Why is everyone against UBI soft and DRM.....

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crozon

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#1 crozon
Member since 2003 • 1180 Posts

When they decided to release prince of persia and call of jaurez drm free to see if more people bought the game. guess noone did which is why we have this always online drm. can anyone prove here that these games sold as well as their console counterparts.

You can't attack a company for trying to protect their property. If you don't like it don't buy it. And don't say that these hack/crack groups are heroes. They are really the cause of all the problems we have with drm. they are the cause of it.

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Ondoval

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#2 Ondoval
Member since 2005 • 3103 Posts

I'm not against, but the last Ubisoft game that I bought was Far Cry in 2004. And I'm not talking about piracy, all my games are legit. I understand the Ubisoft reasons, but I don't blame nor support their system because currently I'm not interested in their games. This could change in the future.

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painguy1

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#3 painguy1
Member since 2007 • 8686 Posts

Im fine with DRM, BUT it has to be reasonable. This new system Ubi has set-up is treating the consumers like pirates.

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Legendaryscmt

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#4 Legendaryscmt
Member since 2005 • 12532 Posts

Im fine with DRM, BUT it has to be reasonable. This new system Ubi has set-up is treating the consumers like pirates.

painguy1

Same here. With what Ubi has done with their new DRM, there are a lot of people out there that still have poor internet speeds and some that don't have it at all. Also take into consideration the server issues Ubi had that made it impossible for people to play the legit version of ACII. It makes me wonder why Ubi would release such a restricting DRM when it's basically common knowledge that the DRM will be cracked by the time the game comes out.

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topsemag55

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#5 topsemag55
Member since 2007 • 19063 Posts

The old system of buying the game, installing it, then entering a License Code for ownership works fine.

You needn't punish your legitimate users, the loyal customers who generally will buy nearly every game a favored publisher makes.

Bioware and EA release new games without harsh DRM, so can Ubisoft.

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crozon

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#6 crozon
Member since 2003 • 1180 Posts

Im fine with DRM, BUT it has to be reasonable. This new system Ubi has set-up is treating the consumers like pirates.

painguy1
Maybe i am one of those lucky people and haven't had any problems. playing it at a hotel with not the best internet around and haven't had a problem. plus i really like the save online feature. really useful for me since i play the game on a laptop and desktop.
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Swiftstrike5

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#7 Swiftstrike5
Member since 2005 • 6950 Posts
You can't attack a company for trying to protect their property.crozon
I can, and will, criticize a company that treats their paying customers like dirt.
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07pops07

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#8 07pops07
Member since 2008 • 552 Posts

[QUOTE="painguy1"]

Im fine with DRM, BUT it has to be reasonable. This new system Ubi has set-up is treating the consumers like pirates.

Legendaryscmt

Same here. With what Ubi has done with their new DRM, there are a lot of people out there that still have poor internet speeds and some that don't have it at all. Also take into consideration the server issues Ubi had that made it impossible for people to play the legit version of ACII. It makes me wonder why Ubi would release such a restricting DRM when it's basically common knowledge that the DRM will be cracked by the time the game comes out.

i understand that "some" people have legit problems that prevent DRM from working with them. but a larg majority of people just whine about it being there when it doesnt even effect them at all.

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crozon

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#9 crozon
Member since 2003 • 1180 Posts
and i much prefer this to the limited activation method. fact is this is likely to be the way a lot of games are designed with. remember everyone complaining about steam when it came out. now its accepted even loved. if they add more reasons and features to backup this always online feature then it might be accepted too.
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crozon

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#10 crozon
Member since 2003 • 1180 Posts

[QUOTE="crozon"]You can't attack a company for trying to protect their property.Swiftstrike5
I can, and will, criticize a company that treats their paying customers like dirt.

no thats companies taking the p"£s with dlc like bioshock 2. charging for content that is already on the disk is really treating their customer like dirt,

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-wildflower-

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#11 -wildflower-
Member since 2003 • 2997 Posts

DRM is pointless. Every new scheme will get cracked eventually so the only people being hurt by these ridiculous obstacles are the ones who are actually buying the games. Way to treat your customers like criminals Ubisoft!

Sorry, but Ubisoft can go bankrupt for all I care. I certainly won't be buying any of the games they publish, not that I ever really did. For the most part Ubisoft's games are usually nothing more that half-witted console ports so, in all honestly, it's not that big of a loss to PC gaming.

