third party pubishers are already starting pull back from making core games for the wii and would rather put out shovelware case in point capcom,sega and ubisoft,the question is why do wii owners not buy games a unless its made from nintendo,look at nsmb it is a rehash of nsmb for the ds,they add 4 players and sells in the millions. we often complain third party publishers give us a lack luster effort but when they gave a reall 100% effort(mad world,no more heroes,cursed mountain,little kings story,zack&wiki and dead space extraction)they get poor sales.i for one cannot blame publishers,i think this will be the make or break year for the wii in terms of third parties.
wii heading the same pathas the gamecube!
This topic is locked from further discussion.
true. but this stuff im pretty sure was released around the end of 09 and i will admit that there was some bad crap coming out around the second half of 09. but we didnt care becuz we are getting an awesom 2010 line up that pleases all types of gamers. so i think Wii went into a little rut but it should be OK it wont go down the gamecube road
Not everyone has money to spend 24/7.
They honestly need to chill.
and I love it when people say they love the Gamecube yet bash the Wii.
The Wii has the power of 4 Gamecubes put together and the Gamecube's power was never brought out fully.
Not only that The Wii has a better Controller than the Gamecube Controller (the Classic Controller) and can use the GameCube Controller.
Oh well. I hope they make more better games for the Wii.
i think this will be the make or break year for the wii in terms of third parties.Part of me hopes we'll finally get some 3rd party games that can compete with Nintendo's games, the other part of me wishes 3rd parties would just get it over with and drop the Wii, so people will quit complaining about it.oleface
Part of me hopes we'll finally get some 3rd party games that can compete with Nintendo's games, the other part of me wishes 3rd parties would just get it over with and drop the Wii, so people will quit complaining about it.but remember third parties make up the bulk of the games[QUOTE="oleface"]i think this will be the make or break year for the wii in terms of third parties.
aransom
The GameCube WISHED it was in the position the Wii is in right now, as that would imply that it actually had third party support to lose. It's no secret as to what Wii owners buy; they buy what appeals to them, and the fact is that if you put NSMBWii on the table with the unknown, unestablished games you mentioned, the majority of people aren't going to hesitate picking up a Mario game. That's not a hard thing to understand.
Who else to blame but the publishers in this situation? The Wii has definitely shown that it can support quality software, and yet, publishers continue to see the system as thier guniea pig, which hasn't worked anywhere near as well as they wished. Instead of owning up to what they've done and putting forth a LEGIT effort to support the Wii, the major third party publishers now insist on jumping ship. I blame no one BUT the publishers for the way they've treated the Wii and assumed that people were just going to buy certain games because they were labeled "hardcore," had an M rating, etc., etc., etc., instead of actually focusing on the system's strengths and creating great games its owners wanted to play.
Guess what? If anyone thinks that this is going to change because of anything other than an improved effort by third party publishers to create better Wii games and actually support their own stuff, they're going to be disappointed... again. :P
Not everyone has money to spend 24/7.
They honestly need to chill.
and I love it when people say they love the Gamecube yet bash the Wii.
The Wii has the power of 4 Gamecubes put together and the Gamecube's power was never brought out fully.
Not only that The Wii has a better Controller than the Gamecube Controller (the Classic Controller) and can use the GameCube Controller.
Oh well. I hope they make more better games for the Wii.
LegatoSkyheart
So true. Wii does just about anything the gamecube could do and SO much more. its a console within a console. whats so bad about that??
but there have been legit efforts on the and yet we do not by them,take madworld and no more heroes good reviews all across the board new ip terrible sales,take assains creed when it came good reviews new hit ip for ubisoft,we as wii owners do not support when publishers do make the effort, most recent case dead space extraction!The GameCube WISHED it was in the position the Wii is in right now, as that would imply that it actually had third party support to lose. It's no secret as to what Wii owners buy; they buy what appeals to them, and the fact is that if you put NSMBWii on the table with the unknown, unestablished games you mentioned, the majority of people aren't going to hesitate picking up a Mario game. That's not a hard thing to understand.
