US soldier who leaked info to Wikileaks being tortured?

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Darthkaiser

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#51 Darthkaiser
Member since 2006 • 12447 Posts
I tried reallllllllllly hard to stay out of this thread because I knew that a lot of comments would piss me off, and gosh, I should have gone with my initial instinct! :x I think that the way that he has been treated so far has been inappropriate. That's all I'm going to say and I'm going to do my darndest to never enter this thread again!t3hrubikscube
He's still human after all right??
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DroidPhysX

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#52 DroidPhysX
Member since 2010 • 17098 Posts

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]Seriously? Well i shouldnt say im surprised given your sig, which i will comment that Lincoln was a liberal president. How did this guy disrespect the law in every single way again?

fidosim

Our military gave him a high-privilege, and he used that privilede to sell us down the river. He swore an oath to defend us against enemies foreign and domestic, and became himself a domestic enemy.

Wikileaks isnt considerend an enemy/terroist according to the U.S.

Not to mention the United States can't prosecute Wikileaks for anything:

New York Times Co. v. United States protects wikileaks....

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deactivated-5fc147aeeb0aa

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#53 deactivated-5fc147aeeb0aa
Member since 2009 • 8315 Posts

[QUOTE="t3hrubikscube"]I tried reallllllllllly hard to stay out of this thread because I knew that a lot of comments would piss me off, and gosh, I should have gone with my initial instinct! :x I think that the way that he has been treated so far has been inappropriate. That's all I'm going to say and I'm going to do my darndest to never enter this thread again!Darthkaiser
He's still human after all right??

And even though it was illegal, I am proud of the guy in a way because I want to know the truth. The people deserve to know it.

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xLFTMx

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#54 xLFTMx
Member since 2010 • 987 Posts

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]Seriously? Well i shouldnt say im surprised given your sig, which i will comment that Lincoln was a liberal president. How did this guy disrespect the law in every single way again?

fidosim

Our military gave him a high-privilege, and he used that privilede to sell us down the river. He swore an oath to defend us against enemies foreign and domestic, and became himself a domestic enemy.

He defended the people against government lies. Them trying to hide the statistics on civilian casualties is horrific..

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fidosim

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#55 fidosim
Member since 2003 • 12901 Posts
[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]

[QUOTE="fidosim"]

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]Seriously? Well i shouldnt say im surprised given your sig, which i will comment that Lincoln was a liberal president. How did this guy disrespect the law in every single way again?

Our military gave him a high-privilege, and he used that privilede to sell us down the river. He swore an oath to defend us against enemies foreign and domestic, and became himself a domestic enemy.

Wikileaks isnt considerend an enemy/terroist according to the U.S.

Not to mention the United States can't prosecute Wikileaks for anything:

New York Times Co. v. United States protects wikileaks....

He had special access to the information that he leaked...and he leaked it. He betrayed our trust.
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GabuEx

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#56 GabuEx
Member since 2006 • 36552 Posts

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]

[QUOTE="fidosim"] I don't think you'll find many conservatives who don't have enormous respect for the law. This guy disrespected the law in the worst possible way. fidosim

I don't see conservatives having much respect for the health care reform law. :P

That's not to say they don't agree with certain laws. :P But really, we're the ones who are afraid of change right? We like traditions...precedents...laws.

Yes, but my point in saying that is that the statement "I have respect for the law" is really a meaningless statement.

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DroidPhysX

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#57 DroidPhysX
Member since 2010 • 17098 Posts

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]

[QUOTE="fidosim"] Our military gave him a high-privilege, and he used that privilede to sell us down the river. He swore an oath to defend us against enemies foreign and domestic, and became himself a domestic enemy.

fidosim

Wikileaks isnt considerend an enemy/terroist according to the U.S.

Not to mention the United States can't prosecute Wikileaks for anything:

New York Times Co. v. United States protects wikileaks....

He had special access to the information that he leaked...and he leaked it. He betrayed our trust.

And props to him. People in this country need to get off their high horse and see that what he did was better for everyone.

