Tulsa Shooting of Unarmed Black Male

http://abcnews.go.com/US/40-year-man-killed-tulsa-officer-friday-hands/story?id=42193626

There's the link, but the format is due to me being on my phone.

Edit: As it would turn out, the man had PCP in his car (whether he had any in his system is yet to be determined.)

So some facts of what occurred;

-The 4 police were responding to another call when they see a vehicle in the middle of the road

- The car belonged to the now deceased Terence Clutcher, as it had stalled

- The cops, from glancing at him, identified him as a "bad guy."

- According to them, he was "disobeying" them

- he walked towards his car (per their orders) with hands up and guns pointed at him

- when he leaned against the car, he was shot and tazed.

There's so much wrong with this picture. A man who is believed to be a terrorist can have a shootout with police and survive. A man who shot and killed 9 people in a church can be taken alive and even get Burger King. But leaning against a car? Selling cigarettes? These somehow lead to deaths that are unwarranted.

From what i cant see he had his right hand in his pocket or something. His hands were not up when they shot or tazed him.

Well need investigated, but im not sure, this looks like another, i shot in fear of my safety cases.

From what I can see is people are just total cowards nowadays. It's this shoot first mentality. People can't deal with anything. The internet is full of cowards like this. Most people are really. All most people care about is themselves. Oh the poor polce department he wasn't following their commands so they shot him. Bunch of scum should be locked up in a cage and shot themselves and see how they feel about it. That's how society deals with things? This is law in this country? **** them. Bunch of greedy shits everywhere who don't even know whta ignorance or abuse is. The truth is is most people are cowards. That's the real problem. The internet is full of shitbags like that think they are enlightening people when I'm fully aware of the amount of cowards out there and what ignorance really is. Most shitbags can't even back up what they say or do. They are overreacting idiot trash who have lost any common sense and brainwashed society to think one way.

@Celtic_34: Thats not exactly what happened. We dont know for sure, but he was ignoring commands and walking to his vehicle. He then put his hands down and either reaches in his pocket or in his vehicle. If he did either without listening to commands, then that could easily put fear on an officer. The fact that he was shot and tazed means there had to of been some sort of threat. Two people dont just shot for no reason and then rush him to the hospital.

It really is. People are cowards who lack common sense. I see it all the time. People are utter retards. You can't say anything nowadays with some control freak abusing you and acting like you are ignorant one. The guy was clearly frustrated because his car broke down and he was expecting help and instead the police were harassing him and overreacting. He got upset and they shot him because they are idiots. They should be shot and put in a cage and see how they like it. I dont care if she's a woman who looks like a nice person. See how she likes being treated that way and iif she gets upset about it. Just dont stop either or show any common sense towards her. Just shoot her. That's how crazy people are.

I hav e my reasons for saying this too. I see it all the time people misinterpret overreact. People are control freak idiots. Think they know what abuse is and are dealing with it and we are the ignorant ones when people are utter retards with no sense.

That's exactly what the problem is. People are cowards. They have no balls. They have no balls to speak the truth. They are cowards. I've seen it enough and most people are trash that way. Can't apoligize. Don't have the guts to realize what they do is wrong. Are so self absorbed over petty bs. It's everywhere.

There's more money and drama in all the charlatan pseudo intellectual bs that is out there. People overanalyze this crap. The best and the brightest lol. Think they know when it's pretty basic human common sense. Most people don't have it or the guts to. They are cowards and out for themselves.

No reason why that guy should have been shot. Total common sense lost and the police trying to control something that wasn't. Paranoid idiotic people. Totally unqualified. I don't care if they have a piece of paper. Their actions show they are totally unqualified and are crminal scum. The fact they were even assuming what they were is utter crap.

@Celtic_34: Im just not seeing what your seeing. Had he had his hands up the whole time and had not reached then youd have a case. You cant expect for everyone to wait until they see what your grabbing while ignoring commands. They tell you hands above your head and not to move for a reason.

His car was broken down, why were they giving him commands in the first place? Cops generally don't give me commands when they approach me in a seemingly innocuous situation.