Who else to blame but the publishers in this situation? The Wii has definitely shown that it can support quality software, and yet, publishers continue to see the system as thier guniea pig, which hasn't worked anywhere near as well as they wished. Instead of owning up to what they've done and putting forth a LEGIT effort to support the Wii, the major third party publishers now insist on jumping ship. I blame no one BUT the publishers for the way they've treated the Wii and assumed that people were just going to buy certain games because they were labeled "hardcore," had an M rating, etc., etc., etc., instead of actually focusing on the system's strengths and creating great games its owners wanted to play.
Guess what? If anyone thinks that this is going to change because of anything other than an improved effort by third party publishers to create better Wii games and actually support their own stuff, they're going to be disappointed... again. :P
Madmangamer364
The gamecube was the worst selling console of all time.wiifan001
Unless you mean the worst selling NINTENDO console of all time, you're wrong.
The Wii could potentially be the best selling Nintendo console of all time, if it can surpass the NES sales.wiifan001
It already did.
but there have been legit efforts on the and yet we do not by them,take madworld and no more heroes good reviews all across the board new ip terrible sales,take assains creed when it came good reviews new hit ip for ubisoft,we as wii owners do not support when publishers do make the effort, most recent case dead space extraction![QUOTE="Madmangamer364"]
The GameCube WISHED it was in the position the Wii is in right now, as that would imply that it actually had third party support to lose. It's no secret as to what Wii owners buy; they buy what appeals to them, and the fact is that if you put NSMBWii on the table with the unknown, unestablished games you mentioned, the majority of people aren't going to hesitate picking up a Mario game. That's not a hard thing to understand.
Who else to blame but the publishers in this situation? The Wii has definitely shown that it can support quality software, and yet, publishers continue to see the system as thier guniea pig, which hasn't worked anywhere near as well as they wished. Instead of owning up to what they've done and putting forth a LEGIT effort to support the Wii, the major third party publishers now insist on jumping ship. I blame no one BUT the publishers for the way they've treated the Wii and assumed that people were just going to buy certain games because they were labeled "hardcore," had an M rating, etc., etc., etc., instead of actually focusing on the system's strengths and creating great games its owners wanted to play.
Guess what? If anyone thinks that this is going to change because of anything other than an improved effort by third party publishers to create better Wii games and actually support their own stuff, they're going to be disappointed... again. :P
oleface
You're talking about two games aimed at a very specific audience and weren't established in any way, shape, or form before their Wii release. Anyone that expected either game to take off was fooling themselves from the outset. These aren't the type of games that should be used as measuring sticks for the Wii's ability to sell games, since they're not system-sellers or are even aimed at a significant portion of the Wii's userbased to begin with. Dead Space Extraction was one of three "big" rail-shooters for the system, and also happened to have the least established brand of the three games; on top of being not what Wii owners and fans of the series was expecting, it was also poorly marketed. All of these games have one thing in common; they were more or less experiments on the Wii market, not system-defining games that should have sold millions and didn't. And let's be truthful here; Madworld, NMH, and DS:E were never pegged to be platinum-selling games.
When a well-established, high-profile series makes its way to the Wii and falls flat on its face, that's when I'll believe that maybe we can say that the Wii and its userbase are not ideal for third party publishers to sell games; as long as they continue to think anything other than their best and brightest will ever be able to make an impression on the system against the likes of Nintendo's best games, this debate will continue to go nowhere, since we'll never see anything that truly has everything to make Wii owners stand up and take notice.
