Yeah but thinking about it being deadly isn't so great. All you need is a knife to usually beat open hand or gun to beat a knife. Anyone can karate chop you in the throat and shatter your esophagus like in Krav Maga then gauge your eyes out but it's overkill really isn't it.
I prefer an internal style. Tai Chi is the best style overall. In that it focuses on internal energy which is released kind of after the blow, a bit like like Fist of the North Star. I'm not saying Tai Chi can make your head blow up... but it's one of those styles that studies nerve endings I think so do things like take out someone's breathing for ten seconds so they will can tell you where the villain is hiding or such, them kill them anyway for being a henchman.
Is there a martial "art" form where you can kick people in the balls, gouge their eyes out, use their hair as leverage, and basically do anything to win?
I think krav maga is like that right? That's probably the best.
All the proper form and technique isn't going to work against someone trained to do whatever it takes to survive.
@JustPlainLucas: It's the title really. Apart from misspelling martial, you can't say which is the most deadly. I just meant favourite. I couldn't think of any particular aspect to focus on...
Each style has a slightly different tactic and application so I would be interested to see which styles people like and why.
@JustPlainLucas: It's the title really. Apart from misspelling martial, you can't say which is the most deadly. I just meant favourite. I couldn't think of any particular aspect to focus on...
Each style has a slightly different tactic and application so I would be interested to see which styles people like and why.
@jackamomo: I can't say how effective Tai Chi is in real life situations compared to the other ones, but I've been practicing Chen style for a year and I find it incredible how much depth and detail is involved when it comes to posture, footing and flow. I'm not even close to being able to use it for self-defense.
Krav Maga is considered the most deadliest martial art. I'm sure others can be, but mostly taught to not be used for violence, while Krav Maga's purpose would be to teach you to defend yourself in ally against 2 people with broken bottles in hands.
@one_plum Chen style was originally developed as a martial art as were all the Tai Chi styles I think, they are also good for your health and chi energy and all that as most people probably know.
I takes a long time to learn to use it offensively I think and it's not really used as that any these days anyway but offensively is characterized by fluid movement and quick strikes.
Pushing hands is used in mma which is a Tai Chi concept and it's interesting in it's use of internal force.
Jujitsu and its offspring (e.g. Judo, Brazilian jiu jitsu, close-quarters combat, combat sambo, krav maga, etc.) are usually the most effective martial arts, widely used by military and police forces around the world, and also dominant in MMA combat sports.
In turn, Jujitsu originates from Samurai, for situations where they found themselves unarmed and forced to fight armed opponents (e.g. with Katana swords), who they disarmed and killed using Jujitsu.
As to the op's question, it's so academic that the question itself becomes somewhat useless. Everyone's going to think it's the art that they study/studied or failing that, the art that they know of/read about/etc. MMA forums like Sherdog and comments on MMA fight videos are without fail filled with debates like "that wouldn't work" or "_____ art doesn't work" or "pffft, if that were me in that video I'd do _______ easy" and "oh yeah, real rough key behind a keyboard". Etc, etc.
While I have my opinions on what art/arts is/are best, I'll keep it to more general principles. Standup arts vary in effectiveness, but I'd say the ones that tend to do the best are the ones where the individual techniques aren't overly complex and more importantly, where the physical training is rigorous like you'd get in a boxing gym. Just being in good shape and having more endurance than the other guy can give someone a significant edge that shouldn't be ignored. While there are many, many different striking arts when you start to boil down what is and isn't effective in things like MMA matches, they tend to not look too significantly different from one another (especially to someone who doesn't train). Footwork, spacing, head movement, strikes, etc.
That said, standup arts are obviously most effective when the practitioner is standing. Grappling arts tend to take that apart pretty quickly. The second you get on your back stances, footwork, spacing, and head movement don't really mean anything. Standing arts have a very hard time against grappling arts if the grappler is able to take them to the ground, and that often happens in fights/matches between standup artists and grapplers because that's literally almost all of what the grappler trains to do. Even in street fights between the untrained, there's a high tendency for fights to go to the ground because people tie up (grabbing someone is preferable to staying in punching range), they lose their balance, etc. Also, if one person -wants- to take a fight to the ground, the other person has to try very hard to prevent that from happening and know how to prevent it successfully.
Even in MMA, the fighters who are primarily strikers need to have a decent vocabulary in takedown defense and at least some ground work to be competitive. But I would always give the edge to the grappler who has some standup skills over the standup artist who has some grappling skills.
That's pretty much what we saw with Khabib vs. McGregor. A grappler vs. striker match, between the best grappler Khabib (mainly a combat sambo specialist) and the best striker Conor McGregor (mainly a kickboxing specialist). Yet McGregor got dominated by Khabib. A good grappler almost always has the advantage over a good striker.