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SpaceMoose

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#12 SpaceMoose
Member since 2004 • 10789 Posts
Well, for starters, when I buy single player games generally DDoS attacks are not something I need to concern myself with. For starters.
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madrocketeer

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#13 madrocketeer
Member since 2005 • 10591 Posts
Well, Ubisoft is obviously testing the limits of gamers' tolerance to DRM, and this is the natural and perfectly predictable backlash. Convention of what is generally acceptable plays a very important part - not since Lost Planet had anyone tried to put a non-negotiable online requirement on a single player game. Attempts to change the status quo and test the boundaries of commonly accepted norms is bound to meet resistance. For the best analogy for this, think of Ubisoft's DRM as a leash - that's effectively what it is, anyway; a virtual leash Ubisoft put on gamers so they won't be out of Ubisoft's sight. "You want to play this game, wear this leash first', says Ubisoft. Many PC gamers used to at the very least feel like they can roam free, but now they're being asked to strap belts around their necks as requirement to playing Ubisoft games. How do you think such gamers would react? Woof woof.
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SpaceMoose

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#14 SpaceMoose
Member since 2004 • 10789 Posts
...Woof woof.madrocketeer
This made me chuckle. :P
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chandu83

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#15 chandu83
Member since 2005 • 4864 Posts
[QUOTE="crozon"]You can't attack a company for trying to protect their property.Swiftstrike5
I can, and will, criticize a company that treats their paying customers like dirt.

Have to ask you this, are you a paying customer?
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dbaron26

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#16 dbaron26
Member since 2009 • 158 Posts

[QUOTE="Swiftstrike5"][QUOTE="crozon"]You can't attack a company for trying to protect their property.chandu83
I can, and will, criticize a company that treats their paying customers like dirt.

Have to ask you this, are you a paying customer?

I was. Couple Silent Hunter, Settlers, PoP, Tom Claney, Heroes Might Magic, few others.

Will be passing on Settlers and any Anno(Dawn of Discovery) exp that requires internet. Also passing on C&C4 btw. Wont be pirating them just flat out ignoring them.

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BlackAlpha666

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#17 BlackAlpha666
Member since 2005 • 2614 Posts

When they decided to release prince of persia and call of jaurez drm free to see if more people bought the game. guess noone did which is why we have this always online drm. can anyone prove here that these games sold as well as their console counterparts.

You can't attack a company for trying to protect their property. If you don't like it don't buy it. And don't say that these hack/crack groups are heroes. They are really the cause of all the problems we have with drm. they are the cause of it.

crozon

Why do you think those games didn't sell well? I don't mean to sound offensive but do you got any proof or are you just making assumptions?And even if they really didn't sell well, it probably has more to do with the games' popularity instead of piracy. Prince of Persia is not a very popular game on the PC and neither is Call of Juarez.

To answer your original question of why everyone is against Ubisoft's DRM. Why shouldn't we be against it? It forces you to be online all the time, so that means you won't be able to play when your connection or their servers screw up. So, that's a big con and what pro do we get in return? You can store your save games on their servers. Well, that's a nice feature but not a pro of the DRM. They could give us that feature without the DRM. So what this means is that the DRM has only cons and no pros. OK, so this is kind of obvious because that's what DRM does, it restricts you, so that you can't do anything the publisher doesn't want you to do.

But why should you put up with this? It's not like they have to implement this type of "protection" against piracy. They can implement other kinds of protection systems where you aren't being put on a leash. The "features" of a protection system (like, forcing people to be online non-stop) are irrelevent when determining how secure the protection system is. It's about how it's programmed that determines how secure a protection system is. Besides, they can change the programming a thousand times or even add more DRM features but such things will always be cracked by pirates. You can argue that the couple of weeks or months during which the pirates are being delayed is enough for the publisher to make enough extra money but at the end it's always the legitimate customer that gets hurt with such DRM systems. (fyi, DRM is mostly aimed towards second hand sales, the legal copies, publisher lose a lot of money that way)

If you aren't happy with the practices of a publisher or game developer, you can make him know how you feel about it by writing a (respectful) e-mail and posting a (respectful) message on their forums to let them know how their DRM is an inconveniance that "forces" you not to buy their game. And most importantly, don't buy their game, obviously. They don't care about you as an individual but if many people let the publisher know how they feel about this, then they will be forced to listen because it means they will lose many sales and they don't want that (and publishers other then Ubisoft don't want bad PR either).

It could be just coincidence but look at Mass Effect 1 and 2. Notice how the second one lacks the DRM that the first one had. I have a feeling it might have something to do with the thousands of angry people who complained. We complained and EA listened.

Finally, let me tell you that for some people this is about two more things. First of all, it's about principle, we like to actually own the games we buy and we don't want to rely on the publisher to be able to play, nor do we want the publisher to have a "kill-switch" that they can use to disable your game in the future ("sorry, you'll have to buy the sequal if you want to keep on playing", this already happens with some console games). And second, we don't want DRM systems to dominate the future. What if all games will use DRM and DRM becomes much worse? We oppose DRM now, so that we can play without fuss later.