OK here's the thing, a good game does not equal good sales. 99.9% of gamers have a budget they have to live within, they cant buy every good game that comes out. Now here's the big thing, all the great reviews and praise in the world will not help a game if it does not operate on all its marketing cylinders. Here's an example, MW2 sold beyond through the roof, it sold through the stratosphere, but was it the best game of last year? Not a chance. There were a lot of games that were better than it and sold at a fraction of it. Why because CoD is a huge franchise, with a huge marketing department dedicated to it. When your average person walks into the game store, and they see great game A that is actually a superior product to MW2, that may or may not have heard about or the game that everyone has been talking about for months and Activision has been shoving down your throat for just as long, what do you think the average consumer is going to get? That is the problem with Wii 3rd party support, While games like Muramasa, Cursed Mountain and Madworld are great, they have zero marketing muscle. Why would someone really buy Muramasa over NSMB, when the latter is a recognizable title, with easily recognizable gameplay and a huge marketing campaign? Quality does not equal sales, marketing is actually more important than quality a mediocre game with great marketing can sell very well. While a good game with a weak marketing campaign can fail at market i.e. Madworld. Then of course huge marketing missteps like Extraction will doom a game. Companies don't put thier best marketing foot forward on the Wii and these days marketing is more important than the quality of the game. I'm not even going to get into how companies don't produce AAA franchises for the Wii to combat Nintendo's AAA franchises. There is a big difference between Rabbids Go Home and Assassins Creed. So 3rd parties have no one to blame but themselves.third party pubishers are already starting pull back from making core games for the wii and would rather put out shovelware case in point capcom,sega and ubisoft,the question is why do wii owners not buy games a unless its made from nintendo,look at nsmb it is a rehash of nsmb for the ds,they add 4 players and sells in the millions. we often complain third party publishers give us a lack luster effort but when they gave a reall 100% effort(mad world,no more heroes,cursed mountain,little kings story,zack&wiki and dead space extraction)they get poor sales.i for one cannot blame publishers,i think this will be the make or break year for the wii in terms of third parties.
oleface
[QUOTE="oleface"]i for one cannot blame publishers,alexh_99i for one can. No advertising = no sales. True, honestly I hardly watch TV anymore (spend too much time playing games), and I saw so many NSMBW commercials that I started to get sick of them, if these publishers advertised every game the same way (maybe a little less to be honest), or even just enough that people are aware these games are out, then I'm sure they will shift more units than they do now. Most of the time people don't know what comes out when and probably won't put the effort to mark it down on a calendar or something, publisher can't only rely on word of mouth. Thats not the only reason either, people don't want to spend $50 on games that look like crap (mind you not all of them are crap). If developers could start releasing better games, people will start trusting 3rd party developers. Instead, once someone feels ripped off buying a crappy game, they will stick to the developers that they know will produce a good game every time.
[QUOTE="wiifan001"]The gamecube was the worst selling console of all time.LordQuorthon
Unless you mean the worst selling NINTENDO console of all time, you're wrong.
The Wii could potentially be the best selling Nintendo console of all time, if it can surpass the NES sales.wiifan001
It already did.
Woops. Yes, the word Nintendo should be between "selling" and "console" :oops: And the Wii has not outsold the NES, at least not yet. NES sold over 60 million, and Wii is at about 55 million.Woops. Yes, the word Nintendo should be between "selling" and "console" :oops: And the Wii has not outsold the NES, at least not yet. NES sold over 60 million, and Wii is at about 55 million.wiifan001
No. The Wii has already sold around 65 units. Check whatever website you like best and you'll see.
[QUOTE="oleface"]i think this will be the make or break year for the wii in terms of third parties.
Part of me hopes we'll finally get some 3rd party games that can compete with Nintendo's games, the other part of me wishes 3rd parties would just get it over with and drop the Wii, so people will quit complaining about it. Heres the problem. Developers have discovered that they can successfully sell and make money with garbage titles on the Wii. they know they can slap together a crappy title with little to no money and or effort involved and shove it out there and the casuals who don't know any better will just snatch it all up[QUOTE="wiifan001"] Woops. Yes, the word Nintendo should be between "selling" and "console" :oops: And the Wii has not outsold the NES, at least not yet. NES sold over 60 million, and Wii is at about 55 million.LordQuorthon
No. The Wii has already sold around 65 units. Check whatever website you like best and you'll see.
http://www.nexgenwars.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_game_consoles
Where are you getting your source?
I would agree that games like Madworld and NMH are far from huge franchises, especially as poorly marketed new ip's. However they aren't niche titles like people often make them out to be. Killer 7 was a niche title, Madworld and NMH are you standard action experiences which are in no short supply these days. Sega and Ubisoft just blew it in the marketing department and Ubisoft seems like they are going to do it again. We are less than 2 weeks away from the launch of NMH2 and no marketing campaign. Ubisoft keeps talking about how this is delayed and that is delayed, you would think in at least one of those reports they would say "well we still have NMH2 releasing on Jan 26th" but they don't even do that. No matter how good this game turns out, if there is no marketing campaign people aren't going to buy it. Especially with it coming out on the same day as ME2, it would appear Ubisoft did not learn from NMH1 and making the same mistakes again and give people more fallacy filled fuel to say "such and such will not sell on the Wii" Ubisoft is doing nothing to promote this game and come a few days before Valentines Day we will be reading the article on IGN about how Ubisoft is displeased with only a 70k copies being sold in the first 2 weeks.You're talking about two games aimed at a very specific audience and weren't established in any way, shape, or form before their Wii release. Anyone that expected either game to take off was fooling themselves from the outset. These aren't the type of games that should be used as measuring sticks for the Wii's ability to sell games, since they're not system-seller.
