ati and nvidia

well.

it looks like now nvidia has got the fastest graphics card out right now. which is sweet, and a 500 dollar price tag for it isnt near as bad as the gtx 280 when it first came out. they were like 650 if i remember correctly

anyways, im looking forward to seeing what ati does with the hd5870.

the 5870 is the one im leaning towards because

1. its a single gpu powerhouse, no worry of micro-stuttering. (although micro-stuttering isnt as bad as it use to be)

2. because of confirmed dx11 support... (but i've also been reading that dx11 will work on dx10 cards, but im not sure about that)

3. because it will more than likely cost less than 500 dollars...(im looking for it at around the $399 mark.)

although either the gtx295 or the hd5870 will be an actual upgrade from what i have.

though im upgrading processor first before gpu... so im not bottlenecking...

either to the amd phenom II class am2+. or if for some reason my mobo wont work with a phenom II, ill get the amd phenom 9950, im sure it will bottleneck the newer gpu alot less than my amd 6000+..

any thoughts?

well.

it looks like now nvidia has got the fastest graphics card out right now. which is sweet, and a 500 dollar price tag for it isnt near as bad as the gtx 280 when it first came out. they were like 650 if i remember correctly

anyways, im looking forward to seeing what ati does with the hd5870.

the 5870 is the one im leaning towards because

1. its a single gpu powerhouse, no worry of micro-stuttering. (although micro-stuttering isnt as bad as it use to be)

2. because of confirmed dx11 support... (but i've also been reading that dx11 will work on dx10 cards, but im not sure about that)

3. because it will more than likely cost less than 500 dollars...(im looking for it at around the $399 mark.)

although either the gtx295 or the hd5870 will be an actual upgrade from what i have.

though im upgrading processor first before gpu... so im not bottlenecking...

either to the amd phenom II class am2+. or if for some reason my mobo wont work with a phenom II, ill get the amd phenom 9950, im sure it will bottleneck the newer gpu alot less than my amd 6000+..

any thoughts?

Lach0121

The way I see things.... IF you go Intel go Nvidia, if you go AMD go ATI.

My reasoning is due to a possible conflict of interest of AMD letting ATI being optimized for Intel based systems; while at the same time Nvidia being in direct competition with ATI.

Although at 500 bucks.... I rather buy a PS3 or 360.

two 4870's? I dont' know about that advice...

The benchmarks I've seen show duel 4870 not working much better than a single one. Probably due to a CPU bottleneck. And @ 2x the cost? I don't know about spending all that extra cash for a small gain like that if, it's a gain, at all.

I wasn't comparing it to Nvidia... but maybe it was the drivers fault on this non-AA bench test...

http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/gaming-graphics-charts-q3-2008/Crysis-v1-21,749.html

i heard so daytona while some are gonna be optimized for DX11 ? So they gonna run better on dX11 i belive ? but then again.. It not a big matter as even my 4870x2 will run dX11 Graphic Feature Ain't it what they stated ?!

How ever If you want a Good video card 399$ MARK as you state then this is the best you can have for money BUY THE 4870x2 at only 399$ AFTER MIR From sapphire They instead will release for higher price : a 3 Expansion slot behind for a dual cooling solution
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102768marcthpro

Ehh... what can I say...I'm lazy and I don't really follow ATI. Tom's Hardware is one of those old sites that I just remember, is all. Just too lazy to go out browsing around. I guess. As for drivers, I'm using a 8600GT, and using the 129.21's because for some reason my setup doesn't like any of the newer drivers with the game Mass Effect. 129.21 are the most stable for me with that game. Also Falcon AF favors those old drivers, too.

Orginally, I was Nvidia + AMD fan, but since the merger. I have accepted the idea that ATI is most likely going to favor AMD over Intel. Regardless, I've turned to my PS2 for gaming for the past few years. Also, being that just about ever newly released game, now has PC problems, and older games don't seem to like these newer drivers, I may just stick with my 939 3000+ (OC'ed to 2.4) with 8600GT, for a while longer. Currently, I'm deciding on upgrading and going AMD with ATI.... but I'm still in the iffy department for that. I may just give up the PC, altogether. And just stick to what I already have.

At 400-500 buck for a video card upgrade, alone? I think I rather invest in a Xbox or PS3 with that cash, myself. Game developers are giving the PC the cold shoulder, anyways. Just about everything released now, is a console port... And a poorly written one, at that. And if not for games, I'd wouldn't be considering an upgrade to begin with....might as well go console with that 400 bucks, instead.

