Target announces but won’t enforce gun ban

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Avatar image for xeno_ghost
#1 Edited by Xeno_ghost (990 posts) -

http://m.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/03/target-announces-but-wont-enforce-gun-ban/

Read how stubborn and disrespectful gun owners can be. I can't believe that in Texas people can walk around with "long arms" openly. Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs.

It's not very family friendly.

Why the need to carry these kinds of gun around in public what are these guys afraid of?

Avatar image for thegerg
#2 Posted by thegerg (18279 posts) -

@xeno_ghost said:

http://m.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/03/target-announces-but-wont-enforce-gun-ban/

Read how stubborn and disrespectful gun owners can be. I can't believe that in Texas people can walk around with "long arms" openly. Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs.

It's not very family friendly.

Why the need to carry these kinds of gun around in public what are these guys afraid of?

"Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs."

No, but luckily here in the US assault rifles are effectively banned.

Avatar image for perfect_blue
#3 Posted by Perfect_Blue (29940 posts) -

The irony is that all these guys do is get people more scared of guns and gun owners.

Avatar image for Assassin_87
#4 Posted by Assassin_87 (2341 posts) -

Elements of our culture seem so bizarre at times, as if I'm living in an episode of The Twilight Zone.

Avatar image for lamprey263
#5 Posted by lamprey263 (34421 posts) -

Well, what choice do they have? If they do decide to enforce something sensible then it will stir up the American right who will then vilify Target on a never ending campaign equating it with Nazis and some such shit.

Avatar image for whipassmt
#6 Posted by whipassmt (15375 posts) -

Well Target can't really enforce the policy unless they have guns of their own or call the police.

I could see why people wouldn't want openly armed guys when they're shopping at the store. I would probably feel a bit uncomfortable. Though in a way, I guess it's better if the weapons are out in the open rather than concealed.

On the bright side, if a nutcase does happen to try to shoot up the place and there are a bunch of armed guys in there, they can stop him.

Avatar image for vl4d_l3nin
#7 Posted by vl4d_l3nin (1093 posts) -

@Aljosa23 said:

The irony is that all these guys do is get people more scared of guns and gun owners.

Pretty much.

Americans who are simply careful with their guns exercise their rights far better than those who make the effort to tote them around everywhere.

Avatar image for whipassmt
#8 Edited by whipassmt (15375 posts) -

No Guns allowed? Well no problem!

Avatar image for lostrib
#9 Posted by lostrib (49999 posts) -

I support the 2nd amendment, but these people are idiots...

I mean really? open carrying an AK at target is "helping keep us safe"?

Avatar image for dave123321
#10 Posted by dave123321 (35329 posts) -

Hope this doesn't escalate

Avatar image for hailtothequeen
#11 Edited by HailtotheQueen (290 posts) -
@dave123321 said:

Hope this doesn't escalate

It will... Everything always escalates in our country because people don't understand when they should stop.

Avatar image for airshocker
#12 Posted by airshocker (31700 posts) -

Open carry with rifles is unreasonable and I'm against that.

But you're wrong for calling all gun owners disrespectful, TC. Many of us don't support open carry.

Avatar image for airshocker
#13 Posted by airshocker (31700 posts) -
@Aljosa23 said:

The irony is that all these guys do is get people more scared of guns and gun owners.

Unfortunately. This is the very reason the NRA is against open carry.

Avatar image for Nuck81
#14 Edited by Nuck81 (6794 posts) -

With all these people walking around with long arms, how will we be able to distinguish who is about to mass murder and who is just walking around?


Avatar image for ad1x2
#15 Posted by ad1x2 (6606 posts) -

Open carry is something I can see doing while in the woods but not in in a mall. No matter how pro-Second Amendment you are you are just asking for trouble. Especially with Virginia Tech and Sandy Hook on people's minds you never know who may shoot at you out of fears you are the next James Holmes or something.

Avatar image for xeno_ghost
#16 Posted by Xeno_ghost (990 posts) -

@airshocker: "But you're wrong for calling all gun owners disrespectful, TC. Many of us don't support open carry"

I didnt think saying "gun owners can be disrespectful" was labelling all gun owners as disrespectful. Sorry if it came across like that.

Avatar image for xeno_ghost
#17 Posted by Xeno_ghost (990 posts) -

@Nuck81: "With all these people walking around with long arms, how will we be able to distinguish who is about to mass murder and who is just walking around"

Good point.

Avatar image for TruthTellers
#18 Posted by TruthTellers (3393 posts) -

I'm pro gun and pro second amendment, but when a business asks customers not to bring guns into the store in an open carry fashion, I have no issue with it. It's the business' store and they make the rules, if people don't like it then they can shop somewhere else.