And in any case putting your hand in your pocket should not justify lethal force unless police have reason to believe there is a weapon in your pocket. It does not even come close to the standard the supreme court has set of probable cause to believe a threat to their life is imminent. Police do not have any greater right to self defense than any other citizen. Do you think I would be prosecuted for shooting someone I was disagreeing with because they put their hand in their pocket? Someone drawing and raising a weapon or charging you with a weapon drawn? Sure. Someone whom the police have no reason to believe is armed putting their hand in their pocket? Absolutely not, that is a human being who the state has executed without trial. Now that may not be the whole story in this case, but if the defense of this shooting were as simple as "he put his hand in his pocket," I would vote to convict on 2nd degree murder without qualm.

Honestly the woman is probably the least of the problems. She will probably be used as a scapegoat though. In her case who knows what happened there. She may have felt pressured herself and just overreacted. I think the issue is much deeper than that though. I don't know her. I don't know what her deal is. Just looking at her she may have just been a victim herself. She may end up being moreso and end up being a fall guy and really should be careful herself just looking at her. The real issue to me is something bigger than that and just something ingrained in people that is just pathetic.

The guy was murdered because he was black and his car broke down. We have far too many people with badges and guns who shouldn't be trusted to water houseplants.

All I want to know is who fired first. Was it the guy with the taster or the woman with the gun?

Cause its looking like the guy with the taster fired and the woman "triggered" and fired her weapon. If so, if the guy with the taser felt only that level of force was sufficient, then the woman needs fired and possibly charged with a crime. The issue isn't wide spread corruption, but that when a cop does wrong they are protected. The guy did lower a hand, at least, from the aerial view. It's easy to see. Also I highly doubt the cops told him to walk back to his vehicle to the door, rather than stop at the tailgate. Hell, I'd doubt they told him to walk all the way back to his vehicle period, given that the pavement sufficed for an arrest.

In no way am I saying he should have been shot. I am rather pissed he was shot. But I am more pissed off at some people already jumping to the defense of the cop who murdered this guy because she is a woman. Least of the problems? She IS the problem here. Another cop made the call just to taser with backup in case it went farther, but some idiot decided to fire at the same time with deadly force. If they all had the same intentions, then the cop with the taser would never have fired in the first place. Charge that bad cop, and stop trying to hang out to dry all the cops who in at least this instanced were doing their job properly, and without intended lethal force.

Something is missing here. Was this guy in the commission of a crime of any kind? Is he a known felon? None of that was reported by ABC news. I have to believe if this guy has some sort of criminal past the truth will come out.

But still, where is the imminent danger in this situation? That is what I am missing. They are responding to a stalled car. Not a burglary, or hit and run, or assault. I mean shyte, if my car stalls and the police come to check it out are they going to have guns/tasers drawn because I am black? That kind of behavior immediately heightens the intensity of the situation.

I hope to hear more facts about this case as this seems EXTREMELY excessive based on the abcnews article. Also, why do we never hear of non-black men accidentally shot by police officer while the men are not in the commission of any crime? Burns me up.

More info is needed. Apparently he had his hands up but wasn't following commands. I'm more interested in what happened prior. That being said, why wasn't a taser utilized for this type of situation?

Dude should have complied but it shouldn't have warranted a death sentence unless he committed a violent crime prior.

THAT is the thing. One police officer did use a taser. Officer Shelby used a firearm. Obviously there was a conflict as to what amount of force was warranted. I reckon that will be the sticking point in this situation. But I agree more info is needed. With two officers there why was lethal force required for a stalled car incident?

Investigate it ruthlessly and prosicute if she is found to have killed him without cause.

You can't see much in the video which is a shame. It almost looks like she thought she had her taser out and screwed it up like that ancient cop that messed up and pulled the wrong weapon out a year or two ago or that chick who reflexively pulled the trigger and almost shot the guy when she keyed up her microphone a few years back.

Also, why would a chopper be overhead? They have air cover for broken down motorists?

This isn't a police state. The guy was doing nothing wrong. He was broke down. Why are the police issuing him anything other than a helping hand? I've broke down and not been issued any commands as the officer helped me. I just don't understand how anyone can justify shooting a man because he is broke down.

Why would they order him to go to his car ? Makes no sense. I was wondering why the hell he was heading to his car ? I heard no one say go to your car in the video. Something smells fishy here.

