Why do so many people complain about America but no one wants to do anything about it?

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Jag85

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#51  Edited By Jag85
Member since 2005 • 19543 Posts
@Damedius said:
@tryit said:
@Damedius said:
@cashewnuttel said:

@Damedius: Well..... okay.

When?

And

Will that make the world finally happy though?

Namely currency debasement and immigration.

an empire expands into another country and then falls because of 'immigration'?

how very ironic

The emperor allowed thousands of refugees fleeing the Huns to enter their empire. Those refugees would later sack Rome and lead to the downfall of their empire.

Probably why they don't teach much history any more. Any American studying Rome would see parallels.

This is a highly selective reading of Roman history, focusing only on the final years of Rome and ignoring the many centuries of immigration that the Roman civilization was built upon. The Romans themselves took pride in their civilization being founded by refugees, specifically Trojans from Asia Minor fleeing the Trojan War. While the Trojan War connection is debatable, what is known about early Rome was that it was founded by migrants, including Etruscans who had heritage from Asia Minor, as well as Indo-European migrants who migrated to the region.

Later, as Rome became an empire and expanded across large portions of Europe, the Middle East, and North Africa, the city of Rome at the height of its prosperity was a diverse multicultural city full of immigrants from across Europe, the Middle East, and North Africa. Many Roman emperors themselves were migrants from across the across Europe, North Africa, and the Middle East, including an emperor called Philip the Arab. The last major classical Roman dynasty, the Severan dynasty, consisted of emperors who migrated from Syria and Libya. The Roman Empire itself most likely reached its greatest extent under the Severan dynasty's founder, Septimius Severus, a Libyan migrant who became Roman Emperor, before expanding the empire east into Arabia, south into the Sahara, and north into Scotland, and then died in England.

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Damedius

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#52 Damedius
Member since 2010 • 737 Posts

@Jag85 said:
@Damedius said:
@tryit said:
@Damedius said:
@cashewnuttel said:

@Damedius: Well..... okay.

When?

And

Will that make the world finally happy though?

Namely currency debasement and immigration.

an empire expands into another country and then falls because of 'immigration'?

how very ironic

The emperor allowed thousands of refugees fleeing the Huns to enter their empire. Those refugees would later sack Rome and lead to the downfall of their empire.

Probably why they don't teach much history any more. Any American studying Rome would see parallels.

This is a highly selective reading of Roman history, focusing only on the final years of Rome and ignoring the many centuries of immigration that the Roman civilization was built upon. The Romans themselves took pride in their civilization being founded by refugees, specifically Trojans from Asia Minor fleeing the Trojan War. While the Trojan War connection is debatable, what is known about early Rome was that it was founded by migrants, including Etruscans who had heritage from Asia Minor, as well as Indo-European migrants who migrated to the region.

Later, as Rome became an empire and expanded across large portions of Europe, the Middle East, and North Africa, the city of Rome at the height of its prosperity was a diverse multicultural city full of immigrants from across Europe, the Middle East, and North Africa. Many Roman emperors themselves were migrants from across the across Europe, North Africa, and the Middle East, including an emperor called Philip the Arab. The last major classical Roman dynasty, the Severan dynasty, consisted of emperors who migrated from Syria and Libya. The Roman Empire itself most likely reached its greatest extent under the Severan dynasty's founder, Septimius Severus, a Libyan migrant who became Roman Emperor, before expanding the empire east into Arabia, south into the Sahara, and north into Scotland, and then died in England.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Migration_Period

I really don't think it is highly selective at all. It's not like it hasn't been written about for hundred of years.

I think you are trying to paint the Roman Empire with a modern touch.

Libya is a modern invention. It was a Roman province in the time period we are talking about. So you are being disingenuous insinuating that the Severan dynasty didn't come from the Roman Empire.

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Jag85

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#53  Edited By Jag85
Member since 2005 • 19543 Posts
@Damedius said:
@Jag85 said:
@Damedius said:
@tryit said:

an empire expands into another country and then falls because of 'immigration'?

how very ironic

The emperor allowed thousands of refugees fleeing the Huns to enter their empire. Those refugees would later sack Rome and lead to the downfall of their empire.

Probably why they don't teach much history any more. Any American studying Rome would see parallels.

This is a highly selective reading of Roman history, focusing only on the final years of Rome and ignoring the many centuries of immigration that the Roman civilization was built upon. The Romans themselves took pride in their civilization being founded by refugees, specifically Trojans from Asia Minor fleeing the Trojan War. While the Trojan War connection is debatable, what is known about early Rome was that it was founded by migrants, including Etruscans who had heritage from Asia Minor, as well as Indo-European migrants who migrated to the region.

Later, as Rome became an empire and expanded across large portions of Europe, the Middle East, and North Africa, the city of Rome at the height of its prosperity was a diverse multicultural city full of immigrants from across Europe, the Middle East, and North Africa. Many Roman emperors themselves were migrants from across the across Europe, North Africa, and the Middle East, including an emperor called Philip the Arab. The last major classical Roman dynasty, the Severan dynasty, consisted of emperors who migrated from Syria and Libya. The Roman Empire itself most likely reached its greatest extent under the Severan dynasty's founder, Septimius Severus, a Libyan migrant who became Roman Emperor, before expanding the empire east into Arabia, south into the Sahara, and north into Scotland, and then died in England.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Migration_Period

I really don't think it is highly selective at all. It's not like it hasn't been written about for hundred of years.

