I can't tell the difference between 60 and 144hz, even with my FPS in the hundreds. Am I crazy?

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Zuon

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#1 Zuon
Member since 2008 • 490 Posts

When it comes to video games, details and performance, I can normally see things most others can't, especially in terms of framerate. Yesterday, I've upgraded from a 60hz IPS monitor to a 144hz TN panel, but the box only came with a Single Link DVI-D cable, which only supports 60hz. Even with only 60hz, I could immediately tell the difference in my new 1ms response time. After a day of using it like this, I came across a dual link DVI cable instead. I swapped the cords, set my refresh rate and... I don't notice anything different. I even launched a few games (DOOM 2016, Dishonored 2, Hitman 2016), and even when the framerate is exceeding 100FPS with Vsync OFF and no frame limit applied, I cannot notice a difference between the look OR feel of my gameplay, compared to my 60hz experience with the monitor a day prior. Is this normal? I'm not crazy, am I?

My monitor is a 3D Acer GN246HL Bbid 24 inch 1080p display.

My mouse is a cheap Letton S1 gaming mouse, and my soon-to-be-replaced keyboard, is still, at the moment, a standard membrane keyboard.

The rest of my specs shouldn't matter in this instance, as my performance is perfectly fine. It's my perception that I'm having problems with.

What are your experiences with switching to 144hz, if I may ask?

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KHAndAnime

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#2 KHAndAnime
Member since 2009 • 17565 Posts

Sounds like something isn't working on your end.

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JigglyWiggly_

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#3  Edited By JigglyWiggly_
Member since 2009 • 24625 Posts

Should instantly be noticeable moving your mouse and windows on the desktop.

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FelipeInside

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#4 FelipeInside
Member since 2003 • 28548 Posts

@Zuon said:

When it comes to video games, details and performance, I can normally see things most others can't, especially in terms of framerate. Yesterday, I've upgraded from a 60hz IPS monitor to a 144hz TN panel, but the box only came with a Single Link DVI-D cable, which only supports 60hz. Even with only 60hz, I could immediately tell the difference in my new 1ms response time. After a day of using it like this, I came across a dual link DVI cable instead. I swapped the cords, set my refresh rate and... I don't notice anything different. I even launched a few games (DOOM 2016, Dishonored 2, Hitman 2016), and even when the framerate is exceeding 100FPS with Vsync OFF and no frame limit applied, I cannot notice a difference between the look OR feel of my gameplay, compared to my 60hz experience with the monitor a day prior. Is this normal? I'm not crazy, am I?

My monitor is a 3D Acer GN246HL Bbid 24 inch 1080p display.

My mouse is a cheap Letton S1 gaming mouse, and my soon-to-be-replaced keyboard, is still, at the moment, a standard membrane keyboard.

The rest of my specs shouldn't matter in this instance, as my performance is perfectly fine. It's my perception that I'm having problems with.

What are your experiences with switching to 144hz, if I may ask?

So you're certain you changed the Refresh Rate in Windows? (not in-game).

Also, when you go to the game settings, does it show 144hz as Refresh?

Some people don't notice it but there's a big difference between 60 and 144.

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Zuon

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#5 Zuon
Member since 2008 • 490 Posts

@FelipeInside: I notice it on the desktop moving the mouse around, but I do not notice it in game, even when the in game settings are set to 144hz and borderless window. And yes, I'm sure the monitor's set correctly. I know how to navigate Windows. XD

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FelipeInside

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#6  Edited By FelipeInside
Member since 2003 • 28548 Posts

@Zuon said:

@FelipeInside: I notice it on the desktop moving the mouse around, but I do not notice it in game, even when the in game settings are set to 144hz and borderless window. And yes, I'm sure the monitor's set correctly. I know how to navigate Windows. XD

"borderless window"

Have you tried Dedicated Full Screen Mode?

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Zuon

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#7  Edited By Zuon
Member since 2008 • 490 Posts

@FelipeInside: I have not, but if Windows is set to 144hz, why wouldn't the game be? I guess I'll try it out right now.

Edit: Just tried DOOM again. I thought I was seeing a difference with exclusive fullscreen mode, but after switching back and forth, it seems I simply wasn't seeing it the first time I tested it. Now, I can definitely see how smooth DOOM is at 144hz, but still my other games look no different to me. My eyes are weird, or my brain's confused or something.

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appariti0n

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#8 appariti0n
Member since 2009 • 4387 Posts

Not crazy at all! I also game on 144hz, and can only visually notice the difference on some games. I can notice a pretty big tactile difference on pretty much any 3rd person/first person games though.

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appariti0n

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#9  Edited By appariti0n
Member since 2009 • 4387 Posts

Oh, and I found this:

http://www.pcgamer.com/how-many-frames-per-second-can-the-human-eye-really-see/

The important take-away from this article is that what you see, is merely what your brain can process of the flood of information coming in from your eyes.

Jumping from 60hz to 144hz is now more than DOUBLE the amount of motion data your brain was accustomed to processing before, so it takes some time to rewire itself.

So it's no surprise that you can now see the difference after some time with the faster refresh rate.