Avatar image for ferrari2001
#19 Posted by ferrari2001 (17760 posts) -

What good is a ban if it isn't enforced. Target has every right to turn customers away who open carry. I like to occasionally go trap shooting and there is a gun in my house, but open carry is just stupid.

Avatar image for branketra
#20 Edited by BranKetra (51726 posts) -

Even with the fact that I work at Target in mind, this does not really affect me beyond a reminder than the days of the American cowboys are slowly coming to an end.

Avatar image for xeno_ghost
#21 Edited by Xeno_ghost (990 posts) -

Open carry is just rediculous, if you lived in a lawless state or if civil war was apon you then yeh, but to openly walk around with long arms out in public, in peaceful times is just weird, it's madness.

Avatar image for THUMPTABLE
#22 Posted by THUMPTABLE (1957 posts) -

@whipassmt said:

Well Target can't really enforce the policy unless they have guns of their own or call the police.

I could see why people wouldn't want openly armed guys when they're shopping at the store. I would probably feel a bit uncomfortable. Though in a way, I guess it's better if the weapons are out in the open rather than concealed.

On the bright side, if a nutcase does happen to try to shoot up the place and there are a bunch of armed guys in there, they can stop him.

You wouldn't know who the nutcase was with the other guns about.

Avatar image for foxhound_fox
#23 Posted by foxhound_fox (96695 posts) -

I'd prefer responsible, well-trained citizens be allowed to carry weapons for self-defence than have to rely on the police. With response times in the 25-45 minute range, I'd rather not take any chances.

Open carry is just arrogant and useless. Conceal carry is an active deterrent which has been proven to lower crime rates on numerous occasions.

I hate the gun laws in Canada due to the fact they make legitimate gun owners lives a living hell (you not only have to go through rigorous testing just to buy a handgun, but if you ever plan on moving it, you have to call the police and provide a detailed (to the minute) route of how you will be transporting it and where) and do absolutelynothingto prevent criminals and mentally ill psychopaths from getting their hands on weapons (the recent Moncton shooter's guns were illegally acquired and modified).

I personally want to own two guns. That's it. A 9mm handgun (probably a Beretta 92F) for concealed carry self-defence and a Remington 700 for range shooting. But since I live in Canada, the only self-defence weapon I am allowed to have is a shotgun... and that must be kept locked in a gun safe at home, with a trigger lock, and the ammunition kept in a separate location, also locked away. It's absolutely fucking stupid.

People are going to get their hands on guns. There is a huge black market. Hell, if they really want someone dead, they won't use a gun, they'll stab them or strangle them. Guns don't kill people, in fact, they've been known to save plenty of innocent lives. [/rant]

As for the topic at hand:

tl;dr

Open carry is stupid and wholly unnecessary unless there is a state of emergency and the government is no longer in power and police/military forces have disbanded or during a civil or international war and there is no one but yourself and your community to defend your people and your land.

Avatar image for chaplainDMK
#24 Edited by chaplainDMK (7004 posts) -

@thegerg said:

@xeno_ghost said:

http://m.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/03/target-announces-but-wont-enforce-gun-ban/

Read how stubborn and disrespectful gun owners can be. I can't believe that in Texas people can walk around with "long arms" openly. Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs.

It's not very family friendly.

Why the need to carry these kinds of gun around in public what are these guys afraid of?

"Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs."

No, but luckily here in the US assault rifles are effectively banned.

Well, they mustn't be automatic. You can still carry a semi-automatic variant of a M16 or an AK-47 around. You can carry an M1 Garand if you so wish. All of those guns can punch a hole through a wall and kill someone on the other side, so ye.

Avatar image for thegerg
#25 Edited by thegerg (18279 posts) -

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@xeno_ghost said:

http://m.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/03/target-announces-but-wont-enforce-gun-ban/

Read how stubborn and disrespectful gun owners can be. I can't believe that in Texas people can walk around with "long arms" openly. Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs.

It's not very family friendly.

Why the need to carry these kinds of gun around in public what are these guys afraid of?

"Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs."

No, but luckily here in the US assault rifles are effectively banned.

Well, they mustn't be automatic. You can still carry a semi-automatic variant of a M16 or an AK-47 around. You can carry an M1 Garand if you so wish. All of those guns can punch a hole through a wall and kill someone on the other side, so ye.

No, a civilian can't buy an M-16. They are effectively banned for civilian ownership.

Anyway, what you posted has no bearing on my post.

Avatar image for chaplainDMK
#26 Edited by chaplainDMK (7004 posts) -

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@xeno_ghost said:

http://m.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/03/target-announces-but-wont-enforce-gun-ban/

Read how stubborn and disrespectful gun owners can be. I can't believe that in Texas people can walk around with "long arms" openly. Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs.

It's not very family friendly.

Why the need to carry these kinds of gun around in public what are these guys afraid of?

"Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs."