I think you are trying to paint the Roman Empire with a modern touch.

Libya is a modern invention. It was a Roman province in the time period we are talking about. So you are being disingenuous insinuating that the Severan dynasty didn't come from the Roman Empire.

It is highly selective to only focus on that particular century and ignore the many centuries of immigration that preceded it, and the role that immigration played in building up Rome and then the Roman Empire.

The modern touch here would be to portray the Roman Empire as a homogeneous monocultural fantasy when it was anything but. The Roman Empire was an imperialistic entity that consisted of numerous different tribes, ethnic groups, religions, and languages.

Libya is the Latin name for the region used by the Romans themselves. Libya was previously a Carthaginian province conquered by the Romans after defeating Hannibal, and the region remained predominantly Semitic and Berber under Roman rule. The Severan dynasty spoke their own native Semitic languages and worshipped their own Semitic gods, rather than the Roman gods.

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Damedius

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#54 Damedius
Member since 2010 • 737 Posts

@Jag85 said:

It is highly selective to only focus on that particular century and ignore the many centuries of immigration that preceded it, and the role that immigration played in building up Rome and then the Roman Empire.

The modern touch here would be to portray the Roman Empire as a homogeneous monocultural fantasy when it was anything but. The Roman Empire was an imperialistic entity that consisted of numerous different tribes, ethnic groups, religions, and languages.

Libya is the Latin name for the region used by the Romans themselves. Libya was previously a Carthaginian province conquered by the Romans after defeating Hannibal, and the region remained predominantly Semitic and Berber under Roman rule. The Severan dynasty spoke their own native Semitic languages and worshipped their own Semitic gods, rather than the Roman gods.

Do you emigration when you say immigration built up the roman empire?

Are you trying to say that Rome simply let people immigrate and that some how made people give them their land to control?

I always kind of thought they went out conquered territory and set up out posts.

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br0kenrabbit

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#55  Edited By br0kenrabbit
Member since 2004 • 17859 Posts

@Damedius said:

Do you emigration when you say immigration built up the roman empire?

Are you trying to say that Rome simply let people immigrate and that some how made people give them their land to control?

I always kind of thought they went out conquered territory and set up out posts.

People often sold either their children and/or themselves into slavery in order to someday become Roman citizens.

Wait, what?

Yeah, slavery in Rome wasn't necessarily a life-long affair. Many former slaves went on to become slave-owning free persons with their own land and trade. Some slaves, favorites of their masters, were even given estates and important positions in their former masters business upon release.

ALSO, after the Marian reforms, you could become a Roman citizen by joining the army and putting in 25 years.

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Cashewnuttel

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#56 Cashewnuttel
Member since 2018 • 15 Posts
@Damedius said:

No it will not make the world happy. The end of the American empire will result in chaos, war and misery.

Nope, according to Quora, YouTube this game site and so many more, when America is gone, the world will finally be a happy place where there will be no more hunger, anger, war and only love will reign.

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Jag85

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#57 Jag85
Member since 2005 • 19543 Posts
@Damedius said:
@Jag85 said:

It is highly selective to only focus on that particular century and ignore the many centuries of immigration that preceded it, and the role that immigration played in building up Rome and then the Roman Empire.

The modern touch here would be to portray the Roman Empire as a homogeneous monocultural fantasy when it was anything but. The Roman Empire was an imperialistic entity that consisted of numerous different tribes, ethnic groups, religions, and languages.

Libya is the Latin name for the region used by the Romans themselves. Libya was previously a Carthaginian province conquered by the Romans after defeating Hannibal, and the region remained predominantly Semitic and Berber under Roman rule. The Severan dynasty spoke their own native Semitic languages and worshipped their own Semitic gods, rather than the Roman gods.

Do you emigration when you say immigration built up the roman empire?

Are you trying to say that Rome simply let people immigrate and that some how made people give them their land to control?

I always kind of thought they went out conquered territory and set up out posts.

Same thing. You have to emigrate from a country in order to immigrate to another country.

Rome conquered lands by force, through warfare. But over time, Rome began handing out Roman citizenship to a select percentage of conquered populations, such as the families of those who served the Roman army. And those who became Roman citizens could freely migrate to Rome. And eventually, some of their descendants went on to become Roman emperors, starting with the Severan dynasty, a family of Semitic and Berber origins.

It's not unlike how, after the British Empire conquered and subjugated lands for a long time, Britain eventually began handing out British citizenship to a select percentage of conquered populations, whose descendants now make up the bulk of modern Britain's Asian, African and Caribbean communities.

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#58  Edited By Cashewnuttel
Member since 2018 • 15 Posts

Guys..... the only way to solve your American problem is if the world put aside its differences, united, invaded it or threatened to invade it in which case they might, MIGHT, stop.

IF NOT, then yeah, attack it and NO, I am not talking about politically or economically, I'm talking about a full invasion of it and then dividing its lands and then giving Somalia, New York City. After that, everything that I listed and so many more will surely stop.

Guys.... they are not going to change..... was Germany or Japan defeated through complaints? They are not going to read the things you write and say to themselves "oh yeah, I have been pretty naughty, okay I won't be naughty anymore". And if you're trying to create awareness...... I'm sure everybody knows this already..... those things I listed were the same rants over and over again from different sites.

.......... you are only wasting your time.

Instead of getting angry, you should be thinking of solutions, that's my solution right there.

Don't wish that it'll collapse, make it so....