Twitch streamer banned for saying only two genders

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Avatar image for Ace132
#1 Posted by Ace132 (1515 posts) -

Https://www.news.com.au/technology/home-entertainment/gaming/gamer-reportedly-banned-from-twitch-for-claiming-there-are-only-two-genders/news-story/80d33347cc41fae6959d45d5d6eead82

Ridiculous, what has our society come to? Simple facts and you get banned which affects their livelihood. No wonder populism is rising

Avatar image for foxhound_fox
#2 Edited by foxhound_fox (97827 posts) -

How is it "fact" that there are only two genders? Gender is a spectrum and biological sex isn't binary either (hormonal and chromosomal differences causing ambiguous genitalia).

And what's wrong with him getting banned? Twitch is a privately owned company with rules they require everyone follow. Break the rules, seeya later.

As someone who actually works for a living, I find it funny when people complain that their "livelihood" of playing video games for ad revenue is taken away from them.

Avatar image for x_karen_x
#3 Posted by X_Karen_x (500 posts) -

@foxhound_fox:

Male and female.

Avatar image for Serraph105
#4 Edited by Serraph105 (33528 posts) -

@Ace132:

@foxhound_fox said:

How is it "fact" that there are only two genders? Gender is a spectrum and biological sex isn't binary either (hormonal and chromosomal differences causing ambiguous genitalia).

And what's wrong with him getting banned? Twitch is a privately owned company with rules they require everyone follow. Break the rules, seeya later.

As someone who actually works for a living, I find it funny when people complain that their "livelihood" of playing video games for ad revenue is taken away from them.

I'd like to point out that this rule applies to almost the entire internet as well, if not the entirety of it. It's almost all owned by private companies which means "freedom of speech" is not protected in this space of the world.

Avatar image for pyro1245
#5 Posted by pyro1245 (4830 posts) -

Seems like a twitchy reaction.

Avatar image for foxhound_fox
#6 Edited by foxhound_fox (97827 posts) -

@x_karen_x said:

@foxhound_fox:

Male and female.

Male and female what? Intersex is a thing, as is trans-gender. There are scientific studies that show opposing brain chemistry to assigned biological sex.

Avatar image for phbz
#7 Posted by phbz (4220 posts) -

Now he can work til at his local supermarket and make bold claims while he scans products.

Avatar image for XVision84
#8 Posted by XVision84 (15602 posts) -

Bad move. The guy shouldn't be banned for speaking his mind without hurting anyone (even though I disagree with there being only 2 genders).

Avatar image for npiet1
#9 Posted by npiet1 (1959 posts) -

@foxhound_fox: source? Never heard that. Pretty sure testosterone and estrogen are responsible for that.

Avatar image for doerevolt
#10 Posted by Doerevolt (41 posts) -

@Ace132: I think the main reason steamer got ban because she started a discussion like about how there are only two genders and get negative publicity so more people to view. Twitch doesn't allow these type of controversies.

Avatar image for GTR12
#11 Posted by GTR12 (13442 posts) -

1. Its a girl everyone, not a guy.

2. It was her opinion, she never said it was fact, just an opinion.

3. Twitch is stupid to ban her, when a known wife-abuser (MrDeadMoth) was given a measly 3 day ban until the community constantly complained and got him banned.

Avatar image for uninspiredcup
#12 Edited by uninspiredcup (32255 posts) -

@XVision84 said:

Bad move. The guy shouldn't be banned for speaking his mind without hurting anyone (even though I disagree with there being only 2 genders).

She. One of those streamers who by virtue of being attractive just sit and play a game and get a ton of free money from lonely vulnerable men. Basically the twitch equivalent of a sex phone-line where men falsely mistake sexual attraction for iove and think they might, just might have a chance. If only I donate more, if only she pays me attention over these other, fakers. Woe.

Which is kind of funny when you think about it, woman demeaning prostituting themselves for men on the other end with a bunch of Kleenex, fine. Having an opinion we don't like? bad. Not that i'm against either. If it works and pays the bills by all means knock yourself out.