Wait until all of the facts are in before you judge this case. The main stream media has been known to doctor video to fit a narrative.

@JimB: I agree that more facts need to be released. However there are some troubling facts that have been released that are a consistent trend in these instances:

1. An unarmed black man was not in the commission of a crime

2. The unarmed man was killed when alternate measure could have been used

Not saying the motorist was completely right as we don't know all the facts. I AM saying with at least two officers on the scene and one of those officers using a taser, that tons of ambiguity abound.

What stuck me as ignorant is how (I believe the female cop) said the man was not answering their questions and I'm guessing that struck a nerve. Someone should inform the police that people do not have any obligation to speak with you. Sure, it might help the situation but not answering questions does not make one a criminal.

So what if he wasn't cooperating? Is that a death sentence these days? Apparently yes, but it sure as hell should not be.

They could have tasered him, or tackled him, or cuffed him, or any number of things. But no, f*** it, let's shoot him he looks like "a bad dude".

Honestly it doesn't matter what the video says. An unarmed man was shot by police and he should not have been. Obviously they wanted to taser him but the other cop was jittery (guess she was scared of the big frightening black male!!! OOOOOOOH scary!) and ended up killing him.

I do like how the police department is handling the situation, though, what with immediately addressing it and calling the DoJ for an investigation.

I'd like to think four armed and trained police could handle a basic incident like this, and that walking to a car won't result in one's death. I mean seriously even if he was beligerant and was like "I'm going to go get my gun, it's in my car" there are still four cops; taser him, mace him, rough him up, whatever...they are trained cops, they need to remember they're in the life saving and protection business.

This. Soooo much this. Very well stated @mrbojangles25. Unless some facts are released regarding the known fearsomeness of this individual(i.e. dude's name was really Bruce Banner) there is no reason to shoot someone simply for belligerence.

So few seem to have even read what happened, since one of the cops did use a taser. That will also be what damns the other cop who got and killed this guy, that someone right next to her made a call for less than deadly force. Unfortunately the cop who tasered seems to have been dragged down with the other cop.

Many people have been made to look foolish after looking at events like these and making snap judgements. It's wise to wait and see what we learn.

@sayyy-gaa:"Also, why do we never hear of non-black men accidentally shot by police officer"

It doesn't bring in ratings/viewers. The only thing that can beat that is a blonde attractive white chick.

Yeah, I tend to say this a lot when these issues come up. Why was her first weapon of choice not the taser when that's what the other cop used? Not saying he even needed to be tasered, but the last thing you want to do regardless of whether or not you deserved it, is reach into a car with guns pulled on you. If you're going to get shot, at least get shot with non-lethal rounds or a taser.

Supposedly, there was at least several minutes prior to when the helicopter showed up, so who knows what really went down. It may have been a case of the cops running the plates (a policy they should do regardless of who's operating the vehicle) and found that this guy had a prior weapons charge, or a warrant, who knows. If that was the case, then the cops are getting off because they'd have probable cause to believe that the man had a weapon in the car. If this isn't the case, then the cop should definitely go down for murder.

If you talk to any rational police officer, there isn't such a thing as a "basic" incident. Sure it seems like a normal traffic incident to you and I but I guarantee those in the field do not.

I don't know the full facts, but this looks very much like the police were at fault. What I've heard was that this gentleman's car broke down, police show up and force him out of vehicle, he is obeying their commands and has his hands up, then a female police officer shoots him. I dont know of the full account or extenuating circumstances, but that seems unjustified. Unless there is some major extenuating circumstance, I suspect she gets charged with manslaughter if not murder 2.

Times sure were simpler when incidents like this could be swept under the rug and ignored by the American Populace.

Vote Trump and he promises that all the attention from these shootings will go away. Believe him. The media attention from this will go away so fast you won't even remember.

Make America Great Again!!

That sounds so outlandish, though. There has to be more to the story. If not, then absolutely prosecute, but it seems unlikely.

