything else. Real racers aren't entirely consumed with the LOOK of their vehicle.

I don't know what version of Gran Turismo you THINK you've played but, if you miss a breaking point by 50 yards, you're not going to handle the corner, you're going to go off the road or into a wall. As far as it being for kids? Please. Most kids wouldn't have any idea how to properly customize their cars. (and by customize I mean actually customize, not add neat paints and rims)

I won't argue the fact that GT5 is eye candy, because it DOES look insanely better than Forza. However, every other aspect of it is also better as well so, it's kick ass graphics are merely a bonus.

Some gamers just aren't cut out to handle Gran Turismo's realism. They don't understand that this isn't a game where you can do 300 MPH through cities and wreck your car into a million bits and fly around corners and etc. REAL car manufacturers don't enjoy seeing their products wrecked to bits. Why do you need car damage so bad? If you're driving how you're supposed to, realistically, you should rarely crash or run into anything. Gran Turismo is, ONCE AGAIN, a driving simulator. To any dumbass that says "you keep calling it a driving sim but you race against other cars!", of course you do. What fun would the game be just driving around an empty track on your own?

wow it's so obvious you're the fanboy here. I've played Gran turismo since before it was released in america, and unfortunately forza2 beats GT in every aspect, except maybe graphics to a degree. You can drop in different engines in forza, eg. put an S2000 engine into a Del sol crx, and then all customization options complete change.

Personally, I think Forza 2 is the best racing game I've played yet. I didn't care for GT4, though I'd say it probably had the best car selection I've ever played in a game. I thought Forza 2 was phenomenal, and I think that people who don't are blinded by corporate loyalty. I'll say unequivocally that the PS3 is a better console than the 360 from a hardware standpoint, but I liked Forza 2 better than any GT game I've played yet. I'm hoping GT5 will change that, but we'll see.

i think u cant call yourself a fan if u dont like it? thats like saying "i am a xbox360 fanboy but i love to criticise it" what you should be saying is "I CANT WAIT UNTIL GT5P COMES OUT SO I CAN PLAY IT FOR 4HOURS STRAIGHT! oh yeah the AI isnt that amazing compared to other games BUT WHO GIVES A DOGS BUM, I LOVE CARS TO THE DEATH!!!!!!"

and by the way you should burn in hell until u find ur way to Egypt which will be just as bad

and please spell bumper correctly

I'm done with this topic. It's useless writing a detailed, thought out, legible argument, when everybody replies with a few sentences that don't further prove or argue anything. I don't need to lie about games I've played to get my point across.

You played Gran Turismo before it came to America? I call BS. And besides, even if you had played GT before it came out in America, what does the time in which you played the game have to do with this argument? When I first bought my Playstation 1, Gran Turismo was the game that came bundled with it. It was my first PSX game. Does that have anything to do with what we're discussing? Not really.

Just because I enjoy the Gran Turismo series doesn't make me a fanboy, it means that I know a quality product when I see it. Many would agree with me. I've played the Ridge Racer series, the Need for Speed series, the Midnight Club series, the Burnout series, the Forza series, etc. I'm sorry but they've all failed to impress me when compared to Gran Turismo.

Gran Turismo 5 will come out on top. Mark my words. Quote me and put it in your signature until it comes out for all I care. If I'm wrong, I'll admit to it and apologize.

Having faith in a game series I enjoy =/= FANBOYISM

Half the people on this board need to grow up.

I dont think its just GT5p. I have forza 2 and quite often on narrow tracks I will be carefully overtaking and they will randomly bump into me. causing me to spin out badly. They almost seem to do it on purpose!

Even so, who cares, if you are behind the racer and try to overtake, its your fault if there is a collision. the other racer is only trying to get the best racing line. if you are behind you can see him , the other racer cannot see you very well.

I dont think its just GT5p. I have forza 2 and quite often on narrow tracks I will be carefully overtaking and they will randomly bump into me. causing me to spin out badly. They almost seem to do it on purpose!

Even so, who cares, if you are behind the racer and try to overtake, its your fault if there is a collision. the other racer is only trying to get the best racing line. if you are behind you can see him , the other racer cannot see you very well.

NinjaMunkey01

Yea if your behind. You have to keep that in mind also. And chances are, if you stick your nose in. But you dont get it within view. You gonna get rubbed some. Thats why in real racing you see so many try and try lap after lap. And back off. Because their not gonna stick their nose in if they cant get fully by. Thus they back down, and try again the next lap. Its not like Motocross where you can block pass. Yet in the video games you can get away with block passing, almost like motocross. I do admit with both games thow. I dont like the fact that if you get a front wheel in front of their view. And they still push in on you.