Avatar image for Ovirew
#13 Posted by Ovirew (8792 posts) -

There are only two genders, or nature only intended for there to be two genders anyway. Mistakes happen, they're probably not meant to.

Avatar image for robert_sparkes
#14 Posted by robert_sparkes (2791 posts) -

I'm all for people being who they want to be but there are only 2 genders the world has gone mad.

Avatar image for XVision84
#15 Edited by XVision84 (15602 posts) -

@uninspiredcup: I'll admit I didn't even bother to read the source since things like this happen so often. Society is too sensitive about this kind of topic these days. After reading it now, she doesn't seem to be one of those boob streamers (unless they're intentionally leaving that out of the pictures).

It's sad to see desperate guys on Twitch funding those kinds of streamers. Sure it may make them money, but I don't think it's respectable even if it pays the bills.

Avatar image for x_karen_x
#16 Posted by X_Karen_x (500 posts) -

@foxhound_fox:

Can trans gender give birth? (I not know). If yes it mean person is female. Still only two gender. It scientific. Not to deal with psychology.

Avatar image for extkaras
#17 Posted by ExTKaras (2 posts) -

People need to realise that there is a difference between sex and gender. I don't care what you identify as, it has as much of a bearing no my life as the colour of the socks you're wearing, but punishing people that have a different view on the world to those that believe that there are more than two genders is just silly.

Avatar image for vfighter
#18 Posted by VFighter (4639 posts) -

@foxhound_fox: For 99.9% of the population its male or female. Some are born with either both or neither amd those are the only exceptions. Its rather simple.

Avatar image for Ace132
#19 Posted by Ace132 (1515 posts) -

@foxhound_fox:

Male female. Intersex is an abnormality.

Gender is linked with biology, it's not a social construct by itself. A girl can be tomboy and a boy can be a sissy but that's a personality not a gender. There is no need for other pronouns, you are man or woman . What's in your brain is irrelevant, because I can say I'm a woman and go to women's changing room or apply for women's basketball team, won't change any facts that I have XY chromosomes, have to check prostate, don't have womb, increased muscle and bone mass, Adams apple, list goes on.

"some women don't have wombs!"

Well that's exception, she's still a woman. A person who chops their legs or born without them is still a man/woman even though every other person has it.

Hopefully twitcher will be unbanned

Avatar image for Byshop
#20 Posted by Byshop (19522 posts) -

@GTR12 said:

1. Its a girl everyone, not a guy.

2. It was her opinion, she never said it was fact, just an opinion.

3. Twitch is stupid to ban her, when a known wife-abuser (MrDeadMoth) was given a measly 3 day ban until the community constantly complained and got him banned.

Goes to show how many people bother to read the source article before chiming in.

As for the incident, I'm curious to hear Twitch's response. Right now all we have is her version of why she got banned. When someone gets banned and seeks support, they tend to put the exact details of how they got banned in the nicest possible light.

-Byshop

Avatar image for Jacanuk
#21 Edited by Jacanuk (18131 posts) -

@Ace132: Good for twitch.

And for anyone expecting Twitch to discuss their banning policy they are in for a long wait, since they, of course, won´t discuss their internal arbitrarily ban system.

Also, is this really a topic for OT,

Avatar image for Ace132
#22 Posted by Ace132 (1515 posts) -

@Jacanuk: it's not political init twitch is private company, but they give pay outs like youtube so they will be headlining alot. Really absurd if twitch stands by their initial statement. I believe it will be overturned, i think pewdiepie will get a hold of this information and get the army to dox twitch (without forcing it). Interesting to see how it goes

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#23 Posted by Jacanuk (18131 posts) -

@Ace132 said:

@Jacanuk: it's not political init twitch is private company, but they give pay outs like youtube so they will be headlining alot. Really absurd if twitch stands by their initial statement. I believe it will be overturned, i think pewdiepie will get a hold of this information and get the army to dox twitch (without forcing it). Interesting to see how it goes

I guess it depends on where the debate is going. And so far the debate is about gender/sex and the reasons behind, which is political.