No, but luckily here in the US assault rifles are effectively banned.

Well, they mustn't be automatic. You can still carry a semi-automatic variant of a M16 or an AK-47 around. You can carry an M1 Garand if you so wish. All of those guns can punch a hole through a wall and kill someone on the other side, so ye.

No, a civilian can't buy an M-16. They are effectively banned for civilian ownership.

Anyway, what you posted has no bearing on my post.

So, the Colt AR-15 is significantly different from an M-16? :)

Ye it has, are the M-16 and AK-47 assault rifles? Yes they are. Can they be bought in the US? Yes the can be. Is a guy in the OP's link open carrying an AK-47 at Target? Yes he is.

Voila

Avatar image for thegerg
#27 Edited by thegerg (18279 posts) -

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@xeno_ghost said:

http://m.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/03/target-announces-but-wont-enforce-gun-ban/

Read how stubborn and disrespectful gun owners can be. I can't believe that in Texas people can walk around with "long arms" openly. Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs.

It's not very family friendly.

Why the need to carry these kinds of gun around in public what are these guys afraid of?

"Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs."

No, but luckily here in the US assault rifles are effectively banned.

Well, they mustn't be automatic. You can still carry a semi-automatic variant of a M16 or an AK-47 around. You can carry an M1 Garand if you so wish. All of those guns can punch a hole through a wall and kill someone on the other side, so ye.

No, a civilian can't buy an M-16. They are effectively banned for civilian ownership.

Anyway, what you posted has no bearing on my post.

So, the Colt AR-15 is significantly different from an M-16? :)

Some Colt AR-15s are M-16s. However, M-16s are military-grade assault rifles. They are effectively banned from civilian ownership in the US, regardless of the variant.

Avatar image for chaplainDMK
#28 Edited by chaplainDMK (7004 posts) -

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@xeno_ghost said:

http://m.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/03/target-announces-but-wont-enforce-gun-ban/

Read how stubborn and disrespectful gun owners can be. I can't believe that in Texas people can walk around with "long arms" openly. Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs.

It's not very family friendly.

Why the need to carry these kinds of gun around in public what are these guys afraid of?

"Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs."

No, but luckily here in the US assault rifles are effectively banned.

Well, they mustn't be automatic. You can still carry a semi-automatic variant of a M16 or an AK-47 around. You can carry an M1 Garand if you so wish. All of those guns can punch a hole through a wall and kill someone on the other side, so ye.

No, a civilian can't buy an M-16. They are effectively banned for civilian ownership.

Anyway, what you posted has no bearing on my post.

So, the Colt AR-15 is significantly different from an M-16? :)

Some Colt AR-15s are M-16s. However, M-16s are military-grade assault rifles. They are effectively banned from civilian ownership in the US, regardless of the variant.

The Colt AR-15 is a semi-automatic variant of the M16 specified for "civilian use". Apart from a few states (California IIRC) they are perfectly legal and in all aspects identical to the military M16, except that they don't have fully automatic or burst fire capacity (though it's pretty easy to get a conversion kit for that actually).

Don't go mumbo jumbo on me because there's a bunch of non Colt built AR-15's, I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use.

P.S: I just remembered you can get an AR-15 variant that chambers the .50 cal Beowulf round, a round that has similar stopping power to the .458 SOCOM round that US Special Forces designed specifically because 5,56x45 NATO doesn't have the stopping power to kill things in one shot. *MURICAAAHHHH!*

Avatar image for HoolaHoopMan
#29 Posted by HoolaHoopMan (9366 posts) -

These losers carrying around rifles into stores simply 'case they can', are making actual respectful gun owners look bad. The vast majority of people don't want feel uncomfortable around these dick less losers shouldering an AK-47 into Chipotle for no reason what so ever.

Avatar image for xeno_ghost
#30 Posted by Xeno_ghost (990 posts) -

@chaplainDMK: "The Colt AR-15 is a semi-automatic variant of the M16 specified for "civilian use". Apart from a few states (California IIRC) they are perfectly legal and in all aspects identical to the military M16, except that they don't have fully automatic or burst fire capacity (though it's pretty easy to get a conversion kit for that actually)."

"Don't go mumbo jumbo on me because there's a bunch of non Colt built AR-15's, I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use."

"P.S: I just remembered you can get an AR-15 variant that chambers the .50 cal Beowulf round, a round that has similar stopping power to the .458 SOCOM round that US Special Forces designed specifically because 5,56x45 NATO doesn't have the stopping power to kill things in one shot. *MURICAAAHHHH!"

I love you

Avatar image for thegerg
#31 Edited by thegerg (18279 posts) -

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@xeno_ghost said:

http://m.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/03/target-announces-but-wont-enforce-gun-ban/

Read how stubborn and disrespectful gun owners can be. I can't believe that in Texas people can walk around with "long arms" openly. Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs.