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mrbojangles25

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#10 mrbojangles25
Member since 2005 • 52057 Posts

no you're crazy. Going from 60 to 144 hz was probably one of the more significant upgrades I've done in many, many years. I don't know why I didn't do it sooner, tbh.

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BassMan

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#11  Edited By BassMan  Online
Member since 2002 • 14512 Posts

Huge difference in smoothness and input lag between 60fps and 144fps. Very easy for me to notice.

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Tuzolord

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#12 Tuzolord
Member since 2007 • 1409 Posts

You should notice it instantly on fast paced games. In rocket league for example you can see how the ball rolls a lot smoother on 144 instead of 60 hz.

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_SKatEDiRt_

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#13 _SKatEDiRt_
Member since 2007 • 3117 Posts

if you cant tell just switch back to your old monitor and save yourself some money.

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skipper847

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#14 skipper847
Member since 2006 • 7334 Posts

Did you click apply. lol

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joseph_mach

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#15 joseph_mach
Member since 2003 • 3898 Posts

While going to 144hz (165 OC'd) was a noticeable difference to my eyes, it wasn't anything "groundbreaking" imho. Things just run smoother overall. It was much the same with the jump from 1920x1080 to 2560x1440. Nice, but not a quantum leap by any means. 4k on the other hand really jumped out at me and that's where I can see a difference. Still, you should be able to see a bit of difference in gaming. Especially in any type of game that involves fast direction changes like the obligatory FPS game, or even racing games. Things should stay crystal clear. My personal opinion on the the "coolest" monitor technology right now is ultrawide. I've got my eye on an Acer Predator X34. 3440x1440, 100hz, G-Sync, a pretty nice "sweet spot" in my book for resolution, fps, and adaptive sync tech.

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Yams1980

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#16 Yams1980
Member since 2006 • 3874 Posts

i only have a 60hz monitor and some games like fps are much better completely unlocked.

Most recent example was just yesterday i was playing Call of Duty 2, its fps max out at 200 fps. I decided to force cap the fps down to around 100 to save a bit of power, and noticed stutter, then down to 60 with vsync and still stutter. So i kept it unlocked to 200fps, just for the smoother gameplay.

So a faster game like a shooter you should notice it for sure, especially with your screen natively running 144hz, probably won't notice it as much with a game without much movement like Civilization.

If your monitors not letting you run it at 144hz with a dvi cable you should try to use a DisplayPort cable, they are superior in bandwidth and frequency range.

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KHAndAnime

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#17  Edited By KHAndAnime
Member since 2009 • 17565 Posts

I'll just put this here btw (dispels myth that >60Hz is necessary or significantly helpful for competitive gaming).

Loading Video...

Motion handling and clarity is basically just another aspect of IQ. Some people like 4k, some people like motion fluidity, but I'm always used to hearing elitism saying "oh I'm a gamer so I *need* 120hz/144hz/g-sync/etc.". People who say this sort of stuff are either just shills or they just want to be part of a "group" (the "I'm special because I like high refresh rate" group).

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#18  Edited By BassMan  Online
Member since 2002 • 14512 Posts

@KHAndAnime: 144hz is objectively better. Sure, you can still be amazing at 60hz, but that does not mean that the higher refresh rate does not help. I can buy the best sports equipment in the world, but that does not make me a great athlete. However, if I was already great, then that high end equipment takes me to another level. Same thing goes for gaming hardware.

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KHAndAnime

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#19  Edited By KHAndAnime
Member since 2009 • 17565 Posts

@BassMan said:

@KHAndAnime: 144hz is objectively better. Sure, you can still be amazing at 60hz, but that does not mean that the higher refresh rate does not help. I can buy the best sports equipment in the world, but that does not make me a great athlete. However, if I was already great, then that high end equipment takes me to another level. Same thing goes for gaming hardware.

I never said 144Hz isn't better. I just said it doesn't make you a better gamer.

Sure, you can still be amazing at 60hz, but that does not mean that the higher refresh rate does not help.

It doesn't. The video demonstrates that. If you think you're playing significantly better just because 144Hz, welcome to the magic of placebo.

However, if I was already great, then that high end equipment takes me to another level. Same thing goes for gaming hardware.

Did you even watch what I linked? This dude can lap circles around you in Quake 3 and he disagrees with what you just said. He said 144Hz looks nice because of the motion fluidity. That's it. Didn't improve his ability at all under testing. Therefore, it doesn't make you a better gamer. It just "looks nice". It's makes you no better of a gamer than 4k does.

You've essentially been brainwashed by gaming monitor companies (gg mental fortitude)

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#20  Edited By BassMan  Online
Member since 2002 • 14512 Posts

@KHAndAnime: It just shows that he is still dominant at 60hz because of his skill and decision making. He prefers the higher refresh rate and even has a 240hz panel. Higher refresh rate reduces input lag and make things more fluid and crisp. It also adds comfort and allows you to play with confidence. I know this first hand. While higher refresh rate does not make you a superstar, it does help. I don't need to watch some YouTuber or listen to company marketing to know the benefits of high refresh rate monitors.

