What can the U.S> do to stop the over-dependence on outsourcing?

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]

[QUOTE="Mafiree"] If US currency can buy more goods in south-east Asia that will only exasperate the supposed problem (outsourcing)........Mafiree

We should target a high tech economy. And having a higher purchasing power relative to the world won't hurt us at all in that area. It would allow our standard of living to remain while potentially dropping elsewhere as well.

I don't see anything good from matching the devaluation going on. It's not like we export much anyways. And what we do (commodities, planes, high tech, etc.) have little competition anyways.

[QUOTE="Mafiree"][QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Not if government spending and corporate taxes were lowered. We haven't made the stuff they make over there for a long time now.

We should target a high tech economy. And having a higher purchasing power relative to the world won't hurt us at all in that area. It would allow our standard of living to remain while potentially dropping elsewhere as well.

I don't see anything good from matching the devaluation going on. It's not like we export much anyways. And what we do (commodities, planes, high tech, etc.) have little competition anyways.

KC_Hokie

We outsource way to much, and while not entirely the issue with the U.S. economy, fixing it would help A LOT. Now what are we doing wrong and how should we fix it? Should we pass some bills that cause isolation in areas of trade? Should we have international companies have companies in the states to manage designs and manufacturing? Canon-Gatorade

I read an article in Time magazine a few years ago that talked about how Germany was doing well for its ability to keep the talent in Germany.  Many technical colleges in Germany are free and they extend this privilege to some foreigners as well.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505145_162-37240853/attending-college-for-free-overseas/

What this does is maintain a healthy domestic product.  Instead of investing heavily into outsourcing, Germany has instead made the investment into free (or heavily subsidized) education for the students of Germany.  The cost comes out of taxes and lowers outsourcing and unemployment rates all over the country.

The US is a much bigger country of course, but if I had to guess, adopting a similarly discounted form of low cost or free education, even just vocational, would boost our internal product and lower outsourcing.

http://www.ehow.com/list_6509386_list-tuition-universities-germany.html

Also, are we still discussing the "trickle down" theory of economy?

Unfortuantely the genie is out of the bottle.  Once you have globalization, you're always going to find markets that can offer cheaper sources of labor.  That's why industrial jobs have dried up.  You can blame companies for outsourcing jobs, but they're just going the pathway of least resistance.  You can't compete with competitors who can pay their labor half as much.

[QUOTE="Canon-Gatorade"][QUOTE="EmpCom"] None of which are youEmpCom

[QUOTE="Canon-Gatorade"]We outsource way to much, and while not entirely the issue with the U.S. economy, fixing it would help A LOT. Now what are we doing wrong and how should we fix it? Should we pass some bills that cause isolation in areas of trade? Should we have international companies have companies in the states to manage designs and manufacturing? starfox15

I read an article in Time magazine a few years ago that talked about how Germany was doing well for its ability to keep the talent in Germany.  Many technical colleges in Germany are free and they extend this privilege to some foreigners as well.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505145_162-37240853/attending-college-for-free-overseas/

What this does is maintain a healthy domestic product.  Instead of investing heavily into outsourcing, Germany has instead made the investment into free (or heavily subsidized) education for the students of Germany.  The cost comes out of taxes and lowers outsourcing and unemployment rates all over the country.

The US is a much bigger country of course, but if I had to guess, adopting a similarly discounted form of low cost or free education, even just vocational, would boost our internal product and lower outsourcing.

http://www.ehow.com/list_6509386_list-tuition-universities-germany.html

Also, are we still discussing the "trickle down" theory of economy?

Nothing at all. Offshoring jobs is a net benefit to the U.S..

[QUOTE="Canon-Gatorade"]We outsource way to much, and while not entirely the issue with the U.S. economy, fixing it would help A LOT. Now what are we doing wrong and how should we fix it? Should we pass some bills that cause isolation in areas of trade? Should we have international companies have companies in the states to manage designs and manufacturing? starfox15

I read an article in Time magazine a few years ago that talked about how Germany was doing well for its ability to keep the talent in Germany.  Many technical colleges in Germany are free and they extend this privilege to some foreigners as well.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505145_162-37240853/attending-college-for-free-overseas/

What this does is maintain a healthy domestic product.  Instead of investing heavily into outsourcing, Germany has instead made the investment into free (or heavily subsidized) education for the students of Germany.  The cost comes out of taxes and lowers outsourcing and unemployment rates all over the country.

The US is a much bigger country of course, but if I had to guess, adopting a similarly discounted form of low cost or free education, even just vocational, would boost our internal product and lower outsourcing.

http://www.ehow.com/list_6509386_list-tuition-universities-germany.html

Also, are we still discussing the "trickle down" theory of economy?

Germany can stay competitive as a manufacturer because the Eurozone props them up and they pay lower wages than most of their Eurozone rivals compared to their productivity. Subsidized education is great for improving social mobility and average productivity but I doubt its effect on German export competitiveness is at all significant compared to the fact that they've got the second largest consumer market in the world captive.