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fidosim

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#58 fidosim
Member since 2003 • 12901 Posts
Lincoln was a liberal president.DroidPhysX
Not by your standards.
Let every American, every lover of liberty, every well wisher to his posterity, swear by the blood of the Revolution, never to violate in the least particular, the laws of the country; and never to tolerate their violation by others. As the patriots of seventy-six did to the support of the Declaration of Independence, so to the support of the Constitution and Laws, let every American pledge his life, his property, and his sacred honor;--let every man remember that to violate the law, is to trample on the blood of his father, and to tear the character of his own, and his children's liberty. Let reverence for the laws, be breathed by every American mother, to the lisping babe, that prattles on her lap--let it be taught in schools, in seminaries, and in colleges; let it be written in Primers, spelling books, and in Almanacs;--let it be preached from the pulpit, proclaimed in legislative halls, and enforced in courts of justice. And, in short, let it become the political religion of the nation; and let the old and the young, the rich and the poor, the grave and the gay of all sexes and tongues, and colors and conditions, sacrifice unceasingly upon its altars.Abraham_Lincoln
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SepticSangreal

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#59 SepticSangreal
Member since 2011 • 302 Posts

This all is just preparing him for Canto 34 :)

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z4twenny

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#60 z4twenny
Member since 2006 • 4898 Posts

[QUOTE="fidosim"][QUOTE="DroidPhysX"] Wikileaks isnt considerend an enemy/terroist according to the U.S.

Not to mention the United States can't prosecute Wikileaks for anything:

New York Times Co. v. United States protects wikileaks....

DroidPhysX

He had special access to the information that he leaked...and he leaked it. He betrayed our trust.

And props to him. People in this country need to get off their high horse and see that what he did was better for everyone.

+1

those who would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither. - Ben Franklin

i find whats happening to him appalling and the way our gov't is reacting shows what its intentions are better than anything else.

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_R34LiTY_

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#61 _R34LiTY_
Member since 2008 • 3331 Posts

goes to show the hypocritical nature of the US. People ask for all types of transparency from the government, but as soon as they get the dirty laundry they asked for, immediately they want the leaker & publisher to face all types of scrutiny for their traitorous actions. I see nothing damaging or anything that'll pose a threat to any of US soldiers or it's coalition allies, all I see is the bad spotlight various doplimats are in thanks to the leaks.

Should he be jailed for making a few US dilpomats face turn red with embarassment for their own stupidity? Of course not.

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DroidPhysX

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#62 DroidPhysX
Member since 2010 • 17098 Posts

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"] Lincoln was a liberal president.fidosim
Not by your standards.
Let every American, every lover of liberty, every well wisher to his posterity, swear by the blood of the Revolution, never to violate in the least particular, the laws of the country; and never to tolerate their violation by others. As the patriots of seventy-six did to the support of the Declaration of Independence, so to the support of the Constitution and Laws, let every American pledge his life, his property, and his sacred honor;--let every man remember that to violate the law, is to trample on the blood of his father, and to tear the character of his own, and his children's liberty. Let reverence for the laws, be breathed by every American mother, to the lisping babe, that prattles on her lap--let it be taught in schools, in seminaries, and in colleges; let it be written in Primers, spelling books, and in Almanacs;--let it be preached from the pulpit, proclaimed in legislative halls, and enforced in courts of justice. And, in short, let it become the political religion of the nation; and let the old and the young, the rich and the poor, the grave and the gay of all sexes and tongues, and colors and conditions, sacrifice unceasingly upon its altars.Abraham_Lincoln

And yet, he prevented the States from declaring nullification (which goes against states rights. Last time i checked conservatives like states rights over federal). He sent troops and fought the south to maintain the country. When was the last time you saw a conservative president sending federal troops in the south to make them follow federal law?

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WhiteKnight77

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#63 WhiteKnight77
Member since 2003 • 12605 Posts

What he did was treasonous and most likely the reason why he is kept in solitary is so that he doesn't have the living daylights beat out of him.

People also fail to realize is that when you join the military, the UCMJ governs your actions and decrees what is a courts-martial offense and what is an Article 15 offense where your CO adjudicates the charges.