Also, why do you think twitch will change their policy? and who will "pick this up" ? not a big twitch or youtube user so I have no idea who the person banned was or why anyone should care.

Avatar image for uninspiredcup
#24 Edited by uninspiredcup (32255 posts) -

@XVision84 said:

@uninspiredcup: I'll admit I didn't even bother to read the source since things like this happen so often. Society is too sensitive about this kind of topic these days. After reading it now, she doesn't seem to be one of those boob streamers (unless they're intentionally leaving that out of the pictures).

It's sad to see desperate guys on Twitch funding those kinds of streamers. Sure it may make them money, but I don't think it's respectable even if it pays the bills.

Well.. they are adults and you need some responsibility when controlling your winky.

You get guys who go to strip clubs who don't realize the woman aren't actually their to have sex with you.

Avatar image for GTR12
#25 Posted by GTR12 (13442 posts) -

@Byshop said:
@GTR12 said:

1. Its a girl everyone, not a guy.

2. It was her opinion, she never said it was fact, just an opinion.

3. Twitch is stupid to ban her, when a known wife-abuser (MrDeadMoth) was given a measly 3 day ban until the community constantly complained and got him banned.

Goes to show how many people bother to read the source article before chiming in.

As for the incident, I'm curious to hear Twitch's response. Right now all we have is her version of why she got banned. When someone gets banned and seeks support, they tend to put the exact details of how they got banned in the nicest possible light.

-Byshop

Is the article even available to everyone? its an Australian news article and I don't know if its geo-blocked.

I was going to post the Kotaku article but I cant find it.

Avatar image for Byshop
#26 Posted by Byshop (19522 posts) -

@GTR12 said:
@Byshop said:
@GTR12 said:

1. Its a girl everyone, not a guy.

2. It was her opinion, she never said it was fact, just an opinion.

3. Twitch is stupid to ban her, when a known wife-abuser (MrDeadMoth) was given a measly 3 day ban until the community constantly complained and got him banned.

Goes to show how many people bother to read the source article before chiming in.

As for the incident, I'm curious to hear Twitch's response. Right now all we have is her version of why she got banned. When someone gets banned and seeks support, they tend to put the exact details of how they got banned in the nicest possible light.

-Byshop

Is the article even available to everyone? its an Australian news article and I don't know if its geo-blocked.

I was going to post the Kotaku article but I cant find it.

I'm in the US and it came up for me.

Responding to voice an opinion based on the subject line of a post alone is a pretty common theme.

-Byshop

Avatar image for volsung
#27 Posted by Volsung (261 posts) -
@Ovirew said:

There are only two genders, or nature only intended for there to be two genders anyway. Mistakes happen, they're probably not meant to.

Mistakes drive evolution.

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#28 Edited by Volsung (261 posts) -
@GTR12 said:

1. Its a girl everyone, not a guy.

I guess you could say they.........

.....just assumed her gender.

Avatar image for foxhound_fox
#29 Posted by foxhound_fox (97827 posts) -

@x_karen_x said:

@foxhound_fox:

Can trans gender give birth? (I not know). If yes it mean person is female. Still only two gender. It scientific. Not to deal with psychology.

Yes, a trans man (F to M) can get pregnant and give birth so long as his female sex organs are still intact.

@Ace132 said:

@foxhound_fox:

Male female. Intersex is an abnormality.

Gender is linked with biology, it's not a social construct by itself. A girl can be tomboy and a boy can be a sissy but that's a personality not a gender. There is no need for other pronouns, you are man or woman . What's in your brain is irrelevant, because I can say I'm a woman and go to women's changing room or apply for women's basketball team, won't change any facts that I have XY chromosomes, have to check prostate, don't have womb, increased muscle and bone mass, Adams apple, list goes on.