In a nutshell: It's pointless against piracy because it always gets cracked. It only causes inconveniances. It could become much worse in the future.

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osan0

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#18 osan0
Member since 2004 • 17878 Posts
here is the fundimental flaw. even as a paying customer..i may as well use a cracked copy. better experience. im better off having a crsacked copy downl.oading while i pop out to the shops to buy the game. so yeah....ubi can shove it and all its other games until this fiasco is brought to an end. iwont pirate them of course (thats not going to help anything)....im just not buying any ubi games on any platform until this stops.
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Dante2710

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#19 Dante2710
Member since 2005 • 63164 Posts
There are some DRM that are actually tolerable and there are some that are beyond ridiculous. Take it for example, someone who`s online isnt very stable or someone who doesnt have their internet on 24/7. This isnt a single player experience anymore when you are FORCED to be online when you are playing the game. I understand developers want to protect their product but treating your customer like criminals and forcing this kind protecting is insane. Thanks to their new DRM i wont be buying Conviction. I know, i know, they lose one customer, big whoop, but at least i know what ill have to deal with if i actually buy the game. Now what happens to those who buy the game, and have no idea what the game has in store for them? Thats right, they are royally screwed.
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Swiftstrike5

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#20 Swiftstrike5
Member since 2005 • 6950 Posts
[QUOTE="Swiftstrike5"][QUOTE="crozon"]You can't attack a company for trying to protect their property.chandu83
I can, and will, criticize a company that treats their paying customers like dirt.

Have to ask you this, are you a paying customer?

I haven't purchased/played a ubisoft game since the last Prince of Persia. After playing splinter cell: double agent and prince of persia, I just gave up on ubisoft. They'd have to pay me to play their crappy games.
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albi321

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#21 albi321
Member since 2007 • 1552 Posts
I'm sure ubisoft knows that the game will eventually be cracked. The point of this DRM is to stall the crackers enough for the game to sell more copies, as the majority of a game's sales usually come in the first few weeks of release. Now its their product, and they clearly stated their terms you need to follow if you want to play it. If you don't like it, dont buy it, don't DDoS their servers like some "smart" individuals. I definitely don't like this DRM, so I'm not buying the game, but I don't blame Ubisoft, we saw how greatly assassins creed one sold, compared to how many copies were pirated. The pirates are the only ones to blame.
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KalDurenik

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#22 KalDurenik
Member since 2004 • 3736 Posts

How many games do people here that DONT pirate buy a year? I know a person that download stuff (games/movies and so on) for around... 20 000- 30 000$ a year. He buy things he enjoy (I KNOW!! HOLY CRAP A PIRATE THAT BUY STUFF!! THE WORLD IS ENDING!!) anyway do people here think that if piracy would go away that he would suddenly go like NOES... Now im going to buy ALL of the games and ALL of the movies... Not a chance he said he would most likely end up buying LESS games because as everyone know that a dev team can say and do anything and the customer cant do anything about it.

Oh well pirates (or most of them) dont care if it take 1 day or a year for a crack to get released. They will just *GASP* move to other games / movies to pirate while they wait!

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ekultus

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#23 ekultus
Member since 2010 • 1013 Posts

the real issue is this doesnt stop piracy or deter nerd rippers so basically it screws the consumer. so whats the point?

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crozon

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#24 crozon
Member since 2003 • 1180 Posts

the real issue is this doesnt stop piracy or deter nerd rippers so basically it screws the consumer. so whats the point?

ekultus
The thing with this drm is that it hasn't be cracked. Was on a forum (the naughty kind) where people were asking for a working crack and the response for that was buy the game. Be interesting to see if ass creed 2 has outsold ass creed 1.
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skrat_01

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#25 skrat_01
Member since 2007 • 33767 Posts
Because the DRM is absolutely horrible, and Ubisoft blatantly lied about it during the server downtime. Its no wonder there is overwhelmingly negative attitudes towards it.
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skrat_01

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#26 skrat_01
Member since 2007 • 33767 Posts
The thing with this drm is that it hasn't be cracked. Was on a forum (the naughty kind) where people were asking for a working crack and the response for that was buy the game. Be interesting to see if ass creed 2 has outsold ass creed 1. crozon
Which has improved the games sales, even though the DRM deters potential customers like myself? It is a short term solution to stopping pirates playing through the game. It doesn't stop people from downloading the game illegally (as we know AC2 was downloaded in droves), and there is nothing to indicate that it appeals to consumers to increase sales (of course again, as we know this DRM is an interference).
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1carus

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#27 1carus
Member since 2004 • 1454 Posts

These threads are absolutely horrible. If you don't know what you're talking about, don't make the thread. If I don't like the DRM, don't buy the game? What kind of logic is that? Considering every game is now geared up with some form of DRM, I guess I have to completely pull out of the gaming scene then?