Personally, the budget I'm looking at for a video card is under $200 bucks (such as this single 4870 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102810), $100 for the motherboard , $180 for the processor, $30 for 2gigs of ram, $60 for a fresh HDD.... and maybe $80-100 for a better PSU if the one I have now can't cut it

Or, to buy a console, instead. Leaning 360, but really like JRPG, so PS3 is still an option. Although PS3 has nothing, yet... So, really just using a PS2, right now. Ar Tonelico 2 is due soon...

well.

it looks like now nvidia has got the fastest graphics card out right now. which is sweet, and a 500 dollar price tag for it isnt near as bad as the gtx 280 when it first came out. they were like 650 if i remember correctly

anyways, im looking forward to seeing what ati does with the hd5870.

the 5870 is the one im leaning towards because

1. its a single gpu powerhouse, no worry of micro-stuttering. (although micro-stuttering isnt as bad as it use to be)

2. because of confirmed dx11 support... (but i've also been reading that dx11 will work on dx10 cards, but im not sure about that)

3. because it will more than likely cost less than 500 dollars...(im looking for it at around the $399 mark.)

although either the gtx295 or the hd5870 will be an actual upgrade from what i have.

though im upgrading processor first before gpu... so im not bottlenecking...

either to the amd phenom II class am2+. or if for some reason my mobo wont work with a phenom II, ill get the amd phenom 9950, im sure it will bottleneck the newer gpu alot less than my amd 6000+..

any thoughts?

Lach0121

Yes,sell your 6000+ and AMD MB get a q6600 and a 750i.You shouldn't be looking for new GPU's until next year, when you will be able to get 2 GT212's for the price of one @ release

Ehh... what can I say...I'm lazy and I don't really follow ATI. Tom's Hardware is one of those old sites that I just remember, is all. Just too lazy to go out browsing around. I guess. As for drivers, I'm using a 8600GT, and using the 129.21's because for some reason my setup doesn't like any of the newer drivers with the game Mass Effect. 129.21 are the most stable for me with that game. Also Falcon AF favors those old drivers, too.

Orginally, I was Nvidia + AMD fan, but since the merger. I have accepted the idea that ATI is most likely going to favor AMD over Intel. Regardless, I've turned to my PS2 for gaming for the past few years. Also, being that just about ever newly released game, now has PC problems, and older games don't seem to like these newer drivers, I may just stick with my 939 3000+ (OC'ed to 2.4) with 8600GT, for a while longer. Currently, I'm deciding on upgrading and going AMD with ATI.... but I'm still in the iffy department for that. I may just give up the PC, altogether. And just stick to what I already have.

At 400-500 buck for a video card upgrade, alone? I think I rather invest in a Xbox or PS3 with that cash, myself. Game developers are giving the PC the cold shoulder, anyways. Just about everything released now, is a console port... And a poorly written one, at that. And if not for games, I'd wouldn't be considering an upgrade to begin with....might as well go console with that 400 bucks, instead.

Personally, the budget I'm looking at for a video card is under $200 bucks (such as this single 4870 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102810), $100 for the motherboard , $180 for the processor, $30 for 2gigs of ram, $60 for a fresh HDD.... and maybe $80-100 for a better PSU if the one I have now can't cut it

Or, to buy a console, instead. Leaning 360, but really like JRPG, so PS3 is still an option. Although PS3 has nothing, yet... So, really just using a PS2, right now. Ar Tonelico 2 is due soon...

Threesixtyci

The way I see things.... IF you go Intel go Nvidia, if you go AMD go ATI.

My reasoning is due to a possible conflict of interest of AMD letting ATI being optimized for Intel based systems; while at the same time Nvidia being in direct competition with ATI.

Although at 500 bucks.... I rather buy a PS3 or 360.

Threesixtyci

What?

If you go intel, go ATI with there chipset except for x58 only allowing crossfire.