Planes aren't competitive? Boeing vs Airbus.......KC_Hokie

Didn't you take an oath to leave this site if Obama was re-elected? The way you lie you should consider politics yourself.

Unfortuantely the genie is out of the bottle.  Once you have globalization, you're always going to find markets that can offer cheaper sources of labor.  That's why industrial jobs have dried up.  You can blame companies for outsourcing jobs, but they're just going the pathway of least resistance.  You can't compete with competitors who can pay their labor half as much.

sonicare

Have to become more competitive. Lower corporate tax rates and fewer regulations. Less government as a percentage of GDP.

KC_Hokie

[QUOTE="Squeets"]

Nothing.

Why? Capitalism.

You have a software business.  You want to make money.

Why pay an American $150k a year plus benefits when you can hire an equally (if not more) qualified Indian for example to do it for $20k a year and no benefits?

They could completely remove corporate tax, that wouldn't change the cheapness of overseas labor.  What do you suggest we do? Introduce market wide US protectionism... 1000% tariffs on all imports... Tell the rest of the world we aren't going to buy foreign, but they should buy from us at an extreme premium... What are you stupid?

Not to mention less risk/liability overseas... I know someone who works for an oil company overseas... They hire on-site guys to do some of the skilled work on rigs and ships for pennies on the dollar what it would cost to send a European/American out there... Some guy recently had his arm crushed in an accident... If that happened to an American, he would get severence in the hundreds of thousands and probably sue the company for millions... The on-site local (from Southeast Asia) that it happened to was given $10,000 and sent on his way after having his arm amputated.

Canon-Gatorade

That's communist talk you damn dirty red!

[QUOTE="Squeets"]

Nothing.

Why? Capitalism.

You have a software business.  You want to make money.

Why pay an American $150k a year plus benefits when you can hire an equally (if not more) qualified Indian for example to do it for $20k a year and no benefits?

They could completely remove corporate tax, that wouldn't change the cheapness of overseas labor.  What do you suggest we do? Introduce market wide US protectionism... 1000% tariffs on all imports... Tell the rest of the world we aren't going to buy foreign, but they should buy from us at an extreme premium... What are you stupid?

Not to mention less risk/liability overseas... I know someone who works for an oil company overseas... They hire on-site guys to do some of the skilled work on rigs and ships for pennies on the dollar what it would cost to send a European/American out there... Some guy recently had his arm crushed in an accident... If that happened to an American, he would get severence in the hundreds of thousands and probably sue the company for millions... The on-site local (from Southeast Asia) that it happened to was given $10,000 and sent on his way after having his arm amputated.

Canon-Gatorade

That's communist talk you damn dirty red!

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]

Have to become more competitive. Lower corporate tax rates and fewer regulations. Less government as a percentage of GDP.

Mochyc

[QUOTE="Canon-Gatorade"][QUOTE="Squeets"]

Nothing.

Why? Capitalism.

You have a software business.  You want to make money.

Why pay an American $150k a year plus benefits when you can hire an equally (if not more) qualified Indian for example to do it for $20k a year and no benefits?

They could completely remove corporate tax, that wouldn't change the cheapness of overseas labor.  What do you suggest we do? Introduce market wide US protectionism... 1000% tariffs on all imports... Tell the rest of the world we aren't going to buy foreign, but they should buy from us at an extreme premium... What are you stupid?

Not to mention less risk/liability overseas... I know someone who works for an oil company overseas... They hire on-site guys to do some of the skilled work on rigs and ships for pennies on the dollar what it would cost to send a European/American out there... Some guy recently had his arm crushed in an accident... If that happened to an American, he would get severence in the hundreds of thousands and probably sue the company for millions... The on-site local (from Southeast Asia) that it happened to was given $10,000 and sent on his way after having his arm amputated.

Squeets

That's communist talk you damn dirty red!

Most of the outsourcing is of low wage jobs. Solution: our work force has to be more skilled so we will dominate the high level skill positions. Diablo-B

Have to become more competitive. Lower corporate tax rates and fewer regulations. Less government as a percentage of GDP.

KC_Hokie

Not saying lower taxes is a bad thing of course, but in the context of this discussion it would have no effect.

The only things that would make a difference is:

a) Equalization of pay/cost.  This actually already happens fairly often, for instance some of the countries that were extremely popular for outsourcing years ago are getting much less attractive.  The reason?  Standard of living INCREASED in those countires, forcing wages up equalizing the costs.  The problem?  Companies simply find less developed countries yet again and just outsource there instead.

b) Large proficeincy gap...meaning our work force is just so much better than outsourced resources using those resources would cause your product to be at a competative disadvantage.  Aside from a few specialized areas though, this isn't a big equalizer as the workforce in other **** is actually pretty damn good.