Madmangamer364
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_game_consoles
Where are you getting your source?
wiifan001
Wikipedia's numbers are from September/October. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WiiUnits shipped Worldwide: 56.14 million (as of September 30, 2009), and, for some reason, Nexgenwars are incredibly slow. Just check some news from Kotaku and other video game news sites. It's there.
Nexgenwars.com's 360's numbers are really old too. It's at 39 million now. And I believe the PS3 is closer to 30 million than those figures.
[QUOTE="Madmangamer364"]I would agree that games like Madworld and NMH are far from huge franchises, especially as poorly marketed new ip's. However they aren't niche titles like people often make them out to be. Killer 7 was a niche title, Madworld and NMH are you standard action experiences which are in no short supply these days. Sega and Ubisoft just blew it in the marketing department and Ubisoft seems like they are going to do it again. We are less than 2 weeks away from the launch of NMH2 and no marketing campaign. Ubisoft keeps talking about how this is delayed and that is delayed, you would think in at least one of those reports they would say "well we still have NMH2 releasing on Jan 26th" but they don't even do that. No matter how good this game turns out, if there is no marketing campaign people aren't going to buy it. Especially with it coming out on the same day as ME2, it would appear Ubisoft did not learn from NMH1 and making the same mistakes again and give people more fallacy filled fuel to say "such and such will not sell on the Wii" Ubisoft is doing nothing to promote this game and come a few days before Valentines Day we will be reading the article on IGN about how Ubisoft is displeased with only a 70k copies being sold in the first 2 weeks.You're talking about two games aimed at a very specific audience and weren't established in any way, shape, or form before their Wii release. Anyone that expected either game to take off was fooling themselves from the outset. These aren't the type of games that should be used as measuring sticks for the Wii's ability to sell games, since they're not system-seller.
Sepewrath
While I'll agree with you on the fact that action titles aren't exactly niche genres, both NMH and Madworld carry a very unique approach that seperates them from the other popular titles of the same genre. Even by standard action game fare, these games don't have a mainstream indentity in the way the look or carry themselves. They may be in the same gerne as a Ninja Gaiden or God of War, but on top of the fact that these games were poorly marketed, it was simply too much to expect for these games to be quite as successful as the former two series. Even for the "mature" group that these games were aiming for, they managed to dig themselves a bigger hole by having such different visuals (with one being mostly black-and-white, which was sure to be a turn-off for many) and themes that many would say catered more towards being "immature" than "mature."
Being a new IP is challenging enough these days, but it seems like publishers and developers enjoy setting themselves up for failure when it comes to their own Wii games. Truth be told, I'm not sure if there was an effective way of marketing a game like Madworld, since they couldn't really show much footage of the game without the FCC coming down hard on Sega or something like that. It's hard to explain, but for games that are supposed to be finding out if "this market" or "that market" exists, which was a bad idea to begin with, the recent third party Wii efforts don't even feel like they were built with those intentions best in mind.
The gamecube was the worst selling console of all time..wiifan001
3DO and the Atari Jaguar would like to say hello.
Not everyone has money to spend 24/7.
They honestly need to chill.
and I love it when people say they love the Gamecube yet bash the Wii.
The Wii has the power of 4 Gamecubes put together and the Gamecube's power was never brought out fully.
Not only that The Wii has a better Controller than the Gamecube Controller (the Classic Controller) and can use the GameCube Controller.
Oh well. I hope they make more better games for the Wii.
LegatoSkyheart
About twice the power actually, not even that.
This is a graph of cumulative sales since launch.
One line is the Wii. The other is the Gamecube.
Guess which is which.
(And yes, I know that your complaint was regarding third-party games. But to say that the Wii is "heading the same path as the Gamecube" is just, well... not true.)