He is all over the place with his thoughts, but prefers the higher refresh rate....

"Moving from 60Hz to 120Hz is amazing, but I noticed I didn't play any better. Now we have 144Hz and 240Hz monitors, so I wondered if I was playing any better on those.

The answer is... not really. I mean, yes in some ways, no in others. Hard to say. The fact is... I still managed to hit some very tight shots and a lot of mid air rockets, so I don't think I was hindered by 60Hz, other than it being harder to follow the action in heated battles. They say there is less delay on 144 and 240Hz though, and while it didn't bother me personally, it may be a factor to some degree... my thoughts on that would be that 60Hz appears slower so it's easier to process certain shots. That's why I think maybe there are advantages to low and high Hz... personally, I'll always choose to play on high."

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JigglyWiggly_

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#21  Edited By JigglyWiggly_
Member since 2009 • 24625 Posts

pfft rocket jump ninja

Why not show an actual good Quake Live CA player

Anyway, once you have played with 100+hz for a long time, it's easier to go back to 60hz. Not the other way around. You can just interpolate the missing frames with your experience and still play at a very high level. You are still playing at a noticeable disadvantage doing this.

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Tuzolord

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#22 Tuzolord
Member since 2007 • 1409 Posts

Im pretty sure if you take the same human being clone him and let one play 60hz and the other 144 or higher hz for 1 year that the one with the higher hz is gonna be a little on top of the other.

But thats not the sole reason you play on high fps, in that case it would be better to look out for faster input lag (I also play on a high level in rocket league and playing on my TV with gaming mode which has 20-30ms input lag makes me terrible). Higher fps is a minor "skill" difference but its better for your eyes. 4K just looks better but its not worth it YET imo for the performance drop and looking at how much a 4k 144hz monitor costs...(2000 dollars) unless ofcourse you don't play any fast moving games. And I also think when VR gets more hz in those screens then less people will have a headache.

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#23 PernicioEnigma
Member since 2010 • 6656 Posts

That's weird. The difference for me was immediately noticeable when I got my first high refresh monitor. I was blown away when I played Insurgency for the first time at 144hz to see how fluid the movement was, especially when I got startled and my hand controlling the mouse twitched, moving the camera around - normally that would result in a blurry, screen torn mess.

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#24 PernicioEnigma
Member since 2010 • 6656 Posts

@KHAndAnime said:
@BassMan said:

@KHAndAnime: 144hz is objectively better. Sure, you can still be amazing at 60hz, but that does not mean that the higher refresh rate does not help. I can buy the best sports equipment in the world, but that does not make me a great athlete. However, if I was already great, then that high end equipment takes me to another level. Same thing goes for gaming hardware.

I never said 144Hz isn't better. I just said it doesn't make you a better gamer.

Sure, you can still be amazing at 60hz, but that does not mean that the higher refresh rate does not help.

It doesn't. The video demonstrates that. If you think you're playing significantly better just because 144Hz, welcome to the magic of placebo.

However, if I was already great, then that high end equipment takes me to another level. Same thing goes for gaming hardware.

Did you even watch what I linked? This dude can lap circles around you in Quake 3 and he disagrees with what you just said. He said 144Hz looks nice because of the motion fluidity. That's it. Didn't improve his ability at all under testing. Therefore, it doesn't make you a better gamer. It just "looks nice". It's makes you no better of a gamer than 4k does.

You've essentially been brainwashed by gaming monitor companies (gg mental fortitude)

I think you're right. Even at 60hz it's your ability to react to the game that is the bottleneck, not the monitors refresh rate. I bet if you were to test even the quickest gamer their response time would be well over a 60th of a second.

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Litchie

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#25 Litchie
Member since 2003 • 29631 Posts

I notice a big difference myself, but my older PC gaming brother says he don't, which I find weird. Even just moving the mouse and moving windows around becomes super smooth. Some just don't notice the difference for some reason, I suppose..

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_SKatEDiRt_

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#26 _SKatEDiRt_
Member since 2007 • 3117 Posts

@Litchie: because they need glasses and knowledge of what is actually happening

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appariti0n

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#27 appariti0n
Member since 2009 • 4387 Posts

I don't really notice any difference once I go above 90ish fps. Studies have shown most people fall into this category.

However, the human brain is remarkable for it's ability to adapt to stimuli. So it makes perfect sense if one doesn't notice the difference immediately. I'm sure if I gamed at 120 fps solid for a month, then dropped to 60, I would notice right away.

Also, you're far more likely to notice a sudden drop from 120 to 90, and back to 120, than you are going from a perfectly paced 120 fps, to perfect 60 fps.

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dxmcat

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#28 dxmcat
Member since 2007 • 3385 Posts

I've been gaming on a 120hz lightboost monitor for the past 5 years. If its something like GTA or Starcraft........its not a game breaker. But for FPS like Quake. its essential. Yea everyone can see the difference but more often than not, regular gamers (fps in particular) should be able to notice a substantial difference. I do fps at 2560x1080 / 144hz now. Everything else 4k/60.

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#29 blangenakker
Member since 2006 • 3240 Posts

Never even seen anything higher than 60... :(