The thing is people say they are human but human beings are capable of being understanding people. There is too much ignorance out there in general. As someone that has been held at gunpoint I didn't shoot the person. If he shot me he would and should have been charged with murder. I think I spoke to him and listened. That's bravery. All this shoot first stuff. There is no reason the police should have shot that guy for reaching in his pocket. There are various reasons why he may have been actiing that way. For one he had a bunch of idiots pointing guns at him and might have been just reacting that way and trying to explain something. Expecting him to follow orders is one thing. Shooting him because he didn't is murder. Honestly there are too many control freaks out there that try to control situations vs actually listening who are just as bad and just as cowardly. Had the guy ran they shouldn't have shot him either. I respect the police and what they do but idiots are idiots too. There is way too much of that stuff out there in general. I don't care if it's the police or not. They should not be shooting people unless its absolutely necessary to protect people.

Listening to the words of those idiots it wasn't a last resort. It was quite the opposite. Instead they were assuming the worst. The same goes for the police they hold me at gunpoint I'm a person just like they are. They can't do that. They shoot me they should go to jail. I understand following procedures and this is what they are told to do for their own safety but honestly I've been treated by the police that way too when it's bs. It's wrong regardless. I've also seen the police show common sense. There was no inherent danger from me. The police escalate situations and make them worse though and are idiots and wrong too though. Police or not what is defined as idiotic needs to be changed anyways. If they are idiots I'll call them that too. I have that right. My reasons for calling people idiots goes deeper than people realize too. There is nothing criminal about calling people idiots either.

I can't really comment on the story for the time being. As the two videos lack key audio, and don't have the best camera angles or resolution for key moments in particular. I also haven't bother looking for articles, as I am cautious to trust any media outlet on these kind of narratives.

I will say traffic stops, are one of the most dangerous assignments for cops. And police do get shot in traffic stops on a yearly basis. The guy may have had his hands up for sometime. But that alone means nothing. I've seen a video where a driver try to play off that false Michael Brown narrative, and then pull out a gun initiating a shootout. Its easy to play off the race narrative. But not only is the investigation just beginning. Who can honestly trust a stranger in the middle of a road they know nothing about. After all, hit hiking has largely become a thing of the past in America. But regardless of how this case goes, this female cop career is probably over.

@jak42: But this isn't a traffic stop. His car was stuck in the middle of the road and broken down. I can understand if it was a group of males, but 1 guy and 4 cops? We don't know everything that occurred beforehand, but if things truly did escalate, have him lay on the ground instead of walk to the car. The worst part is they already decided he was a bad guy for some reason.

@john_of_rivia: Cops aren't superman with x-ray vision. They're ordinary people who have no idea what's in someone's car. Or can read minds to see if a person has something to hide. Which doesn't necessary have to be a weapon, but something criminal in nature that causes guilt and fear to build up. And are fully aware simple matters like, this can escalate fast.

Just last week, a guy trying to remove a boot from his car in NYC. Pulled out a meat cleaver on two cops. After trying to apprehended the guy with multiple cops without shooting, an off duty NYPD detective. Got wacked in the head with the cleaver, and has a massive scar from his jaw to his forehead. And that wasn't a traffic stop either. The perp also had a violent history, and that's not something the cops could have known till after the fact. As we don't have scanners to tell us who is this person, and what danger they may pose.

Police officers seem to take great offense when the public treats them like armed mercenaries or those not following the Constitution. They get offended when people's first instinct is to call them pigs or oinkers or make coffee and doughnut jokes. I can understand people (cops) not being happy if they are disparaged but strangely enough it seems as if the cops do the same thing with civilians by thinking they are criminals until proven otherwise and you can see how his/her demeanor will change after he/she runs your license and finds out you aren't on the F.B.I.'s most wanted list. Guilty until proven innocent huh?

The police woman is like "shots fired" when she was the one who fired the shot. That said I don't think she should be charged with murder. Just hearing her voice she sounds more incompetant and a victim herself. What is defined as murder even needs work. She may be used as a scapegoat because of who she is though, when there are worse people in this world. She's an easy target. It's diffferent than some people who are just bad people though.

Listening to her husband he sounds more like the ring leader real idiot giving really bad advice. He probably has his reasons too trying to protect his wife but it's just stupidity all the way around.