"some women don't have wombs!"

Well that's exception, she's still a woman. A person who chops their legs or born without them is still a man/woman even though every other person has it.

Hopefully twitcher will be unbanned

And therein lies your inability to accept trans people for what they want to be.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/05/180524112351.htm

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#30 Edited by Jag85 (13248 posts) -

There is scientific evidence of a small percentage of people being born with an ambiguous gender. Such as an abnormal amount of X or Y chromosomes, or an abnormal amount of testosterone or oestrogen levels. There are people who do fit into the "non-binary" category, genetically speaking.

But a problem I have with the non-binary movement is how it promotes this idea that anyone can choose to be any gender they want simply because they "feel" like it. That's not how gender works. Your "feelings" don't tell you what gender you are. It's genetics that tell you what gender you are. If you "feel" you are a different gender, then just take a test to find out whether your hormone or chromosome levels are "non-binary" or not. That's not something you decide with your "feelings" alone.

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#31 Edited by mrbojangles25 (43569 posts) -

I always think of it as there being two sexes...

...and a "spectrum" of genders.

Someone will probably tell me I am wrong, though, and should be banned :P

Sex is scientific, gender is societal.

Avatar image for x_karen_x
#32 Edited by X_Karen_x (500 posts) -

@foxhound_fox:

You lose me. Start as man and end up female can give birth, or Vice versa. In your own words it is regardless because even you state it as either or. Even if you start man, have sex change, and can give birth as female, it still is what is: male and female. My curious question for you it is what do you call the other gender other than male or female? “Trans” in a context like this refer to “change/Transformation” which why it call “sex change” because that what it is “changing gender”. It not creating new gender.

Avatar image for foxhound_fox
#33 Posted by foxhound_fox (97827 posts) -

@x_karen_x said:

@foxhound_fox:

You lose me. Start as man and end up female can give birth, or Vice versa. In your own words it is regardless because even you state it as either or. Even if you start man, have sex change, and can give birth as female, it still is what is: male and female. My curious question for you it is what do you call the other gender other than male or female? “Trans” in a context like this refer to “change/Tehran’s formation” which why it call “sex change” because that what it is “changing gender”. It not creating new gender.

F to M trans man can GIVE birth, M to F trans woman can impregnate a woman.

Biologically, actual sexual reproduction, currently, is impossible if someone goes through with an actual sex change.

"Trans" refers either to someone who is currently transitioning, or someone who has completely transitioned.

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#34 Posted by X_Karen_x (500 posts) -

@foxhound_fox:

Yes transition/changing same thing really.

So it what you say is a female who transition to man still have working female organ? That make them still female. I not know the detail on how does the genitalia function in such procedure and do not want to upset anyone with this topic so please if it offend anyone it not mean it this way.

Gender it describe just this. Male or female. It a scientific description of your makeup and it reproductive organ. What you say sound to me like transitioning it more like it physically make person more feminine or masculine? If it a mental thing then it not relate to gender.

Avatar image for ironbrigador
#35 Posted by IronBrigador (108 posts) -

So much for all the noise about diversity yet they have no room for diversity of opinions.

Avatar image for Ace132
#36 Edited by Ace132 (1515 posts) -

@foxhound_fox: if there were more than two genders, why do trans only transition to male or female? If there are more than two genders, why is there bisexual in LGB?

The truth is, there's only two(2) genders. Don't get confused, and don't make random made up pronouns. Next thing you'll know, people will start identifying different race or age because "my brain says so!"

White person saying they're black is still white. Despite any surgery it's still in his dna to have white features. A 40 year old saying he's 12 is still 40, we don't need to conform to him his requests trying for a u15 team. A person saying he's a dragon or chicken kin is still a human. You get it or you need more explanation? A person giving birth a is a female, a female that can't give birth is unfortunately defective. Not all females are defective, if they were you and me weren't born. Can't believe its 21st century and people don't know these things haha

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#37 Posted by MirkoS77 (13982 posts) -

@mrbojangles25: you’re wrong, and you should be banned. j/k :p You make dope posts, GS wouldn’t be the same without good ol’ Bojangles.