It's not very family friendly.

Why the need to carry these kinds of gun around in public what are these guys afraid of?

"Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs."

No, but luckily here in the US assault rifles are effectively banned.

Well, they mustn't be automatic. You can still carry a semi-automatic variant of a M16 or an AK-47 around. You can carry an M1 Garand if you so wish. All of those guns can punch a hole through a wall and kill someone on the other side, so ye.

No, a civilian can't buy an M-16. They are effectively banned for civilian ownership.

Anyway, what you posted has no bearing on my post.

So, the Colt AR-15 is significantly different from an M-16? :)

Some Colt AR-15s are M-16s. However, M-16s are military-grade assault rifles. They are effectively banned from civilian ownership in the US, regardless of the variant.

The Colt AR-15 is a semi-automatic variant of the M16 specified for "civilian use". Apart from a few states (California IIRC) they are perfectly legal and in all aspects identical to the military M16, except that they don't have fully automatic or burst fire capacity (though it's pretty easy to get a conversion kit for that actually).

Don't go mumbo jumbo on me because there's a bunch of non Colt built AR-15's, I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use.

P.S: I just remembered you can get an AR-15 variant that chambers the .50 cal Beowulf round, a round that has similar stopping power to the .458 SOCOM round that US Special Forces designed specifically because 5,56x45 NATO doesn't have the stopping power to kill things in one shot. *MURICAAAHHHH!*

No. The M-16 is a variant of the AR-15, not the other way around.

"I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use."

No, it's not. The weapons are very similar, but civilians are effectively banned from owning M-16s in the US. You can buy a rifle that looks similar to an M-16, and in some ways functions alike, but that doesn't mean that you can buy an M-16.

Avatar image for lostrib
#32 Edited by lostrib (49999 posts) -

@HoolaHoopMan said:

These losers carrying around rifles into stores simply 'case they can', are making actual respectful gun owners look bad. The vast majority of people don't want feel uncomfortable around these dick less losers shouldering an AK-47 into Chipotle for no reason what so ever.

Is this true? Yes, it's true. This man has no dick

Avatar image for chaplainDMK
#33 Posted by chaplainDMK (7004 posts) -

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@xeno_ghost said:

http://m.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/03/target-announces-but-wont-enforce-gun-ban/

Read how stubborn and disrespectful gun owners can be. I can't believe that in Texas people can walk around with "long arms" openly. Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs.

It's not very family friendly.

Why the need to carry these kinds of gun around in public what are these guys afraid of?

"Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs."

No, but luckily here in the US assault rifles are effectively banned.

Well, they mustn't be automatic. You can still carry a semi-automatic variant of a M16 or an AK-47 around. You can carry an M1 Garand if you so wish. All of those guns can punch a hole through a wall and kill someone on the other side, so ye.

No, a civilian can't buy an M-16. They are effectively banned for civilian ownership.

Anyway, what you posted has no bearing on my post.

So, the Colt AR-15 is significantly different from an M-16? :)

Some Colt AR-15s are M-16s. However, M-16s are military-grade assault rifles. They are effectively banned from civilian ownership in the US, regardless of the variant.

The Colt AR-15 is a semi-automatic variant of the M16 specified for "civilian use". Apart from a few states (California IIRC) they are perfectly legal and in all aspects identical to the military M16, except that they don't have fully automatic or burst fire capacity (though it's pretty easy to get a conversion kit for that actually).

Don't go mumbo jumbo on me because there's a bunch of non Colt built AR-15's, I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use.

P.S: I just remembered you can get an AR-15 variant that chambers the .50 cal Beowulf round, a round that has similar stopping power to the .458 SOCOM round that US Special Forces designed specifically because 5,56x45 NATO doesn't have the stopping power to kill things in one shot. *MURICAAAHHHH!*

No. The M-16 is a variant of the AR-15, not the other way around.

"I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use."

No, it's not. The weapons are very similar, but civilians are effectively banned from owning M-16s in the US. You can buy a rifle that looks similar to an M-16, and in some ways functions alike, but that doesn't mean that you can buy an M-16.

The M16 is a variant of the original ArmaLite AR-15, the current Colt AR-15 is a version of the M16.

No, they are identical apart from having no fully automatic firing capability. There's a few bits utterly changed in the AR-15 to prevent easy conversion to fully automatic or burst fire capacity, but that has no effect on the accuracy, lethality or handling of the rifle. You can more or less interchange just about anything between an M16 and an AR-15, though it's illegal to put M16 parts into a civilian AR-15. Otherwise you have the M16 in semi-automatic fire mode if you have an AR-15.

And you are really grasping at straws here, both the M16 and AR-15 (if the AR-15 has the same barrel length and is a 5,56x45mm version) will fire a bullet with the same muzzle velocity and accuracy and will handle identically.