The Jujitsu school of martial arts (which includes Judo, Brazilian jiu jitsu, close-quarters combat, combat sambo, krav maga, etc.) tend to be the best at grappling. Nowadays, it's essential for almost any MMA fighter to have at least some experience with a Jujitsu-based martial art.
Ansatsuken in the Japanese versions or Shotokan in the US translations.
@Jag85 said:
@Byshop:
That's pretty much what we saw with Khabib vs. McGregor. A grappler vs. striker match, between the best grappler Khabib (mainly a combat sambo specialist) and the best striker Conor McGregor (mainly a kickboxing specialist). Yet McGregor got dominated by Khabib. A good grappler almost always has the advantage over a good striker.
The Jujitsu school of martial arts (which includes Judo, Brazilian jiu jitsu, close-quarters combat, combat sambo, krav maga, etc.) tend to be the best at grappling. Nowadays, it's essential for almost any MMA fighter to have at least some experience with a Jujitsu-based martial art.
Yeah, it becomes more complicated when you're talking about two trained MMA fighters. While I agree that the edge is to the grappler because once grappled, the striker is just on the defensive and is trying to get back to their feet while the grappler is actively attacking, I'd also say that when you're talking about two professional MMA fighters pretty much anything could happen because it becomes this meta game of each fighter specifically trying to out tactic the other.
I agree with what you're saying about grappling arts as well. Jiu-Jitsu, BJJ, Judo, Sambo are all good examples. CQC means a lot of different things but depending on exactly what they do it would likely include that. I would not include Krav in that list, though. Not every art that includes grabbing your opponent is an art I would call a "grappling art".
Krav Maga is not a martial art, more of a self defence system.
Martial art is a broad term. It can include self-defence practices and military training.
Still not a martial art.
Sorry, I’m gonna stick with google and wikipedia over some guy saying it’s not.
Plus I am trained in Krav.
If you trained in it you should know that Krav is indeed a "Martial Art", it actually combines several key other "arts" into it
"Let’s begin with the question of whether or not Krav Maga is a martial art. The answer is both “yes” and “no” because it depends on your definition of a “martial art”. If you consider martial arts to be centuries old fighting styles, often Eastern in origin and practiced today as a systematised sport, for example, Aikido, Taekwondo, Jiujitsu and Karate then Krav Maga is not strictly a martial art.
On the other hand, if you take a wider view of martial arts as any system of self-defence and combat and include the more modern forms such as MMA, then perhaps the combat system known as Krav Maga can be called a martial art, particularly at the higher grades. However, there are some important distinctions.
Martial art is a broad term. It can include self-defence practices and military training.
Still not a martial art.
Sorry, I’m gonna stick with google and wikipedia over some guy saying it’s not.
Plus I am trained in Krav.
If you trained in it you should know that Krav is indeed a "Martial Art", it actually combines several key other "arts" into it
"Let’s begin with the question of whether or not Krav Maga is a martial art. The answer is both “yes” and “no” because it depends on your definition of a “martial art”. If you consider martial arts to be centuries old fighting styles, often Eastern in origin and practiced today as a systematised sport, for example, Aikido, Taekwondo, Jiujitsu and Karate then Krav Maga is not strictly a martial art.
On the other hand, if you take a wider view of martial arts as any system of self-defence and combat and include the more modern forms such as MMA, then perhaps the combat system known as Krav Maga can be called a martial art, particularly at the higher grades. However, there are some important distinctions.
Generally it doesn't call itself a martial art but it's a completely semantic argument and kind of pointless. If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, walks like a duck, call it a duck or don't. It really makes no difference.
That's pretty much what we saw with Khabib vs. McGregor. A grappler vs. striker match, between the best grappler Khabib (mainly a combat sambo specialist) and the best striker Conor McGregor (mainly a kickboxing specialist). Yet McGregor got dominated by Khabib. A good grappler almost always has the advantage over a good striker.
The Jujitsu school of martial arts (which includes Judo, Brazilian jiu jitsu, close-quarters combat, combat sambo, krav maga, etc.) tend to be the best at grappling. Nowadays, it's essential for almost any MMA fighter to have at least some experience with a Jujitsu-based martial art.
Yeah, it becomes more complicated when you're talking about two trained MMA fighters. While I agree that the edge is to the grappler because once grappled, the striker is just on the defensive and is trying to get back to their feet while the grappler is actively attacking, I'd also say that when you're talking about two professional MMA fighters pretty much anything could happen because it becomes this meta game of each fighter specifically trying to out tactic the other.
I agree with what you're saying about grappling arts as well. Jiu-Jitsu, BJJ, Judo, Sambo are all good examples. CQC means a lot of different things but depending on exactly what they do it would likely include that. I would not include Krav in that list, though. Not every art that includes grabbing your opponent is an art I would call a "grappling art".