OT, I generally oppose a policy of banning people due to their opinions, ignorant or otherwise. I haven’t yet read the details of this though so won’t comment further.

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#38 Posted by npiet1 (1959 posts) -

@foxhound_fox said:
@x_karen_x said:

@foxhound_fox:

Can trans gender give birth? (I not know). If yes it mean person is female. Still only two gender. It scientific. Not to deal with psychology.

Yes, a trans man (F to M) can get pregnant and give birth so long as his female sex organs are still intact.

@Ace132 said:

@foxhound_fox:

Male female. Intersex is an abnormality.

Gender is linked with biology, it's not a social construct by itself. A girl can be tomboy and a boy can be a sissy but that's a personality not a gender. There is no need for other pronouns, you are man or woman . What's in your brain is irrelevant, because I can say I'm a woman and go to women's changing room or apply for women's basketball team, won't change any facts that I have XY chromosomes, have to check prostate, don't have womb, increased muscle and bone mass, Adams apple, list goes on.

"some women don't have wombs!"

Well that's exception, she's still a woman. A person who chops their legs or born without them is still a man/woman even though every other person has it.

Hopefully twitcher will be unbanned

And therein lies your inability to accept trans people for what they want to be.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/05/180524112351.htm

Whats the sample size? There's study's that state transgenerism is caused by a chemical imbalance in prepubescence people but due to the low sample size (10 people) no one recognizes it.

Avatar image for uninspiredcup
#39 Posted by uninspiredcup (32255 posts) -

@ironbrigador said:

So much for all the noise about diversity yet they have no room for diversity of opinions.

Wise words my man.

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#40 Edited by KungfuKitten (26323 posts) -

@foxhound_fox said:

How is it "fact" that there are only two genders? Gender is a spectrum and biological sex isn't binary either (hormonal and chromosomal differences causing ambiguous genitalia).

And what's wrong with him getting banned? Twitch is a privately owned company with rules they require everyone follow. Break the rules, seeya later.

As someone who actually works for a living, I find it funny when people complain that their "livelihood" of playing video games for ad revenue is taken away from them.

There are only a few popular ways to communicate to masses of people on the internet. When these private companies exercise their american right to silence people it is in effect a form of censorship that is unethical. I know that technically speaking these companies have the right to silence people but I am very much against it and I don't understand how you cannot see the problem with it. The law must be updated so that social media companies that become the de facto method of communication are forbidden to ban people for wrongthink. And the same should apply to the de facto methods of payment like VISA and Paypal. They should no longer have authority over who can get paid and who cannot.

It's also a little immature to ban someone for disagreeing with them. I don't think genders are biologically or scientifically defined, so stating there are 2 genders is a way of looking at things and not necessarily incorrect. (And even science is filled with contradiction and debate.) People can disagree with it, but to ban someone for looking at things differently is a scary road to travel down. And it should make people wonder why they need to be authoritarian about this and cannot use words like a normal human being to defend themselves instead. (Maybe because they are wrong in the first place.) And even if it would be a scientific fact, last time I looked it was OK to be factually wrong about something. And people could simply correct it. That happens all the time. So why the need to ban someone unless it's because they want to hide the truth or feel a desire to abuse their power?

There should also be (way heavier) repercussions for moderator abuse on the internet, as this is an escalating problem all over the place.

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#41 Posted by Planeforger (17968 posts) -

@mrbojangles25 said:

I always think of it as there being two sexes...

...and a "spectrum" of genders.

Someone will probably tell me I am wrong, though, and should be banned :P

Sex is scientific, gender is societal.

No, you're correct that sex and gender are different.

If I remember my anthropology lectures correctly, people really clarified the distinction between sex and gender back in the 70s, and it's now basically just accepted fact in any academic field that studies humans or society.