I wasn't comparing it to Nvidia... but maybe it was the drivers fault on this non-AA bench test...

http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/gaming-graphics-charts-q3-2008/Crysis-v1-21,749.html

Threesixtyci

tomshardware have retarded benchmarks... CF HD4870 1GB works great.

wow i wasnt trying to get another battle going on here, i was just seeing if anyone knew something about the gtx 295 or hd5870 that i didnt...

and maybe a new nvidia single gpu powerhouse.

im going with whichever one offers me best performance/stability/for the price.

if you want best buck for money either 295GTX / 4870x2 but if you trust 295GTX take not it maybe having 20% Of is power hidden cause of driver not updated enough IF you want the great card for moeny i told you Lach0121 it the 4870x2 for 399$: While for 100$ more you got maybe some more power but only if the Driver get a major update if you look the Review and truely interrest into pc just look into that btw ? are you getting a new system in future ? cause the Athelonx2 (64 bits) will be the fall of ur power as it won't run all the gpu power it self you run sli 8800GT OCX right now right ? so if you do someting as buy new gpu i just let you know someting. you will be bottleneck if you get a 4870x2 or 295GTXmarcthpro

also im gonna wait and see what nvidia is launching other than its gtx295,

its gonna take a month or two to save up, i just like getting all the input i can.

i really want just a single gpu powerhouse, thats whyim waiting on the 5870, and im curious to see nvidia's answer to it as well.

5870 isn't before july mate unless ati is really havnig fire on it ass which would push them to release it in may :P but i doubt it
anyway it not before that so you are the one who decide if you wait 5 month or buy now take in consideriaotn taht TWO 8800GT Is still almost as good as a 260GTX 192 core Stock speed there for you wouldn't be crying too much until it release
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2009/01/08/nvidia-geforce-gtx-295-quad-sli-review/6marcthpro

that gtx 295 is pretty sick, i might end up going with one of them, once the price comes down, i wont need anything more at my resolution of 16x10.

two 4870's? I dont' know about that advice...

The benchmarks I've seen show duel 4870 not working much better than a single one. Probably due to a CPU bottleneck. And @ 2x the cost? I don't know about spending all that extra cash for a small gain like that if, it's a gain, at all.

oh yeah definately, im getting the phenom 940 and oc it to 3.2ghz. that should keep from any bottlenecking

Lach0121

Only 3.2ghz? get the black edition and aim for around 3.6-3.8ghz, that seems to be the average most are saying it goes to easily, might get 4ghz with a really good cooler but after that your gonna need water unless u got a golden chip, if you aint got a good cooler get the Xigmatek HDT S1283 but just make sure u dont have big ram like OCZ Reaper & Corsair dominator as it wont seat properly (cos AMD socket design needs rotating 90 degrees so the heatsink fits nicely between ram and other cooling options) and its a git to clamp down if not seated properly (mine sits about 1cm off the bracket snapping down properly but luckily the base plate is big enough to cover the cpu chip so it still doing its job.

I wouldnt ditch the 6000+ & mobo for a Q6600 though like someone suggested, unless you believe the muppets at toms hardware who cant even perform a fair test then you will know the Phenom 2 940 is running on par with Q9400 and you can get better on some games even to the extent of beating I7's (overclock to 3.8ghz and your about on par with I7 920 & Core 2 Extreme in some games) the only reason Toms shows the 940 been along with the Q6600 is cos the test was run giving intel DDR3 ram and 1 of the best mobo's and the 940 was given DDR2 ram (as it dont support ddr3 thats am3 cpus when they arrive) and same mobo as me which gives a performance hit when optimum for Phenom 2 is 790GX platform, even though the increase to DDR3 ram isnt much (and not really worth the money) it is enough to make the Core 2 cpu's look better.

Besides to get Q6600 & decent mobo is gonna cost more than Phenom 2 940.

Heres a few benchies from Legion Hardware to backup what im saying

Even if you drop to 800x600 the cpu still holds its own and doesnt drop to been on par with Q6600 as some seem to believe

For full review read here

Personally if your sticking AMD I would go ATI, there are said to be a few slight perks for sticking with the same company n I reckon it would be true as AMD dont want Intel taking all there sales, but I doubt the difference would be too bad otherwise anyone with an Intel cpu (lets face it thats about 70% of people at the mo) wouldnt buy ATI cards

[QUOTE="Lach0121"]

oh yeah definately, im getting the phenom 940 and oc it to 3.2ghz. that should keep from any bottlenecking

KurganUK23

Only 3.2ghz? get the black edition and aim for around 3.6-3.8ghz, that seems to be the average most are saying it goes to easily, might get 4ghz with a really good cooler but after that your gonna need water unless u got a golden chip, if you aint got a good cooler get the Xigmatek HDT S1283 but just make sure u dont have big ram like OCZ Reaper & Corsair dominator as it wont seat properly (cos AMD socket design needs rotating 90 degrees so the heatsink fits nicely between ram and other cooling options) and its a git to clamp down if not seated properly (mine sits about 1cm off the bracket snapping down properly but luckily the base plate is big enough to cover the cpu chip so it still doing its job.