-Byshop
True, it does depend on the individual fighter more than anything. McGregor has, after all, defeated plenty of grapplers, including some great ones. But against the best grapplers, such as Khabib (and possibly Tony Ferguson), there's not much a striker like McGregor can do to prevent the inevitable (a takedown or submission).
Krav is actually quite similar to Sambo. Krav is essentially the Israeli military's equivalent to the Soviet military's Sambo. The version of Sambo we see in MMA today (used by Russian/Dagestani fighters like Khabib) is a combat-sport variant of Sambo. The original Sambo was a military combat system designed to disarm and kill armed enemies, much like Krav. Khabib's dad himself was actually an elite Soviet army veteran, before he became a MMA coach teaching a combat-sport version of Sambo in the post-Soviet era.
In turn, both Krav and Sambo are ultimately rooted in Jujutsu (not to be confused with BJJ, which is a modern combat-sport variant). Jujutsu was originally a military combat system in feudal Japan, designed to disarm and kill Samurai armed with Katana swords. Modern-day Jujutsu-rooted combat systems generally fall under two sub-branches: military combat systems (e.g. CQC, Sambo, Krav, military judo, etc.) and sport-combat systems (e.g. BJJ, sport judo, sport sambo, etc.).
That's pretty much what we saw with Khabib vs. McGregor. A grappler vs. striker match, between the best grappler Khabib (mainly a combat sambo specialist) and the best striker Conor McGregor (mainly a kickboxing specialist). Yet McGregor got dominated by Khabib. A good grappler almost always has the advantage over a good striker.
The Jujitsu school of martial arts (which includes Judo, Brazilian jiu jitsu, close-quarters combat, combat sambo, krav maga, etc.) tend to be the best at grappling. Nowadays, it's essential for almost any MMA fighter to have at least some experience with a Jujitsu-based martial art.
Yeah, it becomes more complicated when you're talking about two trained MMA fighters. While I agree that the edge is to the grappler because once grappled, the striker is just on the defensive and is trying to get back to their feet while the grappler is actively attacking, I'd also say that when you're talking about two professional MMA fighters pretty much anything could happen because it becomes this meta game of each fighter specifically trying to out tactic the other.
I agree with what you're saying about grappling arts as well. Jiu-Jitsu, BJJ, Judo, Sambo are all good examples. CQC means a lot of different things but depending on exactly what they do it would likely include that. I would not include Krav in that list, though. Not every art that includes grabbing your opponent is an art I would call a "grappling art".
-Byshop
True, it does depend on the individual fighter more than anything. McGregor has, after all, defeated plenty of grapplers, including some great ones. But against the best grapplers, such as Khabib (and possibly Tony Ferguson), there's not much a striker like McGregor can do to prevent the inevitable (a takedown or submission).
Krav is actually quite similar to Sambo. Krav is essentially the Israeli military's equivalent to the Soviet military's Sambo. The version of Sambo we see in MMA today (used by Russian/Dagestani fighters like Khabib) is a combat-sport variant of Sambo. The original Sambo was a military combat system designed to disarm and kill armed enemies, much like Krav. Khabib's dad himself was actually an elite Soviet army veteran, before he became a MMA coach teaching a combat-sport version of Sambo in the post-Soviet era.
In turn, both Krav and Sambo are ultimately rooted in Jujutsu (not to be confused with BJJ, which is a modern combat-sport variant). Jujutsu was originally a military combat system in feudal Japan, designed to disarm and kill Samurai armed with Katana swords. Modern-day Jujutsu-rooted combat systems generally fall under two sub-branches: military combat systems (e.g. CQC, Sambo, Krav, military judo, etc.) and sport-combat systems (e.g. BJJ, sport judo, sport sambo, etc.).
Ehhhh, I wouldn't say that. Yeah, they both come from a background of being developed a military combat styles but they really don't train the same. Sambo trains more like wrestling, where you spend some time drilling and learning it but then you spend a significant portion of your time trying to do it to someone who is doing everything in their power to try to do it to you instead. BJJ is the same way, even moreso than Japanese Jiu-Jitsu historically. Guys who join BJJ who come from wrestling or Sambo backgrounds know how to wrestle, and that's huge. The fundamentals of those arts is in common with other grappling arts even if the positions don't look exactly the same. Krav looks was different when you get to the ground than BJJ or one of those. Also, from what I know of Krav they train more like Kung Fu or Karate schools where it's a lot of time drilling techniques but not a lot of time doing free sparring. I'm not trying to argue efficacy, but anything where you spend a lot of time actually doing it in a situation where someone is trying to do it to you (free sparring as opposed to something like combat drills) then you start to build practical skills quickly. I'd say this applies to any "art" or "sport" or "system", regardless of whether it's a grappling art or not. That's why I'd put most traditional boxers over someone who trains karate most places.
Also, BJJ wasn't developed as a combat sport, but that's what it evolved in to. The Gracies developed it as a straight up fighting style.
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