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Lonelynight

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#64 Lonelynight
Member since 2006 • 30051 Posts
Isn't torturing people illegal?
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lamprey263

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#65 lamprey263
Member since 2006 • 44503 Posts
for starters it hasn't been proven Pvt Manning has provided any information to Assange, for what I know the text log only stated he wanted to, and if that were true they are not doing this to him simply because he provided the info, they're trying to make him say that Assange asked him to leak the info so that they have a case against Assange in the United States, Assange wouldn't have done anything wrong if Pvt. Manning simply gave him the info, but if Assange had asked Manning to give up the info then Assange could be tried, that's why they're treating Pvt. Manning like this... and yeah I do consider it torture, it'd be considered so by the United Nations, it's a mixture of the induced psychological trauma he's endured for the purpose of extracting a confession out of him
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GabuEx

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#66 GabuEx
Member since 2006 • 36552 Posts

Isn't torturing people illegal?Lonelynight

All you really have to do is to say it isn't torture. :P

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Artekus

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#67 Artekus
Member since 2008 • 15700 Posts
Poor guy.
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DroidPhysX

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#68 DroidPhysX
Member since 2010 • 17098 Posts

What he did was treasonous and most likely the reason why he is kept in solitary is so that he doesn't have the living daylights beat out of him.

People also fail to realize is that when you join the military, the UCMJ governs your actions and decrees what is a courts-martial offense and what is an Article 15 offense where your CO adjudicates the charges.

WhiteKnight77

Except for the fact that Wikileaks isnt recognized as a terroist oranization by the U.S.

How can it be treason if he didnt betray the country by turning in information to a news journal entity?

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Dark_Knight6

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#69 Dark_Knight6
Member since 2006 • 16619 Posts

Before clicking on this thread, I thought to myself that it would take at least ten posts before somsone says something along the lines of "he deserves it" or "don't care". Got there in four. Good job, OT. We Americans are all for freedom until someone who may be guilty of doing something illegal has them taken away. Then it's "Yeah, f*** that guy".

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8-Bitterness

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#70 8-Bitterness
Member since 2009 • 3707 Posts
He's a goddamn hero. It's a shame for that to happen.
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DroidPhysX

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#72 DroidPhysX
Member since 2010 • 17098 Posts

Well, people who wants to betray this country, please have a second thought.magicalclick
Surprised the New York times haven't been tried in court yet. They get the leaks in advance following wikileaks.

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#73 Ninja-Hippo
Member since 2008 • 23434 Posts

You should also say he a brave criminal ;)

AngelNeo00

Stating the obvious.

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WhiteKnight77

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#74 WhiteKnight77
Member since 2003 • 12605 Posts

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

What he did was treasonous and most likely the reason why he is kept in solitary is so that he doesn't have the living daylights beat out of him.

People also fail to realize is that when you join the military, the UCMJ governs your actions and decrees what is a courts-martial offense and what is an Article 15 offense where your CO adjudicates the charges.

DroidPhysX

Except for the fact that Wikileaks isnt recognized as a terroist oranization by the U.S.

How can it be treason if he didnt betray the country by turning in information to a news journal entity?

When you are given a security clearance, you promise to not release any information you may or may not handle or read to any one who does not have the same clearance. You are entrusted to said secrets. When you give said secrets to anyone that is not cleared for such information, you have betrayed said trust and that is the definition of treason. Assange being Australian doesn't have a US security clearance and as such, not entitled to receive classified US documents.

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SF_KiLLaMaN

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#75 SF_KiLLaMaN
Member since 2007 • 6446 Posts

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

What he did was treasonous and most likely the reason why he is kept in solitary is so that he doesn't have the living daylights beat out of him.

People also fail to realize is that when you join the military, the UCMJ governs your actions and decrees what is a courts-martial offense and what is an Article 15 offense where your CO adjudicates the charges.

DroidPhysX

Except for the fact that Wikileaks isnt recognized as a terroist oranization by the U.S.

How can it be treason if he didnt betray the country by turning in information to a news journal entity?

He DID betray the country. It is not like the only things on there were political and civilian casualties. He also gave away defensive positions and informant information. That IS TREASON. I thought treason was punishable by death.

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DroidPhysX

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#76 DroidPhysX
Member since 2010 • 17098 Posts

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

What he did was treasonous and most likely the reason why he is kept in solitary is so that he doesn't have the living daylights beat out of him.