Avatar image for thegerg
#34 Posted by thegerg (18279 posts) -

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@xeno_ghost said:

http://m.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/03/target-announces-but-wont-enforce-gun-ban/

Read how stubborn and disrespectful gun owners can be. I can't believe that in Texas people can walk around with "long arms" openly. Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs.

It's not very family friendly.

Why the need to carry these kinds of gun around in public what are these guys afraid of?

"Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs."

No, but luckily here in the US assault rifles are effectively banned.

Well, they mustn't be automatic. You can still carry a semi-automatic variant of a M16 or an AK-47 around. You can carry an M1 Garand if you so wish. All of those guns can punch a hole through a wall and kill someone on the other side, so ye.

No, a civilian can't buy an M-16. They are effectively banned for civilian ownership.

Anyway, what you posted has no bearing on my post.

So, the Colt AR-15 is significantly different from an M-16? :)

Some Colt AR-15s are M-16s. However, M-16s are military-grade assault rifles. They are effectively banned from civilian ownership in the US, regardless of the variant.

The Colt AR-15 is a semi-automatic variant of the M16 specified for "civilian use". Apart from a few states (California IIRC) they are perfectly legal and in all aspects identical to the military M16, except that they don't have fully automatic or burst fire capacity (though it's pretty easy to get a conversion kit for that actually).

Don't go mumbo jumbo on me because there's a bunch of non Colt built AR-15's, I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use.

P.S: I just remembered you can get an AR-15 variant that chambers the .50 cal Beowulf round, a round that has similar stopping power to the .458 SOCOM round that US Special Forces designed specifically because 5,56x45 NATO doesn't have the stopping power to kill things in one shot. *MURICAAAHHHH!*

No. The M-16 is a variant of the AR-15, not the other way around.

"I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use."

No, it's not. The weapons are very similar, but civilians are effectively banned from owning M-16s in the US. You can buy a rifle that looks similar to an M-16, and in some ways functions alike, but that doesn't mean that you can buy an M-16.

The M16 is a variant of the original ArmaLite AR-15, the current Colt AR-15 is a version of the M16.

No, they are identical apart from having no fully automatic firing capability. There's a few bits utterly changed in the AR-15 to prevent easy conversion to fully automatic or burst fire capacity, but that has no effect on the accuracy, lethality or handling of the rifle. You can more or less interchange just about anything between an M16 and an AR-15, though it's illegal to put M16 parts into a civilian AR-15. Otherwise you have the M16 in semi-automatic fire mode if you have an AR-15.

And you are really grasping at straws here, both the M16 and AR-15 (if the AR-15 has the same barrel length and is a 5,56x45mm version) will fire a bullet with the same muzzle velocity and accuracy and will handle identically.

None of that has any bearing on the fact that civilians are effectively banned from owning M-16s in the US. An M-16 and a civilian AR are not identical, and it's important to recognize the difference between the two when talking about the legality of purchase and ownership.

Avatar image for Boddicker
#35 Edited by Boddicker (4332 posts) -

I agree with concealed carry permits and don't think anyone has a right to ask them to leave their store as long as they're concealed. Idk how they would know unless someone came out and asked you or you pulled your weapon out in the store.

Now as to the nuts carrying long guns into a restaurant just because they can................I agree. They are dickless losers.

This is America, and we're fortunately not to that point yet where carrying long guns into restaurants are needed just to feel safe. Maybe after the inevitable oil bust/civil wars/general collapse of society, but now, no.

Avatar image for thegerg
#36 Posted by thegerg (18279 posts) -

@Boddicker said:

I agree with concealed carry permits and don't think anyone has a right to ask them to leave their store as long as they're concealed. Idk how they would know unless someone came out and asked you or you pulled your weapon out in the store.

Now as to the nuts carrying long guns into a restaurant just because they can................I agree. They are dickless losers.

This is America, and we're fortunately not to that point yet where carrying long guns into restaurants are needed just to feel safe. Maybe after the inevitable oil bust/civil wars/general collapse of society, but now, no.

You don't think that a property owner has the right to choose who carries what weapons on his own property? WTF?

Avatar image for Boddicker
#37 Posted by Boddicker (4332 posts) -

@thegerg said:

@Boddicker said:

I agree with concealed carry permits and don't think anyone has a right to ask them to leave their store as long as they're concealed. Idk how they would know unless someone came out and asked you or you pulled your weapon out in the store.

Now as to the nuts carrying long guns into a restaurant just because they can................I agree. They are dickless losers.

This is America, and we're fortunately not to that point yet where carrying long guns into restaurants are needed just to feel safe. Maybe after the inevitable oil bust/civil wars/general collapse of society, but now, no.

You don't think that a property owner has the right to choose who carries what weapons on his own property? WTF?