Well I would agree that the games were relatively unique for an action game, but nothing that made it un-marketable like the publishers acted with thier lack of a marketing campaign. Now I know there are some games that a publisher just cant market, where they have the game and they are thinking "How and who do I sell this to?" Games that come to mind are Killer 7 and Extraction. However Madworld and No More Heroes definitely do not fit into that category. Also I doubt the FCC would have come down on anyone for the marketing of either those games, both could have marketed the silliness, sexuality and violence of the games. Look at Bayonetta another Sega and Platinum product, Sega is just selling the games sexuality and nothing more. And you know when it comes time for Sony to market GoW3, you going to see some things get eviscerated.
Hell a simple Madworld advertisement could have start with one of Black Baron's rant's, toss in some clips of Jack just like walking around the world with the Black Baron voice over then....cue the violence. A few fast moving clips of Jack kicking the crap out of people by launching them into the moon, impaling them ass first , cutting them in half, show some of the bosses, Black Baron's woman with announcers talking over it. 45 secs of that would have gotten peoples attention, couple that with an attack on magazines, websites, hell maybe even stir up some controversy and people would have latched on to the game. The same kind of thing could work for NMH, in reality the "immaturity" could have worked in its favor. Madworld looked like a hilarious Running Man and NMH adding comedy to the violence instead of Travis just being another pissed off Kratos like character, it would actually draw more people in because last I checked people like comedy as much or more than violence. A mix of two certainly couldn't hurt
Hell a simple Madworld advertisement could have start with one of Black Baron's rant's, toss in some clips of Jack just like walking around the world with the Black Baron voice over then....cue the violence. A few fast moving clips of Jack kicking the crap out of people by launching them into the moon, impaling them ass first , cutting them in half, show some of the bosses, Black Baron's woman with announcers talking over it.
Sepewrath
If I'm imagining what you're saying properly, I see Sega having a tough time getting away with promoting something like that on most of television. I'm not even sure if a Quentin Terintino (SP?) flick could get away with having TV spots of something like that. That was the problem with Madworld's commercials to begin with; they existed, but they didn't really show any of the game. A game like Bayonetta had more room to roam with being a marketable title because it had a level of sex appeal and action that could be shown without going too far (ex. shooting bullets in a fashionable manner, without actually killing anyone with them). Madworld's appeal was its over-the-top violence, so with that being a difficult thing to show on TV, it definitely had an uphill battle to climb. And while I don't know the extent of NMH's "comedy", I suspect that some of that has to involve some pretty foul language and rather crude themes, so that would probably be hard to sell as well.
In comparison, I think Dead Space Extraction would have been an easier game to market. Showing monsters roam around the screen and have a little tension build between the characters is something I think would be easier to promote than cutting someone in half or making some off-the-wall joke that you wouldn't want to say in a working environment or around kids. I think DS:E was the kind of "mature" game that would have benefitted from some sort of aggressive marketing. Of course, that probably still wouldn't have saved it from the fact that it was a rail-shooter, but that's another topic. :P
[QUOTE="wiifan001"]The gamecube was the worst selling console of all time..dkrustyklown
3DO and the Atari Jaguar would like to say hello.
Nintendo Virtual Boy...Sega 32X
The Wii has the power of 4 Gamecubes put together and the Gamecube's power was never brought out fully.
LegatoSkyheart
So,where did you get this information?
Come on, guys... He already told me that he forgot to say that he was talking about NINTENDO'S worst selling console. Stop it, stop it...
...
APPLE PIPPIN! I WIN!
but there have been legit efforts on the and yet we do not by them,take madworld and no more heroes good reviews all across the board new ip terrible sales,take assains creed when it came good reviews new hit ip for ubisoft,we as wii owners do not support when publishers do make the effort, most recent case dead space extraction![QUOTE="oleface"]
[QUOTE="Madmangamer364"]
The GameCube WISHED it was in the position the Wii is in right now, as that would imply that it actually had third party support to lose. It's no secret as to what Wii owners buy; they buy what appeals to them, and the fact is that if you put NSMBWii on the table with the unknown, unestablished games you mentioned, the majority of people aren't going to hesitate picking up a Mario game. That's not a hard thing to understand.