People also fail to realize is that when you join the military, the UCMJ governs your actions and decrees what is a courts-martial offense and what is an Article 15 offense where your CO adjudicates the charges.

WhiteKnight77

Except for the fact that Wikileaks isnt recognized as a terroist oranization by the U.S.

How can it be treason if he didnt betray the country by turning in information to a news journal entity?

When you are given a security clearance, you promise to not release any information you may or may not handle or read to any one who does not have the same clearance. You are entrusted to said secrets. When you give said secrets to anyone that is not cleared for such information, you have betrayed said trust and that is the definition of treason. Assange being Australian doesn't have a US security clearance and as such, not entitled to receive classified US documents.

Cool. Google, New York Times Co. v. United States. Thats why Assange and Wikileaks are protected from any prosecution.

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one_plum

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#77 one_plum
Member since 2009 • 6816 Posts

Before clicking on this thread, I thought to myself that it would take at least ten posts before somsone says something along the lines of "he deserves it" or "don't care". Got there in four. Good job, OT. We Americans are all for freedom until someone who may be guilty of doing something illegal has them taken away. Then it's "Yeah, f*** that guy".

Dark_Knight6

Emotions usually take over rationality when things get personal; normal behaviour I believe.

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Ninja-Hippo

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#78 Ninja-Hippo
Member since 2008 • 23434 Posts
Forget all the legal nonsense of the oath he took or the level of his clearance; can anyone say with a straight face that what he did was WRONG, ethically? Heck no.
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#79 Hockey_Slayer
Member since 2004 • 3213 Posts

Really. This is the first I have heard of this. He should not be getting punished the way he is for what he did. So much worse goes on this world and he gets tortured like this?

Also some of these comments make me sick.

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Dark__Link

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#80 Dark__Link
Member since 2003 • 32653 Posts
Forget all the legal nonsense of the oath he took or the level of his clearance; can anyone say with a straight face that what he did was WRONG, ethically? Heck no. Ninja-Hippo
Glad you've taken it upon yourself to speak for others.
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GabuEx

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#81 GabuEx
Member since 2006 • 36552 Posts

Forget all the legal nonsense of the oath he took or the level of his clearance; can anyone say with a straight face that what he did was WRONG, ethically? Heck no. Ninja-Hippo

Well you can if you assert that his actions lead to deaths, which many do assert... and which, to my knowledge, is something even the Pentagon has said is not true.

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SF_KiLLaMaN

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#82 SF_KiLLaMaN
Member since 2007 • 6446 Posts

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"] Except for the fact that Wikileaks isnt recognized as a terroist oranization by the U.S.

How can it be treason if he didnt betray the country by turning in information to a news journal entity?

DroidPhysX

When you are given a security clearance, you promise to not release any information you may or may not handle or read to any one who does not have the same clearance. You are entrusted to said secrets. When you give said secrets to anyone that is not cleared for such information, you have betrayed said trust and that is the definition of treason. Assange being Australian doesn't have a US security clearance and as such, not entitled to receive classified US documents.

Cool. Google, New York Times Co. v. United States. Thats why Assange and Wikileaks are protected from any prosecution.

We are talking about the person who gave wikileaks the info, not wikileaks. These are two completely different issues. The person who gave the info to wikileaks did commit treason.

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Hockey_Slayer

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#83 Hockey_Slayer
Member since 2004 • 3213 Posts

Forget all the legal nonsense of the oath he took or the level of his clearance; can anyone say with a straight face that what he did was WRONG, ethically? Heck no. Ninja-Hippo
Couldn't of said it better myself. What's going on here is just wrong on so many levels, and what'sscary about it is the people agreeing with this bs.

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worlock77

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#84 worlock77
Member since 2009 • 22552 Posts

He did nothing treasonous. He did nothing to actively harm the country. At worst he cause us a bit of embarrassment. We all cry about wanting transparancy and accountability in government, but when someone actually gives it to us we want him drawn and quartered. Make up your goddamn mind America.

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DroidPhysX

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#85 DroidPhysX
Member since 2010 • 17098 Posts

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]

[QUOTE="WhiteKnight77"]When you are given a security clearance, you promise to not release any information you may or may not handle or read to any one who does not have the same clearance. You are entrusted to said secrets. When you give said secrets to anyone that is not cleared for such information, you have betrayed said trust and that is the definition of treason. Assange being Australian doesn't have a US security clearance and as such, not entitled to receive classified US documents.