The point is, DRM does not help anyone. It just pisses off the paying customer. The pirates get away with piracy no matter what. And what's this with "Oh, Prince of Persia didn't have any DRM, and it didn't sell well - so it's the consumers faults." What the hell? Maybe the companies should make some decent games and we'll buy them on that merit. Now consumers have to buy every game that doesn't have DRM on it just to fight this war? Just, absolutely, get out of here. Ridiculous. Absolutely ridiculous.

This is how it is. Companies make **** games, and then justify ****ty sales with piracy. They then introduce their awful DRM, screw over the consumers and make cheap dollars off their paying customers. Pirates are still getting away with piracy. And it drags the whole system - the whole industry down. Companies aren't learning that their games suck, so we're getting suckier games, and we're also getting horrible security to go along with it. At this rate, I'm not going to buy another game again (that's not me hinting at piracy - I'm implying I'm going to completely pull out of gaming).

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dakan45

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#28 dakan45
Member since 2009 • 18819 Posts
The reason everyone is against the drm is because we dont want play games that from now on will ask us to be constant connected with the often possibility of something being wrong on their end. Lets ignore the problems that people experiance now and lets focus in a few years from now when someone will decide to randomly play the game. Bang, ruined product that only makes people to leave pc for he console version. As for the games you posted...you are aware that neither of those games sold well on consoles and neither of those games are what you call "favored" by pc gamers. Their both cheap console ports.
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redsoull

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#29 redsoull
Member since 2008 • 252 Posts

building in some heavy drm **** is a cheap way to so called get your game less pirated...

what a bull .. The only thing a game company needs to do is build in a good multiplayer option.

and release good updates and DLC once in a while, make it a challenging game and ppl will absolutly buy it.

For me personal Ubisoft is a no go. ppl who pirate conviction wil have it easier to play then ppl who buy the game legally.

they dont seem to understant that the more **** a game is the more it gets downloaded, games who arent worth anything more then a week's rent.

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_Pedro_

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#30 _Pedro_
Member since 2004 • 6829 Posts

These threads are absolutely horrible. If you don't know what you're talking about, don't make the thread. If I don't like the DRM, don't buy the game? What kind of logic is that? Considering every game is now geared up with some form of DRM, I guess I have to completely pull out of the gaming scene then?

The point is, DRM does not help anyone. It just pisses off the paying customer. The pirates get away with piracy no matter what. And what's this with "Oh, Prince of Persia didn't have any DRM, and it didn't sell well - so it's the consumers faults." What the hell? Maybe the companies should make some decent games and we'll buy them on that merit. Now consumers have to buy every game that doesn't have DRM on it just to fight this war? Just, absolutely, get out of here. Ridiculous. Absolutely ridiculous.

This is how it is. Companies make **** games, and then justify ****ty sales with piracy. They then introduce their awful DRM, screw over the consumers and make cheap dollars off their paying customers. Pirates are still getting away with piracy. And it drags the whole system - the whole industry down. Companies aren't learning that their games suck, so we're getting suckier games, and we're also getting horrible security to go along with it. At this rate, I'm not going to buy another game again (that's not me hinting at piracy - I'm implying I'm going to completely pull out of gaming).

1carus
Great post!
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pdkkbarnes1

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#31 pdkkbarnes1
Member since 2003 • 391 Posts

I don't mind an initial online activation, but I play many of my games on a laptop where internet isn't available. I'll be forced to use a crack if I want to play these games. I'm not against drm in general, i'm just against ones that go too far.

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PublicNuisance

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#32 PublicNuisance
Member since 2009 • 4582 Posts

When they decided to release prince of persia and call of jaurez drm free to see if more people bought the game. guess noone did which is why we have this always online drm. can anyone prove here that these games sold as well as their console counterparts.

You can't attack a company for trying to protect their property. If you don't like it don't buy it. And don't say that these hack/crack groups are heroes. They are really the cause of all the problems we have with drm. they are the cause of it.

crozon

You guess ? Show me sales data for those two games or don't use it as ammo. I don't mean that biased crap from NDP either. I want data that shwos DD sales as well as retail. Worldwide not just NA. Guess what, I bought COJ and was happy with it. I refuse to buy any game with their POS DRM.