Avatar image for chaplainDMK
#38 Edited by chaplainDMK (7004 posts) -

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@xeno_ghost said:

http://m.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/03/target-announces-but-wont-enforce-gun-ban/

Read how stubborn and disrespectful gun owners can be. I can't believe that in Texas people can walk around with "long arms" openly. Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs.

It's not very family friendly.

Why the need to carry these kinds of gun around in public what are these guys afraid of?

"Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs."

No, but luckily here in the US assault rifles are effectively banned.

Well, they mustn't be automatic. You can still carry a semi-automatic variant of a M16 or an AK-47 around. You can carry an M1 Garand if you so wish. All of those guns can punch a hole through a wall and kill someone on the other side, so ye.

No, a civilian can't buy an M-16. They are effectively banned for civilian ownership.

Anyway, what you posted has no bearing on my post.

So, the Colt AR-15 is significantly different from an M-16? :)

Some Colt AR-15s are M-16s. However, M-16s are military-grade assault rifles. They are effectively banned from civilian ownership in the US, regardless of the variant.

The Colt AR-15 is a semi-automatic variant of the M16 specified for "civilian use". Apart from a few states (California IIRC) they are perfectly legal and in all aspects identical to the military M16, except that they don't have fully automatic or burst fire capacity (though it's pretty easy to get a conversion kit for that actually).

Don't go mumbo jumbo on me because there's a bunch of non Colt built AR-15's, I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use.

P.S: I just remembered you can get an AR-15 variant that chambers the .50 cal Beowulf round, a round that has similar stopping power to the .458 SOCOM round that US Special Forces designed specifically because 5,56x45 NATO doesn't have the stopping power to kill things in one shot. *MURICAAAHHHH!*

No. The M-16 is a variant of the AR-15, not the other way around.

"I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use."

No, it's not. The weapons are very similar, but civilians are effectively banned from owning M-16s in the US. You can buy a rifle that looks similar to an M-16, and in some ways functions alike, but that doesn't mean that you can buy an M-16.

The M16 is a variant of the original ArmaLite AR-15, the current Colt AR-15 is a version of the M16.

No, they are identical apart from having no fully automatic firing capability. There's a few bits utterly changed in the AR-15 to prevent easy conversion to fully automatic or burst fire capacity, but that has no effect on the accuracy, lethality or handling of the rifle. You can more or less interchange just about anything between an M16 and an AR-15, though it's illegal to put M16 parts into a civilian AR-15. Otherwise you have the M16 in semi-automatic fire mode if you have an AR-15.

And you are really grasping at straws here, both the M16 and AR-15 (if the AR-15 has the same barrel length and is a 5,56x45mm version) will fire a bullet with the same muzzle velocity and accuracy and will handle identically.

None of that has any bearing on the fact that civilians are effectively banned from owning M-16s in the US. An M-16 and a civilian AR are not identical, and it's important to recognize the difference between the two when talking about the legality of purchase and ownership.

So, the AR-15 and M16 have identical accuracy, lethality, handling, weight, ammo capacity etc., and are only different in the AR-15 not being select fire. Tell me again how the AR-15 is basically not an M16? And how does that have any bearing on the fact that the 5,56mm AR-15 will kill you just as fast as a M16?

Avatar image for thegerg
#39 Posted by thegerg (18279 posts) -

@Boddicker said:

@thegerg said:

@Boddicker said:

I agree with concealed carry permits and don't think anyone has a right to ask them to leave their store as long as they're concealed. Idk how they would know unless someone came out and asked you or you pulled your weapon out in the store.

Now as to the nuts carrying long guns into a restaurant just because they can................I agree. They are dickless losers.

This is America, and we're fortunately not to that point yet where carrying long guns into restaurants are needed just to feel safe. Maybe after the inevitable oil bust/civil wars/general collapse of society, but now, no.

You don't think that a property owner has the right to choose who carries what weapons on his own property? WTF?

You said that no one has the right to ask someone carrying concealed to leave? Why?

Avatar image for thegerg
#40 Posted by thegerg (18279 posts) -

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@xeno_ghost said:

http://m.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/03/target-announces-but-wont-enforce-gun-ban/

Read how stubborn and disrespectful gun owners can be. I can't believe that in Texas people can walk around with "long arms" openly. Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs.

It's not very family friendly.

Why the need to carry these kinds of gun around in public what are these guys afraid of?

"Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs."

No, but luckily here in the US assault rifles are effectively banned.

Well, they mustn't be automatic. You can still carry a semi-automatic variant of a M16 or an AK-47 around. You can carry an M1 Garand if you so wish. All of those guns can punch a hole through a wall and kill someone on the other side, so ye.

No, a civilian can't buy an M-16. They are effectively banned for civilian ownership.