SF_KiLLaMaN

Cool. Google, New York Times Co. v. United States. Thats why Assange and Wikileaks are protected from any prosecution.

We are talking about the person who game wikileaks the info, not wikileaks. These are two completely different issues.

But wikileaks isnt considered a terroist organization by the United states. How is it treason? How is the U.S. gonna prosecute him when Wikileaks wasnt labled a 'terroist organization'?

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cmdrmonkey45

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#86 cmdrmonkey45
Member since 2010 • 360 Posts

No, he's not being tortured. But you cant fit 'being treated really, really badly for all these reasons' in a topic title.

So the young soldier who gave information to Wikileaks has been kept in solitary confinement for 254 days in a maximum security prison. He is not allowed to workout in his cell, is given just one hour a day to leave and walk around (by himself) and is forced to endure very harsh lights at night time when he wants to sleep.

Ninja-Hippo

This is torture. I don't care how our government tries to spin it.

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SF_KiLLaMaN

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#87 SF_KiLLaMaN
Member since 2007 • 6446 Posts

[QUOTE="SF_KiLLaMaN"][QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]

Cool. Google, New York Times Co. v. United States. Thats why Assange and Wikileaks are protected from any prosecution.

DroidPhysX

We are talking about the person who game wikileaks the info, not wikileaks. These are two completely different issues.

But wikileaks isnt considered a terroist organization by the United states. How is it treason? How is the U.S. gonna prosecute him when Wikileaks wasnt labled a 'terroist organization'?

lol, it doesn't have to be a terrorist organization that you are giving the info to for it to be treason. Treason is just betraying your country. he betrayed his country by giving out classified info to people who were not cleared to see it. It is as simple as that.
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AngelNeo00

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#88 AngelNeo00
Member since 2009 • 392 Posts
Forget all the legal nonsense of the oath he took or the level of his clearance; can anyone say with a straight face that what he did was WRONG, ethically? Heck no. Ninja-Hippo
Stop speaking for others. He betrayed the trust of his fellow comrades. He swore he wouldn't divulge certain information and he did.
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SolidSnake35

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#89 SolidSnake35
Member since 2005 • 58971 Posts
[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]Forget all the legal nonsense of the oath he took or the level of his clearance; can anyone say with a straight face that what he did was WRONG, ethically? Heck no. AngelNeo00
Stop speaking for others. He betrayed the trust of his fellow comrades. He swore he wouldn't divulge certain information and he did.

Do his comrades care?
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nobodylive

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#90 nobodylive
Member since 2005 • 1880 Posts
What the hell is this, a single person concentration camp?!
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#91 DroidPhysX
Member since 2010 • 17098 Posts

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]

[QUOTE="SF_KiLLaMaN"] We are talking about the person who game wikileaks the info, not wikileaks. These are two completely different issues. SF_KiLLaMaN

But wikileaks isnt considered a terroist organization by the United states. How is it treason? How is the U.S. gonna prosecute him when Wikileaks wasnt labled a 'terroist organization'?

lol, it doesn't have to be a terrorist organization that you are giving the info to for it to be treason. Treason is just betraying your country. he betrayed his country by giving out classified info to people who were not cleared to see it. It is as simple as that.

Betrayed his country? To a news organization right. It goes back to the New York times case.

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SF_KiLLaMaN

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#92 SF_KiLLaMaN
Member since 2007 • 6446 Posts

[QUOTE="SF_KiLLaMaN"][QUOTE="DroidPhysX"] But wikileaks isnt considered a terroist organization by the United states. How is it treason? How is the U.S. gonna prosecute him when Wikileaks wasnt labled a 'terroist organization'?

DroidPhysX

lol, it doesn't have to be a terrorist organization that you are giving the info to for it to be treason. Treason is just betraying your country. he betrayed his country by giving out classified info to people who were not cleared to see it. It is as simple as that.

Betrayed his country? To a news organization right. It goes back to the New York times case.