Not really using the oh she's just a girl argument either. It really is just stupidity all the way around. Unfortunately what is being taught is wrong too. People are being taught to protect themselves and all this natural selection crap and supposed wisdom instead of actually being intelligent people. People are being taught to live in fear instead of the opposite and actual bravery or wisdom. With that comes great kindness but there are two sides of the fence and a darkside too. It depends on how you interpret it i guess.

I'd wager any rational police officer would also say that this should not have happened.

And I don't like that "nothing is every basic" bullshit. There is routine (which is generally not so routine), and then there are the weird occasions...either way, their training should have kicked in, needs to be better, or they should have exercised better judgement. Probably a combination of all three.

I don't dislike cops, but there is something definitely wrong with law enforcement in this country. Unarmed people should be shot by people charged with protecting us. Period. Hell, even armed people can be handled better; we've got people with legit concealed weapon permits being shot, too, and that's not right, either.

law enforcement is in the unique position of both creating the incident, and then being victim to it.

I know it is a stressful job, I have a few friends that were police officers in Oakland California and that job changed them; many suffer from PTSD, depression, and other problems exacerbated by their job. It's stressful dealing with a public that generally dislikes authority (it is 100% American to rebel against authority!) while being asked to sometimes put yourself in harms way for them. In a country in the US, where literally anyone could have a gun, I imagine fear plays a larger role in their lives than they care to admit.

All I know is that no one sees a cop and thinks "Oh, good, a cop!" any more and that is sad, and probably their own fault. It didn't used to be that way; I am old enough to remember when cops were positive figures, they were known in the neighborhoods and areas they patrolled. But now you have "commuter" cops, cops that don't even live in the same city (let alone neighborhood) they serve, and that kind of dehumanizes the people they should be protecting.

At the same time, I think we ask too much of law enforcement, or basic patrolmen, and their duties need to be reduced. Right now they need to be a soldier, law enforcer, amateur psychologist, mediator for offended parties, medic, and so forth. It's too much for any one person.

Unarmed guy with his hands up moving slowly with four cops around him, placing his hands on the vehicle. But let's take a step back. Guy was broken down in the road. There was no need to draw their weapons in the first place. Still, he's a "bad dude" just from the looks of it. But, it isn't because he's black, you can trust the police, they never lie and cover up for themselves. And they're going to do a fair investigation and not release any details to prejudice the investigation... oh wait, they're already character assassinating with the PCP allegations. The shooter said he wasn't showing his hands? **pfft** (see video). He was reaching into his car through the window? His window was up and there's the victim's blood on it to prove it. Father of four, no criminal record, enrolled in the local community college and active in his church choir, sounds like a bad mofo. And after shooting him, they fail to deliver any kind of emergency aid, they let him bleed out while the officer who fired is sobbing little bitch, it was more important to consoling her than to provide the real victim any first aid.

By all means NFL, take a knee.

@lamprey263:

1. Her name is Betty Shelby, =(

2. Shelby has been placed on routine administrative leave with pay. wtf?

Seems routine. "investigate" for over a year, by "investigate" they mean to wait it out until it's out of the public spotlight before rendering a predetermined verdict of no wrongdoing.

@PSP107: @lamprey263: Just wait for the full story. She arrived at the scene and couldnt get him to cooperate. She then called for back up. When back up arrived, they still couldnt get him to follow commands or cooperate. Then in the video he clearly reaches for what looks like his pocket. Could be reaching for the window, i cant tell. But he does something and causes not one, but two officers to fire their weapons.

Why two officers fired their weapons, we have no clue. But if it was some corruption or something, then why didnt they even attempt to cover it up. Why did they even call for emergency aid? If she wanted to just kill the dude, why even call for backup, why not just have no witnesses?

This isnt a black & white case. Something went wrong. Out of all these cop shootings weve had, and weve had a lot. How many come back to be cold blooded murder?

I agree people need to take a step back. people need jobs and stuff to do and end up overly complicating basic human things. Just because you are doing a job doesn't mean you should do that. Psychiatry is the same thing. Common sense lost. More money in labelling people and putting them on drugs and escalating issues than actually realizing what is really going on sometimes. A lot of these people make things worse and cause half the issues that happen. That's what I'm talking abut with control freaks. I've had people tell me things i'm not without realizing what they are doing. It's kind of sad. I get jobs are stressful but honestly basic common sense shouldn't be lost. Some of these people think because they are in power they can do that when they really can't.