There are definitely lots of genders, and they are socially constructed. Some non-Western societies have 'third' genders - not masculine or feminine (or male or female), but something entirely different, which has just been a normal part of everyday life for centuries.

The argument that there are only two sexes is...murkier. It's easy for a layman to point at genitalia (or chromosomes) and say "man" or "woman", but the biology probably gets a lot more complicated than that. You could also argue that the concept of what is a "man" and a "woman" (and why there aren't any other biological options) is also a social construct, but...let's not go there.

Avatar image for Sevenizz
#42 Edited by Sevenizz (3418 posts) -

Male/female...and what else? Even if you’re a tranny, aren’t you attempting to mimic one of those TWO?

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#43 Edited by sakaiXx (5161 posts) -

Is speaking opinions hated now? I think we should try communism next.

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#44 Posted by Horgen (119966 posts) -

Isn't Twitch notorious for treating its users differently?

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#45 Posted by Ace132 (1515 posts) -

@sakaixx: only if your opinion is not what theyyy like

@KungfuKitten: great post

Avatar image for SOedipus
#46 Posted by SOedipus (11360 posts) -

Isn’t this the norm now? Popular social outlets policing speech. Look at Twitter.

Avatar image for mrbojangles25
#47 Edited by mrbojangles25 (43569 posts) -

@Planeforger said:
@mrbojangles25 said:

I always think of it as there being two sexes...

...and a "spectrum" of genders.

Someone will probably tell me I am wrong, though, and should be banned :P

Sex is scientific, gender is societal.

No, you're correct that sex and gender are different.

If I remember my anthropology lectures correctly, people really clarified the distinction between sex and gender back in the 70s, and it's now basically just accepted fact in any academic field that studies humans or society.

There are definitely lots of genders, and they are socially constructed. Some non-Western societies have 'third' genders - not masculine or feminine (or male or female), but something entirely different, which has just been a normal part of everyday life for centuries.

The argument that there are only two sexes is...murkier. It's easy for a layman to point at genitalia (or chromosomes) and say "man" or "woman", but the biology probably gets a lot more complicated than that. You could also argue that the concept of what is a "man" and a "woman" (and why there aren't any other biological options) is also a social construct, but...let's not go there.

Right, there are exceptions to the "only two sexes" rule--people with XXY or XYY or whatever chromosomes--but they are relatively rare, I think they sort of prove the rule, as the saying goes.

*Actually not that rare, it says 1 or 2 out of 1000 births have an XXY (or more than one extra X chromosome). With that said, most people don't know they have the extra chromosome and the people are, sexually, still considered male despite having some specific traits.

Avatar image for SOedipus
#48 Posted by SOedipus (11360 posts) -

@mrbojangles25: No, you’re right, and it’s not murky. What you brought up are abnormalities. They can have a number of health issues, mental/physical disabilities, lower life span, inability to reproduce, depending on the chromosomal abnormality. And you’re absolutely right, people with these genetic malformations are generally labeled a sex, male or female. There are 2 sexes.

Avatar image for npiet1
#49 Posted by npiet1 (1959 posts) -

@Planeforger: how is gender a social construct? The definition didn't change until recently, even animals have gender roles. You never see say a male gorilla acting like a female and their a social animal. The only time there gender roles will vary is if the DNA is programmed for it, like the clown fish. No one has ever been able to prove logically with science that gender and sex is different. The only thing they did was change the definition a couple of years ago. Males and females have roles that's a fact. What's a social construct is when we differ from these roles. it isn't an accept fact all scientists agree with, many don't but don't say anything publicly due to back lash.

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#50 Edited by Jacanuk (18131 posts) -

@mrbojangles25 said:

I always think of it as there being two sexes...

...and a "spectrum" of genders.

Someone will probably tell me I am wrong, though, and should be banned :P

Sex is scientific, gender is societal.

In this debate you are correct.

Sex is binary Male/female

Gender is "fluid" according to some.