The point is he gave out classified information. Giving out classified information is treason. I really can't be any clearer...
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cmdrmonkey45

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#93 cmdrmonkey45
Member since 2010 • 360 Posts

52 years is light, he's a traitormfp16

I disagree. I think he's a patriot and a hero who helped expose our government for the evil fascist/corporatist police state that it is.

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Ace6301

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#94 Ace6301
Member since 2005 • 21389 Posts
[QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]Forget all the legal nonsense of the oath he took or the level of his clearance; can anyone say with a straight face that what he did was WRONG, ethically? Heck no. AngelNeo00
Stop speaking for others. He betrayed the trust of his fellow comrades. He swore he wouldn't divulge certain information and he did.

...So? While that's not really a nice thing to do it's still not ethically wrong. No one was killed or harmed because of this. Well except for the dude who's being tortured now. Disproportionate retribution is rather immature in my mind.
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Grodus5

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#95 Grodus5
Member since 2006 • 7934 Posts

We pay tax dollars, we vote for the politicians, we deserve to know that the heck is going on with out government. The man who leaked the information should be punished, however, but not that harshly.

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DroidPhysX

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#96 DroidPhysX
Member since 2010 • 17098 Posts

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]

[QUOTE="SF_KiLLaMaN"] lol, it doesn't have to be a terrorist organization that you are giving the info to for it to be treason. Treason is just betraying your country. he betrayed his country by giving out classified info to people who were not cleared to see it. It is as simple as that.SF_KiLLaMaN

Betrayed his country? To a news organization right. It goes back to the New York times case.

The point is he gave out classified information. Giving out classified information is treason. I really can't be any clearer...

Surpirsed the guy who leaked the Vietnam information wasnt tried for treason. Or the guy who leaked the Nixon info wasnt tried for treason. I mean, they did leak classified information right?

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worlock77

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#97 worlock77
Member since 2009 • 22552 Posts

[QUOTE="SF_KiLLaMaN"][QUOTE="DroidPhysX"] But wikileaks isnt considered a terroist organization by the United states. How is it treason? How is the U.S. gonna prosecute him when Wikileaks wasnt labled a 'terroist organization'?

DroidPhysX

lol, it doesn't have to be a terrorist organization that you are giving the info to for it to be treason. Treason is just betraying your country. he betrayed his country by giving out classified info to people who were not cleared to see it. It is as simple as that.

Betrayed his country? To a news organization right. It goes back to the New York times case.

Using that reasoning every "anonymous source" inside the White House/FBI/Department of Defense/Senator's office/etc who leaks a story to a new organization is guilty of treason.

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T_P_O

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#98 T_P_O
Member since 2008 • 5388 Posts

If those harsh lights are implemented during the night to cause sleep deprivation (which otherwise, I don't see need or use for them), then that's a pretty clear cut and classic case of psychological torture.

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AngelNeo00

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#99 AngelNeo00
Member since 2009 • 392 Posts
[QUOTE="AngelNeo00"][QUOTE="Ninja-Hippo"]Forget all the legal nonsense of the oath he took or the level of his clearance; can anyone say with a straight face that what he did was WRONG, ethically? Heck no. SolidSnake35
Stop speaking for others. He betrayed the trust of his fellow comrades. He swore he wouldn't divulge certain information and he did.

Do his comrades care?

Maybe comrades is the wrong word. But if officers trust you with classified information and you divulge that information you basically betrayed their trust. The army is like a brotherhood so you are basically breaking the trust of the entire military. Its not fair to them
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lamprey263

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#100 lamprey263
Member since 2006 • 44503 Posts

What he did was treasonous and most likely the reason why he is kept in solitary is so that he doesn't have the living daylights beat out of him.

People also fail to realize is that when you join the military, the UCMJ governs your actions and decrees what is a courts-martial offense and what is an Article 15 offense where your CO adjudicates the charges.

WhiteKnight77
I think there's something people often overlook here, for instance one of the believed pieces leaked by Pvt Manning was the video of the helicopter attack on civilians and a Reuter's news crew, resulting in their wrongful deaths, information about the incident was kept classified and but it wasn't kept classified because it had anything to do with maintaining national security, it was kept classified to avoid accountability, and doing so to avoid accountability is an abuse of the privilege to classify such information since to do so is only self serving