Who else to blame but the publishers in this situation? The Wii has definitely shown that it can support quality software, and yet, publishers continue to see the system as thier guniea pig, which hasn't worked anywhere near as well as they wished. Instead of owning up to what they've done and putting forth a LEGIT effort to support the Wii, the major third party publishers now insist on jumping ship. I blame no one BUT the publishers for the way they've treated the Wii and assumed that people were just going to buy certain games because they were labeled "hardcore," had an M rating, etc., etc., etc., instead of actually focusing on the system's strengths and creating great games its owners wanted to play.
Guess what? If anyone thinks that this is going to change because of anything other than an improved effort by third party publishers to create better Wii games and actually support their own stuff, they're going to be disappointed... again. :P
Madmangamer364
You're talking about two games aimed at a very specific audience and weren't established in any way, shape, or form before their Wii release. Anyone that expected either game to take off was fooling themselves from the outset. These aren't the type of games that should be used as measuring sticks for the Wii's ability to sell games, since they're not system-sellers or are even aimed at a significant portion of the Wii's userbased to begin with. Dead Space Extraction was one of three "big" rail-shooters for the system, and also happened to have the least established brand of the three games; on top of being not what Wii owners and fans of the series was expecting, it was also poorly marketed. All of these games have one thing in common; they were more or less experiments on the Wii market, not system-defining games that should have sold millions and didn't. And let's be truthful here; Madworld, NMH, and DS:E were never pegged to be platinum-selling games.
When a well-established, high-profile series makes its way to the Wii and falls flat on its face, that's when I'll believe that maybe we can say that the Wii and its userbase are not ideal for third party publishers to sell games; as long as they continue to think anything other than their best and brightest will ever be able to make an impression on the system against the likes of Nintendo's best games, this debate will continue to go nowhere, since we'll never see anything that truly has everything to make Wii owners stand up and take notice.
Are you saying only well established franchises can sell great. Not to bring up other systems but I beg to differ. Uncharted 1 sold almost 3 million, Resistance sold over 3 million as well as Motorstorm. Mass Effect and Bioshock also sold in the millions as well. Killzone 2 and Infamous also sold pretty good. It doesn't necessarily have to be a well established franchise in order to sell great. Then who is the audience if all of these games have failed?
This person speaks the truth.The GameCube WISHED it was in the position the Wii is in right now, as that would imply that it actually had third party support to lose. It's no secret as to what Wii owners buy; they buy what appeals to them, and the fact is that if you put NSMBWii on the table with the unknown, unestablished games you mentioned, the majority of people aren't going to hesitate picking up a Mario game. That's not a hard thing to understand.
Who else to blame but the publishers in this situation? The Wii has definitely shown that it can support quality software, and yet, publishers continue to see the system as thier guniea pig, which hasn't worked anywhere near as well as they wished. Instead of owning up to what they've done and putting forth a LEGIT effort to support the Wii, the major third party publishers now insist on jumping ship. I blame no one BUT the publishers for the way they've treated the Wii and assumed that people were just going to buy certain games because they were labeled "hardcore," had an M rating, etc., etc., etc., instead of actually focusing on the system's strengths and creating great games its owners wanted to play.
Guess what? If anyone thinks that this is going to change because of anything other than an improved effort by third party publishers to create better Wii games and actually support their own stuff, they're going to be disappointed... again. :P
Madmangamer364
What the original poster is probably referring to is that the Wii despite it's hardware sales is falling into the same kind of thing the GC had fell into. Without the "wii" titles what would the Wii have besides Mario Metroid and Zelda as far as sales numbers go? People are buying this system for like 5 or 6 games tops.
Are you saying only well established franchises can sell great. Not to bring up other systems but I beg to differ. Uncharted 1 sold almost 3 million, Resistance sold over 3 million as well as Motorstorm. Mass Effect and Bioshock also sold in the millions as well. Killzone 2 and Infamous also sold pretty good. It doesn't necessarily have to be a well established franchise in order to sell great. Then who is the audience if all of these games have failed?
gamenerd15
Where-ever did I say that only established franchises can do well? If there is any system that can dispute against such a notion, it's the Wii. Afterall, look at how Wii Sports and Wii Fit have done this gen, and it's clear that it's possible to also create a new IP for the system that can not only do well, but do better than just about anything else on the market, including the new IPs you speak of. However, all of these successful IPs have one thing in common that the IPs the TC speak of don't: they cater to those that own the respective systems and they were pushed hard from a marking perspective.