I think it's an issue with a lot of people in general. There are a lot of people out there in general who think they know what's going on and what's right for other people when most of these people never even asked why they were doing what they are. That's stupidity. Even if you tell these people that they still are control freaks. That's just wrong. People are really insecure. MOre concerned about themselves. I see it all the time in a variety of ways. Society in general is basically nuts in a lot of ways mainly because the people in it are nuts.

What the police are doing is criminal. If I were to point a gun at someone I'd go to jail. The police can do that because they are in power and are allowed to do that when there are reasons why doing that is criminal. It causes problems. It's really not the best course of action. How would you act if you have people pointing guns at you? You are supposed to just trust these people? Even if you do and realize it's the police stll that's not a fun situation. Yet they don't see this. Yeah if everything goes well great but doing that is going to cause issues sometimes.

How would the police feel if I pointed a gun at them and threatened to place them under citizens arrest for threatenign an innocent person? They'd charge me with a crime. They can do that though because they are the police. This is their way of dealing with things and keeping hte peace and we wonder why this is an issue?

They aren't in the right when they are threatening innocent people that's the whole thing. 9 times out of 10 when this stuff happens it's because the person is innocent. Yet they have the right to mess with innocent peoples lives and never admit wrongdoing.

@Celtic_34: Are you saying you dont want police? Or that you want to remove their guns? That they need better trained?

I remember being held at gun point by a police officer. And while my heart was racing and i was scared cause they were undercover in an unmarked car, i still followed put your hands on the car, and dont move. I was then layed face down on the ground with my hands behind my head and ordered to not move and had my belongings searched.

I say layed, but i was actually thrown on the ground fast and with force. It happened in a second. He didnt ask me to get on the ground, he put me on the ground.

I live in what use to be the murder capital of the world for multiple years and have faced many cops. I had one friend even die from a cop while on cocaine and trying to run. He was tasered and it caused his heart to stop. I had another friend who died by trying to swallow a bottle of acid when the cops busted our party.

But even i still have a lot of respect for cops, they have helped me in some rough times and i understand some of the rough situations they go through. Some cops are arseholes, some are nice, theyre just people.

I just think it's messed up when the police expect people to trust them and everything they say when their initial reaction is to accuse and not trust what is even going on or the person they are persecuting. That's not how it works. People are insecure and have egos. If i say something there usually is a reason for it I know that. I've seen people get upset before. A lot of the time i see it. I see what is going on. People make it worse. They escalate it instead of realizing the obvious. I n person is different but a lot of the time its not. People don't listen. YOu can tell people flat out how you meant something and some people are just so set in their ways they are like robots and are going to think what they think regardless. Their experiences or whatever. Understanding is good.

Yeah there are some real sleazebags and dangerous people out there who take advantage of inncoent people but society does that too and gets away with it.

I'm not saying the police don't have their reasons either. I'm not sayng that. I understand or would try to that's the thng. I just think something is lost there.

When people are being shot like dogs for acting up that's just utterly backwoods human nature survival of the fittest idiocy. Humans are capable of understanding. I hear it all the time where people say things like he's really acting up. They dont even hear themselves speak. Instead of asking why that is they either just say it and back away or attack. That really isn't survival of the fittest. It's messed up darwinism. It's ignorance. It's survval of the stupid.

@Celtic_34: I agree, the guy most likely had a very rough day, his car broke down, he couldnt get help, and most likely the officer was giving him an even harder time. He was probably frustrated as hell.

But we still have to give both sides the benefit of the doubt. We cant let the media play with our emotions. When watching a video, as much as it hurts, we have to go by what we see and hear. Nothing more, nothing less.