Anyway, what you posted has no bearing on my post.

So, the Colt AR-15 is significantly different from an M-16? :)

Some Colt AR-15s are M-16s. However, M-16s are military-grade assault rifles. They are effectively banned from civilian ownership in the US, regardless of the variant.

The Colt AR-15 is a semi-automatic variant of the M16 specified for "civilian use". Apart from a few states (California IIRC) they are perfectly legal and in all aspects identical to the military M16, except that they don't have fully automatic or burst fire capacity (though it's pretty easy to get a conversion kit for that actually).

Don't go mumbo jumbo on me because there's a bunch of non Colt built AR-15's, I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use.

P.S: I just remembered you can get an AR-15 variant that chambers the .50 cal Beowulf round, a round that has similar stopping power to the .458 SOCOM round that US Special Forces designed specifically because 5,56x45 NATO doesn't have the stopping power to kill things in one shot. *MURICAAAHHHH!*

No. The M-16 is a variant of the AR-15, not the other way around.

"I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use."

No, it's not. The weapons are very similar, but civilians are effectively banned from owning M-16s in the US. You can buy a rifle that looks similar to an M-16, and in some ways functions alike, but that doesn't mean that you can buy an M-16.

The M16 is a variant of the original ArmaLite AR-15, the current Colt AR-15 is a version of the M16.

No, they are identical apart from having no fully automatic firing capability. There's a few bits utterly changed in the AR-15 to prevent easy conversion to fully automatic or burst fire capacity, but that has no effect on the accuracy, lethality or handling of the rifle. You can more or less interchange just about anything between an M16 and an AR-15, though it's illegal to put M16 parts into a civilian AR-15. Otherwise you have the M16 in semi-automatic fire mode if you have an AR-15.

And you are really grasping at straws here, both the M16 and AR-15 (if the AR-15 has the same barrel length and is a 5,56x45mm version) will fire a bullet with the same muzzle velocity and accuracy and will handle identically.

None of that has any bearing on the fact that civilians are effectively banned from owning M-16s in the US. An M-16 and a civilian AR are not identical, and it's important to recognize the difference between the two when talking about the legality of purchase and ownership.

So, the AR-15 and M16 have identical accuracy, lethality, handling, weight, ammo capacity etc., and are only different in the AR-15 not being select fire. Tell me again how the AR-15 is basically not an M16? And how does that have any bearing on the fact that the 5,56mm AR-15 will kill you just as fast as a M16?

"Tell me again how the AR-15 is basically not an M16?"

An M-16 is a military grade assault rifle. Civilian market ARs are not.

"And how does that have any bearing on the fact that the 5,56mm AR-15 will kill you just as fast as a M16?"

What does that have to do with anything?

Avatar image for Boddicker
#41 Posted by Boddicker (4332 posts) -

@thegerg said:

@Boddicker said:

@thegerg said:

@Boddicker said:

I agree with concealed carry permits and don't think anyone has a right to ask them to leave their store as long as they're concealed. Idk how they would know unless someone came out and asked you or you pulled your weapon out in the store.

Now as to the nuts carrying long guns into a restaurant just because they can................I agree. They are dickless losers.

This is America, and we're fortunately not to that point yet where carrying long guns into restaurants are needed just to feel safe. Maybe after the inevitable oil bust/civil wars/general collapse of society, but now, no.

You don't think that a property owner has the right to choose who carries what weapons on his own property? WTF?

You said that no one has the right to ask someone carrying concealed to leave? Why?

In a municipality where it is allowed, no, that would be a violation of their 2nd Amendment rights. I've known several people that concealed carried and it never bothered me.

Now to the nuts carrying long guns into a restaurant, I would turn around once I saw them and go to another restaurant. Maybe they're not "gun nuts" that are going to go postal, but you have to be atleast a little insane to think that's OK in America.

Concealed carry = OK

Long guns strapped over your shoulder while eating at a restaurant/store = not OK

Avatar image for thegerg
#42 Posted by thegerg (18279 posts) -

@Boddicker: No, a private business disallowing people to carry weapons on its property has nothing to do with the 2nd amendment.

Avatar image for chaplainDMK
#43 Edited by chaplainDMK (7004 posts) -

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK said:

@thegerg said:

@xeno_ghost said:

http://m.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/03/target-announces-but-wont-enforce-gun-ban/

Read how stubborn and disrespectful gun owners can be. I can't believe that in Texas people can walk around with "long arms" openly. Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs.

It's not very family friendly.

Why the need to carry these kinds of gun around in public what are these guys afraid of?

"Can you imagine walking into a Starbucks and everyone is sitting there with ak47's and other high powered assault rifles strapped to there backs."

No, but luckily here in the US assault rifles are effectively banned.