My point is that third party publishers simply think they can just go with these experimental IPs and not put forth the same effort as Nintendo does with its games and expect to get similar results. Time and time again, they've been proven wrong, and now you have major third party publishers feeling the sting. Since they're not going to pay attention to exactly what the Wii userbase wants or give these new IPs the care and attention they need to make a real impression on the system, going with their big guns is probably the best way to go at this point. Right now, third party publishers need to give Wii owners a reason to trust what they're doing on the console or move onward, and I believe that only their biggest franchises have what it takes to do that at this point.
As Sepewrath has put it best many times before, third parties wanted to use ants to do the work of giants on the Wii; those ants got crushed. Now, either they get their A teams to work on their very own giants, or face the fact that they're never going to get what they're looking for out of the console. It's their choice.
with thinking like this....let me ask one question
Name one Wii title that had the same budget as a a big budget PS360 title, and the same advertising campaign that developers are complaining about. Let alone, their top teams working on them, the same amount of sweat, determination, pain, long hours, and funding... you can not name one damn title that any 3rd party company has worked on that fits under the above mentioned. NOT ONE!
No third party effort has gone un-noticed that was actually worth it. The ones that failed, or barely broke even deserved to. There are some gems out there, but the games that these companies are complaining about are not even worth $50 in the first place. If they want to release garbage or half assed attempts, sell it for $30, or don't sell it at all.
If I'm imagining what you're saying properly, I see Sega having a tough time getting away with promoting something like that on most of television. I'm not even sure if a Quentin Terintino (SP?) flick could get away with having TV spots of something like that. That was the problem with Madworld's commercials to begin with; they existed, but they didn't really show any of the game. A game like Bayonetta had more room to roam with being a marketable title because it had a level of sex appeal and action that could be shown without going too far (ex. shooting bullets in a fashionable manner, without actually killing anyone with them). Madworld's appeal was its over-the-top violence, so with that being a difficult thing to show on TV, it definitely had an uphill battle to climb. And while I don't know the extent of NMH's "comedy", I suspect that some of that has to involve some pretty foul language and rather crude themes, so that would probably be hard to sell as well.In comparison, I think Dead Space Extraction would have been an easier game to market. Showing monsters roam around the screen and have a little tension build between the characters is something I think would be easier to promote than cutting someone in half or making some off-the-wall joke that you wouldn't want to say in a working environment or around kids. I think DS:E was the kind of "mature" game that would have benefitted from some sort of aggressive marketing. Of course, that probably still wouldn't have saved it from the fact that it was a rail-shooter, but that's another topic. :PMadmangamer364
Well youhit the nail on the headthe problem with Extraction was there was no one to market it to. There's not some huge contingency of rail shooters fans on the Wii, two success stories that were based on thier name alone is not enough data to make an informed decision on, now with the failure of both Extraction and Darkside Chronicles they see the rail shooter audience does not exist. They also couldn't market it to Dead Space fans as the bulk of fans of the original were not interested in going on rails. If this game had come out before Dead Space maybe it would have been more marketable, but after the original, fans of the franchise were locked onto the TPS aspect. Hence no amont of marketing aggression would have saved it.
Madworldyes could not have been shown during Saturday morning cartoons, but it could have been shown during shows that are for the age range of M rated games. Things like South Park, Adult Swim etc. And like I said the game had other marketable qualities besides the excessive violence which to an extent could actually be shown as long as the whole ad wasn't just Jack slamming some hapless fool down on a rusty spike the hard way for 60 secs. They could show him being Jack as long as they infused the other aspects into the ad. The same goes for NMH. Its not impossible, they just choose not to, they could even imply excessive violence without showing it, maybe even making a joke out of it. Sort of like just putting a censor sticker over Jack doing something awful to someone lol and having the announcers comment on it and the fact that it is censored. There were alot of things they could do that they just ignored and then moaned about why it isn't selling.