I just wonder if anyone asked him what the issue was. Instead their reaction was to put him down like a dog because they felt threatened. Speaking of wich just went to the store and was entering the rotary and a guy just came flying in from the left. There are multiple entrances. I had the right of way because my entrance was on the right. He just drove right into the rotary not even looking. I was actually using caution and looked both ways he could have plowed into the side of me. Had the police investigated it and iw as dead it may have looked like he was in the rotary first when actually we arrived there at the same time. I had the right of way but used caution like i should have. He was wrong and nearly killed me. Is that natural selection? That's him being an utter moron and not looking where he was going or obeying the law. Just so self absorbed he nearly killed someone. I'm still alive though so I guess it was. He shouldn't be though. Had he hit me head first right in the drivers side though I wonder who would have died there. Guy was speeding it was late at night just flew into the rotary like a moron when he was on the left side of it. Didn't even look.

I don't see what the police did here that was really any different than that. Guys car is broken down in the middle of the road. He's flustered and a pedestrian in the middle of the road who's car is broken down. He has the right of way. It doesn't give people the right treat him like road kill or not watch where they are going. It's even worse to me than someone not seeing him and slamming into him and killiing him. The police actually were on foot and decided to pull out there guns and shoot him when they had time to think abut it even moreso then someone swerving to not hit his car to protect themselves and accidently hitting him.

just because they are the police doesn't mean they don't have to follow the law themselves. I had the police do that to me once when i parking and it was late and i couldnt see the paint because it was worn and realized i was in a handicap and started to back out and a cop car came flying in behind me as i was backing out and hit me and making it seem like i hit him when what i was doing was obeying the law. AT the time i was so whatever by it and the police were such aholes i wasnt able to explain it right to a judge. BEcause im a nice person and try to understand other people they used that and twisted it. Assholes. Never again. Understanding people that are idiots and assholes is wrong and they should be called assholes. The cops are criminals too and need to follow the law.

It's one thng if a police officer has his sirens on and is trying to get somewhere to do his job and is usng the appropriate precautions to ensure peoples safety. This guy didn't. He was just a wreckless driver who came flying into a parking lot as i was backing out of a parking space and hit me. I was looking behind me as i was backing out very slowly that's the thing and he came flyinig into the parking lot not looking where he was going. I saw it that's the thing. It was ruled guilty wthout a finding by the judge when i should have called him an asshole like he was but i didn't. it still drove my insurance up for years and i paid for it when it was his fault. Guilty without a finding is basically the dumbest thing ever though. I'm guilty without a finding? So I'm innocent yet had to pay that crap on my insurance and go to driving classes for that crap when he should have? BEcause i was nice and wasn't tryng to screw him over and wasn't a rat.... He screwed me over. Asshole.

Tired of peopel saying this stuff is tragic too and just happens. It happens because people are stupid. All the facts aren't out yet and I realize this but even still that should not have ended with him being shot.

Yeah there are good police officers. More good than bad as i was just driving too a cop car was speeding down the road and had his sirens on, i was coming the other way and the only person on the road. He still beeped his sirens a couple times to say he was coming and i moved over to the side and stopped my car so he could get by. That's a good police officer and a good citizen communicating well. That's nice when that happens. I saw it too and appreciated that he did that. I've seen polce officers where i live be really good and bad. They are human, but they try. I've seen them do some really impressive understanding things. It's noted.

The us gov should stop meddling in affairs of other countries and focus at home.

@iandizion713 Dude. The man is dead. Dead. Unless a spiritual medium becomes a legal consultant we won't get two stories. DEAD GUYS DON'T TALK. That is pretty much my issue. The policemen(the protectors of the peace, servants of the public trust, etc.) are all unharmed and uninjured. They will be able to spin any story they want and who can refute them.

A man is dead. An unarmed civilian in the presence of four armed, trained, and sworn deputies of the law. Circumstances can be extenuating. More facts can be shed. But this dude wasn't even being stopped for speeding or running a red light. HE HAD DONE NOTHING WRONG. How the hell did it go from helping get a broke down car off the road to a dead man? That is what I hope the facts illuminate. How did it come to be a situation with four policemen(guns drawn) trying to subdue an unarmed, innocent suspect? Why the hell was there a helicopter overhead?

Was the dude secretly a drug lord or something? I mean think about it...doesn't that sound like overkill to you? Tasers, night sticks, conflict resolution training, FOUR HIGHLY TRAINED OFFICERS...and the end result is a dead man by gun fire?