Well, they mustn't be automatic. You can still carry a semi-automatic variant of a M16 or an AK-47 around. You can carry an M1 Garand if you so wish. All of those guns can punch a hole through a wall and kill someone on the other side, so ye.

No, a civilian can't buy an M-16. They are effectively banned for civilian ownership.

Anyway, what you posted has no bearing on my post.

So, the Colt AR-15 is significantly different from an M-16? :)

Some Colt AR-15s are M-16s. However, M-16s are military-grade assault rifles. They are effectively banned from civilian ownership in the US, regardless of the variant.

The Colt AR-15 is a semi-automatic variant of the M16 specified for "civilian use". Apart from a few states (California IIRC) they are perfectly legal and in all aspects identical to the military M16, except that they don't have fully automatic or burst fire capacity (though it's pretty easy to get a conversion kit for that actually).

Don't go mumbo jumbo on me because there's a bunch of non Colt built AR-15's, I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use.

P.S: I just remembered you can get an AR-15 variant that chambers the .50 cal Beowulf round, a round that has similar stopping power to the .458 SOCOM round that US Special Forces designed specifically because 5,56x45 NATO doesn't have the stopping power to kill things in one shot. *MURICAAAHHHH!*

No. The M-16 is a variant of the AR-15, not the other way around.

"I'm talking about the Colt manufactured AR-15, which is a semi-automatic M16 for civilian use."

No, it's not. The weapons are very similar, but civilians are effectively banned from owning M-16s in the US. You can buy a rifle that looks similar to an M-16, and in some ways functions alike, but that doesn't mean that you can buy an M-16.

The M16 is a variant of the original ArmaLite AR-15, the current Colt AR-15 is a version of the M16.

No, they are identical apart from having no fully automatic firing capability. There's a few bits utterly changed in the AR-15 to prevent easy conversion to fully automatic or burst fire capacity, but that has no effect on the accuracy, lethality or handling of the rifle. You can more or less interchange just about anything between an M16 and an AR-15, though it's illegal to put M16 parts into a civilian AR-15. Otherwise you have the M16 in semi-automatic fire mode if you have an AR-15.

And you are really grasping at straws here, both the M16 and AR-15 (if the AR-15 has the same barrel length and is a 5,56x45mm version) will fire a bullet with the same muzzle velocity and accuracy and will handle identically.

None of that has any bearing on the fact that civilians are effectively banned from owning M-16s in the US. An M-16 and a civilian AR are not identical, and it's important to recognize the difference between the two when talking about the legality of purchase and ownership.

So, the AR-15 and M16 have identical accuracy, lethality, handling, weight, ammo capacity etc., and are only different in the AR-15 not being select fire. Tell me again how the AR-15 is basically not an M16? And how does that have any bearing on the fact that the 5,56mm AR-15 will kill you just as fast as a M16?

"Tell me again how the AR-15 is basically not an M16?"

An M-16 is a military grade assault rifle. Civilian market ARs are not.

"And how does that have any bearing on the fact that the 5,56mm AR-15 will kill you just as fast as a M16?"

What does that have to do with anything?

Classify what "military-grade" is.

Because there is no difference between the Colt AR-15 and M16 (apart from a lack of automatic fire) in anything except some minor bits that really have no affect on the weapons "efficiency".

Avatar image for Boddicker
#44 Posted by Boddicker (4332 posts) -

@thegerg said:

@Boddicker: No, a private business disallowing people to carry weapons on its property has nothing to do with the 2nd amendment.

Maybe you're right, but Target regardless has lost my business.

Avatar image for thegerg
#45 Edited by thegerg (18279 posts) -

@chaplainDMK: The M16 is manufactured specifically for military use. Again, it is important to recognize and distinguish between M16s and civilian rifles when you talk about legality of purchase and ownership.

Avatar image for lostrib
#46 Posted by lostrib (49999 posts) -

@Boddicker: why? They're not actually enforcing any ban

Avatar image for TruthTellers
#47 Posted by TruthTellers (3393 posts) -

Don't understand why thegerg is arguing about the M16/AR15 platform when he should be defending the AK and it's variants as they are superior to Stoner's f*cked up designs. Direct Impingement... LOL!

Avatar image for deeliman
#48 Posted by deeliman (3744 posts) -

I wonder why people still bother to engage thegerg in these pointless debates

Avatar image for thegerg
#49 Posted by thegerg (18279 posts) -

@lostrib said:

@Boddicker: why? They're not actually enforcing any ban

Because 2nd amendment bro! America!

Avatar image for chaplainDMK
#50 Posted by chaplainDMK (7004 posts) -

@thegerg said:

@chaplainDMK: The M16 is manufactured specifically for military use. Again, it is important to recognize and distinguish between M16s and civilian rifles when you talk about legality of purchase and ownership.

Explain the difference apart from designation.