[QUOTE="Canon-Gatorade"][QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]

Have to become more competitive. Lower corporate tax rates and fewer regulations. Less government as a percentage of GDP.

KC_Hokie

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]

Have to become more competitive. Lower corporate tax rates and fewer regulations. Less government as a percentage of GDP.

Renevent42

Not saying lower taxes is a bad thing of course, but in the context of this discussion it would have no effect.

The only things that would make a difference is:

a) Equalization of pay/cost. This actually already happens fairly often, for instance some of the countries that were extremely popular for outsourcing years ago are getting much less attractive. The reason? Standard of living INCREASED in those countires, forcing wages up equalizing the costs. The problem? Companies simply find less developed countries yet again and just outsource there instead.

b) Large proficeincy gap...meaning our work force is just so much better than outsourced resources using those resources would cause your product to be at a competative disadvantage. Aside from a few specialized areas though, this isn't a big equalizer as the workforce in other **** is actually pretty damn good.

Also you have to factor in that China has such a massive population that it will take a long time for them to increase there overall standard of living to anything comparable to western nations, if it's even possible at all. China has an almost endless supply of cheap labour.

[QUOTE="Mochyc"][QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]

Have to become more competitive. Lower corporate tax rates and fewer regulations. Less government as a percentage of GDP.

KC_Hokie

[QUOTE="Diablo-B"]Most of the outsourcing is of low wage jobs. Solution: our work force has to be more skilled so we will dominate the high level skill positions. Sarkyfritz

Lower taxes and less government.

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"][QUOTE="MakeMeaSammitch"]bush did that. 

I vaguely recall an explosion of debt.

MakeMeaSammitch

We would see the same thing with corperate debt.

Maybe if CEOs weren't payed so well, we could afford to create more jobs here at home.

:lol:

Lower taxes and less government.

LazySloth718

Nope that wouldn't help and would actually exacerbate the problem.

Have to become more competitive. Lower corporate tax rates and fewer regulations. Less government as a percentage of GDP.

KC_Hokie

  Out sourcing needs to be punished and development in the United States needs to be promoted.. If companies want to out source, fine.. But they cannot have the same benefits and they should be penalized if they still wish to use the US economic environment to their advantage.. 

[QUOTE="Canon-Gatorade"][QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Allows corporations keep a higher percentage of their profits which they can reinvest which included hiring. We haven't touched our corporate tax rates since the mid-80s.

KC_Hokie

And lowering corporate tax rates means more profit for corporations which means more investing which means more spending, jobs, etc.

Once again, the common solution is to give away benefits and taxpayer money to "fix" the problem.  Instead of actually trying to compete by deregulating and having a large reduction in taxes (across the board, not just corporations), they simply want to throw money at them, hoping they will stay.  One minute i will read about how evil corporations are for taking advantage of laws and loopholes to save money, and the next i'm reading how the government should pick and choose which ones to give benefits to.  Wow.  

i'm all for lowering corporate tax rates but i'm not deluded enough to think that it will help this even slightly. hokie is overlooking the fact that US companies are raking in record after-tax profits and sitting on massive piles of liquidity and not doing anything with it, so giving them more money won't exactly cause a huge economic revivalAbbeten

We made cooperate taxes much lower in Canada and we are looking at around 1% growth for this year in GDP. We have record level cooperate profit but they are not hiring. The global collapse of capitalism was great for them. The middle class is going out of North America and tax breaks will never fix it. Middle wage jobs have been in large part replaced by low income jobs.

 When we learn that we cant count of a system based on imaginary wealth that promotes greed we might change and some thing different.

[QUOTE="Renevent42"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]

Have to become more competitive. Lower corporate tax rates and fewer regulations. Less government as a percentage of GDP.

Sarkyfritz

Not saying lower taxes is a bad thing of course, but in the context of this discussion it would have no effect.

The only things that would make a difference is:

a) Equalization of pay/cost. This actually already happens fairly often, for instance some of the countries that were extremely popular for outsourcing years ago are getting much less attractive. The reason? Standard of living INCREASED in those countires, forcing wages up equalizing the costs. The problem? Companies simply find less developed countries yet again and just outsource there instead.

b) Large proficeincy gap...meaning our work force is just so much better than outsourced resources using those resources would cause your product to be at a competative disadvantage. Aside from a few specialized areas though, this isn't a big equalizer as the workforce in other **** is actually pretty damn good.

Also you have to factor in that China has such a massive population that it will take a long time for them to increase there overall standard of living to anything comparable to western nations, if it's even possible at all. China has an almost endless supply of cheap labour.

We outsource way to much Canon-Gatorade

and while not entirely the issue with the U.S. economy, fixing it would help A LOT.

I suppose they can make things more expensive through tariffs but then nobody would be able to afford anything. We do love our cheaply made electronics and vehicles.DaBrainz

Actually vehicles are VERY expensive, even accounting for inflation.