I wouldnt ditch the 6000+ & mobo for a Q6600 though like someone suggested, unless you believe the muppets at toms hardware who cant even perform a fair test then you will know the Phenom 2 940 is running on par with Q9400 and you can get better on some games even to the extent of beating I7's (overclock to 3.8ghz and your about on par with I7 920 & Core 2 Extreme in some games) the only reason Toms shows the 940 been along with the Q6600 is cos the test was run giving intel DDR3 ram and 1 of the best mobo's and the 940 was given DDR2 ram (as it dont support ddr3 thats am3 cpus when they arrive) and same mobo as me which gives a performance hit when optimum for Phenom 2 is 790GX platform, even though the increase to DDR3 ram isnt much (and not really worth the money) it is enough to make the Core 2 cpu's look better.

Besides to get Q6600 & decent mobo is gonna cost more than Phenom 2 940.

Heres a few benchies from Legion Hardware to backup what im saying

Even if you drop to 800x600 the cpu still holds its own and doesnt drop to been on par with Q6600 as some seem to believe

For full review read here

Personally if your sticking AMD I would go ATI, there are said to be a few slight perks for sticking with the same company n I reckon it would be true as AMD dont want Intel taking all there sales, but I doubt the difference would be too bad otherwise anyone with an Intel cpu (lets face it thats about 70% of people at the mo) wouldnt buy ATI cards

and the only versions i see newegg selling are the black editions... i will overclock more, once i get more knowledgable about it, but until then, 3.2-3.3ghz is ok by me....

that alone will give me a significant performance boost over what i already have, and will remove any bottleneck i may have on my sli setup... as well not have a bottleneck once i go for nvidia's new single gpu powerhouse (when it gets announced and comes out) or the hd5870...

yes i know it will be months.. but i have a 250 processor i want to get, then i got to save another 3-500 for the gpu, it will take a few months..

cause i am infact a musician too, and music is an even more expensive hobby than gaming.

thats what you'd think but AMD is not favoring ATI with anything, remember ATI and Nvidia used to have a good relationship. i was in your situation and decided to go 360 mainly for JRPG's though.yoyo462001

But there seems to be lot more North Bridge chipset revisions coming from AMD, with Crossfire support versus Nvidia's Nforce with SLI support. Wasn't that long ago where Crossfire boards were very hard to track down, and Nivida's SLI boards were everywhere.AMD's North Bridge chipsets are bound to be better optimized for ATI than with Nvidia. And add the idea that Nvidia's Nforce doesn't support Crossfire, and AMD chipsets don't support SLI. There is favorism going on, there. Now if you're just going to use a single card, I can only assume that it won't matter. Otherwise, I really feel that those who use an AMD CPU with a AMD northbridge type motherboard with crossfire, will have an edge over those using an AMD CPU, Nforce motherboard, with SLI cards. Although, I have nothing to support that idea other than AMD chipsets don't allow SLI support and AMD is bound to have inside info of how ATI cards work.

And recalling what happened between AMD and Intel. How they eventually split apart. I mean they used to be interchangable. And now we have a complete AMD versus Intel split; where you have to decide from the motherboard on up which way to go, instead of the CPU, alone. I see the same trend happening with ATI and Nvidia... with their different chipset motherboards of AMD and Nforce.

As for 360 and JRPG... thats kinda odd. I mean, I've always been under the impression that Japanese gamers didn''t exactly embrace the 360; comparied to their Playstations. Although you are right, with the exceptions of MGS4 and Valkyria Chronical, just about ever new generation game has been multi-ported to both, then you have Star Ocean moving to the 360. And FF13 is expected to come out for both, too. Although, versus FF13 is said to be only for the PS3. I wish game developers would put the effort into PC games like they used to... all this Securom and Starforce protection has really ruined PC gaming. I mean Fallout 3, and Mass Effect are the two games that I thought would be awesome on the PC, and both give me nothing but problems... Even Witcher has problems now, due to the Blur effect after spoken ingame cutscenes... And not one of these 3 games has a patch to fix there problems. Mass Effect has never had a patch released to fix their bugs, Fallout 3 has a notice that it's being released soon, but we have no idea what it's going to fix. And no real word from the Witcher forum about a patch to fix the Blur problem of the EE patch. I'm curious of how F.E.A.R 2 is going to be like.... Hopefully, it comes out with no game stoping problems.