[QUOTE="Madmangamer364"]
[QUOTE="oleface"]but there have been legit efforts on the and yet we do not by them,take madworld and no more heroes good reviews all across the board new ip terrible sales,take assains creed when it came good reviews new hit ip for ubisoft,we as wii owners do not support when publishers do make the effort, most recent case dead space extraction!
gamenerd15
You're talking about two games aimed at a very specific audience and weren't established in any way, shape, or form before their Wii release. Anyone that expected either game to take off was fooling themselves from the outset. These aren't the type of games that should be used as measuring sticks for the Wii's ability to sell games, since they're not system-sellers or are even aimed at a significant portion of the Wii's userbased to begin with. Dead Space Extraction was one of three "big" rail-shooters for the system, and also happened to have the least established brand of the three games; on top of being not what Wii owners and fans of the series was expecting, it was also poorly marketed. All of these games have one thing in common; they were more or less experiments on the Wii market, not system-defining games that should have sold millions and didn't. And let's be truthful here; Madworld, NMH, and DS:E were never pegged to be platinum-selling games.
When a well-established, high-profile series makes its way to the Wii and falls flat on its face, that's when I'll believe that maybe we can say that the Wii and its userbase are not ideal for third party publishers to sell games; as long as they continue to think anything other than their best and brightest will ever be able to make an impression on the system against the likes of Nintendo's best games, this debate will continue to go nowhere, since we'll never see anything that truly has everything to make Wii owners stand up and take notice.
Are you saying only well established franchises can sell great. Not to bring up other systems but I beg to differ. Uncharted 1 sold almost 3 million, Resistance sold over 3 million as well as Motorstorm. Mass Effect and Bioshock also sold in the millions as well. Killzone 2 and Infamous also sold pretty good. It doesn't necessarily have to be a well established franchise in order to sell great. Then who is the audience if all of these games have failed?
thank you thats what i was tryin to say wii owners are hardcore nintendo fans if its not from nintendo it usualy does not sell!!glad to see that someone understandsWhat the original poster is probably referring to is that the Wii despite it's hardware sales is falling into the same kind of thing the GC had fell into. Without the "wii" titles what would the Wii have besides Mario Metroid and Zelda as far as sales numbers go? People are buying this system for like 5 or 6 games tops.
gamenerd15
because gamecube was all about nintendo titles!
umm resident evil dark chronicles comes to mind,mad world and conduit comes to mindwith thinking like this....let me ask one question
Name one Wii title that had the same budget as a a big budget PS360 title, and the same advertising campaign that developers are complaining about. Let alone, their top teams working on them, the same amount of sweat, determination, pain, long hours, and funding... you can not name one damn title that any 3rd party company has worked on that fits under the above mentioned. NOT ONE!
No third party effort has gone un-noticed that was actually worth it. The ones that failed, or barely broke even deserved to. There are some gems out there, but the games that these companies are complaining about are not even worth $50 in the first place. If they want to release garbage or half assed attempts, sell it for $30, or don't sell it at all.
danger_ranger95
at the end of the day what really makes gamers buy games is word of mouth and reviews! no one new about uncharted or god of war but good reviews and people always talking about it is what sold it.
wii owners comlain about thelack of advertising but shovelware does not advertise and it sells eg ben10 nd wii dance party
My goodness. "The Gamecube was the worst selling console of all time." You forget the word Nintendo and then 4 people are on to me about it. They're like, Atari Jaguar and Sega Dreamcast and this and that the HANDHELD Virtual Boy all say hi. It's like, will you all just shut....err...BE FREEKIN QUIET?!?! You wanna talk a system that didn't sell? Talk to the Apple Pippin. It sold worse than everything else that has been said.wiifan001
Lord QuorThon actually mentioned the Apple Pippin a few posts up. He won. :D
[QUOTE="wiifan001"]My goodness. "The Gamecube was the worst selling console of all time." You forget the word Nintendo and then 4 people are on to me about it. They're like, Atari Jaguar and Sega Dreamcast and this and that the HANDHELD Virtual Boy all say hi. It's like, will you all just shut....err...BE FREEKIN QUIET?!?! You wanna talk a system that didn't sell? Talk to the Apple Pippin. It sold worse than everything else that has been said.dkrustyklown
Lord QuorThon actually mentioned the Apple Pippin a few posts up. He won.
I was supporting his statement, and we weren't arguing the worst selling console of all time. And he won nothing. I won nothing. Nobody won anything.Please Log In to post.
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